bacardi182
Posts: 1029
Joined: Tue Jan 04, 2000 2:47 am

American Airlines Hub's

Sat Jan 15, 2000 2:55 pm

what are all of american airlines hub's? I know dfw and chicago are. What ever happened to san juan and raleigh durham? Also, wouldnt it be cool if the winglets on american's md-11s were painted silver so they would be shiney? then you could see the plane while you are seated inside the plane.
 
FLY777UAL
Posts: 4830
Joined: Tue May 18, 1999 3:49 am

RE: American Airlines Hub's

Sat Jan 15, 2000 3:02 pm

RDU was shut down a few years ago (along with BNA--Nashville) due to the slump in the early 90's (I'm almost positive of that).

As far as hubs go, ORD, DFW, MIA, SJU, are the definite hubs, and I believe that SJC (San Jose, CA), JFK, and BOS might be classified as hubs--.

That would be a very interesting idea with the winglets!

FLY777UAL
 
Guest

RE: American Airlines Hub's

Sat Jan 15, 2000 5:28 pm

FLY777UAL is right, Nashville and Raleigh were both cut as being hubs for American. I personally believe that AA was wrong to cut Nashville hub, but there were other issues that prevailed from my understanding.

The current cities that are classifies as hubs are:

DFW, ORD, MIA and SJU (to a lesser extent).

I would not consider JFK a hub even though it is one for American Eagle. Basically the flights in and out of JFK are international, international feeders on Eagle and transcontinental flights (LGA has a perimeter rule which makes transcontinental flights not possible).

BOS is a city that AA has recently focused on and has/is investing a lot of money into building. For example, look at the purchase of the American Connection on Business Express. However, I do not consider BOS a hub since flights in and out are not structured that way from what I can tell. New service to Nashville (Eagle) has been announced but from what I see, BOS is still a point to point type of city.

SJC is no longer a hub either. It was cut earlier in the 90's as well. However, with the purchase of Reno Air, American has really increased their presence again. Of course there is no Eagle feed into SJC either and the flight structure in SJC is not really one of a hub as well. However there is the Tokyo flight there which seems to have several west coast connections to and from it. But, if you are going to classify SJC as a min-hub, you might as well classify RNO and LAS as ones too. AA flies about 35 daily flights out of RNO and about the same out of LAS which is in line with SJC.

If anything was to be classified as an American hub on the west coast, I would call LAX one. LAX has not been classified as a hub by AA (UA has), but AA probably has about 185 flights (not including AE) that connect the west coast and transcontinental flying as well as important cities like Austin, Houston, Fort Lauderdaule, Orlando, Honolulu, Maui, Gudalahara, Paris and London. American Eagle also has a hub there that serves as a feeder service as well from San Diego, Bakersfield, Fresno, Palm Springs and Santa Barbara to name a few
 
sotomayor
Posts: 117
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 3:10 am

RE: American Airlines Hub's

Sat Jan 15, 2000 7:55 pm

San Juan is still an AA/American Eagle hub. Here's some evidence.

Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Orlando Sotomayor


Competition is also increasing in this lucrative market, especially from COA and TWA and to some extent UAL. Gulfstream International is their partner.

Orlando
sotomayor
 
AFa340-300E
Posts: 2115
Joined: Tue May 18, 1999 3:49 am

RE: American Airlines Hub's

Sat Jan 15, 2000 11:10 pm

Hello,

About the West Coast : would it be possible that AA makes LAX, SEA, San Jose or SFO as one of their hub ?

That would boost their operations on Pacific.

Best regards,
Alain Mengus
 
blink182
Posts: 5269
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 1999 3:09 am

RE: American Airlines Hub's

Sun Jan 16, 2000 12:00 am

I know San Juan is still a hub, nashville isnt and same w/ raliegh durham, BOS,LAX,JFK, i would consider hubs, because american is the main airline @ JFK, BOS is one that is evergrowing and lax is a hub( these are only my opinions, so dont quote me on it.
Give me a break, I created this username when I was a kid...
 
AFa340-300E
Posts: 2115
Joined: Tue May 18, 1999 3:49 am

What Is Really A Hub ?

Sun Jan 16, 2000 12:19 am

Hello,

Everything depends on what we call a hub. I think sometimes we speak about sth. that isn't truely a hub.

Take Delta and JFK for example. Dl has many flights to Europe out of there. But they don't have many ops within USA out of JFK. So AF pax who want to take a transfer at New York are offered to travel via EWR instead.

As a proof you can check the AF on-line timetable.
Also AF asked for more feeding flights at JFK in exchange of the code-share on the Concorde flight.

That would be interesting to try to determine where the concept of hub and spokes starts, and where it stops.

