mckennasmall
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Forced To Buy Canadian

Tue Jan 06, 2004 2:09 pm

I have a lot of family that works in management in Air Canada and they have told me that the government had force Air Canada to purchase Canadian or else there would be taxes going up that would threaten Air Canada. I would like to get other people's opinions. People I know that work very high in Air Canada management say they were forced.



Cheers Mike
 
SPLOBKrakow
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Tue Jan 06, 2004 2:54 pm

If this is true then I fully agree with the government.
Lets keep Canadian money in Canada, why invest in other countires and forgin companies, when our own companies are struggling. If Air Canada did not buy any Canadian aircraft they would have gone under, the gov would make sure they did.
 
Goose
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Tue Jan 06, 2004 3:02 pm

Krakow; I think McKenna is speaking of the common myth that Air Canada was forced to buy Canadi>n Airlines, not its recent order of Bombardier RJs.

As someone who worked with Canadi>n, I don't see how someone could think that Air Canada was forced to purchase that company. Air Canada did it of its own accord - almost gleefully so - after the Feds had slammed the door shut on a AMR "rescue" of CP in 1999.

For years AC had drooled over CP's Asian routes, and saw a opportunity to accomplish a goal which had been the stated objective of its board of directors for nearly a decade; to run Canadi>n out of business.
"Talk to me, Goose..."
 
PVD757
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Tue Jan 06, 2004 3:23 pm

As much as i like the government extortion angle, I can't buy into it. If the Canadian government does something like this, they would wind up running an airline because Air Canada would go under for sure. No offense to Westjet, but how pathetic that Air Canada cannot make money against little or no competition.
 
YOW4NOW
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Tue Jan 06, 2004 3:40 pm

I doubt the federal government would have forced Air Canada to Buy Canadian Airlines. I suspect that had Canadian been forced into Bankruptcy, the Feds would have put them on their corporate welfare system to allow them some breathing room.

History only shows that in Canada, one Airline buying up another usually leads to itself being bought out. After all the buy-outs, Air Canada was the sole remaining of the older "dominant" Carriers. Think about it. CP bought Nordair and Wardair. CP continued to struggle. Pacific Western bought CP and became Canadian. They struggled. Air Canada buys Canadian and now their struggling.

Sad to say, but in all likelihod it would have been better for CP to have let Nordair and later Wardair to falter, for Pacific Western to have let CP falter and Air Canada to have let Canadian falter. I'm sure had none of these carriers tried to get too big for too quick, we'd be seeing a few more "National" carriers in Canada. Albeit all smaller in size, rather competitive nonetheless.

I remember watching Nordair, Pacific Western, Canadian Pacific, Air Canada etc fly into my humble hometown. No more of that! Air Canada, some WestJet and that's it! Except for a few flights from US, AA and CO.

Regards!
 
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yyz717
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Tue Jan 06, 2004 3:44 pm

NO government can FORCE any private sector company to buy anything.

AC bought CP on its own free will....just one of many strategic errors by that error-prone buffoon Milton and his useless mgmt team.

I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
mckennasmall
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Wed Jan 07, 2004 12:27 am

I know no airline can be forced to buy a company but when you are told by the goverment if you do not buy this company we will raise tax's in Canada for aviaton and on aviation gas prices if you do not buy canadian or if you buy canadian you will get better tax rates, asian routes and we will not be hasseling you. I have been told this by friends of mine who are mangement in Air Canada. I could be wrong it is what I have been told.


cheers mike
 
Greg
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Wed Jan 07, 2004 12:45 am

Whether they were forced or not...the order came out right. For 70 seats, the EMB170's estimated cost is more expensive to operate than the 86 seat CRJ705 (though they will fly it with 75 seats). Apparently, enough to outweigh even common type rating. A healthy discount from a large Canadian employer was icing on the cake.

I think the EMB190/95 was very competitive with the 717.
 
Guest

RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Wed Jan 07, 2004 12:57 am

"For years AC had drooled over CP's Asian routes, and saw a opportunity to accomplish a goal which had been the stated objective of its board of directors for nearly a decade; to run Canadi>n out of business."

That's it in a nutshell. As some have pointed out here, Ottawa did not/can not "force" a private company to purchase another. Miltie wanted it all, and now he's paying the price. unfortunately, the AC and ex-CP personnel are also paying a price for the Canadi>n takeover.
 
SPLOBKrakow
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Wed Jan 07, 2004 1:13 am

Sorry ....... this who time i thought he was speaking of canadian products not Canadian Airlines.

