727LOVER
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Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Sun Dec 07, 2003 7:15 am

Armchair CEO time again!

Would a CMH hub for Airtran work? As of now, when flying between the east coast to the midwest, you have go down south. How many empty gates at CMH since HP pulled back>?  Smile/happy/getting dizzy
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AirDude66
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Sun Dec 07, 2003 7:26 am

FL flies to CAK, DAY, PIT

CMH...no chance!

They could do the same in Dayton if it was even a thought.
 
All4BWI
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Sun Dec 07, 2003 7:29 am

AirTran could probably make a CMH hub work, but they'd probably prefer opening a hub further west. There's already a lot of hubs up in the general area of CMH too. US in PIT...CO in CLE...DL in CVG...NW in DTW. If the concern is that you have to go down south to fly between the east coast and midwest, why would they open a CMH hub when they already have a nice focus city at BWI? AirTran will serve 12 destinations from BWI by mid-February, and they're not planning on slowing their BWI expansion anytime soon.
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B4REAL
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Sun Dec 07, 2003 7:53 am

No way yet, even though I really like CMH.

All4BWI says it well in that the 'region' is hub good, and even add ORD and MDW to that list.

CMH does have high O&D, which is good for a LCC business model.

What CMH also has is a lot of competition in that market. When I lived in Upper Arlington and Hilliard, I loved CMH for great fares, market driven routes (not just to hubs), and good accessibility, though the security lines could be bad at times.
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Cleco
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Sun Dec 07, 2003 9:33 am

CMH is pretty open right now, but I'm not sure how much of a difference that makes. I agree with All4BWI, in the sense that their are already a lot of hubs in the region. Yet, part of the game is making more product available than will be bought.

When you look around at who has hubs in the region it is continental, Northwest, USAir, Delta. None of these are low cost carriers.
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usairways85
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Sun Dec 07, 2003 1:15 pm

Never.

Airtran is molding together its route network, with ATL as the main hub, BWI and DFW as mini-hubs, and FLL, MCO, and PHL as focus cities. I think the only other potential focus city/mini hub is probably a west coast city.
 
airways6max
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Sun Dec 07, 2003 2:04 pm

Only if Air Tran decides to build an extensive route network throughout the Midwest. The competition is already fierce--right All4BWI?
 
flyCMH
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Sun Dec 07, 2003 2:09 pm

For the reasons previously mentioned, Columbus would most likely not fit into AirTran's route map as a hub. There are about 8 gates left open by America West. However I don't think that, or Columbus' O/D, is enough to convince AirTran to place a hub here. On the other hand, I could see AirTran with service to Columbus, despite its proximity to Dayton. The O/D between CMH and ATL is pretty significant, even with Delta charging pretty hefty fares on the route. During the Valujet days, the airline did incredibly well in Columbus, sending 5 DC-9s daily to ATL, in addition to 2 flights to IAD. Lastly, the airport is offering quite a few dollars in marketing and other incentives for new airlines in Columbus. So I think they could make a go at it.
 
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zippyjet
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Sun Dec 07, 2003 3:02 pm

Interesting question. We (Air Tran) will be taking delivery of 737-700 and 800 series birds brand spanking new from Boeing. In a little over 6 months, these beauties will take to the skies and be able to get you to and from the left coast non-stop from BWI, PHL and our other east coast cities. I feel it would be cool if we opened up stations in Reno and Seattle. Stay tuned!

http://www.boeing.com/news/releases/2003/photorelease/q3/pr_030701g.html
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rockyracoon
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Sun Dec 07, 2003 3:16 pm

I think CMH could be quite succesful as well, maybe not a hub but definetely focus city. Maybe a few once a day flights to the west: LAX, SFO, LAS (once the 737-800s are onboard) along with some east coast routes on the 717-200s. People would definetely flock to CMH from CLE and CVG. I know DAY and CAK are already established, but with CMH you might see more business men and others (the ones who don't care about fares) who would enjoy some direct flights. Forgive my ignorance, but how big of a threat would Southwest be? How many flights do they currently operate?

