bartond
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DFW News....anything?

Tue Oct 21, 2003 1:13 am

Hey I haven't heard much on the DFW front as of late. A few months ago, we had all sorts of wild rumours flying around and it was fun. Few of them were true but it was still fun to listen to and ponder the possibilities.

The only couple of rumours that I've heard recently are that possibly Cathay Pacific is thinking about starting service here, and Eva has been trying for quite some time to get service. I would think that these flights would be extensions from LAX, SFO, SEA, and/or YVR but I'm not sure if these airlines have freedom rights for those flights.

Even so, is anything else happening with/for DFW? Aside from the new AA flight to EZE and the expansion of Airtran with flights to BWI, MCO, etc. (boring) what else is going on? Any info. would be appreciated.
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: DFW News....anything?

Tue Oct 21, 2003 1:18 am

The only couple of rumours that I've heard recently are that possibly Cathay Pacific is thinking about starting service here

I'm willing to bet my first child on that not happening any time in the foreseeable future. What do you wage?  Wink/being sarcastic
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
bartond
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RE: DFW News....anything?

Tue Oct 21, 2003 2:44 am

A bit of a strange bet from you, sir. Ha. I'm broker'n a church mouse so I won't bet on any airline rumours, that's for sure. I just like stirring things up and talking about new stuff for my home airport.
 
ssides
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RE: DFW News....anything?

Tue Oct 21, 2003 4:09 am

The Cathay Pacific stuff wouldn't surprise me, maybe a cargo flight or something along those lines.
"Lose" is not spelled with two o's!!!!
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: DFW News....anything?

Tue Oct 21, 2003 4:43 am

A bit of a strange bet from you, sir.

...and a very safe bet as well  Laugh out loud
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
jcs17
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RE: DFW News....anything?

Tue Oct 21, 2003 10:59 am

Cathay Pacific Cargo wouldnt surprise me at all, nor would JAL Cargo. Every Asian cargo carrier does very well at DFW--I believe EVA is now twice daily on some days.

As for passenger service, Air France will most likely return for next summer (dropped after 9/11) with either a 772 or 343 (at the Delta terminal). However, nothing has been announced as of yet. Skyteam is lacking a European feed from DFW currently.

EVA Air has been rumored to come to DFW for quite a long time, and with all the success they have had on the cargo side of things it certainly helps things. Cathay has balked so far at DFW service, favoring a possible flights ORD instead. Although AA wants CX at DFW and not ORD.

In my opinion, nothing major (other than AF returning) will occur until the new international terminal is completed. When that occurs, we might see a few more international carriers try a run at DFW (just to throw a couple names out--JAL and KLM). Currently the situation with customs and gates is atrocious at Terminal B which makes the market look a bit less attractive.

By the way, it wouldnt be a shocker if AC reinstated mainline service. They were slated to resume 319 service this month, but it was taken off the table. And there was a wild rumor about Great Plains starting D328 service to TUL--I havent heard anything more about that.

That being said, at least we're not at MSY!  Laugh out loud
America's chickens are coming home to rooooost!
 
MSYtristar
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RE: DFW News....anything?

Tue Oct 21, 2003 11:48 am

JCS, haven't heard much from you in the way of anti-MSY comments lately. They were missed!!!

Yall can have the better airport...we all know who has the better city!


Steve in MSY





 
gr8slvrflt
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RE: DFW News....anything?

Tue Oct 21, 2003 12:04 pm

AirTran is going from the current six to between 24 and 30 flights a day after the first of the year. Rumor here is that the 737 fleet will be based out of DFW to start. AirTran has not announced new destinations from DFW but they are rumored to include LAX, SFO, MDW, MSP and CAK.
I work for Southwest, but the views expressed are my own and do not necessarily represent those of Southwest.
 
usairways85
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RE: DFW News....anything?

Tue Oct 21, 2003 12:30 pm

I wouldn't be surprised to see BWI and PHL added to that list.
 
AV8AJET
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RE: DFW News....anything?

Tue Oct 21, 2003 1:30 pm

I would like to see AirTran DFW-PHX!
"To fly or not to fly there is no question!"
 
ssides
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RE: DFW News....anything?

Tue Oct 21, 2003 8:59 pm

I didn't know AirTran still had 737s. Am I just out of the loop?
"Lose" is not spelled with two o's!!!!
 
PVD757
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RE: DFW News....anything?

Tue Oct 21, 2003 9:48 pm

DFW-PVD on AA starts 11/1/03. Probably nothing big for you, but it's a pretty big deal here at PVD!
 
Navion
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RE: DFW News....anything?

Tue Oct 21, 2003 9:55 pm

Ssides, AirTran has ordered new 737-700's. All of their 732's have been phased out which is what you may have been thinking about.
 
bartond
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RE: DFW News....anything?

