Topic Author
Posts: 2166
Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2001 7:46 am

HP/US Merger?

Fri Aug 01, 2003 8:51 am

To me, it seems to be a perfect match. The 732s dont, but there are only 12. And US seems intent on getting about 500 regional partners. The resulting operation:
Hubs at CLT, PHL, PHX (sorry PIT)
133 cities served
27 A318
125 733
102 A319
54 734
100 A320
41 A321
47 752
10 762
10 A332
9 A333
Your thoughts?
Posts: 540
Joined: Tue Dec 31, 2002 1:01 pm

RE: HP/US Merger?

Fri Aug 01, 2003 8:54 am

My thoughts?

Neither of these companies is in a position to take on the added burden that any merger would create.
ei a330-200
Posts: 341
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2001 8:22 am

RE: HP/US Merger?

Fri Aug 01, 2003 8:56 am

What is HP, again? My mind isn't working!!
Posts: 6050
Joined: Sat Dec 02, 2000 9:40 am

RE: HP/US Merger?

Fri Aug 01, 2003 8:57 am

HP- America West

Fly the Flag!!!!
Posts: 5155
Joined: Wed Mar 01, 2000 11:10 am

RE: HP/US Merger?

Fri Aug 01, 2003 8:59 am

EL A330,
HP is America West. Or is it AmWest? America Worst? Whatever, it's the one based out of Phoenix with the interesting green and orange planes.

Watch out- they're making profit!!!! How did THAT happen!?!?!?!?!!!

ei a330-200
Posts: 341
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2001 8:22 am

RE: HP/US Merger?

Fri Aug 01, 2003 9:00 am

Thanks. I just didn't think that they'd use HP as the initials. Why is that, BTW???
Posts: 293
Joined: Sat Jul 05, 2003 11:24 pm

RE: HP/US Merger?

Fri Aug 01, 2003 9:01 am

HP has come a long way in recent years, but with the industry the way it is, I don't think they will grow much in the coming years as they might have without 9-11. Finances has always been at the heart of what is wrong with them, and it will take some time to correct past mistakes.
Posts: 7714
Joined: Sat Oct 14, 2000 6:13 am

RE: HP/US Merger?

Fri Aug 01, 2003 9:04 am

America West has worked hard to restructure itself into a profitable low cost airline - they have had their problems along the way, but they are in rather good shape now. America West goes one-one-one with Southwest in many markets, and does just fine and is making some money.....not many other US carriers can say that at this moment.

Why would they want to hook up with US Airways.......US just got out of bankruptcy and is in the process of adjusting their route system and fleet in a hope to make a profit. Just because they both fly A32X and B757 aircraft is no reason for the 2 carriers to merge.

You may remember that US has had its experiences on the West Coast, they bought PSA, the original low-fare carrier, and 100% failed and closed the entire west coast route system down. If PSA would have been left alone to survive, Southwest would not be the airline it is today.
User avatar
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RE: HP/US Merger?

Fri Aug 01, 2003 9:13 am

U is fighting a up hill battle against LCCs on the East coast, why would they want to take on the biggest, strongest LCC of them all (WN) who virtually owns HP's hubs at LAS and PHX.

U and UAL will try again in the future to merge, but not for awhile and not untill the conditions improve dramatically.
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
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RE: HP/US Merger?

Fri Aug 01, 2003 9:14 am

If anything, US and UAL will merge eventually, since they're both in the star alliance, and have tried already, and already have the code shares in place, among other reasons....can't see US and HP, sorry.
And the winner for best actress is....REESE WITHERSPOON for 'Walk the Line'!!!!!!!!
Posts: 89
Joined: Sat Jul 12, 2003 4:04 am

RE: HP/US Merger?

Fri Aug 01, 2003 9:16 am

I doubt the Pilot Unions at either US or HP would support a merger as it would certainly lead to consolidation and job going from each airline.
Posts: 2194
Joined: Fri Jul 09, 1999 12:15 pm

RE: HP/US Merger?

Fri Aug 01, 2003 9:22 am

Funny story about America West's identifier being "HP"...

Once upon a time, 20 years ago, a fledgling airline was being created, to be named America West. The people bringing said airline to life were dismayed to discover that their identifier would have a number in it (like how jetBlue is B6 and Frontier is F9, etc). They believed that having a number in the identifier was associated with having a small unimportant airline. Much to their surprise, a failed start-up, called Hawaiian Pacific, had their code "HP" up for grabs. Hence forth, America West started operations with the identifier HP.

