CV990
Topic Author
Posts: 4224
Joined: Sat May 22, 1999 3:49 am

Why Do You Love Swiss?

Wed Sep 17, 2003 10:30 am


H
SWISS needs to be loved, I know that now most people feel like cheated the way Swissair broke and this is like when in a couple one of them have an extra-marital relation. I think some of our friends in this forum feel disapointed with the colapse of Swissair and the born of SWISS. But we must agree, when you're in a international airport and you see that nice red tail with a white cross you mind is transported away and you imagine beautifull things about the country and the airline of course. In the past Swissair was a great reference to civil aviation, they operated top-technology aircraft, some they actually helped to develop like the MD80, the CV990, the DC-9, the DC-10. Swiss aviation people gave a big contribution to the safety and orientation rules for civil aviation since the beggining. Swissair was one of the only neutral airlines to actually fly during the WWII, sacrificing crews to fly people all over Europe and eventually losing some airplanes too. Swissair lost some planes in hijackings and bombs on board when they stayed neutral. It will be too bad to lose the identity of SWISS and I strongly think SWISS will wake up from this "bad dream" soon, of course some people will be angry because they want to take advantage of the weakness of SWISS now to jump over them, but knowing the swiss people and knowing the past of Swissair and people that worked there I'm sure they'll come really strong. Besides that it's always a pleasure to fly with them, and my contribute hereunder goes with all the flights I did with them:

1979/11/23
LIS/GVA
DC-9-51
HB-ISR

1981/09/01
LIS/GVA
DC-9-81
HB-INM

1982/12/06
LIS/GVA
DC-9-81
HB-IND

1987/09/28
LIS/GVA/ZRH
DC-9-81
HB-INI

1987/10/01
ZRH/LIS
A310-200
HB-IPD

1998/10/23
LIS/ZRH
A321-111
HB-IOF

1998/11/03
ZRH/LIS
A321-111
HB-IOE

1999/09/03
LIS/ZRH
A321-111
HB-IOA

1999/09/13
ZRH/LIS
A321-111
HB-IOH

2002/12/15
A320-214
LIS/ZRH
HB-IJN

2002/12/16
MD11
ZRH/LAX
HB-IWM

That's why I'm a fan of SWISS!!!
Regards
CV990, the Maserati of the skies!
 
saab2000
Posts: 1216
Joined: Thu Jun 21, 2001 6:19 pm

RE: Why Do You Love Swiss?

Wed Sep 17, 2003 3:10 pm

They sign my paycheck.

But that will soon be finished. Then I don't really care anymore. Until then I will do my job professionally and safely.

SWISS has done a lot to alienate most of their employees. I am not sure I know anyone who is really happy to work for SWISS. They are happy to have jobs in aviation, but nobody really feels any loyalty to SWISS.

Sorry to say it, but that is the reality, at least for most employees.

smrtrthnu
 
Unique
Posts: 1621
Joined: Fri Mar 14, 2003 12:48 am

RE: Why Do You Love Swiss?

Wed Sep 17, 2003 4:31 pm

To put things straight for once and forever: I never worked for Swissair nor Crossair nor do I work for Swiss! I have no direct relationship to LX except that LX is the biggest customer of my employer - the airport company.

That's the only reason why I hope LX to survive!

Endless discussions about their management, route cuts, airplanes, staff, etc. etc. Everybody might be right in what he/she says, but I sincerely hope LX to survive (and indirectly save my job).

I agree when you're saying that the airport will further exist even without LX, but if the airport is reduced to a regional airport, lots of jobs will be lost on our side, too. That's the way the cookies crumble.
I do care if LX is taken over by LH or not as the airport depends on intercontinental flights and not on flights to MUC and FRA.

I sincerely hope that the LX managers as well as the politicians take the right decision (for once).

Spread your wings! FLY!
 
jamesvf84
Posts: 129
Joined: Tue Sep 16, 2003 5:18 pm

RE: Why Do You Love Swiss?

Wed Sep 17, 2003 4:50 pm

I once had a problem while traveling and Swissair went out of their way to help. The quote, "Such a refreshing airline", certainly does not require a lot of thought as to fathom out why!

I frequently travel within Europe and have traveled to Bangkok, Tokyo, Montreal and NY and all with Swissair / Swiss. I have never had to complain.

Why change when everything is fine, I do sympathize with the employees as they seem to be on the receiving edge of this new radical pay cut and job loss. It cannot be very motivating and they do put on a brave and smiley face. Hats off to you chaps!

