AFa340-300E
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Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 4:12 am

Hello,


Noël Forgeard just announced that Emirates was ordering 21 A380-800s and 20 A340-500s and -600s. Details will be given at a press conference, tomorrow.


Best regards,
Alain Mengus
Air Transport Business [ATB]
 
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yyz717
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 4:34 am

Attached is a Reuters news release from earlier today:

http://biz.yahoo.com/rc/030615/airshow_airbus_emirates_1.html

So EK will have 43 A380's on firm order (22 from an earlier order, 21 from this order).
I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 4:41 am

love how these reports routinely fail to specify between A340/777 model variants....
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
kaitak
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 4:47 am

In fairness, this is Airbus's side of the deal, so one assume's Noel Foregeard is, shall we say, less concerned about what Boeing gets out of it.

Good news anyway (well, for Airbus).
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 4:52 am

KaiTak raises an intersting point: EK is not a one-sided carrier, would be interesting to see what sort of order Boeing gets out of them... 25/25 for 772LR/773ER?
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
AFa340-300E
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 5:00 am

Hello,


The number of 777-300ERs that they will order will indeed be of great interest. I doubt however that they would order -200LRs with the 10 additional A340-500s that they are taking -- an order that was not announced in the report published in Flight International.

BTW, one point that surprised me: General Electric has yet to come up with the GE90-120/125B it was reportedly working on for Emirates.



But let's wait for the press conference Airbus will be giving tomorrow; we indeed don't know what are options, what are firm commitments.


The Paris Air Show no longer an exciting event? Seems like some people has spoken too early!

Best regards,
Alain Mengus
Air Transport Business [ATB]
 
CO 757-300
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 5:16 am

speaking of EK, will they EVER open up a NYC or IAD route?
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 5:17 am

I doubt however that they would order -200LRs with the 10 additional A340-500s that they are taking

What was stated some time ago was that they were considering 772LR sans supplimentary tanks to basically operate as superhigh-MTOW 772 for the replacement of their "older" 772A/ERs
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
as739x
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 5:32 am

Co 757-300: They have been talking about Dubai to JFK and SFO in 2004 with the A345. I would assume this is a much more promising of chances now! Keep your eyes open for those announcements.
ASSFO
"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 5:41 am

EK isnt the one delaying the nonstop UAE-USA flights... the USA gov't is still unassured of the safety of DXB, and have yet to raise its operation to Stage/Category-1
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
AFa340-300E
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 5:43 am

Hello ConcordeBoy,


Indeed and I mentioned this possibility in my 777X article of October 2002, but Flight International reported that Emirates would have dropped plans to replace earlier 777-200A and -200ERs, and that all the airplanes that would be ordered would be used for growth.


Best regards,
Alain Mengus
Air Transport Business [ATB]
 
flyyul
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 5:44 am

EK sure has a ton of money to waste..

Mark
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 5:45 am

Flight International also posted a few [other?] inaccuracies as well  Big grin

[Edited 2003-06-15 22:45:57]
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
Udo
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 5:47 am

I'm wondering why they regard DXB as a safe destination for MH's EWR-DXB operation...


Regards
Udo
Me & You & a Plane Named Blue...
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 6:13 am

I'm wondering why they regard DXB as a safe destination for MH's EWR-DXB operation...


It may have been at one time... just as Korea was before the USA decided it unsafe and unfit for future expansion for a time?

B747-437B explained the current problem with EK/DXB flying nonstop USA pretty well in another thread, look for that if you want a more thorough definition.
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
b757300
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 6:32 am

Jeez, I wish I had that much money to burn on a regular basis. I just can't see any airline needing such a large number of high and super high capacity aircraft. Oh well, only time will tell.
"There is no victory at bargain basement prices."
 
flyyul
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 7:58 am

Yeah even the world's largest airline dont need 20-odd A380's  Laugh out loud
 
donder10
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 8:01 am

41 on order now for Emirates?
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 8:04 am

Yeah even the world's largest airline dont need 20-odd A380's

The world's top THREE airlines barely have more than forty 747s between them.... much less forty A380s!!
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
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yyz717
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 8:25 am

41 on order now for Emirates?

43 actually.

I can't imagine where all these behemoths will fly to. In addition to the fleet of 772/773/345/346 aircraft.

I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
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RayChuang
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 10:13 am

If they could extend the runway to 16,000+ feet at DXB, how about the possibility of DXB-DTW non-stop on an EK A380?  Smile Given that the Detroit metro area has the largest population of people of Arab descent in the USA, they would love to be able to fly directly to the Middle East without having to transit through LHR, CDG, AMS or FRA.

I envisage DXB-JFK and DXB-DTW on the A388, plus DXB-SFO/LAX on the A340-500 and DXB-IAH on the A340-600HGW (this last flight serves petroleum industry workers and executives).
 
mandala499
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 10:25 am

Udo, AS739X, Co757-300,
MH has rights to go to the US and the FAA has accepted MH operating into US for years... whether it be through the Pacific or through ME/Europe. Where they stopover doesn't matter in terms of safety regulations. What matters is if there is an independent overseer for safety.

