Shamrock1Heavy
Topic Author
Posts: 242
Joined: Sat Nov 09, 2002 8:46 am

Air Force One...New Plane Ever?

Wed May 21, 2003 2:54 pm

My brother and i were watching "Air Force One" today and he posed a question. The plane is a 747-200 specailly modified of-course, but it is still a 747-200, old, yet classic by todays standards. Will they ever change it? to a 744 or mabye even a 772LR? This made me wonder, so I came here to ask. Comments welcome!

-D
when in hell, we'll do shots at the bar
 
ha763
Posts: 3168
Joined: Mon Jan 06, 2003 5:36 pm

RE: Air Force One...New Plane Ever?

Wed May 21, 2003 3:17 pm

Given the fact that the 2 707's previously used as Air Force One were flying for close to 30 years, it will be awhile before the next Air Force One will be flying. The first of the two current Air Force One's were delivered in 1990, so they are not old. They are also so well taken care of that they always look brand new.

It will also take several years to build the next Air Force One. The 747's were ordered during the Regan Administration and were not delivered until half way into Bush Sr.'s term.
 
User avatar
HA_DC9
Posts: 563
Joined: Thu Jul 15, 1999 3:16 pm

RE: Air Force One...New Plane Ever?

Wed May 21, 2003 3:25 pm

Ha763 is correct, the aircraft are very well maintained and secured. Even though they are based on the 747-200 airframe, the aircraft have not logged on as much flying hours as compared to a regular commercial airliner. It is used only for Presidential flying and Air Force One doesn't fly as many daily cycles nor fly everyday as a regular commercial airliner does.
 
ConcordeBoy
Posts: 16852
Joined: Thu Feb 01, 2001 8:04 am

RE: Air Force One...New Plane Ever?

Wed May 21, 2003 3:45 pm

Will they ever change it? to a 744 or mabye even a 772LR?

Oooh, a private 772LR.... nice!

That monster could hit just about anywhere on Earth nonstop from WAS without a need for any sort of refueling. Shweet! Big grin
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
flyboy36y
Posts: 2897
Joined: Sun Mar 19, 2000 1:45 pm

RE: Air Force One...New Plane Ever?

Wed May 21, 2003 6:22 pm

Actually, I think the A380 is best suited for Air Force 1. No joke.
 
BA777
Posts: 2048
Joined: Fri Jun 29, 2001 11:40 pm

RE: Air Force One...New Plane Ever?

Wed May 21, 2003 6:30 pm

Well, you think with all the AF1's being Boeing planes, they would have to opt for a NG 772 or similar really.

Henry
 
boeing767-383
Posts: 83
Joined: Tue Nov 13, 2001 12:53 am

RE: Air Force One...New Plane Ever?

Wed May 21, 2003 8:06 pm

i the middle of 2002 and 2 i believe on of the airforce one's had about 6000 hours on it
 
jwenting
Posts: 9973
Joined: Mon Apr 23, 2001 10:12 pm

RE: Air Force One...New Plane Ever?

Wed May 21, 2003 8:12 pm

Actually, I think the A380 is best suited for Air Force 1. No joke.

I think president Chirac will happily agree with you...
But the president of the USA shouldn't have to rely on an unreliable sometime ally to provide him with transportation...
I wish I were flying
 
User avatar
RayChuang
Posts: 8005
Joined: Sat Jun 24, 2000 7:43 am

RE: Air Force One...New Plane Ever?

Wed May 21, 2003 11:27 pm

If I remember it, the VC-25A's are built structurally so they have a lot in common with the 747-400. Besides, the VC-25A has the range to fly from Andrews AFB to Moscow, Russia non-stop easily anyway.

The planes are so meticulously maintained that they're in better condition than most brand-new planes!  Big thumbs up
 
EGGD
Posts: 11880
Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2001 12:01 am

RE: Air Force One...New Plane Ever?

Wed May 21, 2003 11:42 pm

Nice of you to bring politics into this, Jt.  Big grin.

I think if they were going to buy something for long range, The A340-500 is the obvious choice.

Of course if they want to get somewhere quickly, picking up a second hand concorde would be handy. Plus they'd be able to fly it anywhere they wanted supersonic caus its the president of the United States of America, not some crappy British airline!
 
JohnJ
Posts: 1362
Joined: Tue Jun 27, 2000 5:01 am

RE: Air Force One...New Plane Ever?