 
CO737800
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Wed Jan 07, 2004 1:31 am

I wish that Onex would have bought both Airlines. It would not be like it is now, and I hope they would have kept the Canadian Airlines service.
 
Goose
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Wed Jan 07, 2004 3:48 am

I know no airline can be forced to buy a company but when you are told by the goverment if you do not buy this company we will raise tax's in Canada for aviaton and on aviation gas prices if you do not buy canadian or if you buy canadian you will get better tax rates, asian routes and we will not be hasseling you. I have been told this by friends of mine who are mangement in Air Canada. I could be wrong it is what I have been told.

--

If that were true, none of those promises indeed happened - gas prices went up, tax rates went up, and the Government appointed a ombudsman to handle complaints from taxpayers from the airline industry - and most of those complaints come from Air Canada customers.

Many of those things mentioned - gas prices, namely... but also some of the taxes - the government cannot makes promises about, especially not to a company like Air Canada, or would face serious repercussions about favoritism from other companies in the industry. The gas prices, the government cannot really control, either.....

I know it's tempting for some folks, especially AC employees, when looking at the current state of their company, to point fingers and say that "it's all Canadi>n's fault." However, that would be wrong - the combined debt of the two companies post-merger was something to the tune of $13-15 billion dollars. Canadi>n had brought around $5-7 billion dollars in debt to that figure. The rest, Air Canada made on its own.

After the ONEX deal fell through, Air Canada rebounded and made a move to buy out Canadi>n because they figured the time was ripe - and were deathly afraid that AMR would make another move to purchase a large stake in Canadi>n (that assumption was correct), rescueing them from immediate financial difficulties and perhaps giving AC some real headaches, especially in the West.

That, coupled with CP's rising image (CP had won a Best North American Airline award that year, and was going through the Proud Wings corporate makeover) struck fear into AC's management of a new, revitalized CP that would be able to at least close the gap between the two carriers, in terms of market share.

Realistically, I cannot see a board of directors - and the shareholders for that matter - accepting putting an attractive share-price offer to CP's shareholders, and take on so much debt, simply to please the Canadian government. Air Canada is a business....

[Edited 2004-01-06 19:56:36]
"Talk to me, Goose..."
 
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yyz717
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Wed Jan 07, 2004 3:56 am

Ironically, had AC refused to buy CP.....CP would likely have gone bankrupt. AC could then have picked up the Asia routes quickly WITHOUT having to take on the CP staff, unions, motley fleet etc.

Exactly the same scenario occurred in Australia in 2000. The Aus govt asked Qantas to buy ailing Ansett.....QF refused and Ansett died. QF has had strong financial performance ever since.

I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
Whiteguy
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Wed Jan 07, 2004 3:59 am

Of course AC was forced to buy CP. The canadian government was pissed because their nice little deal that they had set up with Onex fell through. Why would Milton willingly buy CP, look at the state they were in. It would be like Westjet turning around and buying AC tomorrow. Hey lets start that rumor. Yeah AC may have had some debt before the takeover but they were also making record profits up until 2000!
 
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yyz717
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Wed Jan 07, 2004 4:04 am

Of course AC was forced to buy CP.

Forced by who? The Cdn govt cannot force such things. AC bought CP freely & of its own will.

Why would Milton willingly buy CP, look at the state they were in.

It was the dot-com boom, AC was marginally profitable, and AC wanted CP's Asian routes.



I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
Whiteguy
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Wed Jan 07, 2004 4:14 am

AC actually bought CP for less money than they offered for their Asian routes. Yes the cdn gov and they did. They are the ones that started everything by relaxing the rules and had their hands in the Onex bid.
 
Goose
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Wed Jan 07, 2004 4:17 am

Yeah AC may have had some debt before the takeover but they were also making record profits up until 2000!

Around a billion dollars or so of their debts on new aircraft - like the A330s and A340s - were due to be paid starting in January 2000..... doubtless their profitability would've taken a serious hit, even if they had not purchased CP.

Again, AC's Board of Directors' responsibility is to their shareholders. If they had been "forced," as I've heard people say, by the Canadian feds to buy CP.... then they'd have to answer to their shareholders about why they had made such a foolhardy business decision. The Board would be replaced if the shareholders didn't go along.

But that didn't happen - indeed, the Board and shareholders approved the offering of a very attractive share purchase price to CP, and willingly took on a large amount of debt and unionized employees. Those decisions, doubtless, have done far worse to Air Canada's financial state than any actions taken by the Government against them, could have.

