ssides
Posts: 3248
Joined: Fri Feb 09, 2001 12:57 am

Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Wed Jan 07, 2004 2:38 pm

Anyone have ideas on what would be the largest US metropolitan area with only one major airport (e.g. only one airport with commercial service)?

My guess would be ATL.

Also, does anyone have any ideas regarding the prospects for second airports in these areas? I know most of them are longshots, given the protection the big airports receive, but I am under the impression that Atlanta, Detroit, Seattle, Dallas, and Denver would greatly benefit from smaller suburban airports, maybe with RJ service. Any thoughts?
"Lose" is not spelled with two o's!!!!
 
nycfuturepilot
Posts: 773
Joined: Sun Dec 21, 2003 2:50 am

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Wed Jan 07, 2004 2:42 pm

SSides: Dallas has two airports, DAL (Love field) and DFW.
Father, Son, HOYA spirit
 
StevenUhl777
Posts: 3281
Joined: Sun Jul 08, 2001 11:02 am

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Wed Jan 07, 2004 2:44 pm

PDX is a fairly large metro area, if you include Salem, OR (SLE) in that mix. There's a small airport @ SLE, but no scheduled service that I know of. PDX would also include SW Washington. All told, about 2.3m people approximately.

Re: a 2nd smaller suburban airport for SEA....only thing that comes to mind would be PAE, and there was talk before 9-11 that QX would start a PAE-PDX nonstop. PAE has a runway that's about 9,000' feet long, so it could handle a wide variety of aircraft, but the terminal area is pretty much non existent. Besides PAE, don't know. Any other airport (even a replacement for SEA) would have to be further out, and it's generally pretty hilly around here...nothing practical jumps out at me. Unless they closed McChord AFB, but I don't see that happening anytime soon.
And the winner for best actress is....REESE WITHERSPOON for 'Walk the Line'!!!!!!!!
 
ssides
Posts: 3248
Joined: Fri Feb 09, 2001 12:57 am

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Wed Jan 07, 2004 2:47 pm

Yeah, I know about Dallas ... I still think it could use a third for the "Silicon Prairie" in the northern suburbs maybe. Same for Chicago.
"Lose" is not spelled with two o's!!!!
 
maiznblu_757
Posts: 4952
Joined: Fri Mar 01, 2002 12:05 pm

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Wed Jan 07, 2004 2:48 pm

Detroit has 2 airports with PAX airline service. (DET and DTW) although, at the moment, DET doesnt have PAX service, but, they may again in the future.

 
MAH4546
Posts: 24557
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 1:44 pm

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Wed Jan 07, 2004 2:51 pm

Portland is far from the largest metro area with only one airport. Based on MSA area's, these are the ten largest:

1) New York City (metro incl. EWR, JFK, LGA, SWF, ISP, HPN)
2) Los Angeles (LAX, ONT, BUR, LGB, SNA)
3) Chicago (ORD, MDW)
4) Philadelphia (PHL, ACY)
5) Dallas (DFW, DAL)
6) Miami (MIA, FLL, PBI, MPB)
7) Washington, D.C. (DCA, IAD)
8) Houston (IAH, HOU, EFD)
9) Atlanta (ATL)
10) Detroit (DTW)

The answer is Atlanta. This list is MSA, not CMSA, which combine MSAs (like San Francisco and San Jose and Washington, D.C. and Baltimore) into one.
a.
 
Petrouchka
Posts: 102
Joined: Mon Aug 23, 1999 5:28 pm

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Wed Jan 07, 2004 2:53 pm

http://www.census.gov/population/cen2000/phc-t3/tab03.txt

Philadelphia, PA (metro area: 6 million+)
Boston, MA (5.8 million)
 
AA7573E
Posts: 468
Joined: Wed Nov 05, 2003 11:34 am

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Wed Jan 07, 2004 2:54 pm

Three airports in one city (Dallas) is a misuse of resources, and a poor attempt to improve aviation services to the local community. Most MSAs are better served by investing in their current facilities, bringing in light rail, improving and expanding gate facilities, and adapting the facility to the needs of the flying public.

Building an entire new facility, to supplement the other facilities, most often times is not the best idea. There is zero need in Dallas for a third airport. Two words - capacity reductions.
See you up front!
 
strickerje
Posts: 706
Joined: Tue Feb 20, 2001 1:35 pm

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Wed Jan 07, 2004 3:01 pm

I would say it's either Boston or Philadelphia, or possibly Phoenix, depending on what you consider part of the metro area. I'm not sure which of those three is largest. I'm also not sure whether largest in this context refers to area or population, but I'm assuming area.