Regards,
Alain Mengus
 
sfo
Posts: 88
Joined: Mon Oct 04, 1999 9:34 am

RE: Winglet Idea

Sun Jan 16, 2000 2:13 am

Real cool winglet idea! I would send the suggestion to AA, or better yet to Boeing and Airbus.
 
UA744Flagship
Posts: 1433
Joined: Tue Jul 13, 1999 1:55 pm

LAX -- AA

Sun Jan 16, 2000 2:26 am

I doubt AA has 185 daily flights out of LAX aside from AE. *With* AE -- possibly. But by my last count, AA had about 125 daily flights there. UA has about 200 flights.
no wire hangers!
 
ywg777
Posts: 1240
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 1999 9:40 am

RE: American Airlines Hub's

Sun Jan 16, 2000 2:47 am

AA'S hubs are DFW,ORD,JFK,LAX.. I know this as a fact. It says so in the Canadian In-flight Magizine.
ywg777
 
Guest

RE: American Airlines Hub's

Sun Jan 16, 2000 3:16 am

As far as AAs concerned DFW,ORD,MIA, and SJU are the only cities classified as true hubs. Cities such as LAX,BOS,JFK,SJC,etc are just stations with lots of service from AA and or Eagle. When the new terminal at JFK opens it is rumored to become a full hub operation with flights to new intl cities and more domestic flights as well. AA would love to make LAX a full hub operation but there just isnt room to do it now. SJC is close to being a mini hub with a few connecting passengers, but nothing major as of yet, although there is a rumor of a SJC-LGW flight someday soon.
 
1011 FAN
Posts: 64
Joined: Mon Dec 27, 1999 12:37 pm

RE: American Airlines Hub's

Sun Jan 16, 2000 5:04 am

RDU has'nt been a hub for AA since the early 90s. There used to be flights there from SWF (Newburgh NY) as well as ORD, but now only to ORD from SWF on AA. However RDU is the hub now for Midway Airlines, which I think has something to do with AA but I'm not sure what.
 
unitedchicago
Posts: 97
Joined: Sun Jan 02, 2000 1:44 pm

RE: LAX -- AA

Sun Jan 16, 2000 5:48 am

United owns California. AA will never have a hub in California.
 
ywg777
Posts: 1240
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 1999 9:40 am

RE: LAX -- AA

Sun Jan 16, 2000 6:20 am

For cryin out loud... AA has a whole terminal to them selfs at LAX... It is so a Major HUB.. i BET AA
YWG777
HAS AT LEAST 30 GATES IN THEIR TERMINAL 8
 
Guest

UA Does Not "own" California

Sun Jan 16, 2000 6:24 am

I disagree, UA does not own California since UA competes greatly with WN in the west coast markets.

As I said before LAX is not classified as a hub by American. However, I wouldn't rule it out as a future hub for American. Just because UA is large in California with the LAX and SFO hubs, American has shown that they are willing to get into the west and try to duke it out a little. This is evident with the Reno Air purchase. Also keep in mind all the construction that American is currently doing at LAX to make it a better gateway. Eagle has a new terminal behind the Tom Bradly International Terminal, and much money and time is being spent to creat better/more gates in T-4. Construction of a new FIS facitlity should be underway by now which will allow AA to have internationl arrivals at T-4 much like DL has in T-5.

Also mentioned above is the fact that Midway Airlines is the key player in RDU. This is true. Midway has backfilled andpicked up many routes abandoned by AA when RDu closed as an AA hub. The only real relationship AA has with Midway is a frequent flyer marketing agreement is it not?

JFK has been repeated above as being an AA hub. According to AA, it is not one. It is only a city where a lot of focus has been placed. This is evident with the new 1 billion dollar terminal project that AA is undertaking. It is currently a hub for American Eagle however.
 
Tom in NO
Posts: 6725
Joined: Thu Nov 11, 1999 10:10 am

RE: American Airlines Hub's

Sun Jan 16, 2000 10:22 am

I'll weigh in on this one. According to AA's website, AA operates out of gates 41-49 at terminal 4 at LAX. Allowing for the possibility of A and B jetways at each gate, that allows for 20 gates max at LAX, and that would most likely include Eagle's gates, as well.

As for who "owns" California, I miss the days when PSA (Pacific Southwest Airlines) and AirCal (or Air California) owned California. It was a extremely dark day when USAir and American bought these two airlines.

Tom in NO (at MSY)
"The criminal ineptitude makes you furious"-Bruce Springsteen, after seeing firsthand the damage from Hurricane Katrina
 
TWA902fly
Posts: 2869
Joined: Fri Dec 31, 1999 5:47 am

Nashville?