Tue Oct 21, 2003 10:49 pm

PVD - Any flight that gets me up to your part of the world is welcomed here at DFW. Love New England.

Jcs - So terminal B is horrible to go through? I've never figured out why they don't let BA come into Terminal A right next to all of the AA 772s so they can all use the same customs area and people coming in on BA flights can quickly connect to other AA flights. Hopefully the new international terminal will get things rolling for another carrier or two to try out service here. I know DFW will never be an int'l. gateway like ORD or JFK is but I think that there are some add'l. flights that would work. If Iberia ever expanded past Miami they might work, and either JAL or China Eastern, if they ever become part of Oneworld, might work as an extension from LAX/SFO.

Who knows, I'm just trying to get some things going with DFW chat. Nothing cool ever happens here.
 
ssides
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RE: DFW News....anything?

Tue Oct 21, 2003 10:53 pm

I'm always up for good DFW discussions.

I am with the people who think the new international terminal, along with AA's prominence, could turn DFW into a decent international gateway. If oneworld keeps working, I'd expect to see Qantas, Cathay Pacific, JAL, and LanChile there by 2015. Given Iberia's imminent merger with BA, I don't know if they'd go for the redundancy of having Iberia at DFW. Also, I'd look for Air France to have a decent presence, but it will be either them or KLM -- not both.
"Lose" is not spelled with two o's!!!!
 
bartond
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RE: DFW News....anything?

Tue Oct 21, 2003 11:04 pm

How fantastic would it be to drive by and see 2 or 3 744s, one or two A343s and a row of 772s at the new terminal D?!? Maybe someday. I'm with you on the Asian flights that would probably work here. I just think there is a huge market in Texas for Asian service but the length of flights creates a problem for the westbound sectors, plus the huge Asian markets in Southern California and all up the west coast eats up all of the flights.

We can only hope that atleast a few carriers try service here, but let's get Air France and maybe JAL back in the picture for starters. I keep hearing rumours about AF but nothing solid has come about. Maybe Delta scaling back operations has hit the feed ability at DFW.

 
MAH4546
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RE: DFW News....anything?

Tue Oct 21, 2003 11:23 pm

expect to see Qantas, Cathay Pacific, JAL, and LanChile there by 2015.

JAL is not part of oneWorld and don't hold your breathe for LanChile anytime soon unless AA decides to drop DFW-LIM or DFW-SCL and LA takes it over. The rest is pretty possible.
a.
 
PVD757
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RE: DFW News....anything?

Wed Oct 22, 2003 12:06 am

Thanks Bartond...hope you take avantage of the new PVD service, I noticed the loads are pretty good already, so maybe there is a chance for more frequency.
 
Mexicana757
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RE: DFW News....anything?

Wed Oct 22, 2003 2:19 am

I was thinking the other day, why hasnt IBERIA started services at DFW. I think they would do good if they flew into DFW. They have AA there to feed them some passengers.
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: DFW News....anything?

Wed Oct 22, 2003 2:31 am

Air France will most likely return for next summer (dropped after 9/11) with either a 772 or 343

Says whom?

The only four new USA routes AF are currently evaluating at are DTW, SEA, DEN, and FLL (in that order)... and they're not likely to launch a new USA city before 2005



with either a 772 or 343

certainly not the former, as the Triple7s (and perhaps the A380s, no decision has been yet made public) will be the only remaining 3class aircraft in AF's fleet... aimed at high-premium markets.

assuming AF ever does return to DFW: look for an A332, A343, ....or 7E7  Laugh out loud
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
bartond
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RE: DFW News....anything?

Wed Oct 22, 2003 3:03 am

Aw Concorde quit raining on our little fantasy parade. Heh heh. You may be right though. I dunno, I just keep hearing positive things about this route possibly coming back. We shall see.

Mexicana - I've asked this question many times and was shot down each of them. Evidently Iberia wants to continue building (or just maintain) its hub at MIA and route flights through there. Yeah they go to JFK and ORD but I guess DFW would be an AA feed overkill??? I don't get it either as this seems like a great South American feed system for each carrier. However, MIA serves quite a few more South American cities than does DFW, so maybe they can handle it.
 
aa61hvy
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RE: DFW News....anything?

Wed Oct 22, 2003 3:27 am

One thing I have learned spotting/reading about DFW. Never believe what you hear. I have heard EVA has supposed to service DFW with a 744 on top of cargo for at least 5 years. We were supposed to get Aerolineas Argentina (excuse my spelling) but that never happened. A lot of things 'could and should' happen at DFW but it doesn't.

JAL could come back to DFW, AA has the monopoly on DFW-AA), Japan">NRT flights.
CX could be a possibility since DFW is getting more and more Asian cargo service. Eva, SQ, China Air, KE
I have heard AF will come back to DFW next summer as well.

My take on it all is: DFW will become much bigger after the new terminal opens. I expect to see 3-5 new carries from now until it opens.
We are lacking DFW-China flights. Expect some.