I will not be happy to see Swiss ground to a halt, it is just a shame that so many happy customers, content employees have been mislead and used by the few mindless greedy over ambitious ex-Swissair and present board of directors. Having said that the latter have made improvements but not all the mistakes that were made by the Swissair directors seem to have been correctly understood!

In the mean time I will continue to fly Swiss as long as possible!

 
LH526
Crew
Posts: 1960
Joined: Fri Aug 04, 2000 2:23 am

RE: Why Do You Love Swiss?

Wed Sep 17, 2003 5:18 pm

Well, I love Swiss becaus it goes beyond the borders of pure "people movers". I'm a very aesthetic person, I like design. So that is a very thing of Swiss, I like their style, their design, their understatement. Tyler Brulé and his Winkmedia did a great job there.

Mario
LH526
Trittst im Morgenrot daher, seh ich dich im Strahlenmeer ...
 
Andreas
Posts: 5880
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2001 7:56 pm

RE: Why Do You Love Swiss?

Wed Sep 17, 2003 5:31 pm

Well, my mum loved Swissair, she refused to fly anything but...

Unfortunately after Swissair went belly-up, the routes that my mum frequently uses are no more there, so she switched to LH...and was not really impressed... Big grin
I know it's only VfB but I like it!
 
707CMF
Posts: 4698
Joined: Thu Mar 14, 2002 5:39 pm

RE: Why Do You Love Swiss?

Wed Sep 17, 2003 5:35 pm

Well, ask any user with an username starting with "Sabena" why they love Swiss.  Laugh out loud Laugh out loud

707
 
UTA_flyinghigh
Posts: 6304
Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2001 8:46 pm

RE: Why Do You Love Swiss?

Wed Sep 17, 2003 5:38 pm

...or anyone who has worked with Air Lib and lost their jobs.
Will
Fly to live, live to fly - Air France/KLM Flying Blue Platinum, BMI Diamond Club Gold, Emirates Skywards
 
Rotate
Posts: 1448
Joined: Tue Feb 11, 2003 5:52 pm

RE: Why Do You Love Swiss?

Wed Sep 17, 2003 6:05 pm

tyler brule got 60 mio for that..., quiet exspensive, if you ask me ......

robin
ABC
 
Guest

RE: Why Do You Love Swiss?

Wed Sep 17, 2003 6:11 pm

I don't LOVE Swiss. For me SWISS is nothing else but SWISSAIR without responsibility against old SR-customers.
New name and no refund of SR-tickets, no paying SR-bills.
 
TriStar500
Posts: 4411
Joined: Thu Nov 04, 1999 9:50 pm

RE: Why Do You Love Swiss?

Wed Sep 17, 2003 6:56 pm

Sorry to sound so harsh, but to me, SWISS is only a faint shadow of the quality and worldclass airline Swissair once was.
Homer: Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true!
 
MAC100
Posts: 262
Joined: Wed Oct 25, 2000 7:53 am

RE: Why Do You Love Swiss?

Wed Sep 17, 2003 10:44 pm

What's to "love" about them? They are an average airline like many others. Still the same elitist attitude that made SR go away, though.
 
CV990
Topic Author
Posts: 4224
Joined: Sat May 22, 1999 3:49 am

RE: Why Do You Love Swiss?

Thu Sep 18, 2003 10:26 am


Hi!

Thanks for your feedback. I feel that specially for SWISS they still want to see the airline going on, well at least because they recieved their money from them directly or indirectly. For germans it's interesting, some of them don't like SWISS at all but in the oposite way they want LH to bid to take SWISS, this means something, and for me is that if they take SWISS one day they'll not stop bragging saying that who saved SWISS were LH, and that is very curious and probably there are some hiden issues involved!!!
Regards
CV990, the Maserati of the skies!
 
rey777
Posts: 169
Joined: Fri Apr 20, 2001 4:51 am

RE: Why Do You Love Swiss?

Fri Sep 19, 2003 3:37 am

Well... just ask ex-crossair people what they think of SWISS management. Sorry to say that but for me SWISS is nothing more than Swissair Hold up on Crossair.
"Hey, give us your planes, your money and get the f... out of here".
I just wonder If anyone of you know what really happened for ex-crossair employees...

rey777
 
CV990
Topic Author
Posts: 4224
Joined: Sat May 22, 1999 3:49 am

RE: Why Do You Love Swiss?

Fri Sep 19, 2003 11:52 am


Hi!

