thomasphoto60
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2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Tue Dec 02, 2003 11:59 am

With the recent annoucements from PIA beginning flights in '04' , KLM adding 2 extra flights, rumours of Egyptair eyeing Houston as well as a huge rumour that CO is planning a flight to LOS, as well as a mysterious upstart carrier from Nigeria called Trans Atlantic Airways alledgely beginning an IAH flight to Banjul and Port Harcourt later this month, it looks like if even just one of these services is commenced, 2004 may be a good year for our "Li'l ol airport".

Personally, I remain hopeful but just a little skeptical this early on.

Thomas
"Show me the Braniffs"
 
bigb
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Wed Dec 03, 2003 10:00 am

I agree, I believe 2003 was a good year. New Terminal opened, 15R/33L opened, the new runway opened, the new cargo area opened, and the new FIS building is taking shape, AN-225 making two visits (this helps show what kind of capacity the new cargo area can handle.)
ETSN Baber, USN
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Wed Dec 03, 2003 10:53 am

Announcements and rumors are typically not worth the letters they're typed with....

...when you see a PK or MS aircraft at IAH Terminal-D, then be happy.  Big grin
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
cba
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Wed Dec 03, 2003 10:54 am

Over the years, I've learned to never believe these rumors until I see the plane parked at IAH.
 
atcboy73
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Wed Dec 03, 2003 11:04 am

Personally, Im very bullish on traffic levels rising at the two Houston airports, so much so that I have put bids in to work at both IAH & HOU towers.
 
JayDavis
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Wed Dec 03, 2003 11:43 am

Yeah, yeah, yeah Thomas..........ya'll are finally get some respect in the airline world !! DFW is still much better !! ha ha ha !! Just giving you a hard time!!

Jay
 
Southamerica
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Wed Dec 03, 2003 2:02 pm


Before everybody starts flamming me here, my following question is just RUMOUR. Just though that you people living over there, could confirm something.

Recently I heard that CO might be considering the idea of upgrading the route IAH-BOG-IAH from 737 to a 757. Really don't think so, as imagine the flight is fine as it is, but the idea kept rumbling in my head. Just wanted to ask.


EXPLORE SOUTHAMERICA
 
thomasphoto60
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Wed Dec 03, 2003 2:42 pm

Concorde Boy and Cba,

I agree whole heartedly. Frankly there is no one more skepital than I when it comes to proposed or rumored service at IAH. IAH has been left standing at the alter one too may times, can you say SQ Cargo? Still as I stated earlier, I am cautiously optimistic that at least 1 of these carriers will be sitting at "D" before years end. If I were a betting man, I would sat that PK would be that carrier.

Jay,


Sorry my misguided Dallas friend, but IAH will always outclass DFW when it comes to int'l service  Wink/being sarcastic . We may be smaller but what's that old saying....? "good things come in small packages"  Wink/being sarcastic BTW, where is that QF flight?  Laugh out loud Just giving you a hard time  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

Thomas
"Show me the Braniffs"
 
triley1057
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Wed Dec 03, 2003 3:28 pm

I think 2004 will be a good year as well for IAH. I flew out of there last night back to LAX and explored Terminal E for a bit which I am really impressed with. Now if they would only start working on Terminal C but from what I hear there are plans to do so. I don't know about Trans Atlantic Airways. Doesn't this flight begin on the 5th of December? I guess the only way to find out is to go the airport and see for yourself. I don't know if anything will ever happen with MS but I feel pretty confident that PIA will be there in 2004. I would also expect to see some new cargo service pop up. I have noticed on Flytecomm.com that every Saturday night for the past few weeks there has been either a Gemini Air Cargo DC-10 or Atlas Air 742 flight coming in from LAX. I don't know if this is a regular flight or new. It is great to see KLM adding flights as well. I expect there to be more alliance related growth. Houston as a city seems to be in the spotlight lately with all the stuff going on there. It should be interesting to be at the airports during the Superbowl.
 
Lear777
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Wed Dec 03, 2003 11:50 pm

Those Gemini and Atlas birds are flying for Lan Chile Cargo. They had an 89.1% jump in cargo from Sept 2002 to Sept 2003, and as a result we've outgrown their 767s. That's why you're seeing the DC-10s and 747s now.