-Jeffrey S.
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
Posts: 6104
Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2002 11:45 am

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Wed Jan 07, 2004 3:06 pm

DTW is the primary airport for Southeast Michigan

FNT, TOL, and LAN all act as secondary airports for the Detroit area, notably Flint draws the northern suburbs, LAN the far Western areas and mid-Michigan, and TOL far southern Michigan.

DET will not likely ever regain passenger service, I was just down by there last week, its looking worse than ever.
 
MAH4546
Posts: 24557
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 1:44 pm

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Wed Jan 07, 2004 3:34 pm

would say it's either Boston or Philadelphia

If one is using metropolitan areas, Boston MSA includes Bedford. The CMSA also includes Manchester. Philadelphia MSA and CMSA includes Atlantic City.

Based on MSA populations, there is nothing to dispute here. It is Atlanta, Georgia. Based on CMSA, I think it is still Atlanta, but I am not certain. Based on city proper it is Los Angeles, California. They have only LAX within thier city limits.
a.
 
US653
Posts: 160
Joined: Sun Dec 21, 2003 2:36 am

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Wed Jan 07, 2004 3:40 pm

Based purely on population, I would say Philadelphia. ABE and ACY lie just outside the metro areas (even though technically ACY falls within the Philadelphia MSA). If those areas MUST be included, then ATL it is.

Jeff
US653...PHL-AUA...The best place in the Caribbean!!!
 
b741
Posts: 677
Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2004 3:09 pm

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Wed Jan 07, 2004 4:02 pm

What about Mexico City?
Being Bilingual, I Speak English And Aviation
 
Southamerica
Posts: 2300
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2003 2:56 am

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Wed Jan 07, 2004 4:11 pm


B741,

I was going to participate when I saw that the list was limited to only US airports.

Obviously Mexico City has to be one of the winners worldwide. There are several others out of the US.

Maybe de author of the post could extend the limit?


Regards


SOUTHAMERICA
 
kbuf737
Posts: 765
Joined: Thu Dec 04, 2003 2:22 pm

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Wed Jan 07, 2004 4:16 pm

I was going to say, If not in the US then definately Mexico City. How many people live there now? It must be pushing 25-26 million.
The tower? Rapunzel!!!!!!
 
EddieDude
Posts: 6208
Joined: Fri Nov 14, 2003 10:19 am

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Thu Jan 08, 2004 4:41 am

I agree MX), Mexico">MEX would be the largest metro area with only one airport. However, you could consider that it has a second airport: the Toluca airport, which is less than 40 minutes away by car from the west side of Mexico City. Although in the past it was mainly an airport for private jets, MX and AM seem to have plans to send some domestic routes to Toluca from MX), Mexico">MEX. All I can say is that it would be convenient for me and for many other people, especially now that MX), Mexico">MEX is being expanded to increase its capacity by 30%, and parking and dropping passengers is a real mess.
Next flights: MEX-LAX AM 738, LAX-PVG DL 77L, SHA-PEK CA 789, PEK-PVG CA A332, PVG-ORD MU 77W, ORD-MEX AM 738
 
ssides
Posts: 3248
Joined: Fri Feb 09, 2001 12:57 am

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Thu Jan 08, 2004 4:49 am

I find it hard to believe that Atlantic City is in Philadelphia's MSA. I've made the drive, and they seem like two distinct areas to me.
"Lose" is not spelled with two o's!!!!
 
LH423
Posts: 5868
Joined: Sun Jul 11, 1999 6:27 am

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Thu Jan 08, 2004 4:53 am

What's the difference between an MSA and a CMSA? Because with MHT about 1 hour from Boston and PVD about another 50-55, very few people would consider Manchester or Providence to be in the Boston metropolitan area which would make Boston one of the largest, especially with the loss of service at ORH. However, it is true that US Express still has service at Hanscom/BED.

LH423
« On ne voit bien qu'avec le cœur. L'essentiel est invisible pour les yeux » Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
 
737Captain
Posts: 117
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2003 3:16 pm

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Thu Jan 08, 2004 5:16 am

My vote goes for PHX, only one airport with service, and a HUGE population in Phoenix and its suburban areas.  Smile
"Why do you insist on man-pawing the glareshield everytime you climb up here?!"
 
seb146
Posts: 13902
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Thu Jan 08, 2004 5:49 am

SEA is out: BFI is used by San Juan Air and Helijet. I have not been to PAE for about 3 years but the last time I was there, the 'terminal' had two car rental desks and one office for the ground service.

