LatinPlane
Posts: 2474
Joined: Mon Dec 27, 1999 11:05 am

Re: LatinAmerican Airlines

Mon Jan 10, 2000 4:56 am


As most of you might know, I am facinated with this region of the world and I always want current info on whats going on. Anyway, I have looked at the various countries that compose Latin America and I have compared their national airlines to whats going on with their economies and their politics. Anyway, this is only my opinion and not a statistical research report, so your knowledge and opinions are valuable.

Let me start by comparing the largest Latin American countries and their airlines.

The largest economies in Latin America are as follows:

1.) Brazil
2.) Mexico
3.) Argentina
4.) Chile
5.) ?
6.) ?

1.) Brazil has the largest economy, so therefore it has the largest airlines. Varig's fleet is currently at 75 aircraft and Vasp is around 49. It seems to me that Varig is the only World Class airline because it has a history of good reputation and a history of having far reached destinations. It is currently the only airline in Latin America that serves the Asian continent. It is also very well known in Europe, because they fly to almost all the large capitals of the continent. Although, it has fallen a bit due to the economic crisis it still remains on the top spot in Latin America.

2.) Mexico has the second largest economy and ofcourse the second and third largest airlines in Latin America. AeroMexico is the second largerst air carrier in Latin America and is composed of 65 aircraft and Mexicana de Aviacion is at 55. Although both airlines are owned by Cintra, the parent group, Mexican laws state that they can never merge. Most likely they will be sold off this year. Both airlines have a good on time reputation and both are very profitable. Mexicana is the oldest airline in N.America and the 4th oldest in the world. It also has the pride of having the first jet service in Latin America. These airlines have both anounced that they are joining the new alliances. AeroMexico is best friends with Delta and Air France, while Mexicana is close to United, Lufthansa and Air Canada.

3.) Argentian: Well, what can I say. Although Argentinians love to travel and Argentina is a very visited country it seems like Aerolineas Argentinas won't be able to make it.... I am wondering how much more time it has left of survival. Would anyone like to guess? Would LAPA do a better job flying the Argentine flag throught out the world. Maybe, it would?
LAPA seems like it is much faster at responding to it's social climate. While AR, it's like a gov run agency.
LAPA unlike AR is very interested in renewing it's fleet.

4.) Chile. Chile's economy has been the darling of the 1990's. It's economy has been growing at an unprecidented rate. Along with it's thriving economy is it's thriving national airline. LAN Chile has provably the best in-flight service of any other latin american airline. It is always porforming on the top stops. Too me this airline seems like the Singapore Airlines of the South.
Lan Chile has provably one of the most beautifull liveries of all. A region know for color, it has one of the best corporate images.

As for the othe contries, It would take a whole book to descrive them. However, I can mention something of about some of them.

Taca is one of the most intelligent airlines. It has managed to unite all the central american airlines and branded them with one corporate image. It is often improving and expanding it's service to other parts of the world. recently it opened it's new braches in Peru, TACA PERU and Cuba, TACA Inter.

Avianca has the honor of being the oldest airline in the all of the America's. It is the 3rd oldest airline in the world. However, due to it's countries political and social problems it has many problems, but has learned to survive vigoriously.

Avensa, Although Venezuela is filthy rich in Oil, It is one of the poorest countries in the region. Years of corruption have left the country at a sorried state. Avensa seems like it is expanding opening new services to Europe and elsewhere.


If I missed your contry, please write and mention about it. I will trully apreciate it. I don't know exactly what the category is like regarding the number to which each contry belongs to. But if you know, let me know.
If you have any thing to say about any airline in the region let me know.





Pan Am - The World's Most Experienced Airline.
 
LeoDF
Posts: 349
Joined: Mon Aug 02, 1999 11:44 am

Re: LatinAmerican Airlines

Mon Jan 10, 2000 5:20 am

Hi! I am also into the region. I live in Mexico City. My favourite airline is Mexicana. But I also like Lloyd Aereo Boliviano, for Bolivia, as you know, is a poor country, but still manages to have an airline with A310's, 727's, F-27's and a 737. I always compare this to Paraguay, that has Lapsa, but is owned by Saeta of Ecuador. Of course, LAB is owned by VASP but it is better to be owned by a Brazilian Airline than from a Ecuatorian one... I think Vasp's interest in LAB made it possible for LAB to keep on flying and be one the few latin american airlines without a money loss. I like very much the color schemes of Vasp, Ecuatoriana and LAB, and whenever I can I go to Mexico City airport and admire the 727 that arrives daily except for Friday and Sunday. Well that's my opinion. And I would really like to have the book Airlines of latin america since 1919. But I still think it is too expensive.