Also, the Christmas rush is beginning for cargo. FedEx now has eight flights a day from 5, including DC-10s, A300s, A310, and 727s. I'd expect more growth there as we go along. UPS has added another SDF 757 flight, and upgraded Rockford to a DC-8 and the other two SDF flights to the A300.

Lots and lots of AN-124s and -225s coming in as well. There's a Volga -124 on the ground right now from Shannon.

I have very high hopes on PIA coming here, and Trans Atlantic seems to be somewhat legit...I guess we'll see in two days. I wouldn't hedge my bets on Egypt Air. That rumor has been floating for a while, along with Saudi. Personally what I look forward to is having the KLM 763s here, hopefully timed so that they're here while the 744 is still around. Now who would have thought a couple years ago that you'd be able to go to Terminal D and get a picture of 3 BA 777s, AF 777, LH A340, and KLM 763 and 744 all at the same time?

Brian
Go Astros!
 
ssides
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Thu Dec 04, 2003 12:44 am

What's this rumor about CO starting flights to LOS? I have a hard time believing it, but you never know. I know Shell and other oil companies have big operations there, but it's hard to picture CO there.

If CO did launch this service, would they be the only US airline serving an African destination? I know some US airlines used to serve CAI and maybe a few others.
"Lose" is not spelled with two o's!!!!
 
thomasphoto60
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Thu Dec 04, 2003 5:51 am

Ssides,

I agree, LOS does seem to be a bit of an oddball route but as what was stated in that other thread concering CO's next int'l route, CO has a history of flying to "off the beaten track" destinations. It's "Air Mike" operations spring to mind as well as it's short lived service to CNS in the 90s. Indeed if CO should start the IAH/LOS route, they will be the only US carrier currently flying to Africa.

Thomas
"Show me the Braniffs"
 
MAH4546
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Thu Dec 04, 2003 6:48 am

It's "Air Mike" operations spring to mind as well as it's short lived service to CNS in the 90s.

CO still flies to CNS. Or where you referring to CO excluding Air Mike operations?
a.
 
User avatar
STT757
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Thu Dec 04, 2003 6:57 am

"Recently I heard that CO might be considering the idea of upgrading the route IAH-BOG-IAH from 737 to a 757. ."

At one time when they first launched the route I believe they did indeed fly the 757 to BOG, before they aquired the 737NGs.
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
AA7573E
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Thu Dec 04, 2003 7:24 am

@Thomasphoto60

I could not disagree more with you on your bold assertion that IAH will always outclass DFW in terms of international service. First of all I am unsure what roll class plays in the service at all. Secondly, when the new International terminal is complete at DFW, they will have the largest and most modern facility in the state, and more broadly in the Soutwest. When that facility is complete, sit back and watch the rumors about new international service at DFW become fact. Until then, we are talking about rumors at both airports. If I were a betting man, I would bet on DFW making more of their rumors into reality, and establishing itself as the dominant international airport in Texas (which will nicely complement its status as the busiest airport in the state, and the busiest facility West of the Mississippi!).



See you up front!
 
MAH4546
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Thu Dec 04, 2003 7:27 am

When that facility is complete, sit back and watch the rumors about new international service at DFW become fact. Until then, we are talking about rumors at both airports. If I were a betting man, I would bet on DFW making more of their rumors into reality, and establishing itself as the dominant international airport in Texas (which will nicely complement its status as the busiest airport in the state, and the busiest facility West of the Mississippi!).

Houston's position as the dominant international airport in Texas is not being threatened. It is based on the the simple fact that the international orgin & destination market from Houston to international markets is significantly larger than that of Dallas.
a.
 
artsyman
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Thu Dec 04, 2003 7:30 am

Will the International Terminal at DFW outclass the new Terminal E at IAH ?, This is a question, not a rhetorical question...

Jeremy
 
AA7573E
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Thu Dec 04, 2003 7:36 am

@MAH4546

Your simple facts do not seem to be panning out this year. The following numbers were taken from the DFW airport website and the Houston Airport System Website.