Sun Jan 16, 2000 12:11 pm

I know AA used to have a lot of Nashville service. These days it is reduced, but still you could consider it a hub, for instance the only flight RDU-PHX is via Nashville.
Also, AA uses MIA, JFK, and BOS for many of it's services, but the only one of those that I would call a hub is MIA.
life wasn't worth the balance, or the crumpled paper it was written on
 
UA744Flagship
Posts: 1433
Joined: Tue Jul 13, 1999 1:55 pm

YWG -- Ignorance!

Sun Jan 16, 2000 12:31 pm

YWG! Have you ever been to LaX? Owning a terminal doesn't say much. DAL owns one, and UAL owns 2.5 (half of 6)! Heck, UA express occupies 6 and a separate terminal as well! As was previously stated, AA has T4 which, from my last memory of being there two years ago, has 12 gates or so for mainline. AE has a new terminal. So there!
no wire hangers!
 
unitedchicago
Posts: 97
Joined: Sun Jan 02, 2000 1:44 pm

RE: YWG -- Ignorance!

Sun Jan 16, 2000 3:01 pm

United carries the most passangers to and from California. Southwest is second largest. When American bought Reno, United responded by adding frequency on the Reno routes - a demonstration of United being the market leader in California. I can't see American ever making LAX a hub unless is does an acquisition, which can only be Alaska at this point. Therefore, American will never be a player on the west coast. I challange you to determine how many passangers American carried from California last year.

You need to look beyond how many gates American has at LAX as a basis for how big their ops are there. That's an un-informed, un-valid way of making your argument.

Also, United just opened the refurbished terminals (they spent $250 million) at LAX.
 
doug
Posts: 699
Joined: Thu Jul 22, 1999 8:54 am

RE: American Airlines Hub's

Mon Jan 17, 2000 5:21 am

some of you do not even mention miami which is the airlines third largest hub,and from a recent posting that i put out an american airlines officer says that he thinks that miami will overtake chicago within the next 10 years as related to the number of daily departures.

Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Sharon Manasco


just another typical busy day for american airlines in miami
 
HyperMike
Posts: 968
Joined: Sun Dec 05, 1999 7:03 am

RE: UA Does Not "own" California

Mon Jan 17, 2000 9:23 am

US DOES NOT OWN CALIFORNIA. The carrier that has the largest market share of intra-California air travel is Southwest. Yes, I said Southwest.
 
ywg777
Posts: 1240
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 1999 9:40 am

RE: UA Does

Mon Jan 17, 2000 9:28 am

UA does own California. AA has another hub in SFO. LAX is a AA hub. It says so. AA flies out of LAX at least 60 times a day. UA has a HUB in LAX. The terminal UA has covers at least 30 gates in total.!!! So there!!!!
ywg777
 
FLY777UAL
Posts: 4830
Joined: Tue May 18, 1999 3:49 am

It's Pointless...

Mon Jan 17, 2000 9:33 am

It's pointless trying to show facts to YWG777...

Oh well...

FLY777UAL
 
UA744Flagship
Posts: 1433
Joined: Tue Jul 13, 1999 1:55 pm

Agreed, FLY777UAL

Mon Jan 17, 2000 10:29 am

Indeed... Ignorance with Stubborness = bad combo!
no wire hangers!
 
klwright69
Posts: 2313
Joined: Mon Jan 17, 2000 4:22 am

RE: American Airlines Hub's

Mon Jan 17, 2000 11:28 am

AA does have a sizeable operation out of JFK. However, it isn't really a hub. It is true that they are building a new terminal there. However it shouldn't open for another 6 years or so. Druing that time, across the Hudson at EWR, CO plans to double they're hub size, or so they say. Their new international facility will open in three years. AA has been loosing market share in NYC to CO. In the Wall Street Journal article documenting this, an AA spokesperson didn't seem too concerned about this since they are the "established" carrier, even though the same article mentions CO reducing AA and UA's share of certain markets in NYC. Therefore, AA will be hard pressed to establish a real hub at JFK, since the article basically discusses how CO is stopping at nothing to scoop all the market share out of NYC that they can. For example, currently CO goes to 17 cities across the Atlantic from EWR while AA goes to just a couple out of JFK. In conclusion, how can JFK be considered a hub for AA? I don't know.
 
Guest

To Set The Record Straight

Mon Jan 17, 2000 12:16 pm

Americans 'mega-hubs': ORD, DFW, MIA.

Americans 'medium hubs': SJU (114 daily)
NYC (265 daily)
LAX (216 daily)

***flights include Eagle flights***Source: AA t.t. 7-98.

This information is from 7-98....YES AA has added MORE flights since then, BUT it gives you can idea!!!