LeoDF
Lloyd Aereo Boliviano
 
bacardi182
Posts: 1029
Joined: Tue Jan 04, 2000 2:47 am

Re: LatinAmerican Airlines

Mon Jan 10, 2000 5:49 am

i live in argentina and have a few words to say about the airliners here. First thing is first, i woud never want to fly on LAPA, i hear the service is good but i dont fly on airlines were the pilot puts the flaps in the wrong position for take off and crashes. Also, i have a friend that flew on lapa from atlanta to buenos aires (non-stop) that made a scheduled landing in cancun to pick up more passengers. great non-stop service huh? Aerolineas argentina is a peice of s**t. i have never flow on aa and been happy at the end of the flight. the seats are very small, the service is absolutly horible, the planes are old and tend to smell very bad, and every landing ive been on in their aircraft is very scary and i am relieved to be on the ground after. other people are also relived. on a flight from miami, after a very bad landing, the people in the cabin clapped till we had taxied to the gate. i try to avoid flying on argentine airways and only fly aerolinieas argetna for the miles. (i am advantage gold on american). when i fly to uraguay i fly pluna (not a bad airline) the service was good and they served a full meal on a 45 minute flight. i also fly lan chile to santiago when i fly eze-santiago-dfw. lan chile is an excelent airline and i would chose to fly with them anytime. i prefer lan chile to american airlines. To finish things off, argentine airliners suck and when aerolineas goes bankrupt, expect to see many more flights to eze from the states by united and american

ps- argentine people are to corrupt to run a good airline
 
Derico
Posts: 4209
Joined: Mon Dec 20, 1999 9:14 am

Bacardi182

Mon Jan 10, 2000 6:14 am

LatinPlane:
This is the order of size of economy:
1. Brazil
2. Mexico
3. Argentina
4. Venezuela (but sinking fast... )
5. Colombia
6. Chile
7. Peru

Bacardi182:
Are you really Argentine?
But, that said, I have to agree. AR really is bad. As for LAPA, they are our only hope. Maybe they learned something after the Aeroparque crash. However, I must take exception on the flights from the U.S. Honestly, UA & AA are part of the problem. They are trying to bring down Latin airlines for their own obscure goals of hemisphere domination. No wonder AMR left from the Aerolineas deal right after the Open Skies agreement, they wanted to finish AR in order to take over their routes. The Argentine government has done something good for a change & suspended the agreement with the U.S on this issue.
Good things about Argentina: Argentina has the best internet companies in Latin America. We are #1 in cable companies & connections, #1 in cellular phones, we have the biggest candy maker in the world, Arcor, the best meat in the world, as everyone knows, the largest multimedia company, ClarinGroup (TV, Cable, satellite TV, newspapers, etc), the best sports network: TyC, (jointly with FOXSports en Espanol), some of the largest stainless steel companies, but we have horrible airlines.....maybe we are just not good at this because everyone in Argentina is busy travelling, not SERVING the traveller... 
Derico
My internet was not shut down, the internet has shut me down
 
bacardi182
Posts: 1029
Joined: Tue Jan 04, 2000 2:47 am

RE: Bacardi182

Mon Jan 10, 2000 6:50 am

i am not argentine, i am living here because of my dad's job. I agree with u that american is trying to finish off aeorlineas just so they can get the routes. but aeorlineas is a very bad airline and needs to change if it is to survive. LAPA is the only hope but its going to tkae a while for them to get people to forget about the crash. I think lapa is the best airline for domestic flights in argentina but if aeorlineas goes bankrupt, there will not really be an argentine airliner for international routes.

ps-the women and meat here is the best. but the coruption is to great for a company to do very well here. to much money is spent on bribing police and government officials.
 
Derico
Posts: 4209
Joined: Mon Dec 20, 1999 9:14 am

My Reply...