YTD International PAX

DFW - 4,387,338
IAH - 4,275,799

And that is with DFW currently having some of the worst international facilities in the state. The new terminal will bring marked improvements and new flights from a slew of airlines.



[Edited 2003-12-03 23:46:21]
See you up front!
 
brunswick737
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Thu Dec 04, 2003 7:54 am

Heck, It better be a good year for IAH. I want to see some more mixture of more airlines Instead of seeing them Continental Jets running around  Nuts (I really like continental a lot though)

Will the International Terminal at DFW outclass the new Terminal E at IAH ?, This is a question, not a rhetorical question...

maybe though.... I've been through Terminal E last weekend and for me it kinda has a "domestic" feel to it.....Hopefully by the time it is opened up for International Services it will probally be better....(I am talking about Terminal E) I really like the place, looks modern than terminal A,B,C & D
 
mattg21iah
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Thu Dec 04, 2003 8:21 am

Are there any plans to renovate Terminal C at IAH. On the whole its a great facility but Terminal C is pretty gross compared other airports.
 
thomasphoto60
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Thu Dec 04, 2003 8:26 am

David a.ka. AA7573E,

Jay and I have been antongnizing each other in a good nature manner for years now........so relax.

A slew of new airlines huh....want to name a few that have given any hard commitments to DFW? As for your assertion that DFW will dominate the int'l traffic market in the Texas and the SW once the new int'l terminal is completed, well we will see. Experience has taught me that "if you build it does not mean that they will come". As for those numbers, well I agree they are impressive. I suspect however if CO were the size of "Ameriflot", well IAH's numbers would be on a par if not higher than DFW.

Frankly it sounds to me like you have a problem with H-town!

Thomas
"Show me the Braniffs"
 
bigb
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Thu Dec 04, 2003 9:31 am

Hey AA757E

Thanks for the numbers, however, do not be surprise of the Int. numbers at IAH pass those at DFW. Sure DFW is busy, doesn't mean its INT. numbers are gonna sky rocket, same goes for KIAH.
ETSN Baber, USN
 
ContinentalFan
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Thu Dec 04, 2003 10:05 am

Mattg21ah,

Terminal E can't really be used as an international terminal until the new FIS bldg. is completed, which will be a couple of years after E is finished, so I think the plan is that once E is opened completely, they will be able to close of parts of C and renovate it one section at a time, with E picking up the slack.
 
toxtethogrady
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Thu Dec 04, 2003 10:05 am

"as well as a mysterious upstart carrier from Nigeria called Trans Atlantic Airways alledgely beginning an IAH flight to Banjul and Port Harcourt later this month"

Transatlantic is apparently for-real. We have been told to expect them at Dulles Airport bright and early Monday morning (12/08/03). With a Boeing 747-100. If it doesn't snow too badly...
 
toxtethogrady
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Thu Dec 04, 2003 10:09 am

"YTD International PAX

DFW - 4,387,338
IAH - 4,275,799"

Try looking at monthly stats. DFW's website has done a better job of posting up-to-date figures, but IAH has been ahead in the international passenger count for years.
 
MAH4546
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Thu Dec 04, 2003 10:11 am

YTD International PAX

DFW - 4,387,338
IAH - 4,275,799


Then it must be a real bad year for Houston, because in 2002 they handled 5.7M international passengers compared to DFW's 4.5M.
a.
 
bartond
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Thu Dec 04, 2003 11:21 am

Ha ha ha I've been watching over this typical Dallas vs. Houston (DFW vs. IAH) battle and here's my long-winded take on it, albeit mostly common sense and less filled with (f)actual knowledge:

DFW will always run more passengers through its doors than will Houston. Houston will probably always edge DFW in international carriers simply because of the number of oil refineries and plants in Pasadena (ick!) and oil and manufacturing companies based in H-town. There's more of a reason for someone like PIA to go to Houston than to Dallas, I guess. The Dallas metro area has surpassed Houston in size but it's the business pax that these airlines are counting on for revenue. Dallas is great for more white-collar business but not right now, with the huge tech debacle and real estate (two large economy-drivers in Dallas) being in a horrible state. Oil, however, is never going to have a "bust," per se...it will only run out at some point. ha. So Houston will continue to draw airlines for the oil/mfg. and the city's increasing international populations.

