MAH4546
Topic Author
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AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Mon May 19, 2003 10:59 am

Air Canada has canceled the introduction of Montreal-Rome flights. To have been operated 3x per week, they will not fly the route this summer. Also, various reductions in frequency between Toronto and Glasgow, Manchester, Amsterdam, and Copenhagen.

In addition, Lufthansa's Montreal-Munich service will not be daily. Instead only Monday, Thursday, and Saturday.
a.
 
caribb
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Mon May 19, 2003 12:29 pm

I guess we will hear of more cuts to come as they struggle to get back into financial shape.. too bad for those routes. What's the source by the way?
 
captaingomes
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Mon May 19, 2003 2:32 pm

Wow, that's interesting. Would be good to get a source for sure. If FLYYUL hears about this on his vacation, he'll flip!  Smile
"it's kind of like an Airbus, it's an engineering marvel, but there's no sense of passion" -- J. Clarkson re: Coxster
 
munich
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Mon May 19, 2003 3:13 pm

In addition, Lufthansa's Montreal-Munich service will not be daily. Instead only Monday, Thursday, and Saturday.

Where have you gotten this information, MAH4546?

I only have the information, that this flight will be delayed from today to June, 14th, but than daily.
Regards! Robert alias munich
 
Noise
Posts: 2012
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Tue May 20, 2003 12:21 am

Any one think it will return for summer 2004?
 
caribb
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Tue May 20, 2003 12:40 am

Munich - we know about he flight reduction of Lufthansa to Montreal for a little while now.. it's disappointing but hopefully it will increase in frequency over time. To bad about the other routes a well.. expecially Rome. I wonder if Alitalia will consider starting it up again? Any idea what the reductions will be from Toronto? It's going to be a tougher year for them I'm afraid. Let's hope for the best.

Doug
 
flyyul
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Tue May 20, 2003 2:00 am

Greetings from Cozumel Mexico..

It is quite sad to hear all this news... nobody expected such a cinderella summer at YUL, we knew like the rest the good news would turn sour, and what seems to be perhaps the toughest year in international travel.

The good thing is that withtheflight reductions almost all LH flights this summer are sold-out per the availability charts that ive jsutchecked.... and as for FCO... Imean its only a matter of time until somebody will start flying to Italy from Montreal.

Mark
 
Noise
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Tue May 20, 2003 2:19 am

If it's not AC, it might be AZ, though they are in financial trouble as well.

Any way, enjoy your stay in Cozumel, Mark!
 
Jayce
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Tue May 20, 2003 3:07 am

I agree with Mark, it will be only a matter of time before someone flies direct from YUL to Italy. I hope it would be AZ, so there can be something besides plain old AC aircraft at YUL!

Have a good trip, Mark.
"Trying is the first step towards failure" -Homer Simpson
 
flyyul
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Tue May 20, 2003 5:54 am

Thanks Jayce...

I was lookingat non-reving to FCO this summer with AC on an ID90..

So I asked for three dates

June 20
June 22
June 27

The highest load was booked at 175, and the lowest at 117 pax (out of a 228Y 767-300ER).....

So I am dissapointed, but I know that there will be flights to Italy, just a matter of time and health of the aviation industry.

BOS-FCO/CVG-FCO/DTW-FCO all in the lists of chops as well.

Mark
 
Noise
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Tue May 20, 2003 6:03 am

Romours are going around now that AZ is looking into flying FCO-YUL-YYZ-FCO and most likely MXP-YYZ-YUL-MXP...
 
flyyul
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Tue May 20, 2003 6:31 am

YYZ-CPH is gonna be delayed until July it seems..

Mark
 
BA
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Tue May 20, 2003 6:48 am

Good to see Beirut (BEY) being spared.

Anyone know how the loads are so far?

Regards
"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
 
flyyul
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Tue May 20, 2003 7:02 am

BA the loads are full..

Many flights sold-out an hour after the announcement of theflight..

The first flight is booked at 237 last time I checked out of 228Y... this flight should be a keeper forAC

Mark
 
BA
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Tue May 20, 2003 7:19 am

Hmm....perhaps they should make it a year-round route?

FLYYUL,

Look for MEA in Montreal (YUL) this fall. If you wanna know more, get on AOL Instant Messanger.

Regards
"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
 
EurostarVA
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Tue May 20, 2003 7:40 am

BA,

Are there really plans by MEA to operate to Montreal??

EurostarVA
If there is a will, there is a way
 
BA
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Tue May 20, 2003 7:46 am

EurostarVA,

There is no confirmation, but I heard this fall MEA is planning to start service to Montreal via CDG.

Again, no confirmation. So it may not be true.

Regards
"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
 
Noise
Posts: 2012
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Tue May 20, 2003 7:53 am

Would there be a connection at CDG or just a stop over?
 
BA
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Tue May 20, 2003 8:47 am

Noise,

Just a stop over.

Basically, you WILL be seeing an A330-200 in MEA colors in YUL this fall. Something new to spot.

Regards

[Edited 2003-05-20 01:48:36]
"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
 
flyyul
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Tue May 20, 2003 11:31 am

Hey BA..

What is your source?

Mark
 
BA
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Tue May 20, 2003 2:11 pm

FLYYUL,

Get online tommorow and I will tell you.