Tim
 
flyCMH
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Sun Dec 07, 2003 3:30 pm

I really don't think Southwest would be too much of an issue. Several of the destinations they serve from CMH, mainly BWI and MCO, are seriously underserved now with the departure of America West. For example, America West had 200 daily seats to BWI that filled up constantly, and mostly with O/D pax. Since their depature, no one has come in to fill the gap. Besides the point though, Southwest currently has 16 daily flights to 8 destinations from Columbus operating from 3 gates. Here's the breakdown:

MDW: 5
BWI: 2
TPA: 2
MCO: 1
BNA: 2
STL: 1
PHX: 1
LAS: 2
 
luv2fly
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Mon Dec 08, 2003 12:26 am

Considering the ever increasing presence they have a CAK, I think that will be the focus city in the area more than CMH. Think about it, in CAK you do not have any other LCC's to compete with and it is close enough to draw from both the CLE market and even PIT. So no to CMH being a focus or a hub.
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elwood64151
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Mon Dec 08, 2003 1:47 am

Luv2fly:

While CAK is providing great O&D revenue, I doubt it will become a focus city.

AirTran is expanding westward. They need a coast-to-coast hub somewhere in the midwest or great plains. I have mentioned my biased preference for MCI, but I have doubts that will happen, either.

CMH does not strike me much better. It is a competitive market and while it has good O&D numbers, it is far too close to BWI to be used effectively, I think. BWI will become the northeast hub, connecting PA, NY, New England, MD, VA, WV, and OH to the midwest and west, while ATL will continue as the southern hub.

The question is, where will their coast-to-coast hub be? DFW is adding flights, but the competition from DL and AA will be fierce! STL already has significant presence from WN, and AA is still technically a hub carrier. IND is too small, as are BMI, MLI, DAY, DSM, LIT, ICT, OMA, OKC, and TUL. MEM is dominated by NW, and is too close, really, to ATL. MKE looks good, but YX is holding on to those gates, and FL will need them sooner rather than later. It's also a trifle small. MCI has its gate/connection issues that seriously hampered so many airlines that have tried there (though this could be easily fixed if the city would just listen to me!!!  Big grin). DEN is dominated by F9 and UA, and has its winter-ops issues. BNA is next-door to ATL, and too far east and south for a coast-to-coast hub.

The only cities left are MSP, DTW, CVG, CLE and ORD, each of which is dominated by another carrier that FL would have to fight for market share.

So, where can FL go for a coast-to-coast hub?
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luv2fly
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Mon Dec 08, 2003 2:13 am

Elwood64151

I agree that MCI will never happen, Joe Leonard having been previous with EA and EA having had an MCI hub that I do not see him repeating.

CAK keeps getting more service, LGA is now offered. Florida service also and of course ATL. Also like I pointed out it does not have another LCC to compete with, as CMH, CLE, ORD and DTW already has a LCC carrier in place.

MSP and the Humphrey terminal might work tho NW will fight tooth and nail to protect there fortress hub. Also to a small extent you do have Sun Country there.

To this day I believe that NW beefed up service out of MKE for 2 reasons, one because of the weak state of YX and two as a preemtive strike so AirTran would not come in first and offer more service.

I do think you will see DFW as a mini hub of sorts that will offer connection of a limited scope and it will rely more on the huge O & D market that is already there.
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InnocuousFox
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Mon Dec 08, 2003 2:18 am

"AirTran is expanding westward. They need a coast-to-coast hub somewhere in the midwest or great plains. I have mentioned my biased preference for MCI, but I have doubts that will happen, either."

They could pick up the old Vanguard gates if they are still available or they could pick up some of the slack at STL where TWA/AA is pulling out.
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InnocuousFox
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Mon Dec 08, 2003 2:19 am

From what I understand, CMH may be a good place for an airline to just start a completely RJ hub to serve that whole area. Who? I don't know...
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luv2fly
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Mon Dec 08, 2003 2:21 am

InnocuousFox

That is what HP had for the most part and they left!!!!
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InnocuousFox
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Mon Dec 08, 2003 2:22 am

"That is what HP had for the most part and they left!!!!"