In the PDX area there are three airports: PDX, HIO, and VOU. HIO has a terminal used by Intel and there has been talk of extending one runway to use it for cargo.

GO CANUCKS!!
Life in the wall is a drag.
 
bongo
Posts: 1783
Joined: Sat Oct 04, 2003 5:32 am

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Thu Jan 08, 2004 5:54 am

I think most of big latinamerican capital and second largest cities have only one airport such as Mexico City, Bogota, Lima, SJO, etc.
BTW: Atlanta has only one airport ? Are you sure?
MDE: First airport in the Americas visited by the A380!
 
cx340
Posts: 518
Joined: Sat Sep 02, 2000 2:59 am

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Thu Jan 08, 2004 6:15 am

I agree with EddieDude, you could actually consider Toluca (TOL) as a second airport for Mexico City.

Toluca has a single runway perfectly suited for commercial operations (more than 13,000 feet long), that has been upgraded from time to time. In fact, Fedex's mexican hub is TOL, and almost all private or corporate aircraft use this airport as gateway to Mexico City. For people living or working in the newer developments on west side of Mexico City, it is a 35 minute ride.

The problem for Toluca is the altitude and prevaling weather. It is higher than MEX and thus not viable for long range operations. In fact, in the late eighties there was a serious project which intended to develop Toloca as the international airport for MEX, but the altitude was one of the major drawbacks. Like EddieDude said, some Mexican airlines have or have had operations there in the past, but the fares where high and the frecuencies low, so they havn't really worked.

I've always wondered though, why no one has tried to open a serious regional airline based at Toluca.


 
mckennasmall
Posts: 240
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 2004 5:00 am

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Thu Jan 08, 2004 6:23 am

YUL,
they just got rid of Mirabel and YUL is expanding
 
kbuf737
Posts: 765
Joined: Thu Dec 04, 2003 2:22 pm

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Thu Jan 08, 2004 7:15 am

In Toronto, can you count Downsview or City Centre as true second commercial airports?

Even Atlanta and Phoenix have secondary airports like Scottsdale and Deer Valley or Peachtree.

The tower? Rapunzel!!!!!!
 
User avatar
ATA L1011
Posts: 1275
Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2001 6:47 am

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Thu Jan 08, 2004 7:53 am

San Diego pretty large, one airport with a single runway, although they are so close to Orange County and Long Beac. The LA/SD area is really one huge area.
Treat others as you expect to be treated!
 
DeltaGuy
Posts: 3965
Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2001 5:25 am

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Thu Jan 08, 2004 8:00 am

My vote goes to ATL...really the only airport around, till you get to BHM or Valdosta...and it's a big surrounding area! Just my 2 c's  Smile

DeltaGuy
"The cockpit, what is it?" "It's the little room in the front of the plane where the pilot sits, but that's not importan
 
expressjetphx
Posts: 259
Joined: Sat Sep 06, 2003 2:33 pm

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Thu Jan 08, 2004 8:07 am

My vote goes for PHX, only one airport with service, and a HUGE population in Phoenix and its suburban areas.

Me too, I think SDL should be upgraded for some regional traffic because most resort vacationers go to Scottsdale anyways. Who knows?
 
gigneil
Posts: 14133
Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2002 10:25 am

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Thu Jan 08, 2004 8:25 am

If you start including further parts of the metro, Atlanta still whoops Phoenix handily.

N
 
737Captain
Posts: 117
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2003 3:16 pm

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Thu Jan 08, 2004 8:40 am

Expressjetphx-
I very much agree, that would be a great idea.
On another note, if Jetblue acts upon their current plan of using IWA in the future for service into the Phoenix area, we'll be out of the running for this title in the near future.  Smile
"Why do you insist on man-pawing the glareshield everytime you climb up here?!"
 
MAH4546
Posts: 24557
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 1:44 pm

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Thu Jan 08, 2004 10:47 am

What's the difference between an MSA and a CMSA? Because with MHT about 1 hour from Boston and PVD about another 50-55, very few people would consider Manchester or Providence to be in the Boston metropolitan area

Boston's CMSA includes Manchester. Neither the MSA nor the CMSA includes Providence. I agree that very few would probably consider Manchester in the Boston metro, but the US Census Bureau does, and that is what matters.
a.
 
