Aleksandar
Topic Author
Posts: 2937
Joined: Sat Jul 29, 2000 11:43 pm

767 Question : Why RR Engines Were So Unpopular?

Thu Nov 20, 2003 12:46 pm

I was just wondering recently : Why RR engines were not that popular among 767 costumers. There were only two airlines ever to order 767-300 with that type of engine: British Airways and China Yunnan?

Is something wrong with their performance or what was the problem?
R-E-S-P-E-C-T
 
Shenzhen
Posts: 1664
Joined: Wed Jun 25, 2003 12:11 pm

RE: 767 Question : Why RR Engines Were So Unpopular?

Thu Nov 20, 2003 2:19 pm

I believe you could say they lacked performance, were heavy, and reduced the value of the airframe in the re-sell market.
 
lutfi
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Joined: Wed Sep 27, 2000 6:33 pm

RE: 767 Question : Why RR Engines Were So Unpopular?

Thu Nov 20, 2003 2:33 pm

Performamce not an issue, weight is.
 
jhooper
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RE: 767 Question : Why RR Engines Were So Unpopular?

Thu Nov 20, 2003 2:41 pm

are you sure it wasn't an economic issue? The RR RB211 engine almost messed up the L-1011 program.
Last year 1,944 New Yorkers saw something and said something.
 
cancidas
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Joined: Thu Jul 03, 2003 7:34 am

RE: 767 Question : Why RR Engines Were So Unpopular?

Thu Nov 20, 2003 4:12 pm

The RR RB211 engine almost messed up the L-1011 program.

how?
"...cannot the kingdom of salvation take me home."
 
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Aaron747
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RE: 767 Question : Why RR Engines Were So Unpopular?

Thu Nov 20, 2003 4:34 pm

Development delays. The RB211 was a proven powerplant on the 747 prior to the 767 program and was the launch engine on the 757. Though it's worth noting, the same variant that found initial popularity on the 747-400 but later fell out of favor to GE due to long-range performance, the -H, was also that used on the 763.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
ha763
Posts: 3168
Joined: Mon Jan 06, 2003 5:36 pm

RE: 767 Question : Why RR Engines Were So Unpopular?

Thu Nov 20, 2003 4:40 pm

A short explanation:

The development of the RB211 fell behind schedule due to technical difficulties. This and other economic problems caused RR to collapse financially. It took a bailout by the British government to get the RB211 program back on track. With the RB211 being the sole engine supplier for the L-1011, it really hurt the program and carriers switched their orders to the DC-10 also causing the L-1011 to be a money loser for Lockheed and their final push out of the commerical airliner business.
 
Rick767
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RE: 767 Question : Why RR Engines Were So Unpopular?

Thu Nov 20, 2003 6:44 pm

In short the RRs result in a couple of hundred kilos extra weight on the 763, but performance is no issue and fuel burn is comparable with the PW / GE models.

BA benefit from common streamlined maintenance and the ability to swap 763 engines with their 744 ones (also the RB.211-524H).
I used to love the smell of Jet-A in the morning...
 
biggles313
Posts: 31
Joined: Tue Dec 05, 2000 8:11 am

RE: 767 Question : Why RR Engines Were So Unpopular?

Thu Nov 20, 2003 8:04 pm

You can definitely say that the original RB.211 was late and heavy and that this "almost destroyed" the TriStar programme. RR was much smaller than either of its US rivals and had no military contract on which to develop high-bypass engines, didn't understand the big US market and took too many risks. Performance-wise, all the early big engines were dreadful...
You simply can't compare any of them to the later derivatives, particularly the -524.
BA wanted fleet commonality between the 74 and 76... The engine has done well in the 747, for which it was designed. However, BA found itself operating its 767's on very short routes, such as London-Paris. The engines were optimised for long-haul use, and of course were less suitable.

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