Again, AC wanted to buy CP primarily for its Asian routes and to a slightly lesser degree to stroke its collective corporate ego - by putting CP out of business.
"Talk to me, Goose..."
 
Guest

RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Wed Jan 07, 2004 4:21 am

Whiteguy, true, the Canadian Government did in fact relax the rules and widened the perimeters re purchasing CP, yet in the end, it was ultimately Robert Milton and the AC board who made the horrific decision to buy CP.

A agree with those here who stated AC should have watched the Goose "die"
(as much as I personally and truly hate to say that) and then surrounded it like vultures, picking the pieces (Asia network) that it so desired. Qantas made the correct decision re Ansett, no doubt they cast their collective gaze towards Canada and saw the results/fallout from the AC purchase.
 
Goose
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Wed Jan 07, 2004 4:22 am

Oh, and as for debt... looks like I was in error;

Quote:
Prior to 1999, Air Canada was dominant, but not oppressively so. Regional carriers provided feeder services to both it and Canadian. Contrary to popular myth, Air Canada was not "forced" to absorb Canadian Airlines -- in fact, it fought tooth and nail for the merger. President Bob Milton also successfully fought off an attempt -- by Gerry Schwartz and Onex Corp., in conjunction with American Airlines -- to enter Canada's airline industry. Mr. Schwartz has repeatedly expressed his relief at losing that fight.

Having successfully married Canadian Airlines' market share to its own, Air Canada set out to manage the combined debt of both airlines by absolutely dominating the marketplace in a bid to manage prices. The gambit did not work. Feisty competitors like WestJet in the west and Air Labrador and Provincial Airlines in the east refused to fold in the face of price wars. Air Canada responded by creating new, low-cost carriers of its own, and Tango and Jazz were born. But the bleeding continued. Before the merger, Air Canada already had $4-billion of debt. Canadian brought another $7-billion of debt to Air Canada's balance sheet. Another $2-billion of debt has been accumulated since 1999.


Source:
http://www.globeandmail.com/servlet/ArticleNews/TPStory/LAC/20030408/COTOBIN/Comment/Idx
"Talk to me, Goose..."
 
Whiteguy
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Wed Jan 07, 2004 4:24 am

AC did not willingly taken all unionized employees. As soon as the take over was done the government came out with the new list of rules for AC and one was that they were not allowed to layoff any employees for 2 years. So how can you say the gov doesn't have their hands in the takeover.
 
Goose
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Wed Jan 07, 2004 4:29 am

A agree with those here who stated AC should have watched the Goose "die"
(as much as I personally and truly hate to say that) and then surrounded it like vultures, picking the pieces (Asia network) that it so desired. Qantas made the correct decision re Ansett, no doubt they cast their collective gaze towards Canada and saw the results/fallout from the AC purchase.


There were some doubts in the minds of many that the Goose would've died at all if there hadn't been a merger. We'll never know, but there were some very long discussions with AMR and Ottawa about opening the doors on foreign ownership.... right up until the eve of the merger with AC. Realistically, I have quite a bit of doubt that there could've been much done by a patron like AMR to save CP, but as I said, that's the road not travelled....

But the fact is that Air Canada was very afraid that AMR would put its very deep pockets behind Canadi>n, because they figured that Ottawa would loosen restrictions on foreign ownership sooner or later. That was another reason they pushed for the merger.....
"Talk to me, Goose..."
 
Whiteguy
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Wed Jan 07, 2004 4:31 am

Goose

Wow if its in the paper it must be true. Yes we had just bought the A330s and A340s but we had BOUGHT them. Now everything is leased, a good old canadi>n tradition.
 
Guest

RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Wed Jan 07, 2004 4:33 am

Thanks for the above info, Goose. Perhaps Miltie feared AMR and Schwartz would relaunch an aggressive campaign, or AMR (as stated) would invest and "pump up" CP even more re ops and image. Still, to purchase a debtload of 4 billion......aye yi yi, NOT to mention a fleet of mostly increasingly archaic equipment type (B737, DC-10-30). Don't get me wrong here, I am not slinging mud at Canadi>n.

Here's another dichotomy. AC purchases CP. AC plans to phase out older CP equipment types from the fleet. AC plans to reduce the number of duplications in flight ops (ex-CP). AC KNOWS they have the "no lay-offs" policy agreement to adhere to. Could Miltie do the math? Could the AC board do the math? This equation equals surplus employees with a combined heightened debtload, and rising daily.
 
