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Topic Author
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SAS And Baghdad

Thu Jul 03, 2003 8:23 pm

Swedish radio reported some minutes ago that SAS has applied for twice weekly Copenhagen - Baghdad flights.

I wonder when services could start and what equipment will be used. I guess the distance is too long for a A321 as a nonstop service though.
The A321s were planned to serve (among others)TLV, before turmoil restarted in that area. So perhaps they could be deployed on Baghdad instead. They are used mostly on intrascandinavian routes so two runs to Iraq could probably be managed as well.
Or is SAS planning to keep the remaining 767s a little longer?

Or could CPH - Istanbul - Baghdad be possible?


 
vadheim
Posts: 539
Joined: Wed Jul 26, 2000 9:21 pm

RE: SAS And Baghdad

Thu Jul 03, 2003 9:54 pm

I think it would be a direct service, maybe B737-800?? Most SAS flights are direct flights, and direct point to point service has been part of their philosophy so far!


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copenhagenboy
Posts: 541
Joined: Fri Sep 14, 2001 11:03 pm

RE: SAS And Baghdad

Thu Jul 03, 2003 10:52 pm

They are not allowed to refuel in Bagdad, so it have to be with a one stop flight or a longdistance airplane.
 
traveler_7
Posts: 448
Joined: Tue May 23, 2000 12:45 am

RE: SAS And Baghdad

Thu Jul 03, 2003 11:20 pm

Why they are not allowed to refuel in Baghdad?
 
CPH-R
Posts: 6059
Joined: Thu May 03, 2001 5:19 pm

RE: SAS And Baghdad

Thu Jul 03, 2003 11:32 pm

Because the US authorities tells them so  Wink/being sarcastic

Could it be a possible CPH-SDA-KUW-CPH routing?
 
airsicknessbag
Posts: 4626
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RE: SAS And Baghdad

Thu Jul 03, 2003 11:36 pm


If AF stops non-stop flights to TLV in order to prevent their crews from staying in Israel overnight, maybe SK will do somthing similar, like stopping at LCA to change crews and add fuel for LCA-SDA-LCA and LCA-CPH respectively.

>>>Why they are not allowed to refuel in Baghdad?

a) to minimise ground time in a country which is basically in the midst of a guerilla war

b) fuel is a scarce commodity in Iraq, so why not carry it in from the outside if you can?

c) lack of security equipment needed to be present when refuelling (fire trucks, ambulances etc.)

d) less-than-optimal infrastructure at SDA.

That´s what I´d come up with on first thought.

Daniel Smile
 
airmale
Posts: 7125
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RE: SAS And Baghdad

Thu Jul 03, 2003 11:54 pm

It will be SK's only middle eastern destination. Glad to see them back in the region.
.....up there with the best!
 
luv2fly
Posts: 11056
Joined: Tue May 13, 2003 2:57 am

RE: SAS And Baghdad

Thu Jul 03, 2003 11:58 pm

Also I read 2 hour on the ground maximum time limit as well. And no catering at this time so you need to carry pax meals for the return trip with you.
You can cut the irony with a knife
 
copenhagenboy
Posts: 541
Joined: Fri Sep 14, 2001 11:03 pm

RE: SAS And Baghdad

Fri Jul 04, 2003 12:52 am

I have just heard in the news they want to fly it direct 7 days in the week, but there will be a big competition, because only one company from Europe will be allowed to fly into Baghdad. BA, Lufthansa and KLM is also trying to have the route. Don't know if it is only rumors.

[Edited 2003-07-03 17:53:30]
 
carduelis
Posts: 1388
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RE: SAS And Baghdad

Fri Jul 04, 2003 1:13 am

http://www.britishairways.com/press/?source=RHG_press_en

Edited to say, you'll have to put 'Baghdad' in the News Releases Search box to see the article.

OK, so it is two months old, but clearly states that BA have got traffic rights.

I thought the reason of US going to Iraq was to get rid of SH, not to take over . . . !

Or maybe many of us are mistaken . . . ?