Neo
Posts: 730
Joined: Sat Jan 06, 2001 8:21 am

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Thu Jan 08, 2004 11:50 am

Does anyone have an updated list of the largest metro-areas in the world.

The last time i checked it was something like this:

1 TYO
2 MEX
3 NYC
4 SAO
5 LAX
6 SHA
7 LOS......

Don't know if that was right..... can anyone provide a list please???

Thnks

Neo
 
haveric
Posts: 1219
Joined: Fri Jan 05, 2001 9:31 am

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Thu Jan 08, 2004 11:59 am

I disagree that the Census Bureau has the final say on this.

Thus, for all intents and purposes, Philadelphia is the largest metro area with one airport. If PNE, TTN, or Wilmington, DE (ILG, i think) ever re-establish commercial service, then we can talk.

ACY is not part of the Philadelphia metro area. Until recently, US had flights PHL-ACY!

Similar story for Boston. Manchester is really not part of greater Boston. Anyone who argues so is kidding themselves. However, Philly is bigger than Boston, so Philly wins.

 
FLAIRPORT
Posts: 3863
Joined: Thu Oct 26, 2000 10:46 am

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Thu Jan 08, 2004 12:33 pm

Boston has Worchester and some of the airports on the cape and Nantucket!

In any case, I saw its ATL. Fulton County and Peachtree DaKalb cannot recieve anything over corperate jets. Pre 9/11, there were rumors of introducing service to Dobbins, but that obviously faded.
I wish they would have planned better. For me to get to my camp in Gainesville, it might cos as much as the ticket to ATL! They need another airport up north, but ii don't think it CAN be done!
NEXT FLIGHT: FLL-ATL-HPN on FL
 
MAH4546
Posts: 24557
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 1:44 pm

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Thu Jan 08, 2004 3:50 pm

ACY is not part of the Philadelphia metro area.

Tell that to the US census bureau. They consider Atlantic City in the Philadelphia metro area.

Until recently, US had flights PHL-ACY!

Continental flies IAH-EFD, both in the Houston metro area. United Airlines flies ONT-LAX, again in the same metro area. In the past, airlines have flown MIA-FLL, SFO-OAK, EWR-HPN (as recent as last spring), and LAX-SNA, to name a few. Does not change the fact they are the same metro area.
a.
 
azmd80
Posts: 276
Joined: Tue Nov 11, 2003 8:19 pm

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Thu Jan 08, 2004 7:23 pm

In my opinion ATL is the largest metropolitan area with only one Airport.

In Europe I Think that the first rank is AMS.

bie
 
Cessna172RG
Posts: 642
Joined: Wed Aug 30, 2000 8:31 am

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Thu Jan 08, 2004 7:34 pm

With all of the airports near Seattle, I'm suprised that some are underused as they are today with the current carriers.

I'd personally like to see Tacoma/Narrows (KTIW/TIW) open up with some regional service. Sure, Tacoma may not be like Seattle, but there would be (IMHO) possible demand (maybe) for a TIW-PDX or TIW-YVR run. Why drive from Tacoma to Seattle (40 minutes) when you can drive 10 minutes across the bridge to catch a flight with other fellow passengers who could benefit from the service? Then again, Tacoma Narrows really doesn't have the room to accomodate a terminal for that, and there are noise abatement proceedures in effect (and a runway placard that reminds you). So scratch that...

Paine Field in Everett would be nice too. Everett's a pretty big town. About 20 miles North of Seattle, closer than Tacoma.

Then again, I'm not an expert in this field...so...please don't flame me!!!  Big grin

As for metropolitan areas with one airport, how about Honolulu? Or Charlotte?
Save the whales...for dinner!!!
 
flyboy7974
Posts: 1210
Joined: Sat Jan 18, 2003 4:35 pm

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Thu Jan 08, 2004 7:35 pm

to correct the above about phx, scottsdale did in the past have commercial airline service, and the community didn't support it. that is why the terminal was built the way it still is now, with gates and a pax holding area. stateswest use to fly nonstop to orange county from scottsdale with B1900. flown with a metroliner, back in the early 90's, air laughlin also served scottsdale on a tus-sdl-ifp flight r/t.
 