Regards
"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
 
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DaV
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Tue May 20, 2003 5:30 pm

AZ is looking into flying FCO-YUL-YYZ-FCO and most likely MXP-YYZ-YUL-MXP...>

Alitalia only flies to YYZ from MXP, they could extend the route to YUL, but they won't start the same route via FCO (codeshare agreement with AC wich operates the YYZ-FCO). AZ is retiring 3 remaining MD11 combi and thus cancelling the historical MXP-KIX... no way they could start another route.

DaV
Two monologues do not make a dialogue
 
flyyul
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Wed May 21, 2003 12:17 am

BA..

Im on a cruise boat in the middle of the ocean and this is costing me 0.75 cents a minute..

Can you please elaborate?

Thx,

Mark
 
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yyz717
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Wed May 21, 2003 1:48 am

It is quite sad to hear all this news... nobody expected such a cinderella summer at YUL,

Mark, until last week you were waxing poetic about the growth prospects at YUL this summer. I think you did indeed expect a cinderella summer at YUL.

I know that there will be flights to Italy, just a matter of time and health of the aviation industry.

It has less to do with the health of the industry than the market potential for YUL-Italy. The industry is also poor in YYZ, MIA, JFK, BOS, ORD, LAX etc, yet Italy nonstops from these markets continue......


I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
MAH4546
Topic Author
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Wed May 21, 2003 3:49 am

It has less to do with the health of the industry than the market potential for YUL-Italy. The industry is also poor in YYZ, MIA, JFK, BOS, ORD, LAX etc, yet Italy nonstops from these markets continue......

LAX has not had non-stops to Italy since March 2002. Can't speak for other markets, but poor industry aside, the fashion industry is doing fine, and that is what keeps Alitalia's MIA-MXP a money maker.
a.
 
flyyul
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Wed May 21, 2003 4:41 am

Neil what can I say...

there are a few cuts from YYZ also... i know of many flights booked at over 180 to FCO out of YUL but in all Y.. its only a matter of time until somebody starts nonstops to italy on a regular basis.

Mark
 
Noise
Posts: 2012
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Wed May 21, 2003 5:19 am

AZ is retiring 3 remaining MD11 combi and thus cancelling the historical MXP-KIX... no way they could start another route.

Yeah, but they will/would start this route when they get their 2 new 777s.
 
flpuck6
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Wed May 21, 2003 6:02 am

Air France will be adding a 3rd daily (seasonal) service...

AF344/345 A343
AF346/347 744
AF348/349 A343


THAT's some good news
Bonjour Chef!
 
Marco
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Wed May 21, 2003 6:25 am

there are a few cuts from YYZ also... i know of many flights booked at over 180 to FCO out of YUL but in all Y.. its only a matter of time until somebody starts nonstops to italy on a regular basis

Mark, did you use Amadeus.net or do you have access to the real loads? If you used Amadeus.net, then those figures can be very different!
Proud to be an Assyrian!
 
flyyul
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Wed May 21, 2003 8:09 am

Marco.

Those numbers came from AC RESIII...

Why I decided to get these numbers? I was looking to purchase an ID90 fare to FCO this summer, my girlfriend and I were looking at FCO for a few days.

Remember that NW and DL cut fco from DTW/BOS/CVG... I am not surprised, FCO is a low-yield tourist destination, and is not a huge money maker. I know the ADM is in talks with Alitalia, and apparently they made a big push w/ AC to start the FCO flights!

Mark
 
donder10
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Wed May 21, 2003 8:16 am

Does YUL have MXP flights currently?
 
Noise
Posts: 2012
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Wed May 21, 2003 8:38 am

Nope. No flights to Italy.
 
Marco
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Wed May 21, 2003 9:52 am

Thanks Mark.

I'm not surprised at the loads. Montreal has a huge Italian community (fortunately Big grin)!
Proud to be an Assyrian!
 
LH423
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Wed May 21, 2003 4:19 pm

For some reason FCO has never been a money maker. When Malpensa opened in 2000 AZ made a huge change and focused more on Milan, transferring most of the US-Italy flights to MXP. AZ used to have Rome flights then transferred it to MXP, and this year Delta was going to start a BOS-FCO flight, but cancelled it due to the poor state of the industry. I'm sure eventually things will come back to they way they should be, and maybe YUL will finally get a non-stop to Italy, but I think we're all gonna have to take a step back to take two steps forward.

LH423
« On ne voit bien qu'avec le cœur. L'essentiel est invisible pour les yeux » Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
 
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DaV
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RE: AC: No YUL-FCO; Red. YYZ-Europe; LH Red. YUL-MUC

Wed May 21, 2003 5:27 pm

Yeah, but they will/would start this route when they get their 2 new 777s.

There are other priorities before a YUL-Italy! To mention a few: the supposed MXP-PVG/KUL/SYD, reopening of many routes such HKG, SIN, LAX and SFO, putting the 777 where it's needed (EZE, MIA, and so on).

If they can keep it running, it would be great a MXP-YYZ-YUL with 777, more room, more cargo, more pax, a single flight. But a daily or a 5-weekly Italy-YUL flight would be full in Y but hardly in C/F, making the flight unprofitable.

By the way, in an Italian aviation forum, after a careful reading of the latest AZ press release, it's mentioned they have been granted a 500+ milion $ loan for a further batch of other 6 777 (-200ER, we supposed). 6 delivered, 4 on leasing to be delivered before the end of the year and this 6 more = 16 777.

DaV
Two monologues do not make a dialogue

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