As Concordeboy says, there are problems associated with this route... So EK can get as many A345s they want, but unless the US regulatory body(ies) are satisfied that EK can have its maintenance independently supervised (a standard requirement) the US will not allow it to fly into their cities on a regular scheduled pax service. At the moment, it cannot convince anyone that the maintenance has an independent overseer because EK, DXB, and everything else about Aviation in the State of Dubai is owned by DNATA...

Further inquiries to some sources also state that EK isn't likely to be released from the clutches of DNATA because of "uncontrolled methods" of reporting financial figures. Again, there's a lack of independent auditing in this aspect...

It looks like some airlines are only in it for the game, and not for the money... Lucky they got rich backers  Smile

Mandala499
When losing situational awareness, pray Cumulus Granitus isn't nearby !
 
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RayChuang
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 10:35 am

Mandala499,

I think there is one way EK can avoid the situation you just described: have some of their fleet maintained by an outside organization, like for example use the companies that maintain the A340-600's for VS and possibly the company that will eventually maintain the A380-800's for AF. Given the large number of A340-500/600's and A380-800's EK will get the airline could spare a small number of A345/A346 and A388 airplanes to be serviced outside the DNATA organization so they get FAA certification to fly only these planes to the USA from DXB. Given how rich the backers of EK are they could afford to do this.  Smile
 
N754PR
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 11:21 am

More great news for Airbus and the A380.
Bush, your a sad, sad man.
 
Bluebellya380
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 1:42 pm

Does EK have the option of converting some of the orders to the other 380 series at a future date or strictly -800? I could see a few -700s and a couple -900s thrown into the mix, if they are actually launched. That's an awful lot of one model! Best of luck, nevertheless!
 
teahan
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 5:12 pm

Well know it is well past 10:00 (time of the press conference) and nothing anywhere). Airbus.com, Emirates.com, Boeing.com or Google News.

Jeremiah
Goodbye SR-LX MD-11 / 6th of March 1991 to the 31st of October 2004
 
teahan
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 5:39 pm

Confirmed!

- 18 A340-600
- 2 A340-500
- 21 A380-800

In addition to the direct order, 2 A380 and 2 A340-600 will be leased from ILFC.

Total: 45

Boeing portion expected this later today.

Jeremiah
Goodbye SR-LX MD-11 / 6th of March 1991 to the 31st of October 2004
 
teahan
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 5:41 pm

Goodbye SR-LX MD-11 / 6th of March 1991 to the 31st of October 2004
 
teahan
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 5:42 pm

Some more information.

Deliveries of the A340-500s will begin in 2004, A340-600s in 2007 and A380s in 2009.

Jeremiah
Goodbye SR-LX MD-11 / 6th of March 1991 to the 31st of October 2004
 
mandala499
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 6:11 pm

RayC...
Exactly !

Now, what will EK do with all those planes ? I guess it's time Ek go into some financially questionable routes ! *Hey rich backers !  Smile*

Mandala499
When losing situational awareness, pray Cumulus Granitus isn't nearby !
 
qatarairways
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 6:27 pm

Any information regarding the remaining options on the A340-500 and A380-800. Are they still valid?
 
sabenapilot
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 6:38 pm

How many A380s have been sold in total?
Must be well over 100 by now?  Wow!
I suppose even the most skeptical observer must admit by now there is a market for this huge plane after all as Airbus has always upheld?
Will the market be big enough?
Well, selling well over a hundred A380s at a moment the world economy is in a global recession and with aviation business is in its worst slump for decades is enough of an indication on how big a success this program will prove to be. Once the global economy picks up , once Asian carriers are not suffering from SARS anymore, and once aviation will be booming again, (maybe all this in 2 to 3, maybe 4 years?) it isn't hard to imagine what the orderbook of this plane will look like.....

 
Joni
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 6:50 pm


Counting the yet-to-be-inked Malaysia and Qatar orders I think the 388 backlog is now 126 units.
 
teahan
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 7:38 pm

Joni,

Well 95 firm
21 New EK Order
2 Qatar
6 Malaysia

Total: 124

Jeremiah
Goodbye SR-LX MD-11 / 6th of March 1991 to the 31st of October 2004
 
Joni
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 8:33 pm


Teahan,

I stand corrected.

 
teahan
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 8:45 pm

Goodbye SR-LX MD-11 / 6th of March 1991 to the 31st of October 2004
 
kaitak
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 8:47 pm

The split between the A340-5/600(ER) is interesting; I was only expecting 10 -600s, whereas (including the 2 ordered from ILFC), they will have 20.

I wonder if this is because Airbus needed an order of 20 to launch the -600ER. Might we see CX (which wanted a -600 with the -500's range) follow suit?

Emirates777, what's your view of all this? (Haven't heard from you in a while; hope you're keeping well!)
 
SInGAPORE_AIR
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 8:57 pm

Where do they get their money?

How many of these are being leased?

How many of these are they going to own?
Anyone can fly, only the best Soar.
 
gigneil
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Mon Jun 16, 2003 9:10 pm

I'm curious as to the actual specifications of the higher-gross-weight 346.

