ssides
Posts: 3248
Joined: Fri Feb 09, 2001 12:57 am

DFW's Terminal D -- All International Flights?

Fri Jan 16, 2004 3:33 pm

Quick question re: the new International Terminal D at DFW. According to the DFW web site, the new terminal will have 23 gates. This seems low to me. Will AA use the terminal, or will it continue to keep its international operations in Terminal A?
"Lose" is not spelled with two o's!!!!
 
usnseallt82
Posts: 4727
Joined: Tue Jan 06, 2004 4:49 pm

RE: DFW's Terminal D -- All International Flights?

Fri Jan 16, 2004 3:41 pm

I'm sure AA will have a large slice out of the share of gates at the new terminal. Other airlines will probably replace sections of C or B, but I'm sure AA will also keep it's share of A. Terminal E hosts most DL flights and some other carriers, but it can't be expanded anymore than it already has been.

Overall, I'm sure AA will keep most of what they already have and then take most of the new gates at D. Although, if D is being built for a new customs area, which I'm not sure of yet, then AA and others may switch their international arrivals over there.

It will be a nice addition, though, whatever the outcome!

Cheers!
Crye me a river
 
BHMNONREV
Posts: 1209
Joined: Thu Aug 28, 2003 9:17 am

RE: DFW's Terminal D -- All International Flights?

Fri Jan 16, 2004 11:09 pm

I read somewhere recently that all international arrivals, regardless of airline, will arrive at "D". I would guess that AA's arrivals would then be towed to "A" for departure when Customs/Immigration/Agriculture is completed...
 
jsnww81
Posts: 2301
Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2002 3:29 am

RE: DFW's Terminal D -- All International Flights?

Fri Jan 16, 2004 11:41 pm

AA wanted to keep their international arrivals at Terminal A, but that would leave Terminal D grossly underutilized - only British Airways, Lufthansa, Korean Air, AeroMexico, Aviacsa, TACA, Sol Air and the odd charter flight. I'm pretty sure DFW will require all international arrivals to come into D (similar to O'Hare, where international flights arrive at T5 and are towed to their T3 gates for departure.

With American's international flights, Terminal D will be quite busy indeed - the Latin/South American/Caribbean flights go out in the morning, and the European flights go out in the evening.

It should be a spectacular facility; it was shaping up quite nicely when I was at DFW last month.
 
PUDFW
Posts: 98
Joined: Tue Sep 30, 2003 3:45 pm

RE: DFW's Terminal D -- All International Flights?

Fri Jan 16, 2004 11:47 pm

My understanding is that all international flights will depart and arrive from the new Terminal D. American will no longer use Terminal A for international flights but will keep all those gates. Any airline regardless will use the terminal for international flights. So you will see British Airways, Lufthansa, Korean Air move over from Terminal B to the new facility.

And with regards to them towing the aircraft over to A, for departure that's not the case. I realize they do that at O'Hare but also its a lot of hassle for connecting passengers to change terminals in Chicago. Connecting passengers at DFW will be able to do it in less than 5 minutes with the new Sky Link system, so its really not going to be inconvenient.
 
bartond
Posts: 647
Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2003 6:59 am

RE: DFW's Terminal D -- All International Flights?

Sat Jan 17, 2004 12:30 am

the question is what new airlines will the new international terminal bring?
 
ssides
Posts: 3248
Joined: Fri Feb 09, 2001 12:57 am

RE: DFW's Terminal D -- All International Flights?

Sat Jan 17, 2004 5:25 am

the question is what new airlines will the new international terminal bring?

Hopefully Qantas, Air France, Cathay Pacific and LanChile!
"Lose" is not spelled with two o's!!!!
 
PUDFW
Posts: 98
Joined: Tue Sep 30, 2003 3:45 pm

RE: DFW's Terminal D -- All International Flights?

Sat Jan 17, 2004 6:01 am

Air France will come back, Cathay is a possibility. LanChile I am doubting will happen because American has that covered already. And hopefully Qantas will start its long awaited and announced (2 years ago) service DFW-AKL-SYD.
 
AlitaliaORD
Posts: 237
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2003 12:38 am

RE: DFW's Terminal D -- All International Flights?

Sat Jan 17, 2004 6:29 am

Why did Air France leave DFW and how long did they operate there?
I remeber seeing a picture of an AF -340 but thats about it
Joy To The World, All The Boys and Girls, Joy to the Fishes in the Deep Blue Sea, Joy to You and Me
 
PUDFW
Posts: 98
Joined: Tue Sep 30, 2003 3:45 pm

RE: DFW's Terminal D -- All International Flights?

Sat Jan 17, 2004 6:49 am

Air France started service in like April of 2001 I believe, they ran an A340 there at first. Then capacity dropped and they put a 767 on the route. I cant remember exactly when they dropped the service but it was after 9/11 maybe the same year or early 02.

