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Joined: Wed May 24, 2000 2:50 am


Sun Oct 26, 2003 11:09 am

Is Delta no longer operating widebodies in this market? I was looking on line and noticed that the early morning Delta flight to LAX from JFK is now being flown with a 757!

Delta was trying to compete with AA and UA by offering two-class (with Biz Elite) 767-300 ER service to LAX and SFO. When did this end?

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Joined: Wed Jun 23, 1999 9:45 am


Sun Oct 26, 2003 11:17 am

2 of the 3 daily JFK-LAX flights (back to 4 flights soon) are operated with 767-300ER's. JFK-SFO is operated with a single 757 now.
727, L1011, MD80, A300, 777-200, 737-300, 737-700, 747-400, 757-200, 737-800, A320. E190, E135, 767-200, CRJ9
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Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2000 4:07 pm


Sun Oct 26, 2003 10:01 pm

Depending with the load factors were doing with those flight from JFK-LAX/SFO. I'm will think about it of more flight out of JFK and last time before 9/11 were using with fourth flight from JFK-LAX is doing very well. Don't you even know about this one of DL flight?
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Mon Oct 27, 2003 12:17 pm

DL's remaining Domestic flights out of JFK are..(non Song or CRJ flying)

Atlanta 2 767-300s,
Cincinnati 1 757, 1 767-300
LAX 1 757, 2 767-300
Phoenix 1 757
San Francisco 1 757
Seattle 1 757

It's very probable and in my opinion very likely that Song will take over their flying from JFK to LAX, SFO, PHX and SEA since these routes have competition from Jet Blue, and they are already 757s all they need to do is paint them in the green and white and upgrade the interiors.

I think DL's downsizing of aircraft and frequencies (SFO) to the West Coast is an indication of the realities of the post B6 market at JFK, B6 is trashing yields. Which is one reason why AA is downsizing their JFK terminal project from the proposed 55 to only 39, they are not going to build up a large Domestic/Eagle operation at JFK because they cannot compete with B6.

AA, UAL may follow DL (UAL being the next) to downsize their trans-cons from JFK, since AA and UAL have such huge 757 fleets and the main stay of their trans-cons from JFK (767-200) are 20+ years old it makes sense for them to switch to the 757 on those routes. However they would probably reconfigure them with a better premium class offering (aka CO's Business First 757s).
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
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Joined: Wed Oct 22, 2003 1:09 am


Mon Oct 27, 2003 3:17 pm

what ever happened to PDX?
Airline photography. Whether they're fully clothed, butt naked, having issues or confused I'm taking pictures!!
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Mon Oct 27, 2003 6:22 pm

As mentioned above, the 4th JFK-LAX flight (the red-eye in each direction) will return 1/1/04 with a 757 and JFK-DFW will also return the same day with the MD88. The 2 JFK-LAX flights with direct transatlantic connections will remain as 763ERs.
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Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:12 am


Mon Oct 27, 2003 10:44 pm

Just for accuracy, DL also flies one daily MD88 DCA-JFK but who knows how long that will last. As Panamair mentioned, DFW-JFK is also coming back in January.

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Tue Oct 28, 2003 1:41 am

America West has also started nonstop flights from SA - New York">JFK-SA - California">LAX and SA - New York">JFK-SA - California">SFO, also ATA is launching SA - New Jersey">EWR-SA - California">SFO and SA - New York">LGA-SA - California">SFO (SA only) flights.

Thus the SA - New York">JFK-SA - California">LAX/SA - California">SFO market is not what it used to be, it will be interesting to see what happens.
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
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Joined: Sat Oct 14, 2000 6:13 am


Tue Oct 28, 2003 2:39 am

DL has struggled on the transcon flights out of JFK......its a tough market that AA and UA dominate and protect and its very hard for other airlines to succeed on the JFK-LAX/SFO routes; many have tried, including Eastern (with Transcon service - 4 1011s to LAX and 3 1011s per day to SFO out of JFK, flying nearly empty!), TWA was a big player at one time, Pan Am with 747s to the coast, MGM Grand with all first class service, etc. etc. Jet Blue has done well with its low fare service to alternate Los Angeles/San Francisco airports and low will be interesting to see if America West has any success.

I find it curious that DL is now using 757s on some transcontinental flights....I thought that DL's strategy was to use international configured 767-300s and offer their excellent BusinessElite service on these flights in order to compete for premium and full fare passengers with AA and UA, maybe they have given up on attracting large numbers of premium pax on the routes and are now concentrating on connecting passengers?

I am not convinced that replacing mainline service with the Song product will work on these transcon routes.

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