ConcordeBoy
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Shortest Runways With Sched. Transoceanic Service?

Thu May 08, 2003 3:13 pm

Anyone know the airport with the shortest runway to have scheduled nonstop transAtlantic service; as well as the shortest runway to have scheduled nonstop transPacific service as well?


I'd imagine SAN has to be a forerunner for the former case. Anyone?
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
HAL
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RE: Shortest Runways With Sched. Transoceanic Service?

Thu May 08, 2003 5:08 pm

San Diego's runway is 9400' long. Do they have service from Asia? I'm not sure. I'd guess the British Airways flight is the longest distance arrival there.

But for a short, pucker factor inducing runway, nothing in my mind beats Kahului airport (OGG) in Maui, Hawaii. Only 7000' long with a good down slope toward the ocean (the usual landing direction), plus winds gusting over 30 knots a LOT of the time, means it takes the cake in the short runway-hot brakes-burnt rubber-"Jeez the end of the runway is coming up fast" sweepstakes.

Add the facts that most of the pilots flying there don't come in regularly, and that approach control thinks nothing of telling you to do a short slam-dunk approach, and that there's a 10,000 ft. mountain on one side and a 4000' mountain on the other side, and that those mountains and wind combine to cause constant teeth rattling turbulence to touchdown, and I think OGG wins the award (from a pilot's perspective at least).

HAL
One smooth landing is skill. Two in a row is luck. Three in a row and someone is lying.
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: Shortest Runways With Sched. Transoceanic Service?

Thu May 08, 2003 5:17 pm

Oops, almost forgot: CLE's Rwy6R/24L is only 8999ft long; yet features nonstop transatlantic service to LGW.
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
Lionel
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RE: Shortest Runways With Sched. Transoceanic Service?

Thu May 08, 2003 5:54 pm

SXM has a 7000' long runway and direct flights to CDG!
 
captaink
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RE: Shortest Runways With Sched. Transoceanic Service?

Thu May 08, 2003 10:14 pm

A lot of the caribbean airports have runways that would be considered short in the US. Grenada is only 9000, and the first post talked about SAN being 9400 and it being short  Smile I dont know the exact length but airports such as TAB, SXM, MBJ etc have runways that a bit shorter than 9000. All of the above have international transatlantic flights.. Airlines using equippment like A330;s, A340's. B777, B747. In fact we had the concorde once in Grenada a few years ago...I was a marketing thing i believe, because that was the one and only time it came here  Smile
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by738
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RE: Shortest Runways With Sched. Transoceanic Service?

Thu May 08, 2003 11:16 pm

I am not sure of the exact length but I dont think Glasgow EGPF has one of the longest runways and has regular scheduled transatlantic 767-300/A330 and now 777 flights with occasional charter 747's. Must be long enough or they wouldnt use it!!
 
DIA
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RE: Shortest Runways With Sched. Transoceanic Service?

Thu May 08, 2003 11:35 pm

Just a guess. . .St. Maarten?
Ding! You are now free to keep supporting Frontier.
 
I LOVE EWR
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RE: Shortest Runways With Sched. Transoceanic Service?

Thu May 08, 2003 11:52 pm

I would need to agree with HAL about OGG.

HAL, what's going on with the OGG runway expansion plans if that is still a viable option.
 
ScottB
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RE: Shortest Runways With Sched. Transoceanic Serv

Thu May 08, 2003 11:58 pm

Runway 9/27 (mostly departures/arrivals on 9, though) at BOS is 7,000 feet and regularly sees transatlantic departures and arrivals (I hear the departures overhead at my apartment  Big grin)
 
fritzi
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RE: Shortest Runways With Sched. Transoceanic Service?

Fri May 09, 2003 12:07 am

Correct, SXM does receive transoceanic heavies. But they don't have oceanic flights departing from there. When the heavies take off from SXM, they make a fuel stop a fuel stop somewhere else in the Caribbean whose rwys can safely let a heavily fueled aircraft take off for a flight across the Atlantic, for example Santo Domingo, Dom. Rep.
 
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coronado
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RE: Shortest Runways With Sched. Transoceanic Service?

Fri May 09, 2003 2:02 am

SAN with its displaced threshold actually only has about 7200 or feet for landings so the Virgin 747 from London has a tight fit!
Interesting article on SAN in this months Airliners magazine with pictures showing the 1800 foot displacement on the threshold.
The Original Coronado: First CV jet flights RG CV 990 July 1965; DL CV 880 July 1965; Spantax CV990 Feb 1973
 
ammunition
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RE: Shortest Runways With Sched. Transoceanic Service?

Fri May 09, 2003 2:07 am

what about BHX? that must be amongst the shortest runways with transatlantic service?
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donder10
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RE: Shortest Runways With Sched. Transoceanic Service?

Fri May 09, 2003 2:17 am

what about BHX? that must be amongst the shortest runways with transatlantic service?
First thought that came in to my head!AA had problems there getting a decent payload off to ORD.
 
Lionel
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RE: Shortest Runways With Sched. Transoceanic Service?

Fri May 09, 2003 2:36 am

Fritzi, thats not correct. The 747 has to do a fuelstop somewhere but the AF A340 flies from SXM to CDG nonstop.
 
RL757PVD
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RE: Shortest Runways With Sched. Transoceanic Service?