DLKAPA
Posts: 7962
Joined: Wed Dec 03, 2003 10:37 am

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Sat Jan 10, 2004 8:23 am

Denver has to be one of the largest in the U.S. There have been futile attempts to open up APA for passenger service, but because there is no terminal facility, that would take years to develop into anything real.

Also, many people on the south side of town drive to COS, but that is an hour and a half away.

DLKAPA
And all at once the crowd begins to sing: Sometimes the hardest thing and the right thing are the same
 
767Lover
Posts: 3254
Joined: Fri Sep 26, 2003 6:32 am

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Sat Jan 10, 2004 2:40 pm

I don't know if anyone mentioned this or not (I scanned the posts) but Jacksonville, FL is supposedly the largest city in the U.S. in terms of square miles, but only one airport as far as I know (JAX). Or am I wrong?
 
Spark
Posts: 421
Joined: Tue Mar 05, 2002 11:50 am

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Sat Jan 10, 2004 3:53 pm

If you look at the Census information, it comes down to MSA vs CMSA.

The top five metro areas in the US are all covered. New York has 5, LA has 5, Chicago has 2, Washington D.C. has 3, and San Francisco has 3. No one can argue that any of these areas are served by one airport.

The next biggest is Philadelphia. Do people in Philadelphia consider ACY to be an airport choice?
Boston is next, which includes Worchester (which I thought had service) and possibly MHT.
Detroit, which includes Flint.
Dallas, and then Houston are the next two biggest metro areas, and both served by multiple airports.
Atlanta is next, and there is no question that ATL is it's only airport.

It is all a question whether Philadelphia and Boston have more than one airport, if they do, Alanta has the next largest population.

BTW, Miami is next (MIA,FLL,PBI)
Seatle (SEA)
Phoenix (PHX)
Minneapolis (MSP)
 
jm017
Posts: 780
Joined: Sun Jun 16, 2002 6:47 pm

RE: Which Airline Has The Best Paint Scheme?

Sat Jan 10, 2004 5:29 pm

this link:

http://www.census.gov/population/cen2000/phc-t3/tab03.txt

lists the Philadelphia CMSA as Philadelphia-Wilmington-Atlantic City and includes parts of PA, NJ, DE and MD. If we consider CMSA, then Philly technically has two airports. Philly's MSA excludes Atlantic city, in which case the area has one airport, making it the largest area with one airport. Most people would not consider atlantic city a part of the Philly metro area anyway.

Do people consider ACY to be an airport of choice? Well I have tried. I know ACY has some scheduled service (spirit airlines is an example). But in practical terms not a lot of people consider ACY as an airport of choice. It's quite far (relative to PHL) and much smaller, offering limited flight options.
"It's okay to cheat, if you just really don't like to lose."
 
MAH4546
Posts: 24557
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 1:44 pm

RE: Largest Metro Area With Only One Airport?

Sat Jan 10, 2004 5:32 pm

Spark, those are outdated figures. The US census completely revised the CMSA and MSA defintions in 2003, merging some and splitting up others.

25 Largest MSAs:
1) New York City-Newark-Edison, NY-PN-NJ
2) Los Angeles-Long Beach-Santa Ana, CA
3) Chicago-Naperville-Joilet, IL-IN-WI
4) Philadelphia-Camden-Wilmington, PA-NJ-DE-MD
5) Dallas-Fort Worth-Arlington, TX
6) Miami-Ft. Lauderdale-Miami Beach, FL
7) Washington-Arlington-Alexandria, DC-VA-MD-WV
8) Houston-Baytown-Sugar Land, TX
9) Atlanta-Sandy Springs-Marietta, GA
10) Detroit-Warren-Livonia, MI
11) Boston-Cambridge-Quncy, MA-NH
12) San Francisco-Oakland-Fremont, CA
13) Riverside-San Bernadino-Ontario, CA
14) Phoenix-Mesa-Scottsdale, AZ
15) Seattle-Tacoma-Bellvue, WA
16) Minneapolis-St. Paul-Bloomington, MN-WI
17) San Diego-Carlsbad-San Marcos, CA
18) St. Louis, MO-IL
19) Baltimore-Townson, MD
20) Tampa-St. Peterburg-Clearwater, FL
21) Pittsburgh, PA
22) Denver-Aurora, CO
23) Clevleand-Elyria-Mentor, OH
24) Cincinnati-Middletown, OH-KY-IN
25) Portland-Vancouver-Beaverton, OR-WA

a.