Wed May 21, 2003 11:45 pm

"Well, you think with all the AF1's being Boeing planes, they would have to opt for a NG 772 or similar really."

Not to fuel a 4-engine vs. 2-engine debate, but don't you think the Presidential aircraft will always have 3-4 engines to get around ETOPS issues?
 
Greg
Posts: 5539
Joined: Sat May 28, 2005 1:11 am

RE: Air Force One...New Plane Ever?

Thu May 22, 2003 12:03 am

VC-25's can be refuled inflight....extreme range is not important.
 
aa61hvy
Posts: 13021
Joined: Fri Nov 05, 1999 9:21 am

RE: Air Force One...New Plane Ever?

Thu May 22, 2003 12:10 am

I could see a 777 as the next AF1 with GE most likely as the engine, definatley the LR or IGW. No way it would be an Airbus, come on guys "freedom fries"  Wink/being sarcastic
Go big or go home
 
na
Posts: 9161
Joined: Sun Dec 12, 1999 3:52 am

RE: Air Force One...New Plane Ever?

Thu May 22, 2003 1:20 am

The president stepping down from a 747 to a 777? Well, I hope the economical situation will never become that bad!

I bet that Boeing will have something more grand on the table when the current AF1s need to be replaced around 2015-2020!
 
srbmod
Posts: 15446
Joined: Tue Mar 20, 2001 1:32 pm

RE: Air Force One...New Plane Ever?

Thu May 22, 2003 1:25 am

When it is time to replace AF1, it'll will be with whatever 4 engined member of the 7E7 family.
 
bmacleod
Posts: 2503
Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2001 3:10 am

RE: Air Force One...New Plane Ever?

Thu May 22, 2003 1:47 am

If you look closer at AF1's engines they are the same as the current 744, PW4000s.

[Edited 2003-05-21 18:47:40]
"What good are wings without the courage to fly?" - Atticus
 
GDB
Posts: 12653
Joined: Wed May 23, 2001 6:25 pm

RE: Air Force One...New Plane Ever?

Thu May 22, 2003 2:13 am

I thought that AF1 had GE engines, in any case they are good for another 20 years.
 
citationjet
Posts: 2258
Joined: Sun Mar 09, 2003 2:26 am

RE: Air Force One...New Plane Ever?

Thu May 22, 2003 2:25 am

When the AF-1 747-200 was selected, the 747-300 had already been in service a few years (-300 went into service in 1983). However, the 747-300 did not meet some of the requirements in the AF-1 Request for Proposal (RFP). The Air Force had total cumulative fleet hours, engine service, and other requirements that the -300 did not meet. Therefore the -200 was offered.

The reason why AF1 has in-flight refueling is interesting. The competition for the AF-1 contract was between the DC-10 and the 747. The way the RFP was written initially, the DC-10 could not meet the range requirement, but the 747 could. Then the RFP was revised to require in-flight refueling capability. This was done to keep the DC-10 in the competition, even though the 747 could meet the range without the refueling system. After Boeing won the contract they offered to not install the system and refund the savings, but the government said no. There is a book written about this by Chuck Fisher, the Boeing flight test pilot. I can't remember the name.
I don't think they have ever used the in flight refueling system on AF-1, especially with the President on board.

BTW, Boeing bid $250M for the contract for the two AF1 aircraft. $250M was the cost for two regular 747s at the time. They lost about $350M on the total project, but Boeing management did not want the President in a DC-10.
Boeing Flown: 701,702,703;717;720;721,722;731,732,733,734,735,737,738,739;741,742,743,744,747SP;752,753;762,763;772,773.
 
JBirdAV8r
Posts: 3454
Joined: Sun Jun 24, 2001 4:44 am

RE: Air Force One...New Plane Ever?

Thu May 22, 2003 2:29 am

I believe the engines are GE CF6-80C2B1.
I got my head checked--by a jumbo jet
 
ConcordeBoy
Posts: 16852
Joined: Thu Feb 01, 2001 8:04 am

RE: Air Force One...New Plane Ever?

Thu May 22, 2003 3:28 am

Not to fuel a 4-engine vs. 2-engine debate, but don't you think the Presidential aircraft will always have 3-4 engines to get around ETOPS issues?

What ETOPS issues? The 777NGs are to feature ETOPS330 (if Boeing can get the approval). That will basically negate any ETOPS no-fly zones except those directly over Antarctica.
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!

Who is online