Yeah, but is that because of CMH or HP?
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luv2fly
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Mon Dec 08, 2003 2:26 am

I am not 100% sure of the reason tho 9-11 played into the reason or was used as the reason for leaving the hub, and of course the financial conditions of HP sure did not help at the time. And in CMH you do have WN, in CAK you have FL and out of DAY you have FL as well and PIT is only a little over 2 and 1/2 hours from CMH. A lot of choices in the area. It never really was a strong hub for HP, used to connect LGA and DCA from the west coast since they could not offer non-stops at the time from those cities/hubs.
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capt078
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Mon Dec 08, 2003 2:55 am

although not specific to columbus, this is an old topic. given airtran's recent westward expansion, and columbus' relative proximity to baltimore, i do not think we will see an airtran hub in columbus. my bet is a future airtran hub will be west of the mississippi river, most likely milwaukee. also, one of the reasons america west pulled out of columbus was there was not enough o&d traffic or demand at cmh. no reason to think airtran would have any more success.
 
InnocuousFox
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Mon Dec 08, 2003 3:21 am

"west of the mississippi river, most likely milwaukee"

Grab a map, sir.
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capt078
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Mon Dec 08, 2003 4:38 am

InnocuousFox:

you are absolutely correct. sorry about that. can you believe i made it to the state finals of the national geographic, geography bee in the 4th grade? actually, i got distracted when writing that, and wasn't thinking. if it makes you feel better, i'm ashamed. nevertheless, i do think that milwaukee potentially has a future with airtran. we'll see. if not, i would think they would pick a city at least west of the great lakes, if not west of the mississippi (see that, i covered my ass on that one).
 
InnocuousFox
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Mon Dec 08, 2003 4:55 am

"if not, i would think they would pick a city at least west of the great lakes"

Lake Superior would be insulted, sir.  Smile

Anyway, I don't think MKE has enough gate space to support a hub other than the presence that Midex has there. I'm serious... look to STL and/or MCI.
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InnocuousFox
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Mon Dec 08, 2003 5:15 am

"Armchair CEO time again!"

Sure... be my guest!
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flyCMH
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Mon Dec 08, 2003 5:15 am

Luv2Fly:

America West's decision to pull the Columbus hub was mostly likely a mix of the after-effect of September 11 and the then-impending war in Iraq, combined with their new fare structure and Delta's strong-arm tactics to further weaken HP in Columbus.

As I've said before, prior to September 11, 2001, the hub was going to be expanded greatly. The plans were already drawn up for 6 more regional jet bridges to be implemented in Concourse B, and flights were supposed to be boosted eventually up to 90 daily flights.

In the time between September 11, 2001 and February 11, 2003 (the day America West announced the hub closure), there really wasn't any indication that the hub might be closing until a month or so before the announcement. But many underlying aspects signaling the doom of the hub were apparent

First off, it is VERY clear now that America West's new fare structure does not support the continues use of small regional gets (50 seats and less). Mr. Doug Parker has claimed before that the CRJs (200 and 700) do not work in the America West system, hence why America West has dumped the CRJ-700, increased CRJ-900 utilization, and lessened the number of CRJ-200s in operation. Since HP's CMH operation proportionally was very RJ-heavy, full planes were not guaranteeing profitable flights with the new fare structure.

Secondly, the airline industry was again in a state of disarray in the weeks before the conflict in Iraq. Airline stocks were back to near-Sept. 11 lows and the future was cloudy at best. I would think that this also prompted the airline's decision to not take the financial risk, and go ahead and shut the hub down.

Thirdly, Delta sensed blood in the water in Columbus, and quietly ramped up and stream-lined operations in CMH. Delta had always been neck-and-neck with America West in Columbus, and this time was ready to deal the final blow. Delta initiated service to Washington National from Columbus, which had traditionally been a good route for America West. Delta also started a codeshare agreement with Chautauqua Airlines, which also served as America West Express at the time, and place RJs on the Florida route. This trumped America West's service by offering double the frequency HP offered to Orlando and flying no empty first class seats, whereas HPs Airbusses to Florida left with first class occupied either by upgrade recipients or non-revvers.

Given these factors, I do think the main one that lead to the hub's demise was the new fare structure. Yes, the hub consisted mostly of RJ flights. But proportionally, it was no different to Continental's Cleveland hub. Apply the same fare structure in CLE and you have the exact same dilemma as was faced in CMH, but with more flights. That and America West truly had no interest in maintaining their presence out east. Certain routes such as BWI, BOS, and YYZ filled consistently, but instead of focusing in on the faults and repairing them, they decided to abandon the investment altogether.

