MTChemNerd757
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What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Mon Feb 09, 2004 1:42 pm

Hey, can anyone tell me what happened to Delta's A310s after they were retired by Delta? Were they sold, scrapped, still sitting in the desert, etc? Are any of them still flying? Same question with their 747-100s?

Thanks!
Brad
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corey07850
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Mon Feb 09, 2004 1:51 pm

I believe most were sold to other airlines (Aeroflot, Air Jamaica, FedEx) but I could be wrong.

Does anyone know why DL bought A310's and not more 737's?
 
JAL777
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Mon Feb 09, 2004 1:53 pm

The A310's were inherited from Pan Am. Simply put... they didn't serve a purpose in Delta's fleet and were quickly sold off.
 
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Mon Feb 09, 2004 1:53 pm

The A310 ranged from brand new to only a few years old... the -200 were sold to FexEx, the -300 were sold to a leasing company (or companies) and scattered among various airlines...
 
SpeedbirdHeavy
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Mon Feb 09, 2004 1:57 pm

Did they ever fly in service for DL, or where they immediately sold off after the acquisitions and never carried the DL livery?
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JAL777
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Mon Feb 09, 2004 2:00 pm

Not only did they carry the Delta livery... but I had the oppurtunity to fly in one twice.  Smile
 
deltaffindfw
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Mon Feb 09, 2004 2:00 pm


There are several pages of photos on a.net of the DL A310.


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JBirdAV8r
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Mon Feb 09, 2004 2:08 pm

Yes, some were delivered factory new to Delta from Airbus (Pan Am's outstanding order).
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Krags
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Mon Feb 09, 2004 2:24 pm

Delta didn't fly them for long but they did make some improvements to the interiors. The main thing they did was remove some seats. Pan Am had a lot of seats crammed in these birds and Delta increased the seat pitch. Delta didn't need the 767-300 and the A310 so one had to go. They ended up flying on some domestic routes before they were gone. I would have liked to have seen one of Pan Am's A300s in the Delta colors.
 
hirisk
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Mon Feb 09, 2004 2:31 pm

as for the 747's.delta never bought any that i'm aware of.they don't have the routes that would need a 47.
happy contrails
 
HlywdCatft
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Mon Feb 09, 2004 2:33 pm

After Pan Am died, Delta took over the Pan Am European routes. There used to be a Delta A310 route that went DTW-LHR. I don't know how Delta didn't keep LHR after that with only UA and AA getting LHR from USA. The DTW-LHR route only lasted a year or two with Delta before Northwest got the Detroit-London route but now going to LGW instead.

The A310 was definitely an oddball in the fleet which already had planes from three other companies- Boeing, Lockheed and McDD.

Think about the widebody fleet during that time...

Boeing 767-200
Boeing 767-300
L1011
DC-10-10 (from Western merger)
MD-11
A310

yes the A310s for the most part went to Fed Ex
 
mikeclod
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Mon Feb 09, 2004 6:14 pm

Anybody have the tail #'s of the ones that went to FedEx?
Thanks, Mikeclod
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Mon Feb 09, 2004 6:24 pm

as for the 747's.delta never bought any that i'm aware of

DL did indeed purchase and op the 741


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solnabo
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Mon Feb 09, 2004 7:48 pm

No €uropeans in an all-Everett fleet...
Tragic!

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DeltaMD11
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Mon Feb 09, 2004 8:42 pm

Hirisk,
DL was in fact one of the very first customers for the 747-100 they just didn't last long (1970-1977).


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JMChladek
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Mon Feb 09, 2004 8:53 pm

Main reason Delta got the 74s and then got rid of them was because they were a bit big for domestic routes when the economic downturn in the 70s came and Delta didn't have any international destinations at the time (or at least none that I am aware of). So, they discontinued their 747 service. American was in a similar situation with their 741s, but they had a little more lucrative routing and they were a bit more creative in terms of keeping their 741 service a bit longer. But a lot of American's 747s got stored or sold off in the mid 1970s as well with one becoming NASA 905, the first shuttle carrier aircraft.
 
DL685
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Mon Feb 09, 2004 9:57 pm

I do know that 2 of Delta's 747-100 are in service with Polar Air Cargo
 
luv2fly
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Mon Feb 09, 2004 10:35 pm

The route when PA flew it did go DTW - LHR after the sale of routes to UA the route was moved to LGW as only two US carriers are allowed to fly to LHR at anytime. DL flew the route DTW to LGW before selling it to NW.

[Edited 2004-02-09 14:46:46]
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oobitsa
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Mon Feb 09, 2004 10:43 pm

I had a hunch that I had flown on one of these A310s on an Aeroflot flight from Vladivostok to Moscow in January 2002. I couldn't help but think that the somewhat ratty interior looked like Delta's. The A310's are ideal for an 8 hour domestic flight.
 
airsicknessbag
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Mon Feb 09, 2004 10:59 pm


I flew on two DL A310s in 1994, FRA-ATH-FRA. That was part of the ATL-FRA-ATH flight. (DL20/24 iirc.)

