1world
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Aerofalcon, Newest Proposed YYZ Based Airline.

Sat Nov 01, 2003 11:52 am

Will this airline make it past the paper stage as they do intend to start flying in December with a 747-??? to India. They haven't even started interviewing Cabin Crew so it makes it hard to keep on track.

Good luck to this new venture but delaying your initial start date usually hurts the bottom line.
YYZ spotter
 
pilottim747
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RE: Aerofalcon, Newest Proposed YYZ Based Airline.

Sat Nov 01, 2003 3:16 pm

Interesting stuff. http://www.aerofalcon.ca/

Looks like a they want to use the B744. I don't know if they'll be able to fill that, but we'll see.

pilottim747
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B747-437B
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RE: Aerofalcon, Newest Proposed YYZ Based Airline.

Sat Nov 01, 2003 3:19 pm

If these guys get off the ground, Elvis will be their first passenger.
"The A340-300 may boast a long range, but the A340 is underpowered" -- Robert Milton, CEO - Air Canada
 
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yyz717
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RE: Aerofalcon, Newest Proposed YYZ Based Airline.

Sat Nov 01, 2003 3:53 pm

If these guys get off the ground, Elvis will be their first passenger.

I have to agree with Sean. The worldwide track record for newstarts with a single 747 is 100% fatal, regardless the merits of this business model.

I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
C-GRYK
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RE: Aerofalcon, Newest Proposed YYZ Based Airline.

Sat Nov 01, 2003 4:29 pm

Hey Neil, don't forget Virgin Atlantic started with just 1 747-200, and they have grown to be quite a successful (and my personal favourite) airline.

But this isn't London-New York so... I too am doubtful this airline will succeed.

If they are successful, great, because as of right now... there will be no more 747's flying for a Canadian airline in the not too distant future! Shame.

Jeremy
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yyz717
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RE: Aerofalcon, Newest Proposed YYZ Based Airline.

Sat Nov 01, 2003 4:42 pm

Hey Neil, don't forget Virgin Atlantic started with just 1 747-200,

Jeremy....I stand corrected! You are right!

Technically, VS was a new airline but not a new company....it was a subsidiary of the established Virgin Records. Hence it was well capitalized from Day 1.

I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
behramjee
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RE: Aerofalcon, Newest Proposed YYZ Based Airline.

Sat Nov 01, 2003 4:48 pm

From : aerofalcon.ca

AeroFalcon will be operating most economical, comfortable and safe aircraft on all its routes. The flights on our long-range network will be conducted using the state-of-art Boeing 747-400 aircraft, fully equipped for onboard comfort of our passengers and latest entertainment systems.

***Where is the B 744 coming from??? Also "latest entertainment systems"...hmm maybe PTVs in every seat?
 
SafeFlyer
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RE: Aerofalcon, Newest Proposed YYZ Based Airline.

Sun Nov 02, 2003 5:56 am

I am as most people on this site, very doubtful.

Just by having a look at their business plan all I can say is: Oh boy
I'd be surprised If they ever got off the ground.
 
BOEING747-700
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RE: Aerofalcon, Newest Proposed YYZ Based Airline.

Sun Nov 02, 2003 6:54 am

Well Air Canada now has four Ex Cp 744s they are sending back to leasors, they might be able to keep their Canadian regs and stay right here in their home where they belong.
 
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yyz717
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RE: Aerofalcon, Newest Proposed YYZ Based Airline.

Sun Nov 02, 2003 7:02 am

Well Air Canada now has four Ex Cp 744s they are sending back to leasors, they might be able to keep their Canadian regs and stay right here in their home where they belong.

Yup Jordan. All 4 are out of service now. 2 left a while ago back to the desert. 1 is destined for Aerolineas Argentinas. Don't know about the other 3.

If the lessor can't place them, the may offer AC a bargain lease rate for the summer season. We may see 1 or 2 back in service for YVR-NRT or LHR.


I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
BOEING747-700
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RE: Aerofalcon, Newest Proposed YYZ Based Airline.

Sun Nov 02, 2003 7:04 am

I'll be pissed off if Aerolineans Argentinas gets C-FGHZ thats my baby and it should stay here with a CDN reg. She won't be babied down there like she is here
 
caribb
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RE: Aerofalcon, Newest Proposed YYZ Based Airline.

Sun Nov 02, 2003 7:57 am

Interesting. I'm surprised this has not happened earlier given the huge Indian population in the Toronto mega region. Toronto is so underserved to Asia given it's potential so I'm sure this will be a major success if they get all the financing and equipment.
 
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yyz717
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RE: Aerofalcon, Newest Proposed YYZ Based Airline.

Sun Nov 02, 2003 8:28 am

The problem with serving the Canada-India market (or the US-India) market is that only the newest long range aircraft can fly nonstop (744, 343, 772) which of course are the most expensive. This limits established legacy carriers' ability (let alone newstarts) to fly the market nonstop.

The other alternative (refueling in Europe) would allow older 742 equipment but it less efficient and can get bogged down in landing rights, bilaterals etc since a 3rd country would be involved. 5th freedom rights to Europe can exasberate the yield mix if seats are full to Europe but Indians can't get seats all the way to India.

I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
bmi330
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RE: Aerofalcon, Newest Proposed YYZ Based Airline.

Sun Nov 02, 2003 9:27 am

Will they not have to fly via somewhere in Europe? If so they could go via GLA not sure about 744 full getting of the runway. Or PIK and get a slice of the route development fund for new international routes from Scotland. They would sell seats no problem on the YYZ - GLA sector and also the Indian destinations as there is a large community in GLA with Indian origin with no direct flights. Would give this airline extra capital to start with and they need to stop anyway so if they don't sell seats on the sector each way its no big loss. Long shot but could this maybe be the idea sort of like what zoom are doing from Glasgow? Or even link with FR at PIK plenty of feed if they are going for economy stuff.
 
behramjee
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RE: Aerofalcon, Newest Proposed YYZ Based Airline.

Sun Nov 02, 2003 2:34 pm

How about starting the B 744s YYZ-DXB-DEL/BOM-DXB-YYZ or to cater for the large Lebanese community in YUL and YYZ fly YYZ-BEY-DEL/BOM...in this way both the Indians and Lebanese are happy plus remember it is very difficult to fill up a B 744 full pax version 400 seater on a nonstop CAN-IND-CAN route for the entire year.

Look at AC...till mid Dec they're YYZ-DEL flights are full but DEL-YYZ is hardly 60% full till mid Dec. However, both legs are sold out Dec 15-Jan 20th date range.

I was reading in AIRLINER WORLD magazine that AEROFALCON's initial route was going to be a Boeing 747-300 YYZ-LGW-DEL 3 times a week and not a -400 jumbo series!!!

My recommendations are : (3 times weekly B 744s)

YYZ-MAN-DEL/BOM (due to the lack of nonstop flights from North Eng to India and there being a HUGE Indian community in MAN-BHX and the surrounding areas of Scotland-Midlands etc)

OR

YYZ-BEY-DEL/BOM (which will cater to both communities giving better chance of filling up the flights plus BEY has an open sky policy so it shouldnt be too hard getting pax and cargo rights for the BEY-INDIA-BEY sector which currently no airline flies nonstop.

OR

YYZ-DXB-DEL/BOM (this route will cater to the needs of the Arab community within UAE and its neighbours + Indians plus DXB has too an open sky policy and BG-CX-TG fly India-DXB-India will full traffic and cargo rights.