I am assuming AA's daily service had a lot to do with it as well. I believe they used to operate 2 daily flights there, now its just one.

PUDFW
 
bartond
Posts: 647
Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2003 6:59 am

RE: DFW's Terminal D -- All International Flights?

Sat Jan 17, 2004 7:03 am

Air France was here for a little over a year if I remember correctly but I'm not positive. It wasn't here long enough, I know that. They'd park the A343 at the very end of Terminal E, the Delta terminal, and that was a pretty rundown operation if I remember correctly. As far as why they left, I believe someone told me they lost some contracts with French corporations in the Dallas area and that was the main reason. Also, the downturn in technology sector caused Alcatel to close a massive plant and reduce their operation alot here so that didn't help.

I still can't understand why all of the demand on the DFW-CDG route left - AA had two daily 772s and Air France had an A343 on the route for awhile then 9/11 hit and last year the route was whittled down to one daily 763. I know that the 9/11 attacks and the ensuing war and tension between USA and France has brought traffic down but there's gotta be room for AF at DFW.

As far as new carriers that might start service - yeah LanChile probably is going to let AA keep the route. Unless LanChile wants to do mainly a cargo route and bring some of that good red wine they produce to the metroplex...that'd be cool with me. I really think that either Cathay or Eva might show up and in a few years maybe China Eastern or China Airlines. Cathay would make the most sense, though. There were rumours about 6 months ago after Eva increased their cargo service here that they plan on introducing pax service at some point. Thinking Oneworld here, Qantas should open up DFW and I still say that Iberia would do okay here but they seem to be stuck on Miami. Aer Lingus probably ain't comin here...just not enough traffic between the two areas.

Although I wish that more European carriers would show up I think most of the expansion will be via Asia. I just want more heavies at my airport....BA, LH and KE ain't enough.
 
ConcordeBoy
Posts: 16852
Joined: Thu Feb 01, 2001 8:04 am

RE: DFW's Terminal D -- All International Flights?

Sat Jan 17, 2004 7:40 am

Air France will come back

Doubtful... any time in the forseeable future


Why did Air France leave DFW

AA boosted capacity; and AF wasnt able to secure premium traffic, and loads werent that great even with DL feed
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
us330
Posts: 3413
Joined: Tue Aug 08, 2000 7:00 am

RE: DFW's Terminal D -- All International Flights?

Sat Jan 17, 2004 7:42 am

Apparently, DFW's #1 target is EVA passenger service. Ever since they started the flight, the airport officials have tried to recruit them to start passenger service as well.
 
Bobs89irocz
Posts: 599
Joined: Fri Aug 22, 2003 4:52 am

RE: DFW's Terminal D -- All International Flights?

Sat Jan 17, 2004 7:55 am

I also believe all the inbound international stuff with deboard at terminal D, and AA's will be taxied back to Termial A for alot of there boarding flights. Much like ORD. Iberia is taxied to the AA gates to fly from here to Madrid, Spain. Both LH planes (744, 343) are taxied to the united gates to leave. Private air (operated by LH, A319) leaves from Northwest gates. But all deboard at T5 which is where customs is and everything (very nice termial).

As far as traffic that will come to DFW. I dont think that much but we will see some. AA has alot of stuff already taken up out of DFW to where they will eat up the compitition or at lease try and drive them out. AA is like that. I hope SAS would have a A330/340 come over from Stockholm or Copenhagen. AF with a 777/343 from paris(this will be a tough market). Swiss or Alitalia would be nice but dont see happening because there really isnt that big of a market for either airline out of DFW. Aviacsa, Aeromexico, Mexicana i could see maybe one of these airlines to fly in to DFW but 2 would be pushing it. Aviacsa only has 1 a day to ORD and Aeromexico just dropped there 2nd a day back to 1 a day till summer. Mexicana has about 10 a day or so i believe.

I think the termial will bring 5-8 new carrers at the most...BA/LH/KA of course because they already fly. SAS/AF/CX/QA/KLM?/BMI?/a mexican carrer??
those are my thoughts....good topic though.
 
bartond
Posts: 647
Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2003 6:59 am

RE: DFW's Terminal D -- All International Flights?

Sat Jan 17, 2004 8:13 am

yeah i heard that too, Us330. you never know about this type of stuff but i love to talk about rumours. it seems much more feasible for CX to startup DFW but I guess Eva sees an underserved Texas-Asia market and might want to hop in here 3x weekly. Their cargo service has gone from nothing a few years ago to them being the largest cargo carrier at the airport. Keep it comin Eva.

It'd be really healthy for the airport if some other carriers could come in and have decent operations, if nothing more than to cut into AA's near monopoly on international flights at DFW (80% I think). I don't think there will be more than maybe 2 in the next few years, and my guess would be Eva and QF. Other than that AA will dominate any European or South American carrier that tries to come in, I'm afraid. Alitalia, SAS, etc. don't have any real reason to come to DFW.