Goose
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Wed Jan 07, 2004 4:36 am

AC did not willingly taken all unionized employees. As soon as the take over was done the government came out with the new list of rules for AC and one was that they were not allowed to layoff any employees for 2 years. So how can you say the gov doesn't have their hands in the takeover.

Air Canada knew that before they signed the cheque, figuratively speaking.

You have a source for the Federal-imposed no-layoff clause on CP's purchase? I've heard the rumours from AC guys for a good many years, but they have never told me where to find information about it, whether it be from Air Canada themselves or another source.

The only no-layoff clauses I'm aware of with AC are those that they've willingly made with some of their own Unions, as stated in their contracts. That's one of the major stumbling blocks in their restructuring plans......

http://cbc.ca/stories/2003/02/06/aircanada_030206
"Talk to me, Goose..."
 
Goose
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Wed Jan 07, 2004 4:41 am

Thanks for the above info, Goose. Perhaps Miltie feared AMR and Schwartz would relaunch an aggressive campaign, or AMR (as stated) would invest and "pump up" CP even more re ops and image. Still, to purchase a debtload of 4 billion......aye yi yi, NOT to mention a fleet of mostly increasingly archaic equipment type (B737, DC-10-30). Don't get me wrong here, I am not slinging mud at Canadi>n.


AMR and AA drooled over CP's TransPac routes almost as much as AC did; but realistically, AA had no means to enter YVR and use it as a Trans-Pacific gateway, legally, without Canadi>n. At least, that's how I gathered it. AA didn't have the routes in the Pacific which UA and NW did, but CP did. That was a major reason they invested in CP in the first place.

As for the fleet.... well, CP was moving to a "five-type fleet" by 2002 (if I remember the memos).... and the DC-10s were gone before the merger, replaced by 763s. The 732s were perfectly suitable and still had good years left in them - I mean, look at WestJet's success with them.
"Talk to me, Goose..."
 
Guest

RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Wed Jan 07, 2004 4:43 am

Actually, Goose, Ottawa did in fact "enforce" this no-layoff policy with AC re CP employees. Milton and the board agreed to adhere to it (and subsequently tried to "undo" it a while later when Miltie realized massive cuts were needed to help stop the massive bleeding). It's true. Why? Simply due to the fact it was close to election time, and the one thing Ottawa did not want to cause was the alienation (and anger) of Western Canadians as a result of massive layoffs of the Alberta and BC ex-CP employees, not to mention the resulting widespread anger of Westerners towards Ottawa re these layoffs.
 
Guest

RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Wed Jan 07, 2004 4:47 am

"Wow if its in the paper it must be true. Yes we had just bought the A330s and A340s but we had BOUGHT them. Now everything is leased, a good old canadi>n tradition."

Whteguy, if I may, AC was in the process of aletring their equipment strategy years ago, realizing the lease deal was perhaps the best for them. This would have resulted even if the CP purchase did not take place, as the cost to AC re purchasing/modernizing the AC fleet would have been in the stratosphere.

And besides, if AC aint happy with the lease deals, then knock on Miltons door and ask HIM "wazzup"?
 
Guest

RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Wed Jan 07, 2004 4:58 am

"As for the fleet.... well, CP was moving to a "five-type fleet" by 2002 (if I remember the memos).... and the DC-10s were gone before the merger, replaced by 763s. The 732s were perfectly suitable and still had good years left in them - I mean, look at WestJet's success with them."

Yeah, I recall this as well. Incidently, the CP pilots loved the DC-10-30's, and if wasn't for the growing costs in maintaining a trijet, they felt these Douglas babies could have flown forever.

Perhaps you can shed some light on this question. I heard that after CP received back some of their DC-10-30's from UA (swapped for UA's DC-10-10's), CP maintenance were appalled at their condition, and a heated argument resulted between CP and UAL, CP demanding UAL pay the costs of bringing the 10-30's back to shipshape. You know anything about this? My brother heard it loud and clear at CP, but it could have been a rumour.
 
Goose
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Wed Jan 07, 2004 4:59 am

Actually, Goose, Ottawa did in fact "enforce" this no-layoff policy with AC re CP employees. Milton and the board agreed to adhere to it (and subsequently tried to "undo" it a while later when Miltie realized massive cuts were needed to help stop the massive bleeding). It's true. Why? Simply due to the fact it was close to election time, and the one thing Ottawa did not want to cause was the alienation (and anger) of Western Canadians as a result of massive layoffs of the Alberta and BC ex-CP employees, not to mention the resulting widespread anger of Westerners towards Ottawa re these layoffs.