Mon Jan 10, 2000 6:59 am

I agree 100%. That is the nature of things. And yes, if AR goes, is there own fault. Argentines travel, Europeans & Americans fly a lot to Argentina, & business men too. If they can't earn 1 stupid cent with those advantages, then they have to go. LAPA will not take over anytime soon, so I agree, Argentina will be a while without a flagship international carrier. The corruption is as bad in Argentina as anywhere else in Latin America. That is no excuse to run a bad company. Shame on AR (& the Spanish for finishing it off).
My internet was not shut down, the internet has shut me down
 
bacardi182
Posts: 1029
Joined: Tue Jan 04, 2000 2:47 am

RE: My Reply...

Mon Jan 10, 2000 7:08 am

you are right. it is there own fault. if united and american are making tons of money by flying down hear with full planes and shitty service. then why can't ar do it?
 
LatinPlane
Posts: 2474
Joined: Mon Dec 27, 1999 11:05 am

Re:

Mon Jan 10, 2000 7:40 am

Hello, Leo DF.


First of all, I am pleased to meet you. I understand that you have a web site made for Mexican Aviation and I have visited it. I would like to congradulate you for that matter.

I am also interested in the book, ''Airlines of Latin America since 1921'' I once saw it here in a store, but I was scared away because the price was about $75.00. Althought it is worth the price it was written in the early 80's so it now needs a replacement or an update. However, I was able to get good quality information that I have never seen anywhere else.

I would also like to point out that you are right about the LAB, Lloyd Aereo Boliviano. I was in fact going to mention it in my article, but I had to leave for a moment and time ran out. I think that you are very right LAB has a pretty interesting fleet or aircraft. I wouldn't mind flying on their A310 at all. LAB has had better success than it's close brother AeroPeru which unfortunatly had to suspend operations. However, I am not to sure about Ecuatoriana. I have heard that Ecuatoriana is having some problems and needed some money injection. I wouldn't dought that because of the fact that Ecuador's economy is at such a poor state.


Well, Leo DF. I really admire your pictures that you have posted and you have a nice web. Thanks and keep in touch.


Pan Am - The World's Most Experienced Airline.
 
LatinPlane
Posts: 2474
Joined: Mon Dec 27, 1999 11:05 am

Re:

Mon Jan 10, 2000 8:12 am


Hello Derico and Bacardi182!

First of all, thank you Derico for your info on the Economies. That really helped. I would have thought that Chile's economy was larger because Chileans overall have a better standard of living than Venezuelans and Colombians.

But you have to hand it to the Chileans, because they have managed to turn their country and national airline into a shining star. If all the hispanic countries managed to do their homework like they did, then we would really have an edge on things.

Now since Derico is half Argentinian and Bacardi is living there then you very aware of what is going on there.
I liked the fact that Derico knows his stuff on Argentina.
I know that all that Argentina is known for. However, It's kind of sad when you know that your national airline
is the worst of the worst. But that is life and I agree with Bacardi182 on critizing your people or your country for not living up to their full potential. That is just a form of constructive critizism. I often do that too with my mother country. I was born in the U.S. but my parents are from a Latin American country, and the people from that country are very nationalistic like most other Latin American countries. I often get critized or get called a ''sellout'' by my people because I say things the way they are, without hiding anything....

However, I am proud of the airlines that represent that country because they have always provided a good service whenever, I have flown with them.


So as too Aerolineas Argentinas, everyone recognizes that they are bad, but the question is that how long do they have to live.....?


Pan Am - The World's Most Experienced Airline.
 
Derico
Posts: 4209
Joined: Mon Dec 20, 1999 9:14 am

Re: LatinAmerican Airlines

Mon Jan 10, 2000 8:25 am

Latinplane:
Maybe we will know by next week, because there is a meeting of the owners of AR. Like I wrote above, I am ashamed of AR, it is a disgrace the state that this airline is in.

As for the economies, just because a country has a bigger economy doesn't mean they live better. Colombia has a bigger economy than Chile simply because Colombia has 40 million people, Chile has 16 million. The more people, the bigger the economy.