Aeromexico already flies to DFW. I can't see any other Mexican carriers coming with AA's numerous flights to Mexico.

I get you Concorde on the Air France thing. With Delta trimming their DFW "hub" into a regional jet zoo, Air France won't get nearly as much feed from DL so that's a big kicker in the plan. That sux...I'd love to see them come back and flourish.
 
User avatar
ramprat74
Posts: 1328
Joined: Wed Dec 17, 2003 6:01 pm

RE: DFW's Terminal D -- All International Flights?

Sat Jan 17, 2004 8:32 am

Sabena flew into DFW not to long ago. I don't know if SN Brussels would think about flying back in or not.
 
aa777flyer
Posts: 1017
Joined: Fri Feb 09, 2001 8:45 am

RE: DFW's Terminal D -- All International Flights?

Sat Jan 17, 2004 8:54 am

All of AA's international flights will arrive and depart from terminal D. Taxiing the airplanes back to A for departure would add too much time to turn around times and would not be very efficient. AA will boost additional capacity out of terminal A once D opens.
The TSA was created to make the post office look efficient!
 
TexAussie
Posts: 142
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 2004 5:26 pm

RE: DFW's Terminal D -- All International Flights?

Sat Jan 17, 2004 9:16 am

Yes, Qantas will likely (we hope!!!) commit a 747-400ER to DFW that is either SYD-AA), New Zealand">AKL-DFW or MEL-LAX-DFW. Rumor is that will be 2005, but when the A380s come online later that will free up some 744s for new routes.

Don't rule out Singapore Airlines as a DFW Target either. They already have a cargo 744-F on that route (or did) and I would not be surprised to see a 772ER via a major US gateway (making use of time for aircraft utilization turn and cargo). Of course, that would depend on whter they would code share come commueter flights with Delta -- not an impossibility. Star Alliance does not have much coverage in Texas and Dallas/Austin still have considerable Asia/Pac ties. Delta and SQ used to have very close ties.

I wish DL would ramp us their mini jet camp at DFW, but they do have a big network of regional routes that could be quite appealing for a foreign flag carrier to tap into.

Regardign AA double daily 777s to CDG, I don't recall that, but if they did it was probably the typical One World approach to driving out competition. One World wrote the book on that (Crandall at AA and Colin Marshall at BA were the pioneers in that field -- both smart, tough businessmen). Qantas has learned that from their British big brother, who own about 49% of QF... BA.

When Branson brings his Airbuses to Sydney this year, watch BA/QF make life rough for them along the Kangaroo route!

 
PUDFW
Posts: 98
Joined: Tue Sep 30, 2003 3:45 pm

RE: DFW's Terminal D -- All International Flights?

Sat Jan 17, 2004 9:28 am

I read somewhere that Terminal D will have to take on domestic OPS once it first opens because if its just international it would be drastically under used.

I can't see why AA would use Terminal A for departure, I mean this is going to be arguably the best facility in the country when its finished, why not show it off?

Also I am willing to bet that DFW will have at least one new airline signed up to help kick off the new terminal.

PUDFW
 
TexAussie
Posts: 142
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 2004 5:26 pm

RE: DFW's Terminal D -- All International Flights?

Sat Jan 17, 2004 9:57 am

Ooops, forgot...

When I was in the LH lounge at DFW a few months ago, they staff there said that JAL was going to be coming back in 2005 with the new terminal. While that may be gossip, the staff said that the company that contracts that lounge (their employer) told them it was signing a service contract with JAL to provide lounge services at DFW to begin in another year or so.

I wonder whether BA lounge will merge with AAdmiral's Club. Qantas/AA are combing lounges at LAX for T4.
 
bartond
Posts: 647
Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2003 6:59 am

RE: DFW's Terminal D -- All International Flights?

Tue Jan 20, 2004 4:11 am

It may be a rumour about JAL coming back, true, but they had service here for a while in the 90's and that's not the only time I've heard of them wanting to start service back up. I'd love to see them come in and steal about 5-7 flights per week from AA...I love AA but foreign flaggers/other carriers are needed to lessen AA's stronghold on this airport.

If they were to come back to DFW in 2005, would they bring back the MD11 or start things up with a new cool-looking 772? My vote is for a 772. It'd be great to drive by the new int'l. terminal and see about 4 AA 772s, BA 772, JAL 772, KE 772, LH A340, QF 744..?
 
flyinghighboy
Posts: 722
Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2001 8:06 pm

RE: DFW's Terminal D -- All International Flights?

Tue Jan 20, 2004 4:16 am

BA only owns about 20% of QF. It used to be 25% until a year or so ago when they listed more shares and BA's stake in QF went down. As to how much say they have in QF is not that much with only one member on the board.