The conclusion/my predictions: JL will come back, AF will come back, CX will come. KLM will come.
Go big or go home
 
bartond
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RE: DFW News....anything?

Wed Oct 22, 2003 4:19 am

Don't get me all rowled up saying that all of those carriers will come to our airport, AA61hvy. I don't see KL coming here with them haveing a 744 daily to Houston and no real feed for them at DFW. AF might come back which would be fine, taking away the need for the second daily AA to CDG (currently using 763). JAL seems like it would do pretty well with native Asians that like to fly their carriers over US carriers. There seems to be enough demand to support a daily AA 772 and JL MD11 like there was before 9/11. I think AA flies 13x weekly right now with 772s so maybe they could share. I'm sure they'd be up for that. HA.

Other than that I have no idea what I'm talking about, I'm just thinking out loud. I know what you mean, though - everyone that lives here or flies through here wants so badly for new exotic carriers to come here and do well but as long as businesses close and/or contract, DFW won't get any service cuz people DAMN SHO ain't coming to Dallas just to see Billy Bob's and the Grassy Knoll.
 
ssides
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RE: DFW News....anything?

Wed Oct 22, 2003 4:20 am

After the merger is complete, I don't think we'll see AF and KLM at the same time. Just one or the other. I don't think the market is there.

Might also look for consolidation at IAH, which is currently served by both AF and KLM.
"Lose" is not spelled with two o's!!!!
 
deltaffindfw
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RE: DFW News....anything?

Wed Oct 22, 2003 5:47 am

From this July conference in Dallas, AF does not have near-term plans to come back to DFW.

http://www.skyteam.com/EN/aboutSkyteam/doc/dallas.pdf
 
bartond
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RE: DFW News....anything?

Wed Oct 22, 2003 7:24 am

That's some great information Deltaff, thanks. May I ask where you got it and where I could find some stuff like that?

I know that you're a Delta guy but would you know where the same info. would be for us oneworlders? Well, it looks like AF doesn't want to come back to DFW anytime soon but maybe when/if AF and KL consolidate a bit and when int'l. travel comes back that DFW might get another AF 343 in here at some point. Keeping fingers crossed...
 
deltaffindfw
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RE: DFW News....anything?

Wed Oct 22, 2003 9:12 am


Bartond -

I usually check the skyteam site about once a month or so to see updates, and that's where I found it. Skyteam publishes a monthly update - don't know if Oneworld does the same. You might check there site under the press releases. I think I also found out about this meeting on dfwairport.com.
 
aa61hvy
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RE: DFW News....anything?

Wed Oct 22, 2003 11:05 am

I remember seeing the AF A340 almost every night in the summer a few years back. It was always so low and you could hear it so clearly. It was great.
Go big or go home
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: DFW News....anything?

Wed Oct 22, 2003 11:13 am

don't know if Oneworld does the same

yes, they do.

It's called "A Word from OneWorld" and I've listed most of them on Airwise, though not some of the most recent ones.
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
deltaffindfw
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RE: DFW News....anything?

Wed Oct 22, 2003 11:23 am


Yeah, I see the LH A340 when I happen to be home during the day. I don't think it's as impressive as seeing the 777 or the cargo 747s. I live in the flight path of 18R, so I see good mix of planes while lounging in the backyard!
 
jcs17
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RE: DFW News....anything?

Wed Oct 22, 2003 12:07 pm

Says whom?

The only four new USA routes AF are currently evaluating at are DTW, SEA, DEN, and FLL (in that order)... and they're not likely to launch a new USA city before 2005


What? They are not evaluating service to MSY? Stupid Frenchies  Big grin . Technically, DFW is not a "new" route. And your probably right when you said it wouldnt be with a 772. I'll bet you $50 that DFW will regain AF service within a year after the new international terminal opens.

By the way, if any of you read the Skyteam report. It stated that KE is considering making DFW a daily flight.

If my memory serves me correctly, LH will be daily this winter, instead of five or six times weekly.

Jcs - So terminal B is horrible to go through? I've never figured out why they don't let BA come into Terminal A right next to all of the AA 772s so they can all use the same customs area and people coming in on BA flights can quickly connect to other AA flights. Hopefully the new international terminal will get things rolling for another carrier or two to try out service here

The customs and immigration area is pretty new, but the terminal areas are awful. The main reasons why BA doesnt relocate to A is because they already have their Terraces club right by their gate, and secondly there are not very many BA pax connecting onto AA flights at DFW. DFW is the final destination for the vast majority of their pax because of the OneWorld mileage and codeshare issues. That being said, Terminal A itself and customs and immigration isnt that much better than Terminal B.
America's chickens are coming home to rooooost!
 
aa61hvy
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RE: DFW News....anything?

Thu Oct 23, 2003 3:44 am

Going from B to A isn't all that bad either.
Go big or go home