Lastly, given today's airline system in the United States, I quite plainly do not think that a full-fledged hub in Columbus could work. HOWEVER, I am positive that a sort of "focus city," capitalizing on high O/D markets from Columbus with a strictly low fare attitude, could definitely work. My example would be ATA's operations in Indianapolis. Demographically and geographically, Indianapolis and Columbus are VERY similar cities: both have a metro population of roughly 1.8 million, both are rapidly growing new cities, both are state capitals, in the center of their respective states, and are located in the Midwest. While ATA might not have a full-fledged hub in IND, they have an excellent route system from IND, flying to high O/D destinations such as Los Angeles, Cancun, Orlando, Ft. Lauderdale, and New York with all coach 737-800 and 757-200/300 aircraft. I have no doubt in my mind that a similar set up could work in Columbus. There just needs to be an airline that is willing to invest in such an endeavor.
 
InnocuousFox
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Mon Dec 08, 2003 5:29 am

Uh... wow. Not bad at all. I hadn't thought about comparing it to IND.
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luv2fly
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Mon Dec 08, 2003 9:47 am

The number of destinations offered non stop out of CLE is way more than what HP ever offered from CMH. True we might have are shares of RJ flights, we also offer way more cities non stop.
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luv2fly
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Mon Dec 08, 2003 9:48 am

Also 9-11 was in 2001 and the war in Iraq was not intil 2003!
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flyCMH
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Mon Dec 08, 2003 12:00 pm

The number of destinations offered non stop out of CLE is way more than what HP ever offered from CMH.

Well, one would assume that if there are more flights being offered, that a greater number of destinations are also offered (i.e. 250+ flights going to 16 cities wouldn't make much sense). So that's a moot point.

Also 9-11 was in 2001 and the war in Iraq was not intil 2003!

I don't believe I understand your point. I was trying to highlight the different occurances between the September 11 attacks and the announcement of America West's hub closure. I'm sorry if there was any confusion.
 
Midway2AirTran
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Mon Dec 08, 2003 2:02 pm

My three guesses...
ORD
ORD
oh, did I mention
ORD.

Cheers! Smile
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capt078
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Mon Dec 08, 2003 2:59 pm

InnocuousFox: this time i meant exactly what i typed. the "great lakes region" is generally considered to be the lands east of wisconsin to the western boarders of new york state.

milwaukee and kansas city are interesting possibilities for airtran. i doubt st. louis will be chosen...too much american airlines pressure, and a history of failures. that also goes for kansas city, but at least with k.c., airtran would be choosing a more westerly hub than st. louis, whose proximity to atlanta could prove a deterrant. with milwaukee, airtran would be choosing a prime airport to facilitate easy transfer for the coveted east-west transcontinental travelers, particularly with regards to those traveling between northern california/pacific northwest and the northeast/mid-atlantic states.

of course, given the recent rise of point-to-point operations, airtran's recent orders for 737-700s, and the airline's admitted reason for buying these planes being higher capacity and the ability to fly transcontinental routes, there is no clear evidence the airline intends to add another hub. certainly, adding longer distance routes from atlanta, baltimore, philadelphia, and perhaps others, are as much a possibility as the ever-so-costly addition of another hub-and-spoke city.
 
DCA-ROCguy
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Mon Dec 08, 2003 3:15 pm

On the other hand, I could see AirTran with service to Columbus, despite its proximity to Dayton. The O/D between CMH and ATL is pretty significant, even with Delta charging pretty hefty fares on the route. During the Valujet days, the airline did incredibly well in Columbus, sending 5 DC-9s daily to ATL, in addition to 2 flights to IAD.

I second your entire post, FlyCMH, especially this part. AirTran's Dayton station draws from Delta-oppressed Cincinnati, so an FL station in CMH probably wouldn't hurt DAY. FL does fine in Buffalo and Rochester which are slightly further apart than Columbus and Dayton. FL offers connections from ATL to lots of places WN doesn't fly, either.

