Alpha 1
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It's Official: CommutAir In CLE March 16th

Sat Jan 25, 2003 1:49 pm

Read in our system today that CommutAir will start new service in CLE beginning March 16th, with the first cities being served as Kalamazoo (AZO), and Elmira, NY (ELM). Schedules will be available for sale Feb 1st. Don't know of the frequencies with the B1900 yet. More cities will follow as the year progresses.
 
B747-437B
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RE: It's Official: CommutAir In CLE March 16th

Sat Jan 25, 2003 2:03 pm

Well, son of a Beech!  Nuts
"The A340-300 may boast a long range, but the A340 is underpowered" -- Robert Milton, CEO - Air Canada
 
ouboy79
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RE: It's Official: CommutAir In CLE March 16th

Sat Jan 25, 2003 2:29 pm

Mesaba in TOL has been contracted to work 4 CO flights this year. No start date.
 
Alpha 1
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RE: It's Official: CommutAir In CLE March 16th

Sat Jan 25, 2003 2:34 pm

Ouboy79, it's likely that TOL, SBN, FWA, LAN, MBS will be some of the cities to start-up this year. I was a little surprised that Elmira, never served from CLE, was a start-up city. I was told by a COEX pilot that it made sense because ELM is a MX base for Commutair.

I'm sure there'll be more surprises in what will be served with the Son of Beech out of CLE.  Smile
 
ouboy79
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RE: It's Official: CommutAir In CLE March 16th

Sat Jan 25, 2003 2:36 pm

TOL is a given from the plans Mesaba/NW have for TOL that I was made privy to tonight. Specifically stated was a contract being signed to ground handle the CO flights - 4 times per day. They, however, just haven't been told when. Staffing levels at this station are expected to increase dramatically...so it seems these two code-share partners are up to something.  Smile
 
HlywdCatft
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RE: It's Official: CommutAir In CLE March 16th

Sat Jan 25, 2003 2:54 pm

How will CommutAir successfully compete with CoEx Jungle Jets?
 
ouboy79
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RE: It's Official: CommutAir In CLE March 16th

Sat Jan 25, 2003 3:22 pm

Why would they compete? Most of these routes were all dropped when runway construction started and the Beeches removed from CLE.

One note about AZO - this route will be subsidized through the AIR 21 federal loan program.
 
co/ba
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RE: It's Official: CommutAir In CLE March 16th

Sat Jan 25, 2003 4:04 pm

Is there any word of furloughed CO or COEX pilots being able to fly for them?
 
jetskipper
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RE: It's Official: CommutAir In CLE March 16th

Sat Jan 25, 2003 8:49 pm

All furloughed Exjet pilot were called a few months ago and offered positions at Commutair. They will not be replacing Commutair pilots, but however being added to support the demand from the extra service. They are all able to keep there COEX numbers and will be recalled as soon as posible...most likely by the end of 2003.
 
masseybrown
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RE: CoEx: CLE-AUS And CLE-SAT

Sun Jan 26, 2003 4:30 am

Just for history's sake, I believe Mohawk regularly flew CLE-ELM.
 
ExpressJet_ERJ
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RE: It's Official: CommutAir In CLE March 16th

Sun Jan 26, 2003 6:39 am

Hopefully they'll start CLE-PIT just like CoExp did with Beeches. Maybe even CAK?
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Alpha 1
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RE: It's Official: CommutAir In CLE March 16th

Sun Jan 26, 2003 10:07 am

ExpressJet_ERJ, I would rather see COEX start CAK-EWR service instead of CAK-CLE. For three reasons: 1. CAK-CLE becomes like "fodder" when there's maintainence problems-it's easy to cancel, and that never looks good; 2. Even with the new runways that will eventually increase traffic, CAK-CLE will always be succeptable to ATC problems because CAK does sit in the approach pattern for CLE. That was always a huge problem, and 3. CAK-EWR would be a nice counter to the AirTran service CAK-LGA that's starting in March, I believe. I think that AirTran service could lure some CO and AA New York travelers to CAK, and CO would be smart to counter this new service.
 
777gk
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RE: It's Official: CommutAir In CLE March 16th

Sun Jan 26, 2003 10:09 pm

CLE lost a chunk of traffic when we started removing the 1900s and shipping those passengers to DTW onto NW-operated flights (I've been lurking at FT for some time now, and I'm not going to use the ubiquitous term NW "metal" here  Smile). This has been a much anticipated move and should boost the amount of connecting traffic we have at CLE.

By the way, keep your eye out for a CLE-AMS nonstop with a 757 to be announced at some point in the near future. I hear once we start taking more 737-800 deliveries that we can replace a 757 in the schedule and that would be the aircraft we would operate that flight with. Just rumors, but I think this one has at least a leg to stand on with the KLM link and impending Skyteam entrance.
 
masseybrown
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RE: CoEx: CLE-AUS And CLE-SAT

Mon Jan 27, 2003 2:36 am

Could the 757's do CLE-AMS without regular westbound load restrictions? At 3921 miles, the route is almost at the limit of Boeing's 757-200 advertised range.
 
N766UA
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RE: It's Official: CommutAir In CLE March 16th

Mon Jan 27, 2003 2:51 am

I don't think CLE-AMS could be a 757. Pilots flying the current CLE-LGW route complain enough as is about fuel limits and LGW is a bit closer.
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redngold
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RE: It's Official: CommutAir In CLE March 16th

Mon Jan 27, 2003 9:11 am

Yay! Expansion at CLE! (even if it is re-expansion!)