In standards of living, however Chileans are WAY better off than Colombians. In fact I have a list here so that you know, comparing size of the economy with what people earn, & therefore how high their standards of living are. This is all from the World Bank book:

Size of Economy

1. Brazil (650billion)
2. Mexico (490billion)
3. Argentina (305billion)
4. Venezuela (90billion)
5. Colombia ( 85billion)
6. Chile (70billion)
7. Peru (60billion)

Standard of living/ Per capita income in US dollars

1. Argentina ($8,500)
2. Uruguay ($6,300)
3. Chile ($5,800)
4. Brazil ($3,500)
5. Mexico ($3,400)
6. Venezuela ($2,900)
7. Colombia ($2,100)
8. Peru ($1,900)

That is how you divide the economy by the population.
Hope now you understand why Chile is not as big, but more prosperous
My internet was not shut down, the internet has shut me down
 
A300 American
Posts: 132
Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2000 8:37 am

Re: LatinAmerican Airlines

Mon Jan 10, 2000 8:49 am

Hey All,

Everyone who has mentioned that the Latin American governments are corrupt as hell are right on the money. Just take a good look at AeroPeru. The tourism here is exploding and AeroPeru has managed to screw it up (it´s been in the making for years). Peru has a couple mentionable domestic airlines.
1) Aero Continente (fleet of B737-200s, B727s, 1 B757 and supposedly an L-1011)
2) Taca (can´t remember what they operate)
3) Lan Peru (fleet of 2 B737-200s & don´t know how many-B767s) - parent company is Lan Chile
4) Tans (fleet of B737-200s)-Govn´t owned

American Airlines WAS operating national routes (Lima-Cusco) using a B757, but I don´t know what happened to that. I´ve heard they could operate only using tourists coming in the country using their service. I guess to protect the Peruvian carriers.

Latest news is the United Airlines has decided to abandon it´s Miami-Lima routes due to tons of competition with this popular route.

Happy Flying!
A300 American
 
LatinPlane
Posts: 2474
Joined: Mon Dec 27, 1999 11:05 am

Thanks Derico!

Mon Jan 10, 2000 8:52 am


Hey Derico, Thanks a lot.

I should be more carefull on how I word things, but Maybe I should take Economics 101 again. I took that class 2 years ago in college, but I had the worst Proffesor............. He was from Bolivia and I could not understand what he was saying (his accent was bad) . Not to say that Bolivians are bad, but It's just that he had such a bad temper, whenever you didn't understand something you would be afraid of asking him, because he would get mad!

Well, I managed to pass the class but with a ''C'' which means that I attended the classes but I didn't learn anything. In other words: The light was on, but nobody was home.... 

Pan Am - The World's Most Experienced Airline.
 
LatinPlane
Posts: 2474
Joined: Mon Dec 27, 1999 11:05 am

Peru's Problems

Mon Jan 10, 2000 9:07 am


I certainly agree with you. I visited Peru just one month before AeroPeru quit, and I was left wondering???? why does an airline like that go bankrupt living in such a tourist oriented country like Peru.


Many people were blaming the Mexicans as it was partly owned by Cintra (Parent country of AeroMexico & Mexicana) and I have to agree that if they should have paid a little more attention to it, then it would have had a change. However, I really don't think that it was all their fault. Just look at all the airlines that have come and gone in Peru. Faucett, Americana, etc, etc, I mean every airline that starts service there ends up bankrupt. Not just that but, I noticed how AeroContinente which is owned by a drug dealer was pushing the competion out by charging ridiculous low fairs. $25.00 and even $19.00 fairs anywhere in the country. I mean how can anyone live off that.!!!!

I belive that Cintra and Delta figured out that AeroPeru was not worth saving because nobody in Gov. really wanted to do something about it. It's such a shame because a country like Peru should have a well established airline. I don't blame Cintra and Delta for not wanting to invest in Aeroperu anymore because they knew that AeroContinente was involved in the Drug cartel and quite frankly, nobody is a match for them. Even worst, nobody in Gov. wanted to do something about it.


Pan Am - The World's Most Experienced Airline.
 
