Noise
Topic Author
Posts: 2012
Joined: Wed Dec 22, 1999 7:38 am

JetsGo Looking For Smaller Aircrafts...

Mon Oct 27, 2003 5:24 am

According to YYZnews.com the airline is looking at introducing a smaller type plane to serve lighter markets such as the Fokker 100. This was an aircraft formerly flown by Inter-Canadi>n and Intair, when these companies were headed by Michel Leblanc. There are a lot of Fokker 100s on the second-hand market right now that have been withdrawn by US Airways and by American Airlines.

JetsGo really is expanding fast. I wonder how many aircrafts they'll order, and when.
 
srbmod
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RE: JetsGo Looking For Smaller Aircrafts...

Mon Oct 27, 2003 6:33 am

They need to be looking for a/c that can do their longer flights without having to send the bags on another airline!
 
captaingomes
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RE: JetsGo Looking For Smaller Aircrafts...

Mon Oct 27, 2003 6:45 am

Srbmod, don't be silly.

Rumours suggest Jetsgo is looking at the F100 as well as the 717. Rumours from last year suggested the 767. Let's just wait until the smiley face is painted onto the fuselage of a different aircraft type.
"it's kind of like an Airbus, it's an engineering marvel, but there's no sense of passion" -- J. Clarkson re: Coxster
 
Noise
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Posts: 2012
Joined: Wed Dec 22, 1999 7:38 am

RE: JetsGo Looking For Smaller Aircrafts...

Mon Oct 27, 2003 8:06 am

Hey Captaingomes, I also heard rumour about they getting 767s. Do you know what routes they would have been used for? Transatlantic? High volume domestic and US routes?

717s eh? Wasn't that what CanJet was lookinh into a few years ago? I'd like to see SG get some of those rather than the F100s.

Why no CRJs?

BTW, I just heard that SG has plans to enter California....but I doubt it's with the new, smaller, aircrafts.

YYZ-LAX, YYZ-SFO, YUL-LAX.....that could work.....

[Edited 2003-10-27 00:14:09]
 
captaingomes
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RE: JetsGo Looking For Smaller Aircrafts...

Mon Oct 27, 2003 8:15 am

Chris,

The 767 rumours were at a time when people were seeing Leblanc essentially recreate Royal, but on a low-cost basis. Rumours were suggesting Leblanc was going to fly international routes with the 767's much like Royal did with the A310's.

Regarding the 717, yes, Canjet was apparantly looking at them, but some say that so is Leblanc. The problem I see is that Leblanc is still very conservative with money, and would rather acquire used aircraft at very low prices than brand new ones. The F100 fits that description.

The CRJ's from what I understand are not that abundant in the used market, and I would not be surprised to see used CRJ prices higher than F100, while losing in passenger capacity and appeal compared to the F100.

In summary, I see the F100 at Jetsgo before I see any other aircraft. I don't see 717's for a while, same thing with 767's, if ever.
"it's kind of like an Airbus, it's an engineering marvel, but there's no sense of passion" -- J. Clarkson re: Coxster
 
Noise
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Posts: 2012
Joined: Wed Dec 22, 1999 7:38 am

RE: JetsGo Looking For Smaller Aircrafts...

Mon Oct 27, 2003 8:22 am

Thanks Nuno.

What's the range of an F100 vs 717?
 
dutchjet
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RE: JetsGo Looking For Smaller Aircrafts...

Mon Oct 27, 2003 8:31 am

With lots of cheap F100s around (ex-US and soon ex-AA), the type would make a lot of sense for Jetgo........especially on short-haul routes within eastern Canada. Germania picked up a bunch of ex-US F100s for next to nothing (out of the desert) to operate their low fare divison - Jetsgo could do the same thing and probably make it work. The F100 is rather effecient (maybe not as good as an RJ, but it has more seats and is a bit more flexible) and the cheap lease prices would allow for low operating costs. Jetsgo went with the MD80s (instead of 2nd or next generation 737s or A320s) for similiar reasons - they could be acquired cheaply!

Regarding the longer haul type or wide-body type, not likely unless somehow Jetsgo gets authority to fly some transatlantic routes AND Jetsgo determines that such services would make sense. The range issues with the MD83 are very much exagerated; (I think) one nasty article in the Canadian press started all of this. Toronto-Vancouver should not be a problem for the MD83s unless the load is extremely heavy or the weather/wind conditions are very, very usunusal. AA used MD80s on routes out of ORD to the West Coast for years and years without any difficulty whatsoever.
 