Plus, look at the metro areas with large AA hubs and international feed - Chicago, Miami, DFW. Chicago and Miami each get an absolute crapload of international carriers, many of whom are tied with AA, so there's no need for direct feed flights to DFW (see EI, IB, Finnair, Swiss..AA takes care of Zurich flights for DFW). That would be a big reason why a carrier like IB or EI would ever fly to DFW, is to use AA to connect pax through. Continental has Houston, Newark/NYC and Cleveland. Much smaller airports overall, so Houston serves as a megahub for Continental and will get an international carrier or two or add'l service from all of the new agreements CO is putting in place.

So, these are a couple of obvious things point to IAH growing more internationally than DFW. DFW's beautiful new int'l. terminal might attract an Asian carrier and we might get AF back and possibly QF someday, but that will be in a few years. In the meantime, DFW will continue to be dominated by AA and not much else will change. It never does for DFW dammit. Screw IAH. Ha ha, I'm really just kidding.
 
AA7573E
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Thu Dec 04, 2003 12:04 pm

Wow! I was not expecting to take such a beating, but after reading my comments, I guess I might of been a bit angry with my postings. If that is the case, it was certainly not the intention!

I am a bit partial to DFW, can ya tell, and I am a big fan of the new terminal. Again, we are all talking about rumors, and as one of the early posts in this thread said, "Rumors are not worth the paper they are printed on!". We will just have to wait and see who gets the big international fish, once the real bidding starts! Suffice it to say, it will be a good thing in the long run for Texas aviation, when the new International Terminal at DFW is complete, and when the new terminal(s) at IAH are fully finished out. I would, quite frankly, like to see both get good business, and I think they both attract disparate markets. IAH should see be able to develop the African and Middle East business, while DFW should, through the leverage applied by the One World Hub City Status, be able to draw more Asian and European traffic. It fits the demographics and the business PAX profile. I could see Korean and Air France coming back to DFW. There is always the never ending rumor about Quantas showing up, and lets not forget the new talk around the airport of Cathay Pacific setting up shop. And last but not least, lets not discount the potential of AA further expanding Latin American, European and Asian travel from DFW. That was one of AA's motivating factors in moving forward with their portion of the new terminal construction. I have an article from AA somewhere (I will locate and scan it in) discussing their very large international expansion at the new DFW international terminal. The article indcated that AA will make DFW their largest Asian departure station, and expand their currently underseverd Trans Atlantic destinations from the new DFW. Again, all rumors and speculation, but exciting speculation at the very least!

Again, sorry if I came across as hostile! And for the record, I lived in Houston for 23 years, so I have a lot of affinity for IAH as well!

Cheers
See you up front!
 
triley1057
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Thu Dec 04, 2003 12:21 pm

This IAH vs. DFW debate always makes me laugh. It's all good natured though AA7573E and by the way I am sure some Aussie is about to flame you for spelling Qantas with a "U." I agree that DFW will always be the bigger airport. IAH though, by all means in my opinion is a more international airport and city. No offense to anyone in the Big D. Just look at all the international airlines serving IAH compared to DFW. I don't think it has to do just with facilities. My home airport (LAX) doesn't have the best facilities and look at all the airlines cramming in there. If there is a will, there is a way. I am sure that when the new Intl terminal in Dallas opens, it will be AA adding all the new routes and maybe if you guys are lucky a few foreign airlines.

On a completely different subject, when/if CO joins Skyteam, what do you guys think the chances are of KE tagging on IAH to their DFW flight?
 
thomasphoto60
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Thu Dec 04, 2003 1:10 pm

The H-Town vs Big D debate is definetly fun to watch and participate. As someone who was born in Dallas and having more than a few relatives and friends in the "Mertoplex" I really enjoy a good and lively debate as this has turned out to be. A side note in regards to Triley's comment about Qantas, I live there some years back in the 90s and I can attest they do get a little pissed when we "septics" put in that 'u' .