Like you I don't see CMH ever hosting either an LCC or network-carrier hub, but the market still seems to me underserved. I can't believe Southwest only runs two dailies to BWI, that route could probably support 5-6 if they wanted. Buffalo and Albany each support 7 with smaller MSA's.

Jim
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jimbobjoe
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Mon Dec 08, 2003 4:24 pm

Indianapolis and Columbus are VERY similar cities: both have a metro population of roughly 1.8 million, both are rapidly growing new cities, both are state capitals, in the center of their respective states, and are located in the Midwest.

I believe that Indianapolis is a touch bigger than Columbus (metro area wise.) But just a touch.

I however disagree on the midwest part. I personally have never considered Ohio "midwest." For me, midwest doesn't begin until at least Central time (which, given all that vagaries of Indiana...I move to the border of Illinois.)

 
Coronado990
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Mon Dec 08, 2003 4:57 pm

I would very much call Ohio the Midwest. Ohio was christened the "Midwest" probably in the 1700s long before the the U.S. was a coast-to-coast nation and when the center of the United States was much further east.
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luv2fly
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Mon Dec 08, 2003 11:57 pm

Ohio and Michigan are very much part of the Midwest.
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InnocuousFox
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Tue Dec 09, 2003 12:14 am

"I doubt st. louis will be chosen...too much american airlines pressure, and a history of failures. that also goes for kansas city, but at least with k.c., airtran would be choosing a more westerly hub than st. louis, whose proximity to atlanta could prove a deterrant"

Kansas City is only a few hundred miles west of STL so there isn't much to be gained there. As for pressure from American in STL, they are pulling out of STL quite a bit. Since one of the requirements for starting a hub is available gate space - and lots of it - the opportunities are plentiful in STL.
Dave Mark - Intrinsic Algorithm - Reducing the world to mathematical equations!
 
luv2fly
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Tue Dec 09, 2003 12:19 am

STL already has a LCC WN is firmly in place in STL, also MCI.
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capt078
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Tue Dec 09, 2003 12:43 am

the midwest is pretty much considered to stretch from western new york state until about minnesota. just listen carefully for the nasal midwestern accent that is prolific in this region.

InnocuousFox: i continue to disagree with your assumption that St. Louis is a good hub option for airtran. i refer you to the numerous posts held on this topic over the past year; the general concensus has been that st. louis is too close to atlanta. i find it interesting that you are so quick to turn down the notion that kansas city is not a consideration because it is only a few hundred miles west of stl. well, stl and atl are only about 500 miles or so apart from each other, not a lot in this business. perhaps the added few hundred miles to mci would be enough to justify a hub there. you may also recall when airtran was considering the purchase of twa. airtran declined that option for several reasons, not the least of which (according to joe leonard), was that st. louis was too close to atlanta to make it a viable option. st. louis will not be an airtran hub. for that matter, i doubt very much kansas city will either. i am even skepticial that airtan will pick a hub at all, although i do see a western focus city as a possibility. as my previous post mentioned, i think airtran will start more point-to-point operations, as well as continue to grow their exhisting hub and focus citiies.

lastly, you mention that american is pulling out significantly from st. louis. while this is true, american will still be the largest operator at the airport, offering over two-hundred flights (not something to be ignored).

Luv2Fly: so what if southwest is ingrained in both st. louis and kansas city? that didn't stop airtran from entering and succeeding in baltimore.
 
luv2fly
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Tue Dec 09, 2003 1:00 am

Both AirTran and Southwest took BWI from US thanks to US's financial condition, they both came in at about the same time, WN has been in both STL and MCI for years.
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capt078
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Tue Dec 09, 2003 1:31 am

Luv2fly: no offense, but you are absolutely incorrect.

southwest was in baltimore well before airtran. southwest started service out of baltimore in 1993, and today operates 156 daily flights from bwi to 35 cities. bwi is one of southwest's top-ten airports, something neither st. louis or kansas city can claim. check out the below link for more information.

http://www.southwest.com/about_swa/press/factsheet.html

airtran did not start service to baltimore until 2001. below is a link from airtran's website announcing the commencement of service to baltimore, their 36th destination.

http://www.businesswire.com/webbox/bw.121201/213462131.htm
 
luv2fly
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Tue Dec 09, 2003 1:37 am