Derico
Posts: 4209
Joined: Mon Dec 20, 1999 9:14 am

Corruption

Mon Jan 10, 2000 9:16 am

Hey guys:

Before the whole Forum goes ahead and jumps in to the
"Latin Americans are the most corrupt in the world" bandwagon, let me say that while this may be absolutely true, the reason that it has had an impact on companies in Latin America is because most of them used to be OWNED by the government. In Europe & the U.S, companies have been private for a long time, minimizing the bad influence of bureaucracy. But if anyone really thinks that European & American governments are CORRUPTION FREE, then you must really be dreaming!!

Latinplane: If you look at my user info, there you see I also like Finance, that is why I know about those things...  
Derico
My internet was not shut down, the internet has shut me down
 
LatinPlane
Posts: 2474
Joined: Mon Dec 27, 1999 11:05 am

RE: Corruption

Mon Jan 10, 2000 9:48 am


Yes, Derico you definetly right about that.


Lets clear things up a bit for all the people. I believe that corruption is everywhere, and the U.S. is not exempt from it. However, it is seen somewhat less here than in other parts of the world where coruption is the authority. At least here in the U.S. if you are cought you will be prosecuted and sent to jail.


In Europe we've seen it all. Look at all the state run airlines. Air France, Iberia, Lufthansa, Alitalia. Can you belive how much money they have lost........
Each one has lost several ''billions'' of dollars and still they are flying.

No airline in the U.S. or anywhere else would be allowed to do that because the gov. here would not bail them out. Look at Pan Am. It lost so much money before it ceased operations but it never had an option of the gov, coming to bail it out. Although I wish it had, thats just our laws. Well, we lost our national pride, but thats just the way things work around here.

Pan Am - The World's Most Experienced Airline.
 
LeoDF
Posts: 349
Joined: Mon Aug 02, 1999 11:44 am

Latin Aviation The Best!

Mon Jan 10, 2000 12:20 pm

LeoDF again!

Hi! MM thank you for your comments!! Have you ever seen or maybe you have it the book Latin Glory?? I think it is one of the best aviation books!! Especially the chapters dedicated to Bolivia and Mexico. Airlines in Mexico that I saw but never photographed, for I was too little. I mean I'm only 17 at the moment. Jaja many people say I'm too young, but you don't know how well you feel when someone at my age comes and congratulates you on your photos. That's about the only thing that goes right in my life right now. It is very very comforting!!!

Well just wrote to thank you!!!

LeoDF
Lloyd Aereo Boliviano
 
Shanti
Posts: 59
Joined: Thu Dec 30, 1999 2:41 am

Merger Is The Key

Mon Jan 10, 2000 7:55 pm

I have been flying in LAC for long and believe that so many nat airlines are not economically sustainable nor efficient. Take Ecuador, for example, where you have SAETA, ECUATORIANA, TAME in a relatively small Country with only 2 big cities.
The way to go should necessarily be MERGING on a REGIONAL basis and TACA is the best example. Major Regional airlines should coagulate minor ones with great benefits in terms of safety, fares and service.
Latin America has a history of national prides but airlines today are no longer a matter of flags and hymns
What do you think?
 
Shanti
Posts: 59
Joined: Thu Dec 30, 1999 2:41 am

Re: LatinAmerican Airlines

Mon Jan 10, 2000 8:45 pm

I have been flying in LAC for long and believe that so many nat airlines
are not economically sustainable nor efficient. Take Ecuador, for
example, where you have SAETA, ECUATORIANA, TAME in a relatively small
Country with only 2 big cities.
The way to go should necessarily be MERGING on a REGIONAL basis and TACA
is the best example. Major Regional airlines should coagulate minor ones
with great benefits in terms of safety, fares and service.
Latin America has a history of national prides but airlines today are no
longer a matter of flags and hymns
What do you think?
 
Flying-Tiger
Posts: 3924
Joined: Mon Aug 23, 1999 5:35 am

Regio Airlines In Latin-America

Mon Jan 10, 2000 11:27 pm

As you´re all interested in airlines in Latin-America here is what I can provide: The fleet data from most of the regio airlines in this part of the world. Please check my site to learn more about them. Choose "Worldmap" in the pull-down menu, the rest is very easy. What do you think about this site?