Triley,

I am sure Jay might have a more definitive answer in regards to KE tagging on IAH to their ICN/DFW flight but my feeling is that they probably will not. Frankly I do not see any additional traffic increase (at least in huge numbers) due to Skyteam. Because CO has not seriously persued an alliance, and all of IAH's int'l service predates the alliance craze of the last decade, IAH is somewhat unique amongst secondary market airports in that int'l service stands on their own for the most part, frankly I find that something to be proud of.

So which TX city will get the first N/S to LHR........?

Thomas
"Show me the Braniffs"
 
MAH4546
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Thu Dec 04, 2003 1:16 pm

So which TX city will get the first N/S to LHR........?

Houston is definitley closer. British Airways flies IAH-LHR daily via ORD.
a.
 
jcs17
Posts: 7376
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Thu Dec 04, 2003 2:48 pm

Despite our lack of international airlines, at least we are still allowed to take pictures of aircraft here at DFW  Smile
America's chickens are coming home to rooooost!
 
thomasphoto60
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Thu Dec 04, 2003 2:59 pm

Well, we can still take pics here from the terminal garages . Still I much rather have my two old haunts back, as they provided some fantastic photo ops.

Thomas
"Show me the Braniffs"
 
bartond
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Fri Dec 05, 2003 12:14 am

AA757, good post sir. I agree with you. I think the airports will kinda go their separate directions and have different strategies, which is fine. Nothing wrong with having two large international airports in one state, and I'd love to see happen what you mentioned - for IAH to conquer Africa and the Middle East while still having a good European network, and DFW to really make a push at Asia and increasing its European market. It will be a slow process but if this economy can get out of the dumps I think both international terminals will get some int'l. carriers to bite.
 
triley1057
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Fri Dec 05, 2003 5:20 am

On a different subject, do you guys see any new domestic carriers coming to IAH? I would love to see Alaska sitting at Terminal A as well as Jetblue. Although with Jetblue, I see them at HOU rather than IAH if they choose to fly to Houston. I'm going to make a bold prediction (this is only my opinion) that you will see Hooters Air at one of the Houston airports soon. If I am right, one of you Houstonians can buy me a beer on my next Houston visit.
 Smile/happy/getting dizzy
 
jcs17
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Fri Dec 05, 2003 6:03 am

Houston is definitley closer. British Airways flies IAH-LHR daily via ORD.

And AA flies to LHR via ORD as well on a single f/n....

I doubt it. I have a feeling that if the Bermuda agreements are ever changed to be inclusive of more cities and airlines both AA, BA, and CO would all garner route authorities to LHR from IAH and DFW. So, in other words, I doubt one city would get n/s service before the others.

Apparently, Air France will not be coming back to the DFW market in the near future (at least for Summer '04). This was expressed in a SkyTeam communique recently when that specific question was posed. For that reason partially, I would not be surprised to see KLM exploring the possibility to come to DFW in the near future. Think about it for a second, there is only one airline at DFW that can actually offer seamless, one-airline connections to European and Middle Eastern cities...and that is Lufthansa (BA is to LGW which offers very limited connections). What kind of Star Alliance presence is at DFW? Virtually none. The fact that Lufthansa has been able to do reasonably well against AA should be heartening to DFW. Not to mention that DFW is still a very high yield market for trans-Atlantic flights. Hell, AA doesn't even serve AMS any more, although I'm not sure if they still hold the right to fly ORD-AMS. I am still convinced that there is still a market for another major European airline or two at DFW for that reason.
America's chickens are coming home to rooooost!
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Fri Dec 05, 2003 6:06 am

So which TX city will get the first N/S to LHR........?

Houston is definitley closer. British Airways flies IAH-LHR daily via ORD.


True. But then again, there's always the [off] chance that BA may someday pull DFW for some reason or other. If so, AA could theoretically switch the flight to LHR, due to its traffic numbers and existent authority to serve that airport. (similar situation to BA @ PHX/DEN/SAN)
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
thomasphoto60
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Fri Dec 05, 2003 12:31 pm

DFW is bound to see increased services to Europe by European carriers, though I sincerely doubt that KL would be one of those carriers. Keep in mind that pending the approval of the EU and other parties if the announced purchase of KL by AF goes through, well than KLM's days as an independent carrier are probably numbered, despite the comments to the contrary, which of course leave IAH short one European carrier (the longest, btw).