Personally I don't think CAK-CLE is a good idea. In addition to the airspace problems, CO was losing money on people flying out of CAK "connecting through CLE" to buy cheaper tickets. They could use a bus like they do ABE-EWR.

I also don't think CLE-DTW will work on B1900s when NW uses DC-9s, A320s, and Mesaba 340s. All are more comfortable and more expedient than B1900s.

redngold
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N766UA
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RE: It's Official: CommutAir In CLE March 16th

Mon Jan 27, 2003 11:21 am

Is not CLE-DTW operated by ERJs and 737s? I know in the summers 737-300s make up a good chunk of the CLE-DTW route.
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ouboy79
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RE: It's Official: CommutAir In CLE March 16th

Mon Jan 27, 2003 11:29 am

CLE-DTW isn't part of the CommutAir deal...that is handled by ExpressJet and the rest.
 
ncflyer
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RE: It's Official: CommutAir In CLE March 16th

Mon Jan 27, 2003 12:27 pm

The turbroprop makes a return to CO-- or a CO affiliate-- I believe these will be the only props in the CO system? A few years back CO made a big deal of saying CLE was moving to an all jet hub, but maybe that was a way of sugarcoating a big service cut.
 
Alpha 1
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RE: It's Official: CommutAir In CLE March 16th

Mon Jan 27, 2003 1:44 pm

Is not CLE-DTW operated by ERJs and 737s? I know in the summers 737-300s make up a good chunk of the CLE-DTW route.

737'S haven't made up a "good chunk" of the CLE-DTW service in 15 years. About 2 years ago, CO did operate one positioning 735 DTW-CLE-SRQ, I believe, but the 735 didn't run CLE-DTW. DTW has been all turboprop/RJ for the better part of a decade now, at the very least.

A few years back CO made a big deal of saying CLE was moving to an all jet hub, but maybe that was a way of sugarcoating a big service cut.

I don't see how it sugarcoated anything, since CLE was the first CO hub to go all-jet in November of 2001. There were cuts in some routes to smaller destinations, mainly because of the runway constraints at CLE-and it was the runway, since some markets like CLE-AZO, CLE-SBN actually were profitable.

I'm no big fan of the B1900, but, as Senior VP Jeff Smisek told us in November, if CO/COEX thinks it can make a few $$$ by bringing back the Beeches on some of these routes, then why not? In this day and age, the carriers are looking for every little advantage to squeeze extra revenue. The upside, of course, is if any of these markets do well, they can always be upgraded to COEX ERJ service.
 
ouboy79
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RE: It's Official: CommutAir In CLE March 16th

Mon Jan 27, 2003 1:50 pm

NCFlyer said...

The turbroprop makes a return to CO-- or a CO affiliate-- I believe these will be the only props in the CO system? A few years back CO made a big deal of saying CLE was moving to an all jet hub, but maybe that was a way of sugarcoating a big service cut.

The Beeches are flown by CommutAir, which has been flying as Continental Connection for a few years now. Gulfstream Int'l in Florida is also another Connection carrier that flies the Beeches - so no, these will not be the only props in the system. They are no longer flown by Express Jet (Continental Express)...but they have never left the system.
 
redngold
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RE: It's Official: CommutAir In CLE March 16th

Mon Jan 27, 2003 1:54 pm

Continental Express still has its "Britt Airways" division which flies out of IAH -- and uses EM2's on some shorter routes (for example, ELF-IAH, LIT-IAH).

redngold
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Lear777
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RE: It's Official: CommutAir In CLE March 16th

Mon Jan 27, 2003 2:29 pm

Redngold

Continental Express is all jet out of all of the hubs now...no more props from IAH.

Brian
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N766UA
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RE: It's Official: CommutAir In CLE March 16th

Mon Jan 27, 2003 8:15 pm

Alpha1- I flew a 737-300 DTW-CLE last year and I know there was at least another one on the schedule at the time, too.
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Alpha 1
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RE: It's Official: CommutAir In CLE March 16th

Mon Jan 27, 2003 10:40 pm

Redngold, Britt Airways was basically folded into COEX. It no longer exists as an individual entity, and hasn't for quite a while now. There used to be Britt North and Britt South.

And N766UA, as I said, there was one 733 DTW-CLE for a while, but there were not other 737's on the CLE-DTW-CLE run, and have not been for years. When I started in '87, DTW-CLE-DTW was operated exclusively by mainline jets, as there was not Britt/COEX in CLE in '87, but that was pared back in the early '90's, and slowly went all COEX.

I do remember one time, around 1990, when a CLE-DTW 733 was downgagued for a flight one day to a EMB-120. Only time I ever saw a mainline decommitted to an Express turboprop.
 
jetskipper
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RE: It's Official: CommutAir In CLE March 16th

Mon Jan 27, 2003 10:41 pm

Continental Airlines bought Britt Airways years ago and combined it with airlines such as Bar Harbor and other to make what is now known as Continental Express. The entire Continental Express system currently operates under the Britt Airways operating certificate, that is why whenever doing a search for an Express flight on such websites as FlightTracker the code for Express is BTA. This is also mthe code the FAA and ATC uses to identify us. There is no Britt Airways division.
 
DFORD757
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RE: It's Official: CommutAir In CLE March 16th

Mon Jan 27, 2003 11:57 pm

I am glad that another airline is showing interest in ELM. Since US Airways pulled mainline service out, things have been kinda slow there, but it seems like the number of passengers hasn't changed any. Never flown on Continental before...but I might have to give them a try next time I fly back into ELM.

Good job CommutAir for taking a chance at ELM!!!

DFORD757