I'm positive that will spark an interest with the gentlemen over in Hong Kong.

I also can't wait to see how Emirates diversifies their fleet across their network.

N
 
gigneil
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Tue Jun 17, 2003 3:08 am

Their owner? They're a publically held and traded company that reports its finances just like any other multinational corporation.

Their major shareholders include Citifinancial and several German banks that I'm unfamiliar with.

They're also one of the most profitable airlines on the planet.

N
 
Scorpio
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Tue Jun 17, 2003 3:10 am

According to Emirates' website the new A380 orders include 2 freighters.

The airline has also announced the Boeing part of the deal: 26 777-300ERs to be leased through GECAS and ILFC. No direct orders from Boeing.
 
Udo
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Tue Jun 17, 2003 3:25 am

I'm really wondering why they want to operate the direct competitors A340-600s and B777-300ERs side by side. The A340-500 would seem more logical for ultra long hauls, plus B777-300ERs for 'normal' long hauls. But who cares? Image is everything, and they can afford it. Just fantastic to imagine one could fly A346, B773ER, A380 on a stop over round trip (e.g. to Asia), on one single airline...


Regards
Udo
Me & You & a Plane Named Blue...
 
Greg
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Tue Jun 17, 2003 3:34 am

I'm glad to see both Airbus and Boeing doing well by Emirates.
However, this is very close to financial suicide when you start looking at their current revenues.
I can't see where they expect all their growth to materialize. Nobody wants to stop in the middle east on their way from Europe to Asia.

It's a very interesting saga considering five years ago they were basically nothing.....

Brgds.
 
flying lsd
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Tue Jun 17, 2003 4:20 am

Emirates will add 26 new 777 300 ER but it's a sad day for Boeing for them it's NOT a new order because Emirates will lease these birds from Gecas and another company.
 
Udo
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Tue Jun 17, 2003 4:38 am

Nobody wants to stop in the Middle East? I think their planes are full exactly for the reason that people do like stopovers at Dubai. People know well the difference between Israel/Palestine and peaceful regions like the UAE.
I personally couldn't imagine a better stopover airport than DXB, maybe SIN or HKG but that's already Asia. DXB is a perfect hub and it will grow to a super hub of dimensions nobody can really imagine today. 40+ A380 based at DXB say a lot...


Regards
Udo
Me & You & a Plane Named Blue...
 
cfalk
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Tue Jun 17, 2003 4:40 am

Well, I guess we'll know who will provide the biggest A380 order cancellation in a few years.

Emirates is absolutely nuts.

Charles
The only thing you should feel when shooting a terrorist: Recoil.
 
Udo
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Tue Jun 17, 2003 4:45 am

Charles,

Emirates is not Swiss.


Regards
Udo
Me & You & a Plane Named Blue...
 
kaitak
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Tue Jun 17, 2003 4:51 am

It's a big risk, but a noble and impressive one. Say what you want about EK having money burn, yada, yada, yada . . . EK is only a part of what Dubai is doing (and this is precisely what worries me about Qatar - it isn't doing what Dubai is). Dubai is transforming itself and has been for the past thirty years. It has planned forward and you can be pretty sure that for every year of EK's existence, there were people who were only too keen to say, "can't be done"; they said the same about SIA in the late 70s when it ordered 747s and again when it ordered 14 743s in the early 80s. And look now.

Maybe they will need to defer some; it's not as if other airlines haven't, from time to time. Who knows what's ahead; last year, we have no inkling of SARS, but on the other hand, what better way to signal a future; what better way to mark out your vision for your society and your economy than something like this. Such confidence can help to create confidence among inward investors too and it creates a challenge to the Dubai government to ensure the innovation machine keeps churning!

And don't forget, Dubai knows oil wealth is limited; would it be logical to place such a huge order unless is paralleled this with huge developments in Dubai. Make no mistake, Dubai is creating its own future - investing, building and challenging itself. I wish it luck. It deserves it. Great achievement never comes without risk.

And a little message to EK; you've just spent an eleven figure sum on new airplanes. Do you think you could just spare three A330s a week to Dublin! Ah go on, you will, you will, you will . . .
 
cfalk
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Tue Jun 17, 2003 4:55 am

Udo,

Swiss won't survive long enough to take delivery of an A380. They will be bankrupt before it is put into service.

But can you expect me to believe that Emirates can fill over 40 of these monsters when Airlines like Lufthansa, British Airways, Singapore, and Qantas cannot? Maybe they just want to use them once per year on Haj charters, but this is ridiculous.

Charles
The only thing you should feel when shooting a terrorist: Recoil.
 
Udo
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RE: Airbus Announces EK Order

Tue Jun 17, 2003 5:04 am

Even if they used them once per year, they would not go out business. But I'm quite sure they know what they are doing and they will have use for the aircraft.
Kai Tak gave a good hint. Who thought 20 years ago that SIA would become one of the world's largest B744 and B777 operators, plus permanent leader in service issues? Who thought 20 years ago that Swissair would disappear?

EK will grow to something which only few people can imagine today.


Regards
Udo
Me & You & a Plane Named Blue...

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