IMO one such carrier that might give DFW a serious looksee would be VS.

Thomas
"Show me the Braniffs"
 
bigb
Posts: 722
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Fri Dec 05, 2003 1:08 pm

IMO one such carrier that might give DFW a serious looksee would be VS.

If VS wanted to come to Texas, IAH would be first on the list due to the codeshare with CO.
ETSN Baber, USN
 
bigb
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RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Fri Dec 05, 2003 1:23 pm

IAH? I would love to see Alaska sitting at Terminal A as well as Jetblue. Although with Jetblue, I see them at HOU rather than IAH if they choose to fly to Houston. I'm going to make a bold prediction (this is only my opinion) that you will see Hooters Air at one of the Houston airports soon. If I am right, one of you Houstonians can buy me a beer on my next Houston visit.


Alaska already serves IAH, its operated by CO as a Code Share, as long as CO and AS are code sharing, Alaska planes will not show up at IAH.

JetBlue, if they do come, its gonna be a long long time from now. I highley doubt a HOU-JFK route would make a good run (pax wise) for B6 plus there only challenger on HOU-JFK, would probably be AUS-HOU-LGA ran by AA. If there were to run IAH-JFK, I believe CO will be giving them shit trouble along with AA.

If Hooters AIr shows up at IAH or HOU withing the next six months I will buy you a Beer myself.
ETSN Baber, USN
 
MAH4546
Posts: 24521
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 1:44 pm

RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Fri Dec 05, 2003 2:22 pm

And AA flies to LHR via ORD as well on a single f/n....

With a change of plane from an M80 to a 777. The only thing that single flight number does is give passengers on the DFW-LHR flight less air miles. They get the miles for DFW-LHR, as opposed to DFW-ORD-LHR.

although I'm not sure if they still hold the right to fly ORD-AMS.

I think the Netherlands and the US have Open Skies. No route rights needed.

IMO one such carrier that might give DFW a serious looksee would be VS.

I would not hold my breathe. Dallas does not Virgin's destination profile at all. Every city they serve in the Americas is a popular leisure destination from London. Now, none the less, destinations like New York City clearly have heavy business traffic, but they still are popular leisure destinations. In fact, in thier whole system, only Lagos and Port Harcourt do not fit the leisure profile.
a.
 
thomasphoto60
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Joined: Thu Jan 27, 2000 1:04 pm

RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Fri Dec 05, 2003 3:15 pm

BigB,

In regards to HOU vs IAH, well some locals (specifically some very vocal IAH supporters) would love to see HOU shut down as they feel it takes away potential business from IAH. I personally do not agree with this sentiment however. I believe that Houston benefits from being a 2 airport (3 when you include EFD) city and besides where would WN go? I doubt seriously that they would want to set up a large HOU type of operation at IAH.

As for which airport a carrier like Jetblue, Alaska and others would choose is a very good question. All I can give is an educated guess and I am inclined to believe most of the so called "LCCs" like Jetblue would probably choose HOU over IAH due in part to lowerer operating costs at HOU. While Jetblue has had Houston on their route map from the get go (although not acknowleging which airport) I don't expect to see their "320s" anytime in the Houston market on a schedule basis anytime soon. Like WN they tend to choose their markets very carefully and as what happened to their short live service to ATL and Houston being dominated by 2 carriers well I afraid that our fair city looks less attractive at this time. To the comment that Jetblue would possibly not do too well running a JFK/HOU service. Bare in mind PA and TW had n/s service from these 2 airports in the 80s, though I can not say as whether they were successful or not. I suppose the fact that neither carrier is around may say something.

Alaska actually had a interchange agreement (pre code share for the youngsters out there) with AA at IAH in the late 80s/early 90s and now with their affiliation with CO, I believe that they would select IAH over HOU.