Nashville was indeed cut around 90-91, the only non-stops go to LAX, PHX, NYC, DFW, ORD, MIA. Raleigh/Durham was also cut at the same time (hince Midway Airlines). ANYWAYS...I definitely agree about the gate thing...just because you have 30 gates doesnt mean you have 500 daily flights.
 
Guest

JFK New Terminal

Mon Jan 17, 2000 12:21 pm

remember when AA anounced they were building a new MEGA terminal at JFK???? What ever happened about that?
 
ywg777
Posts: 1240
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 1999 9:40 am

RE: JFK New Terminal

Mon Jan 17, 2000 12:35 pm

I think AA is still building that terminal at JFK. Where are they putting it?
ywg777
 
nwa man
Posts: 1752
Joined: Mon Jun 07, 1999 3:24 am

RE: American Airlines Hub's/ JFK

Mon Jan 17, 2000 1:55 pm

The new terminal at JFK should be really wonderful. 52 gates (if I'm not mistaken) of state-of-the-art technology should really be the crown jewel of that airport. Also, AA is getting a new 70+ gate terminal at MIA, another state of the art facility. And...

YWG777-You just contradict yourself! It's like you put both sides of the debate down, and just ramble. "AA has a hub at SFO...LAX is an AA hub" yet United owns California? From your post, how could it be?

Food for thought,
NWA Man
Create your own luck.
 
Guest

YWG

Tue Jan 18, 2000 2:05 am

SFO and LAX ar NOT AA hubs. SFO only has 44 daily departures and LAX only 105 (without Eagle) daily depatures. LAX could classify as a hub in the future with some AA expansion at LAX, but one of the limiting factors for AA right now is the lack of gates. AA has 14 in Terminal 4 and 2 in Terminal 3. None of the gates in Terminal 4 are FIS gates which means that the LHR and CDG arrivals must arrive in Terminal 5 (Delta). However, construction has begun which will house a new AA FIS facility in the future. But, Terminal 4 is fully expnaded and to my knowledge, no more gates are obtainable in that facility.

And for the person who keeps saying that there are AA flights between BNA and PHX...This is not true at all. There have been no BNA-PHX flights since about 93-94ish. This is when the Nashville hub started to be pulled down.

Panamfanatic, here are ther current numbers of departures including AE.

LAX 177 (102 No AE)

NYC TOTAL 261 LGA 108 (64 No AE)
JFK 119 (57 No AE)
EWR 34

SJU 134 (43 No AE)

As I said before, the only official AA hubs are DFW, ORD, MIA and SJU.



 
Tom in NO
Posts: 6725
Joined: Thu Nov 11, 1999 10:10 am

RE: Points To Ponder

Tue Jan 18, 2000 3:05 am

Some things to think about when discussing an airline hub:

1) the number of flights is not necessarily important.
a) when do these flights arrive and depart?
b) are they timed to connect with other flights?
c) or are they O and D (origin and destination) flights?

The problem with considering LAX as an airline hub in the first place is twofold:

a) does that respective airline carry traffic over the Pacific, or...
b) does that airline carry north and south traffic to Mexico, Central America, or northwest US and Canada
c) Los Angeles is in a terrible location to be a domestic hub

Next consideration, commuter flights:

a) California has the highest concentration of commuter airports in the US. There needs to be access to larger cities: LAX, SFO, SAN, SMF, etc.
b) does this consitute a hub? No way.
example) at MSY, USAirways Express operates numerous commuter flights to BTR, SHV, JAN, BPT, LIT, etc, yet USAirways operates only perhaps 8 or 9 dailys itself into MSY, yet it's not a hub.

I conclude my remarks.....is everyone still awake???

Tom in NO
"The criminal ineptitude makes you furious"-Bruce Springsteen, after seeing firsthand the damage from Hurricane Katrina
 
AFa340-300E
Posts: 2115
Joined: Tue May 18, 1999 3:49 am

MIA To Be The 1st AA's Hub

Tue Jan 18, 2000 4:09 am

Hello,

MIA is a gorwing market, and some people say it could become the greatest AA's hub.
Could somebody procide me some information about MIA ?

Why is it so strong on Latin America ? Some figures ?

Please contact me at alain.mengus@wanadoo.fr

Best regards,
Alain Mengus
 
ywg777
Posts: 1240
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 1999 9:40 am

RE: MIA To Be The 1st AA's Hub

Tue Jan 18, 2000 7:39 am

Really ORD and DFW are the hubs for AA. MIA is a second hub. What are the AA expansion plans at LAX? Anyone know?
ywg777

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