Noise
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RE: JetsGo Looking For Smaller Aircrafts...

Mon Oct 27, 2003 8:41 am

I'm sure SG can get a few of these not-so-lonely F100s, which are currently roasting in the desert, for a really low price....


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captaingomes
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RE: JetsGo Looking For Smaller Aircrafts...

Mon Oct 27, 2003 9:04 am

Chris,

no problem. To add to your other question regarding the range of the F100 versus the 717, according to the Aircraft Data and History page on airliners.net:

Fokker 100 -

Performance

Max cruising speed 845km/h (456kt), long range cruising speed 737km/h (453kt). Range with 107 passengers and Tay 620s 2505km (1323nm), or high gross weight version with Tay 650s 3167km (1710nm).


Boeing 717 -

Performance

717-200BGW - Cruising speed 811km/h (438kt). Range with 106 passengers 2545km (1375nm).
717-200HGW - Cruising speed same. Range with 106 passengers 3815km (2060nm).


These two aircraft obviously serve the exact same role with the 717 having a range advantage in the IGW version when compared to the F100 high gross weight version.
"it's kind of like an Airbus, it's an engineering marvel, but there's no sense of passion" -- J. Clarkson re: Coxster
 
Noise
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Joined: Wed Dec 22, 1999 7:38 am

RE: JetsGo Looking For Smaller Aircrafts...

Mon Oct 27, 2003 10:20 am

Any way, what cities do you expect will be served with the F100? YQB comes to mind, along with YXE, YQR, YQT and a New Brunswick city,
 
luv2fly
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RE: JetsGo Looking For Smaller Aircrafts...

Mon Oct 27, 2003 10:52 am

Even if the F100's are cheap to acquire are they not gas hogs....
You can cut the irony with a knife
 
planemaker
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RE: JetsGo Looking For Smaller Aircrafts...

Mon Oct 27, 2003 3:48 pm

Very interesting gossip!

JetsGo would be nuts to look at the CRJ-700 when, as many posts have stated, there is a desert load of F100's available. I think that they are good looking aircraft (personal bias) and obviously have a much more comfortable interior than the CRJ - not too mention that they are much cheaper to acquire.

NOISE: I am not 100% sure but I only recall that Intair and Inter-Canadi>n operated the F28 and not the F100.
Nationalism is an infantile disease. It is the measles of mankind. - A. Einstein
 
Goose
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RE: JetsGo Looking For Smaller Aircrafts...

Mon Oct 27, 2003 3:55 pm


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"Talk to me, Goose..."
 
planemaker
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RE: JetsGo Looking For Smaller Aircrafts...

Mon Oct 27, 2003 4:11 pm

Goose:

Thanks for posting the pics. Interesting to see the AC 727 in the background.

A point that isn't brought up often is that Bombardier turned downed the opportunity to buy Fokker (I believe that it was around 1996-97). In hindsight, with all the current interest in 100 pax jets, especially since BBD's Shorts Bros. made the Fokker wings, it could have been a good acquisition.

One has to speculate if LH and Crossair might have gone for an updated, re-engined F70/100 instead of the CRJ-700/FD728 & and the E170 since they were already available. At the very least, FD and EMB might have had second thoughts about entering the 70+ pax jet market.

And I have to wonder if the 728/928 acquisition that BBD passed on will turn out to be another "lost" opportunity. Particularily if the 728/928 somehow manages to get into the air.
Nationalism is an infantile disease. It is the measles of mankind. - A. Einstein
 
VonRichtofen
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RE: JetsGo Looking For Smaller Aircrafts...

Mon Oct 27, 2003 4:32 pm

I didn't know about those Canadi>n F100's

We never saw them out West I don't think. Only F28's.
 
lymanm
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RE: JetsGo Looking For Smaller Aircrafts...

Mon Oct 27, 2003 4:34 pm

"AA used MD80s on routes out of ORD to the West Coast for years and years without any difficulty whatsoever."

Poor comparison - ORD is signifiantly further west than YYZ.

Eg - YYZ-YVR: 1805NM

ORD-SAN: 1493NM
ORD-LAX: 1512NM
ORD-SFO: 1599NM
ORD-SEA: 1490NM

The smallest difference is still over 200NM; that is huge.
buhh bye
 
717fan
Posts: 1975
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RE: JetsGo Looking For Smaller Aircrafts...

Mon Oct 27, 2003 8:51 pm

IMO, the MD-87 would also make sense...

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