If it's indeed true that a few of AC's own unions have "no-layoff" clauses in their contracts anyway, having Ottawa enforce a seperate but entirely concurrant no-layoff clause is rather moot, no?

And besides.... aside from Edmonton, where else in the West votes for Liberal MPs, or would ever have a hope-in-Hell chance of voting in a Liberal MP? I doubt that not helping CP employees would've made much difference in the West to improve the Liberal Party's standing. Seeing how the Grits have been performing (or rather, ignoring) in the West for the past four or five years, I'm unsure that they would've been much concerned about how their image would gain or falter based on the AC-CP merger.

I still recall that CP in YYC had a seperate contractor doing their ground handling - one of the only CP hubs that did - and AC opted to cancel their contract and indirectly lay off the 120-200 guys from the ground-handler (I think it was Hudson General) and then turn around and hire about 100 people off the street to replace them once the operation was amalgamated.....

.... knowing they'd have an influx of staff in other Stations and the trend for folks in the AC system to want to transfer to YYC, why would they hire extra people... especially with a no-layoff clause imposed by the Feds? I know that's only one station, but this is an example of how AC oft works in mysterious ways  Big grin
"Talk to me, Goose..."
 
Guest

RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Wed Jan 07, 2004 5:08 am

"If it's indeed true that a few of AC's own unions have "no-layoff" clauses in their contracts anyway, having Ottawa enforce a seperate but entirely concurrant no-layoff clause is rather moot, no?"

Moot? yes indeed, but, as (ugh) Celine Dion sings, "that's the way it is". Personally, I have NO doubt in my mind that, without this clause, Miltie would have cut CP personnel by the hundreds, and more so, especially given the fact that there would have been at that time no ratified agreement/amendment to the two separate seniority lists. Proof? just look at the battles raging at AC even today, where many AC employees still feel what would have been just and fair would be to place all the CP'ers at the bottom of the totem pole.

Beleive me, I hear you on the Westerner "Who gives a sh*t about the Liberals
anyway", but that's the mindset Ottawa adopted. Parliament Hill works is mysterious ways as well.  Smile/happy/getting dizzy


 
Whiteguy
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Wed Jan 07, 2004 5:09 am

Goose,

Actually all the Hudson ground handlers were given priority to the AC jobs and most of them took the offer. Alot of them are still at AC barely.
 
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yyz717
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Wed Jan 07, 2004 5:21 am

I heard that after CP received back some of their DC-10-30's from UA (swapped for UA's DC-10-10's), CP maintenance were appalled at their condition, and a heated argument resulted between CP and UAL, CP demanding UAL pay the costs of bringing the 10-30's back to shipshape. You know anything about this?

Hehehe....I recall this also! CP has 8 DC-10-30's in the mid-80's but swapped 3 to UAL for 3 DC-10-10's for a year or longer. UAL needed the -30's for new intl service and CP used the -10's on shorter routes such as YYZ-YVR, YVR-HNL and YYZ-LIS. I heard from some MDD employees (who kept in touch with CP mechanics) that the -30's were in poor condition upon their return.

If you think that is bad.....CP earlier swapped their 4 742's to PIA for PIA's 4 DC-10-30's.....CP then standardized on the DC-10....the ex-PIA Dc-10's were said to be in absolutely horrid condition!

I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
Guest

RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Wed Jan 07, 2004 6:29 am

Yes, I heard about the PIA DC-10's horrible condition upon Canadi>n receiving them, but don't you find it tad rather strange that the CP people did not perform thorough checks/assessments on the PIA DC-10's prior to signing the swap agreement? This "deal gone bad" doesn't say much about the CP people who were involved in this deal. I'm sure heads rolled at Canadi>n for this.
 
mckennasmall
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Wed Jan 07, 2004 7:56 am

Why trade with PIA you know the quality of the service. Why
 
Goose
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Wed Jan 07, 2004 8:46 am

Actually all the Hudson ground handlers were given priority to the AC jobs and most of them took the offer. Alot of them are still at AC barely.

I asked one of my buddies about this today. The Hudson guys were only given an opportunity for an interview, not a firm job offer - despite having the same Union as the AC ground handlers. I know many of the laid off HG guys did apply, but I know that only a couple dozen were actually given a job at AC - out of the hundred-odd guys which were laid off, that's not a high percentile.