Best regards
Flying-Tiger
http://fly.to/rorders
Flown: A319/320/321,A332/3,A380,AT4,AT7,B732/3/4/5/7/8,B742/4,B762/763,B772,CR2,CR7,ER4,E70,E75,F50/70,M11,L15,S20
 
Guest

RE: Regio Airlines In Latin-America

Tue Jan 11, 2000 3:40 am

I am studying in USA, so I periodically fly between Argentina and USA. Last time I did, it was with Aerolineas Argentinas (in June) and in addition to the fact that the plane was delayed and had mechanical problems the service was terrible. Next week I am flying with LAPA from Atlanta, does anybody have any idea how LAPA's service is? The ticket was pretty cheap, so I am starting to wonder again about the quality of service.
 
Derico
Posts: 4209
Joined: Mon Dec 20, 1999 9:14 am

To Rch: Lapa

Tue Jan 11, 2000 3:58 am

Hi,
I think we can safely say AR is a hated airline! I guess they brought this to themselves, so, they can't blame anyone...
LAPA: Well, this is an airline that has been private all of its existence. LAPA has grown considerably over the decade of the 90's, along with many other new airlines in Argentina (Southern Winds, Dinar, Alas Doradas, etc.),
taking advantage of a robust economy. What I have been told is that LAPA has good service. I think the Atlanta flight will be even better for you, because this is their breakout route internationally, so they want to present a good image. I think it should be a good flight.
LAPA did have a crash in August of last year, & there were some safety concerns, but these were mostly EXAGERATED by the local media, as usual. Just like the story here in the U.S about pilots being asleep in flight that scared many simply because it was so taken out of proportion, so are the safety questions of LAPA. So, don't worry, & have a safe trip.
Derico
My internet was not shut down, the internet has shut me down
 
MX-757
Posts: 63
Joined: Thu Dec 23, 1999 1:35 pm

Derico

Tue Jan 11, 2000 4:04 am

I just write this to tell you something about:

Argentina #1 in cellular telephones?
Largest Media Company?
Largest Candy Maker?
Better ISP's?

Well, I don't think so, 'cause
Mexico has greater cellular companies, and also they have digital services, and also much more cellular phones.
Televisa is the biggest Media Company in Latin America
Arcor? I don't even know about them
You bet! There are many more ISP's here in Mexico plus better services

So, before saying something, be more informed!
 
bacardi182
Posts: 1029
Joined: Tue Jan 04, 2000 2:47 am

RE: Derico

Tue Jan 11, 2000 4:09 am

he is right about internet service providers! i have a cable modem here in argentina and it is a peice of crap. it is always out of service and is slow as hell!
argentina also has digital phone service.
 
Derico
Posts: 4209
Joined: Mon Dec 20, 1999 9:14 am

Lets Take It Slow

Tue Jan 11, 2000 4:17 am

Ok, lets see this point by point:
-Argentina has more cellular phones per person than any latin country, this is a fact. But I would say Mexico has probably more cell phones overall, because of the population difference.
-Televisa is the largest MEDIA company in latin America, you are right, this was my mistake, because I was thinking of South America only.
-Arcor: It is not my fault you have never heard of them.
In Argentina, nobody knows of Pizza Hut, even though they are the largest Pizza chain in the world. Trust me, they are the largest.
-& as for internets: El Sitio.com, one of the first latin companies in the New York stock Exchange, Yupi.com, from ARG, Patagon.com (First finance site were you can trade stocks) Terra.com (partly owned by Spain Telefonica), LaNacion Newspaper internet (#1 prize in the world outside the U.S.A according to an international contest on internet newspaper sites)
TyC.com.ar (#1 prize for best sports page online),
Cordoba.com.ar( best promotion site in S.America) & I could go on & on, so, don't get upset, these are just facts. Mexico is #1 in many things Argentina is not, so
you don't have to be upset. Anyways, bye.
My internet was not shut down, the internet has shut me down
 
MX-757
Posts: 63
Joined: Thu Dec 23, 1999 1:35 pm

It's OK! Derico

Tue Jan 11, 2000 4:33 am

It's OK, I'm not upset, but I thought I had to say that.

After all we are Latinamerican people, aren't we?
Bye

 
Derico
Posts: 4209
Joined: Mon Dec 20, 1999 9:14 am

Viva Mexico!