Thomas
"Show me the Braniffs"
 
bartond
Posts: 646
Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2003 6:59 am

RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Fri Dec 05, 2003 4:01 pm

Although it would be nice, VS ain't comin to Dallas. There's too much AA/BA interest there (4x daily DFW-LGW right now) and, like was mentioned before, VS tends to take leisure destinations that have some business ties, too...Dallas is all business, unlike Orlando, Boston, NYC, Vegas, etc.

I'm with Jcs that it's strange that only one Euro airline offers one-airline connections from DFW through Europe to other areas. However, i'm not sure why KL would ever want to start service here. I'm not aware of many Dutch business in Dallas/Fort Worth, there's not a big Dutch community here, and there are no real codeshare advantages with any airlines that serve DFW. KL to IAH serves Texas all that it needs from AMS. AF will come back at some point to serve some of the French businesses that have significant operations in the metroplex and the crapload of tourists going to France from this region, but it might take awhile and it might not happen at all if DL keeps adding regional jets and taking away decent-sized aircraft.
 
bigb
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Joined: Fri Nov 07, 2003 4:30 pm

RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Fri Dec 05, 2003 5:24 pm

In regards to HOU vs IAH, well some locals (specifically some very vocal IAH supporters) would love to see HOU shut down as they feel it takes away potential business from IAH. I personally do not agree with this sentiment however. I believe that Houston benefits from being a 2 airport (3 when you include EFD) city and besides where would WN go? I doubt seriously that they would want to set up a large HOU type of operation at IAH.

Thomas, regarding to this issue of IAH vs. HOU. I like HAS and how it is set up. Houston is a city that needs multi airports. I personally want both airports open. (therefore I can keep my job at HOU). Yes, WN don't want HOU ops at IAH. Why? Because of Delays. Besides, HOU has a nice project going right now. Central Concourse should be finished in the spring time.

As for which airport a carrier like Jetblue, Alaska and others would choose is a very good question. All I can give is an educated guess and I am inclined to believe most of the so called "LCCs" like Jetblue would probably choose HOU over IAH due in part to lowerer operating costs at HOU. While Jetblue has had Houston on their route map from the get go (although not acknowleging which airport) I don't expect to see their "320s" anytime in the Houston market on a schedule basis anytime soon. Like WN they tend to choose their markets very carefully and as what happened to their short live service to ATL and Houston being dominated by 2 carriers well I afraid that our fair city looks less attractive at this time. To the comment that Jetblue would possibly not do too well running a JFK/HOU service. Bare in mind PA and TW had n/s service from these 2 airports in the 80s, though I can not say as whether they were successful or not. I suppose the fact that neither carrier is around may say something.

Yes I'm aware of TW and PA running these routes a long time ago, but that is a long time ago. I'm a ticket verifier at HOU sercurity checkpoints, I'm mostly on central concourse in the afternoons, but I have worked on concourse C quite a few times, I do not usualy how many are usually on the plane still coming from Austin going to LGA for the afternoon let, but I can tell ya, around a avg of I say 50 people would be booked on the afternoon flight going to LGA from HOU. For the evening flight, only a avg, of 5 people are booked going to LGA from HOU and about 45 people would be booked going from AUS-LGA.

Alaska actually had a interchange agreement (pre code share for the youngsters out there) with AA at IAH in the late 80s/early 90s and now with their affiliation with CO, I believe that they would select IAH over HOU.

I remember hearing about AA and AS relationships in the past, however, AS already service IAH-SEA (operated by CO on codeshared).
ETSN Baber, USN
 
bigb
Posts: 722
Joined: Fri Nov 07, 2003 4:30 pm

RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Fri Dec 05, 2003 5:33 pm

Besides, If AS planes do decide to actually show up, I'll be happy to welcome them at Terminal C or B at IAH.
ETSN Baber, USN
 
thomasphoto60
Posts: 3686
Joined: Thu Jan 27, 2000 1:04 pm

RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Fri Dec 05, 2003 9:52 pm

I completley agree that the chances of VS serving DFW anytime, well frankly, DFW would have a better chance of seeing a July blizzard. My point was that if VS were ever to consider a service to the Lone Star Sate that DFW would probably get the nod over IAH. Now if memory serves you guys still have LH abd BA, correct? Hey maybe SAS, IB, Finnair might consider a DFW flight. You never know.