Well in this case I am wrong, sorry.
You can cut the irony with a knife
 
capt078
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Tue Dec 09, 2003 1:43 am

no reason to be sorry, but thank you for acknowledging your mistake. you certainly were correct that both airtran and southwest (and others) have capitalized on us airways' failure at bwi. perhaps airtran could capitalize on american's contraction of services out of stl., as well as the limited services out of mci.
 
luv2fly
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Tue Dec 09, 2003 1:51 am

Well yes and no, I think STL is to close to ATL, which is what AA is now realizing, STL to close to ORD and DFW, MCI Joe Leonard who was previously with EA, and EA had a hub in MCI I do not think he is going to revisit a MCI hub anytime soon. Also just a thought these 737's have the range to do coast to coast, so other then the 4 gates at DFW, does AirTran even need a West Coast hub?
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Mikey711MN
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Tue Dec 09, 2003 2:18 am

I don't think MKE would be entirely out of the question as I think there'd be ample gate space for at least a mini-hub operation. Moving DL over to E (where FL happens to have their two gates) would allow the [soon-to-be-]SkyTeam clan to be together (along with NW and COEx), which would "force" the Tran over to C where there happens to be a lot of room. Combined with the planned renovation and expansion of C, and I think a reasonable operation could be maintained there over the long term.

It's just a question of whether they'd want to relative to their other options...
I plan on living forever. So far, so good...
 
InnocuousFox
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Tue Dec 09, 2003 2:28 am

"Also just a thought these 737's have the range to do coast to coast, so other then the 4 gates at DFW, does AirTran even need a West Coast hub?"

Only if they plan on serving enough destinations in the west and enticing people to travel between them. Going from SEA to LAX via ATL is kinda silly.  Smile
Dave Mark - Intrinsic Algorithm - Reducing the world to mathematical equations!
 
luv2fly
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Tue Dec 09, 2003 2:32 am

OK devils advocate, why do they have to offer SEA to LAX?
You can cut the irony with a knife
 
InnocuousFox
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RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Tue Dec 09, 2003 2:38 am

"OK devils advocate, why do they have to offer SEA to LAX?"

They don't. The point being, without a western hub, the only traffic that they can hope to pull from western feeders is trans-con. That limits your potential customer base significantly and puts you in competition with many other carriers who offer the same service. In addition, many of your major potential east-coast destinations (by population and/or demand such as NY, DC, BOS, and various Florida destinations) may very well have direct service from west-coast cities. Some, but not all. That also cuts into a your potential market. I'm just saying that with a decidedly Southeast hub, it limits some of the things you can do.

AirTran would likely be better off concentrating their efforts on continuing to digest the remains of failing airlines in their own neighborhood... nameley chewing up the remains of USAir. SWA is already having a field day with that (PHL being the recent example).
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Prinair
Posts: 621
Joined: Thu Dec 02, 1999 7:28 am

RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Tue Dec 09, 2003 5:56 am

The should come to ELP and establish a southwest hub...

A. Lots of O/D traffic from the ELP, CJS and southern New Mexico area.

B. Large demand of seats to cities all over the west coast and Texas.
HP and WN flights have high load factors out of ELP.

C. Large military presence in the area...lots of military traveling.

D. Great weather year round.

E. Available gate space in a nice recently remodeled airport.

F. Hangar space and plenty of facilities available.

G. Long runways.

H. Low cost of living and a properly educated workforce available.

I. Good geographic location (large cities in the USA and MEX within range of
the 717-200).

PRINAIR : Puerto Rico International Airlines
 
InnocuousFox
Posts: 2556
Joined: Sat Dec 06, 2003 1:30 am

RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Tue Dec 09, 2003 6:13 am

Again, you almost hate to put a hub on an edge of the country like that. Centrally located is better for domestic travel.
Dave Mark - Intrinsic Algorithm - Reducing the world to mathematical equations!
 
Prinair
Posts: 621
Joined: Thu Dec 02, 1999 7:28 am

RE: Could CMH Be A Good Hub For Airtran?

Tue Dec 09, 2003 3:53 pm

It can be "on the edge" but if the demand is there....
Besides it is centrally located for a perfect southern west to east hub.
PRINAIR : Puerto Rico International Airlines

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