[Edited 2003-07-03 18:23:03]
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SAS-A321
Posts: 348
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RE: SAS And Baghdad

Fri Jul 04, 2003 9:08 am

If they were allowed to refuel in Baghdad, there would be no problems using the A321. At www.sasflightops.com I found that the max. range for the A321 is 5700km. And the great circle route to SDA is about 4000km.
But if they get the rights I think that they will use the B767...
It's Scandinavian
 
FBU 4EVER!
Posts: 980
Joined: Sat Jan 27, 2001 6:53 am

RE: SAS And Baghdad

Fri Jul 04, 2003 5:20 pm

SAS have only applied for traffic rights.No firm plans for operation in the foreseeable future.
A likely candidate for the operation would bee the A321,if it remains in the SAS fleet,that is.All 8 are now on the "transfer list" for sale or leasing.
The 767 is out of the question as the last one will be phased out at the end of November this year.Maintaining a fleet of one,or possibly two,would be prohibitively expensive for a twice-weekly schedule.
Most likely solution will be a MD-82/737-700 one-stop operation with Beirut,Tel Aviv,possibly Cairo as likely places.
"Luck and superstition wins all the time"!
 
vadheim
Posts: 539
Joined: Wed Jul 26, 2000 9:21 pm

RE: SAS And Baghdad

Fri Jul 04, 2003 5:40 pm

Would'nt there be lots of security restrictions flying between Tel Aviv and Baghdad? I would think so!
 
Sean-SAN-
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RE: SAS And Baghdad

Fri Jul 04, 2003 5:44 pm

CPH-Tel Aviv-Baghdad? LOL LOL LOL !!!

That's completely ridiculous!
 
FBU 4EVER!
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RE: SAS And Baghdad

Fri Jul 04, 2003 7:33 pm

CPH-Baghdad via TLV ridiculous?well,not really!.With Israeli control on one end and U.S. control on the other,with pro-western Jordan in between,what would the problem be?
"Luck and superstition wins all the time"!
 
SAS-A321
Posts: 348
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RE: SAS And Baghdad

Fri Jul 04, 2003 8:53 pm

"The 767 is out of the question as the last one will be phased out at the end of November this year.Maintaining a fleet of one,or possibly two,would be prohibitively expensive for a twice-weekly schedule."

You are right about that... But until it is phased out they could use it...
The A321 is already flying to Beirut so it would be a possible to make a combination of that route: CPH-Beirut-Baghdad.
Very interesting to see what will happen.
It's Scandinavian
 
FBU 4EVER!
Posts: 980
Joined: Sat Jan 27, 2001 6:53 am

RE: SAS And Baghdad

Fri Jul 04, 2003 11:01 pm

Well,Beirut is a "Snowflake" destination for the time being and the most likely customers initially will be Scandinavian military,UN and diplomatic persons with completely different needs from what they get from a LCC operation like "Snowflake". Besides, SAS says the destination will be operated by SAS Airline,not "Snowflake".
A 767 operation could be technically possible,but with in excess of 200 seats not very economical and,in view of the economic situation here at SAS,highly unlikely.A direct flight with a 737-700 or -800 is possible,but with the temporary restrictions on fuel uplift rules out this option for the time being.When,or IF,the route starts up,it will most probably with a stop outside Baghdad,possibly with a third pilot as relief.
"Luck and superstition wins all the time"!
 
transswede
Posts: 969
Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2001 9:30 am

RE: SAS And Baghdad

Sat Jul 05, 2003 1:35 am

Beirut, Istanbul, or Cairo sounds like the most likely 1-stop stopovers, if the route happens. But it's only my specualtion.

TLV will be politically impossible, I think.
 
airmale
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RE: SAS And Baghdad

Sat Jul 05, 2003 1:44 am

What other middle eastern destinations have SK served in the past?
.....up there with the best!
 
transswede
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RE: SAS And Baghdad

Sat Jul 05, 2003 3:11 am

They did serve Baghdad and Dubai at least...
 
Alessandro
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RE: SAS And Baghdad

Sat Jul 05, 2003 5:32 am

There´s a large Iraqi ex-pat market in Scandinavia (which this route are directed at) and I don´t think they would´ve like to fly to Iraq by Israel.....
From New Yorqatar to Califarbia...
 
FBU 4EVER!
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RE: SAS And Baghdad

Sat Jul 05, 2003 5:14 pm

The Iraqi population would not be on the flights to Baghdad during the early period anyway.By the time they would start to travel,the fuel restrictions would have been lifted and direct flights will take place.
What little fuel is available in Iraq at the moment is reseved for Coalition planes and choppers.Hence the refueling outside Iraq requirement.
"Luck and superstition wins all the time"!
 
transswede
Posts: 969
Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2001 9:30 am

RE: SAS And Baghdad

Sun Jul 06, 2003 10:22 am

True... But it still would not be a very smart thing to do. In the near future, any incoming passenger liner to Baghdad originating from Tel Aviv will be quite a magnet for SAM's, RPG's, and small arms fire.  Smile

I read a report from a aweek or two ago that coalition military aircraft landing in Baghdad still take sparadic small arms fire (in their general direction) on every approach. The way things are now (and seem to be heading), it will be quite a while before any airline in their right mind would fly to Baghdad.