Fri May 09, 2003 2:50 am


In the summer PVD has weekly service on two carriers to Ponta Delgada in the Azores. The aircraft is a weekly A330 op by Air Luxor, and a weekly A310 by SATA. the runway they depart from is only 7,166 ft, and the A330 has landed on the crosswind on occasion which is only 6081.
Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
 
762er
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RE: Shortest Runways With Sched. Transoceanic Service?

Fri May 09, 2003 3:28 am

Yea, AA is now flying OGG-ORD nonstop. That's a long way for a 7,000 ft. rwy. Those Maui coast winds can really howl. The most satisfying landing I ever had was flying into rwy 2 at OGG in a C172, winds 350 at 25 gusts to 35. You really had to go opposite aileron/rudder. It was intense.
 
USAFHummer
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RE: Shortest Runways With Sched. Transoceanic Service?

Fri May 09, 2003 3:30 am

BHX's main runway, 15/33, is 8500 ft. I believe...

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c72
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RE: Shortest Runways With Sched. Transoceanic Service?

Fri May 09, 2003 3:40 am

Does Aloha 737-700 service between SNA and HNL count? SNA is 5700ft.
 
fritzi
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RE: Shortest Runways With Sched. Transoceanic Service?

Fri May 09, 2003 3:52 am

Lionel,

My bad, thanks for correcting me. I forgot that they had switched to the beautiful aircraft with 4 APU´s. Big grin
 
EGFF
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RE: Shortest Runways With Sched. Transoceanic Service?

Fri May 09, 2003 4:34 am

I remember hearing BOH a few weeks/months ago had a transoceanic flight which struggled until the last moment to take off due to the short runway.... believe it was an EAL 742, could be wrong ... can anyone clarify?
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Shaun
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neednewairport
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RE: Shortest Runways With Sched. Transoceanic Service?

Fri May 09, 2003 5:40 am

Nope, no Asia flights from SAN. However, we have almost daily BA nonstop service to London with a 777. Gosh that thing is huge compared to everything else at SAN. Virgin flies their 744's here, that is news to me.
 
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coronado
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RE: Shortest Runways With Sched. Transoceanic Service?

Fri May 09, 2003 5:44 am

You are right BA is in SAN--however the artcile in Airliners was saying that Virgin had been talking about bringing in their 747's there. I don't know if this is out of consideration now or now in light of the current conditions in air travel, particularly international
The Original Coronado: First CV jet flights RG CV 990 July 1965; DL CV 880 July 1965; Spantax CV990 Feb 1973
 
bhxforever
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RE: Shortest Runways With Sched. Transoceanic Service?

Fri May 09, 2003 6:06 am

How come AA had problems from BHX when carriers such as AMM, BY, and MYT all operate non stop to destinations in the Caribbean and Florida, with considerably more passengers on board (190 vs 300+) when ORD is closer so less fuel would be carried aswell!
 
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HA_DC9
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RE: Shortest Runways With Sched. Transoceanic Service?

Fri May 09, 2003 6:29 am

LIH has a 6500' runway. UA has 757 service to LAX and SFO from LIH.
 
HAL
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RE: Shortest Runways With Sched. Transoceanic Service?

Fri May 09, 2003 7:45 am

HA_DC-9,
LIH is shorter, but it's only 757's going there. OGG has everything up to 777's, and that's a lot of plane for such a short runway.

I LOVE EWR,
Last I heard, the local population shot down the OGG runway extension in a vote last year. The ground is already graded & cleared, and all it would take is a little asphalt - but I don't think it'll happen any time soon.

HAL

One smooth landing is skill. Two in a row is luck. Three in a row and someone is lying.
 
I LOVE EWR
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RE: Shortest Runways With Sched. Transoceanic Service?

Fri May 09, 2003 11:26 am

Thanks again HAL for the reply.

Yeah I saw how the ground was already graded and cleared. I hope that the short runway is not creating that much of a safety issue.
 
HAL
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RE: Shortest Runways With Sched. Transoceanic Service?

Sat May 10, 2003 7:12 am

I can't say how much of a safety hazard it really is. I do know we're always really careful there. My guess is that if there will be an overrun accident anywhere in the US, most likely it'll be at OGG. I've certainly seen more than the average number of go-arounds there when it appears a plane is going to land long. Plus a lot of bone-crunching landings as guys really plant it on to get it stopped in a hurry.

HAL
One smooth landing is skill. Two in a row is luck. Three in a row and someone is lying.
 
Guest

RE: Shortest Runways With Sched. Transoceanic Service?

Sat May 10, 2003 8:33 am

Could a 747 make it to LHR from SAN non-stop with a full load? BA always said they did the stop in PHX because of this and I know that BA's 744 was a bit weight restricted from SAN if I remember correctly.
 
konrad
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RE: Shortest Runways With Sched. Transoceanic Service?

Sat May 10, 2003 11:41 am

Krakow KRk/EPKK has a 8366' (2550m) runway and scheduled non-stop LOT(LO) service to Chicago ORD operated with B767-300 and -200 aircraft. The distance along the great circle is 4100nm (7600km) which usually yields to a 10h+ westbound flying time. In addition to the year-round ORD service KRk gets seasonal non-stop flights to JFK and EWR in summer. Supposedly, the departures to ORD are weight limited in hot weather due to the short take-off distance.

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