BigB,


How are things at HOU? I imagine you guys are getting geard up for the big show (Superbowl) in Dec. I hear that HOU may be swamped with Biz Jets in the coming weeks. As I live in the Kingwood area, I primairly use IAH, but I will have to make the drive to HOU one day soon and do some photography. Say when is the "Terminal 1940" project due to open? I though I read that it would be around the 17th or so.


Thomas

Thomas
"Show me the Braniffs"
 
bigb
Posts: 722
Joined: Fri Nov 07, 2003 4:30 pm

RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Sat Dec 06, 2003 1:23 am

Thomas things are HOU are well. A little behind on the Terminal project. Half of Central Concourse (East wing) is open for SWA (flights that run to Dallas, Corpus, HRL). The west wing of Central is due to open in the spring. The rest of the Terminal is going be quite a while.

Yes, HOU is suppose to be swamped with Biz Jets (from what I heard). They are suppose to close a taxiway down for parking for these Biz Jets. Chances are, is that the superbowl teams might charter into HOU instead of IAH (closer to the Stadium). I live closer to IAH, I tend to make most of my trips out of IAH, but I just work at HOU.
ETSN Baber, USN
 
jcs17
Posts: 7376
Joined: Mon Jun 18, 2001 11:13 am

RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Sat Dec 06, 2003 1:57 am

Finnair might actually be a possibility for DFW, for two main reasons:

1) Nokia's massive US headquarters in is Irving. Therefore, the numbers of high-yield business travelers between the two cities (DFW-HEL) is actually quite high. No to mention that I believe I read an article that says Dallas is in the top five US business destinations for Finnish travellers.

combine this with...

2) Finnair really does not offer good connections in the US market from JFK or MIA at all. The connection possibilities are quite limited as compared to DFW.

There is no doubt in my mind that Finnair would come to DFW before ORD. I wouldn't be surprised to see DFW operated as an extension of the JFK flight a few times a week.
America's chickens are coming home to rooooost!
 
UA744Flagship
Posts: 1433
Joined: Tue Jul 13, 1999 1:55 pm

RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Sat Dec 06, 2003 2:19 am

I definitely think IAH has a lot of potential.

The professor of my airport management class was the #2 airport manager at IAH until 2.5 years ago, when she left to be the #1 at my school airport.

One of her main projects was Terminal E.

I went through E on thanksgiving and was very impressed.
no wire hangers!
 
jsnww81
Posts: 2294
Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2002 3:29 am

RE: 2004, A Good Year For IAH....?

Sat Dec 06, 2003 4:24 am

First of all, let me just say how refreshing it is to read an intelligent, good-natured debate on this site. Quite a change from the usual 12-year-olds claiming that JetBlue is coming to Bozeman, Montana, followed by the chorus of grade-schoolers saying "your wrong! there going too fly too Bismarck!"

(I was a journalism major in college, so the grammar and misspellings really get my dander up --  Smile )

On the subject of DFW and IAH... Texas is really blessed to have not one but two successful international airports. Continental has done a phenomenal job building IAH into the world hub it is today. I've been especially impressed with the number of ERJ flights to small Mexican markets that they've opened up; they've really got the market covered. Historically, IAH has always had more international service -- even back in the 1970s, they were served by Aeromexico, Air France and KLM, while DFW was only handling Mexicana.

So IAH has always had a little more international variety. I'd definitely agree that they're well-poised to pick up some African traffic, if and when it does come.

The new Terminal D at DFW is going to be a phenomenal facility, no doubt about it. It's got to be one of the largest all-in-one international facilities in the country, after SFO, ORD and LAX (it may even be larger than LAX, I'm not sure). When it does open, it'll be swamped with American Airlines flights, however - they operate the bulk of DFW's international services. It probably won't have the 'color' that the international ops at IAH have, although I'd love to see a few more of the big European carriers at DFW (hopefully AF will return, although it's probably unlikely.)

Thanks again for your good humor and insightful comments. It's debates like this that renew my faith in these forums - I was getting pretty close to deleting my profile, honestly.

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