Tue Jan 11, 2000 4:41 am

Of course. But just so that I'm fair let me say this about Mexico:

-Televisa IS the largest media company, so I apologize for my mistake.
-Telmex is the largest phone company in the developing world!!  
-Tubos de Acero is also #1 at what they do
-Mexico has AeroMex & Mexicana, Argentina has, well...
    can't say it, I'm so depressed
-Mexico has probably the most competitive soccer league in THE Americas, with Argentina's & Brazil's
-Mexican food is world known.
-Mexico has more movies made than any latin country!
-Mexico is #1 in tourism in Latin America!
So, you see, Mexico has many good things too,  , so be proud.
Derico
My internet was not shut down, the internet has shut me down
 
rawch
Posts: 91
Joined: Sat Feb 04, 2006 3:28 am

Latin American Airlines

Tue Jan 11, 2000 11:34 am

Hello everybody!

First of all, let me tell you guys that although I don't post often, I always read the posts that concern Latin America.

I lived in Panama for 14 years, before moving to S. Fl. My work is focused on Latin America so we have to travel there often. I personally prefer to fly with "national" airlines because most of the time the service is much better than American, Delta or United. That is my personal experience.

I am most familiar with COPA since I travel most of the time to & through Panama. They have improved a lot since the 70's & 80's. I remember travelling a DC-3 with them from Panama - David - San Jose. Now that Continental basically outbid Grupo Taca for the majority ownership, they are taking the steps to improve the airline. Especially with the acquisition of 12 new 737-700s.

But I agree with you guys that Grupo Taca has done many good things, as well as Lan Chile. It is a shame that the economies in Latin America are very cyclical & affect the airlines a lot. Anyways, keep posting!

Rob
 
LatinPlane
Posts: 2474
Joined: Mon Dec 27, 1999 11:05 am

Latinos Will Be Latinos!

Tue Jan 11, 2000 4:13 pm

O.K. you guys. uhh, I knew that someone was bound to get all nationalistic sooner or later.

But, what the heck, you guys are all right. I mean, you all have your points all backed up and very well.

From what I have noticed about ''Derico'' is that when it comes to a topic about Argentina he gets very nationalistic and proud . However, he is very sincere because he sometimes critizises and talks the truth about the reality in Argentina. He doesn't say something dum like, Argentina is number one and your country is not....

Oviously ''MX 757'' is Mexican!!! And we all know that Mexicans are very very nationalistic when it comes to their country. I mean, you will never see a Mexican burning his flag or talking bad about their country.... (heck I should know I'm one of them)

Anyway, both countries have good and bad things but the truth is that we are all brothers and although we may have our little diffrences, we are more alike in more ways than we think!!


So lets say: Viva la Raza!!! To all of us!!





Pan Am - The World's Most Experienced Airline.
 
Derico
Posts: 4209
Joined: Mon Dec 20, 1999 9:14 am

AeroMex To Be Sold?

Tue Jan 11, 2000 10:17 pm

I read a newspaper clip indicating that AeroMex & Mexicana will be sold!! Is this true?? I think that could be a mistake by Mexico, specially if they rush it too fast.
Mexico should learn from the stupidity of us Argentines, who went a head a sold AR to the first taker...look what is happening now. I think Mexico is doing an AMAZING job with both the companies. If it is in foreign hands, they might not care as much for them as Mexicans do.
Can anyone expand on this? Thanks.
Derico
My internet was not shut down, the internet has shut me down
 
CometII
Posts: 291
Joined: Tue Dec 28, 1999 6:02 am

Re: AeroMex To Be Sold?

Tue Jan 11, 2000 10:40 pm

Why are you calling people stupid? It is not the people of Argentina's fault their goverment made a bad business deal. Dont go around & call people stupid for no reason...
 
Derico
Posts: 4209
Joined: Mon Dec 20, 1999 9:14 am

I Would Just Like To Say This...

Tue Jan 11, 2000 11:17 pm

I AM SICK & TIRED OF THIS!!!