Most of these guys were given a two- or three-for-one seniority exchange too, so they ended up at the bottom of the pile at AC - so a good number of these guys have now been furloughed or laid off.
"Talk to me, Goose..."
 
Whiteguy
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Thu Jan 08, 2004 3:27 am

The Hudsons guys were all put behind the AC guys in seniority yes, that sounds fair they came from a different company. They were above all the other new hires at that time. I can list 15 people from hudson that are still working, I work with them everyday.
 
bmacleod
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Thu Jan 08, 2004 3:48 am

Forced? No one forces anyone into doing anything......

Forget about goverment "pressuring" AC to buy Canadian. Our regional jets are the best in the world and that's why AC chose Bombardier and our closest competitor, Brazil's Embraer.

[Edited 2004-01-07 19:50:41]
"What good are wings without the courage to fly?" - Atticus
 
Whiteguy
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Thu Jan 08, 2004 3:51 am

Bmacleod

Did you actually read what this topic was about.
 
Goose
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Thu Jan 08, 2004 3:52 am

Forced? Forget about goverment "pressuring" AC to buy Canadian. Our regional jets are the best in the world and that's why AC chose Bombardier and our closest competitor, Brazil's Embraer.

I'm going to go out on a limb and say that you probably read none of what was said in this thread before posting  Big grin

The topic is not about the recent sale of RJs to AC, but about the purchase of Canadi>n Airlines by AC.......
"Talk to me, Goose..."
 
bmacleod
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Thu Jan 08, 2004 4:01 am

Then why didn't Mckennasmall specify "Canadi>n" in his opening statement? That would've made it clearer.
"What good are wings without the courage to fly?" - Atticus
 
Whiteguy
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Thu Jan 08, 2004 4:04 am

He was to excited doing his other 50 postings!!
 
mckennasmall
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Thu Jan 08, 2004 4:05 am

Sorry about not stating it. I was writing on one of those airport computers and i was rushing sorry about that .
 
Goose
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RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Thu Jan 08, 2004 4:09 am

Hah! Bingo, Whiteguy...  Smile

Well, he didn't specify that he was talking about the RJs at all, people just assumed that.

I don't think he's been around the industry long enough to really know that folks refer to CP as "Canadi>n" if they're spelling it out.

[Edited 2004-01-07 20:10:10]
"Talk to me, Goose..."
 
Guest

RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Thu Jan 08, 2004 4:23 am

Well well, aren't you guys warm and welcoming to someone who has an interest in civil aviation. Nice to know this person can come on here, and in response to his questions (however lame you may think they are) be ridiculed and verbally dissected by people who are so judgemental of others. Did you ever stop to think that perhaps not everyone is on the same level re aviation knowledge/insight as yourselves, the gurus of air? And if someone is a "novice", is this website not a viable source of information and "education" per se? I believe we all started out knowing absolutely jack shit about civil aviation, fellas.


 
Guest

RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Thu Jan 08, 2004 4:27 am

"Sorry about not stating it. I was writing on one of those airport computers and i was rushing sorry about that."

Mckennasmall, you have nothing to apologize for. As a matter of fact, the apologies should be coming from the other side.
 
Goose
Posts: 1771
Joined: Thu Aug 21, 2003 3:40 am

RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Thu Jan 08, 2004 4:30 am

Indeed, CPBoy, at one time all of us knew squat about this subject.

I don't think anyone here is ridiculing the fact that he's asking questions. That's good. He has an interest and I don't mind answering questions which I have answers to. I don't mind - and I think others feel the same - people asking questions which one might roll their eyes about and say "that's easy," because they've worked in the industry for X number of years.

I think most of the jokes are just about the sheer number of threads he's started on the board in the last 24 hours..... some of which can be classed as frivilous or downright silly.

[Edited 2004-01-07 20:30:52]
"Talk to me, Goose..."
 
Guest

RE: Forced To Buy Canadian

Thu Jan 08, 2004 4:59 am

Okay, so the guy is an eager beaver today. Besides, his topics aren't really that "downright silly", as many have responded to his questions, unless that makes for a lot of silly people on this site........er......never mind.  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

Ya wanna talk about silly? Look at the "Canada 3000 A330" topic and look how I myself turned that topic into "raunchy flight attendant layover stories and beauty/grooming regimes for FA's"! LOL.

Next topic: "Canadi>n Airlines International Beverage Trolley Horror Stories".

 Smile/happy/getting dizzy

CPBoy

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