I find out that actually people really hate the management and all the issues involved, well I must agree this is not a piece of cake, but I was talking more in a aviation/enthusiast way. We must "separate the waters", one thing is the poor choises, strategies, etc. etc. another is the SWISS product, fleet, service, confort, etc. etc.
If we see SWISS in those eyes maybe the opinions are different. My feeling is that when Jeffrey Katz came to Swissair and the megalomanic projects he had for Swissair really dumped the airline down, THY, TAP, AOM, Sabena were infact not the best choises, but thats history now.
I'm looking more for the people that work in SWISS now and is trying their best to raise up SWISS, crews, ordinary workers, those that really generate money for the airline, those really have my deepest respect and solidarity, that's why I want SWISS to keep flying!
Regards
CV990, the Maserati of the skies!
 
saab2000
Posts: 1216
Joined: Thu Jun 21, 2001 6:19 pm

RE: Why Do You Love Swiss?

Fri Sep 19, 2003 3:21 pm

Rey777,

Interesting of you to bring this up. Myself and hundreds of other former Crossair employees have been shown the door. I will be finished at the end of October.

Yes, hundreds of pilots and flight attendants of Crossair have been fired. Yet none of the former Swissair people have been fired (except when Swissair itself still existed and went bankrupt). Our costs are much lower, yet we have been eliminated in favor of the Golden Boys of Swissair.

I am glad at least one other person sees the truth here.

I am sure the former Sabena people feel about as good about Swissair people as I do.
smrtrthnu
 
MD-11 forever
Posts: 550
Joined: Wed Mar 14, 2001 12:15 am

RE: Why Do You Love Swiss?

Fri Sep 19, 2003 4:59 pm

Saab2000

I can understand your grief, but please stay at a certain fairness level. When you talk about Swissair people, you are talking about pilots, right? do you happen to know that not all Swissair employees were pilots?Do you think a ticket sales agent coming from Swissair to Swiss and now being outsourced to Swissport (by the way loosing a lot of flight privileges...) is what you call a golden boy? If so, I really have no understanding for your position.

Please stay at least fair, ok? By the way, I assume that a lot of the managers, responsible for the troubles at Swiss were from Crossair, also the CEO, who used to be one of your group... So also Crossair managers are not as shiny as some might think.

And, also around 400 people at my company are or will be shown the door because of the "great" managment in place at Swiss. I also feel not happy about them, but the regular staff workers at Swiss, are NOT responsible for this, no matter whether they are ex Swissair or ex Crossair, so there is no reson to feel bad about them. The people who deserve to feel angry about them are wearing the nice suits and calling themselves "managers"!

Cheers, Thomas
 
saab2000
Posts: 1216
Joined: Thu Jun 21, 2001 6:19 pm

RE: Why Do You Love Swiss?

Fri Sep 19, 2003 7:17 pm

Thomas,

We have discussed this before. Yes, the management is responsible. I agree. And I will be the first one to say loudly that the management is made up of many, many ex-Crossair "managers". But not exclusively. There are also many ex-Swissair managers, including Manfred Brennwald, who also have a hand in what is going on. He is a member of Aeropers and thus by definition cannot be objective regarding the layoffs. The CEO is ex-Crossair, but the Chairman of the Board is not. He is ex-KLM and should be more competent than he has been. I have been VERY disappointed in him.

I am not blaming all the ex-Swissair employees - simply being critical of the fact that practically all working conditions in the company are better for them than for ex-Crossair. This just is not fair!

I feel badly for all who lose their jobs in this environment. Yes, all, including non-pilots. BTW, most of the outsourcing of ticketing, handling, check-in, etc to Swissport happened before Swissair went bankrupt. That is nothing new at all and certainly is not the fault of SWISS.

Also, off the subject here a bit. And I am not trying to kiss your ass but I think that maintainance and engineering of an airline is perhaps THE most important part of the company. Mechanics have the worst job in the sense that nobody respects the knowledge they require and at least the line maintainance guys are always working under stress. If an airplane cannot fly because of a mechanical reason it causes the company to lose a bucketload of money.

I feel badly for all the mechanics, and everyone else, who is losing their job as a result of the incompetence of the company. And yes, it is incompetence. That I will say loudly.
smrtrthnu
 
rey777
Posts: 169
Joined: Fri Apr 20, 2001 4:51 am

RE: Why Do You Love Swiss?

Sat Sep 20, 2003 5:50 am

In terms of product, I think SWISS is questionnable...
The strategy is struggling.
First time "Destination Excellence"... and then SWISS Express... and then not anymore "Express" but something like Low Cost... Oooops we dont have any low cost ! Hey, what are we going to do ?

First question to ask : "what kind of product my customers want ? ". But SWISS has first asked : "what kind of product we like to have to show we are the best ? "

In terms of human ressources, SWISS is nothing more than a genocide from ex-SR to ex-LX... One more time, just ask all people who leave the company at the end of october what they think about this.

rey777