You know, I believed this Forum was a good place to talk about positive & negative aspects about airliners.
I WAS WRONG. Just like the REST OF THE WHOLE WIDE WORLD, everyone here seems to go by the same ridiculous rule human kind invented in the 90's:
POLITICAL CORRECTNESS!!!!!!!!
No, you can't say this you might insult this group.
No, you can't say that because you might offend this other group.
No, you can't say these things because those two people there may get UPSET.
No, you can't say this because you might insult a FRUITFLY...
I pity the world of today. Because you can't speak the GOD DAMN TRUTH!! If I say GOOD THINGS about my country, then everyone thinks I think too much of myself. When I say BAD THINGS about my country, then everyone thinks I'm not a good person.
I'm SICK & TIRED of seeing people kiss each other's a--,
just to please everyone else.
If you CANNOT take the truth about how things in life are, wheather you like them or not, good or bad, then I feel sorry for you. I, for one, speak the truth!!!!!!!
Wheather is positive or negative, & I will continue to speak the truth & be honest on how I FEEL!!!!
If you do not like this, do not read any threads or posts of mine again!!!!!     ON YOU!!!!!
SIGNED WITH BIG LETTERS FOR THE WORLD TO SEE:
DERICO (AUSTIN PANETTA)
(If you wish to E-mail me on this, please DO!!... I can take the heat, unlike most of the world today.)
My internet was not shut down, the internet has shut me down
 
LatinPlane
Posts: 2474
Joined: Mon Dec 27, 1999 11:05 am

Derico Just Speaks The Truth.

Wed Jan 12, 2000 12:37 am

I just want to set things straight....

Derico like I (Latinplane) live in a country where you can speak you mind out. U.S.A. We here, have a law called freedom of speech. So therefore, sometimes we will openly declare our opinions because we are raised to do so. This is what democracy is like........


Like I said before, Derico is a very sincere person. If he choses to critize the politics in Argentina, then he is free to do so!! And the reason is that he is Argentinian himself. So don't take it upon yourself to correct someone's point of view. When someone is just speaking the Truth!!!!!!!

The truth is out there, so if you are trying to live in a world called Never never land, then you have a problem.


If you have any comments regarding this issue please e-mail me or e-mail Derico and we will respond to your questions. However, please don't post anymore of these things unless they have something to do with Aviation in Latin America. O.k. pretty please.... 


Have a good day!  
Pan Am - The World's Most Experienced Airline.
 
LatinPlane
Posts: 2474
Joined: Mon Dec 27, 1999 11:05 am

RE: AeroMex To Be Sold?

Wed Jan 12, 2000 12:46 am


Yes, you are right!

I think that the Mexican Government is trying to disband what they call a monopoly. They believe that because AeroMexico and Mexicana are both owned by Cintra, the parent group, then it hurts competition. I hardly see it that way.

However, AeroMexico and Mexicana have always been the airlines of Mexico. For years, they have flown the flag of Mexico and have done so with pride.

I think they should focus on other aspects of aviation such as not letting Taesa resume service. Taesa does nothing for aviation in Mexico.
Pan Am - The World's Most Experienced Airline.
 
LatinPlane
Posts: 2474
Joined: Mon Dec 27, 1999 11:05 am

Copa Flying The Panama Flag Proudly

Wed Jan 12, 2000 12:54 am

It is my belive that Panama has much potential. Panama city has the largest business district in central America.

I have read reports that Continental chose Copa because it has such a great route network. If you have never seen Copa's route map, then take a look at it. It is rather impressing. I also know that the infrastructure at Panama city airport is one of the best. And Continental plans to help Copa turn this into a nice hub.

I think that the posibilities with the pact between Continental and Copa are endless.......
Pan Am - The World's Most Experienced Airline.
 
Derico
Posts: 4209
Joined: Mon Dec 20, 1999 9:14 am

Go Latinplane!

Wed Jan 12, 2000 3:47 am

Thanks for that, Latinplane. I'm not upset, I just pretended I was so I made the reply as "angry" looking as possible. But it does really crap me when you can't say anything good or bad about anyone, or any country, just because it is the truth. Life is not so uptight, people, you have to take the good with the bad, that is what I do, with my life, my family, my country (countries), and so on. We are all imperfect beings, anyways.

Well, as for Cintra, I guess some would see it as a monopoly. But you know what, if the monopoly WORKS, why change the rules? It is when a monopoly HURTS competition when they should be destroyed. Mexicana & Aeromexico ARE COMPETING, against all of the other airlines of the world!! So, if it ain't broke, don't fix it. That is what I think Mexico should do with their airlines.
Derico
My internet was not shut down, the internet has shut me down