The End
(At least that's the info I got during my tenure with the company.)

As for a merger between America West and USAirways...it has its pro's and its con's. The initial idea sounds good. USAirways would get their long-desired West Coast presence, America West would finally have an East Coast presence. Both airlines have similar fleet types and both have Mesa as regional affiliated. However, there would be a lot of hurdles to complete also. USAirways already failed taking on Southwest at Baltimore, imagine having to deal with Southwest at Las Vegas and Phoenix, America West's main hubs. In addition, America West's Airbus fleet has different engines compared to USAirways'. Not to mention the costs associated with such an endeavor, unless the RSA would like to chip in some funds from their endless pockets.
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Joined: Tue May 13, 2003 2:57 am

RE: HP/US Merger?

Fri Aug 01, 2003 9:35 am

Can not see it happening, sorry. Can see HP doing more PIT flights tho! I could even see them doing more of a focus city out of PIT if there financial conditions improve.
You can cut the irony with a knife
Posts: 7618
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2000 3:12 pm

RE: HP/US Merger?

Fri Aug 01, 2003 9:39 am

The merger mania of the mid to late 80s will likely not be repeated anytime soon. For one the given pool of airlines is considerably smaller. And secondly the majors have learned that the costs of a merger are extremely high, much more than the initial acquistion cost. Alliances appear to be the wave of the future. However airlines in well managed and coordinated alliances with very similiar cost structures maybe prime candidates for mergers.
Stop drop and roll will not save you in hell. --- seen on a church marque in rural Virginia
Matt D
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RE: HP/US Merger?

Fri Aug 01, 2003 9:44 am

Exactly how DID America West manage to survive 80's merger mania?

By '87-'88, they were right about ripe for takeover. Not too big, and not small enough to remain unnoticed?

I remember reading an article in Air Transport World written in '88 and both AWA and SWA were written off as the "next and last" takeover targets.
Posts: 3730
Joined: Fri Nov 16, 2001 11:59 am

RE: HP/US Merger?

Fri Aug 01, 2003 9:46 am

Can't see that merger. Don't forget US is trying to get rid of all it's boeing aircraft. Once the 332's come in the 762's will be retired. The new EMB-170's will eventually take the place of the 733's and 734's.

HP and a focus city at PIT??? If they couldn't keep a focus city in CMH than how do you expect them to keep one in PIT, not too far away.
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Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2000 3:12 pm

RE: HP/US Merger?

Fri Aug 01, 2003 9:52 am

I'd suspect that both HP and WN benefited from the fact that their was a finite number of buyers at the time. And they bought up the seemingly more attractive airlines out there... namely PSA, AirCal, Western, Piedmont, and Republic. And with Lorenzo's airlines all tied up in a quagmire of mergers and other bizarre things most of the majors had picked up a regional. The only exception was United, but they didn't need to acquire a regional to improve their national coverage (though I suppose the 1986 buyout of PanAm's Pacific routes is in a sense a type of merger).
Stop drop and roll will not save you in hell. --- seen on a church marque in rural Virginia
Posts: 1443
Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2003 9:55 am

RE: HP/US Merger?

Fri Aug 01, 2003 9:52 am

HP and a focus city at PIT???

I don't see a PIT focus city. However, I've heard HP's new PHX-PIT flights have been doing fairly well. I wonder what the possibilities of LAS-PIT are.
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RE: HP/US Merger?

Fri Aug 01, 2003 10:10 pm

US seems contenet to stay a super regional carrier. They bought up, who was it, PSA or someone on the west coast could make it work ended up abondoning the west coast for the most part and selling those intra-californoia routes to none other than UA. At least that's how the story was told to me.

US seems to want to play to its strengths at this time. In addition HP seems to be heading toward a more LCC type service. This makes sems since they are relativily small and are in Southwest's territory. HP apparently has decided to join the ranks of LCC's and make a go at it. So far fairly sucessfully. US on th eother hand is attempting to remain a for lack of a better term "Full service" carrier.

Bottom line niether airline seems to fit with the other for various reasons. HP doesn't need or want more expoure to the extreme competition of the North east. US doesn't need access to the west it has that through the partnership w/ UA. (Why fly it yourself when some one else can) They both seem to be attempting to make a go at it with different strategies, both may be sucessful but niether will want to mess up those strategies by linking to one another.
A little less Hooah, and a little more Dooah.

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