Daniel Smile
 
oobitsa
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Mon Feb 09, 2004 11:20 pm

One of the ex Delta birds now with Aeroflot:


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Photo © Charles Falk

 
FlagshipAZ
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Mon Feb 09, 2004 11:22 pm

Delta has operated 7 A310-200s & 23 A310-300s, including the ships from Pan Am. DL also had 5 747-132s briefly. Regards.

http://www.geocities.com/~aeromoe/fleets/delta.html
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N312RC
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Mon Feb 09, 2004 11:31 pm

Delta did operate DTW-LHR with those A310's and the route was sold to NWA and became DTW-LGW. I would like to point out that DTW does still get LHR service with BA (772).
N/A
 
PVD757
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Mon Feb 09, 2004 11:39 pm

I fairly certain that SATA (S4) operates some of DL's ex-A310-300's...
 
gr8slvrflt
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Mon Feb 09, 2004 11:43 pm

To my recollection, Delta acquired A300s and A310-200s as part of their purchase of some of Pan Am's assets. The A300s were disposed of immediately and never operated by Delta. The A310-200s were used for a while but replaced by NEW A310-300s ordered from Airbus. I don't believe these were old Pan Am orders. Delta tried to purchase the old Eastern hangar in Atlanta for their Airbus maintenance base but the city of Atlanta was holding up that sale. The city wanted another airline to come in and takeover the base as part of a hub operation. Northwest and TWA were the prime candidates. Delta decided instead to contract Airbus maintenance to it's then Quality Alliance partner, Swissair.

When Delta started hemmoraging red ink in the mid 90s the Frankfurt hub was scrapped, most trans-Pacific routes were dropped and the Airbus became a victim of fleet simplification. Shortly thereafter Delta signed an exclusive agreement with Boeing. Of course, Delta did evenutally get the Eastern hangar.
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LHMark
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Mon Feb 09, 2004 11:44 pm

I was under the impression that Delta used them on ATL-TXL for a while. Am I correct?
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luv2fly
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Mon Feb 09, 2004 11:46 pm

No DL never flew the route into LHR, check your facts. Once PA sold the routes to UA, UA did not want the DTW to LHR route, had UA bought it they could have operated it into LHR. Bermuda 2 only allows 2 US carriers to operate into LHR, that being AA and UA so even if DL wanted to and I am sure they did, they could not fly the route into LHR. Even PA after selling the routes to UA had to operate this one route in LGW from DTW before selling it to DL.
You can cut the irony with a knife
 
SQ25J
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Tue Feb 10, 2004 12:06 am

In reference to DL's 747-Evergreen International has 2 of the the 747-132, although they were delivered new to China Airlines.
DL's 310's were a casuality of Delta's "Leadesrhip 7.5" cost-cutting campaign as to get pax seat mile cost to 7.5 cents. Delta had 19 310's 200+300. 13 were inherited on lease from Airbus and 6 Delta purchased. The 6 Delta owned were sold to FDX in 1995. The rest were returned to Airbus in 1995-96. Airbus then placed a few with Air Jamaica, Air India, and maybe Air Club of Canada.
When DL operated the 310's they were from JFK and FRA hubs. They most likely only flew to Atlanta for MX or equipment swap. I am almost certain DL never operated regular scheduled flights ATL-TXL. Perhaps this was a funnel flight through JFK.
 
Scorpio
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Tue Feb 10, 2004 12:33 am

The 7 A310-200s all went to FedEx, where they are currently flying as N416FE to N422FE.
2 of the -300s eventuallly also ended up with FedEx, after serving with other airlines first:
N823PA => N801FD
N824PA => N802FD

Of the A310-300s, 5 went to Aeroflot:
N812PA => F-OGYP
N817PA => F-OGYQ
N836AB => F-OGYT
N842AB => F-OGYU
N843AB => F-OGYV

4 went to Air Jamaica:
N838AB => 6Y-JAB
N841AB => 6Y-JAE
N839AD => 6Y-JAC
N840AB => 6Y-JAD

2 ended up with Air Plus Comet, after first flying with Air Club International:
N815PA => C-GCIV => EC-GMU
N818PA => C-GCIT => EC-GOT

7 ended up with Khalifa Airways, and are now stored I believe (are these the ones going to PIA?) N811, 813, 816, 820, 821, 822PA and N837AB

1 is with Biman Bangladesh:
N835AB => S2-ADH

N814PA went to Tarom as YR-LCC, and crashed on 31st of March 1995.

N819PA went to Transaero as F-OGYR, appears to be stored now (anyone know if this one is still stored?)

source:
http://jetphotos.net/census/listing.php?model=A310
 
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Crosswind
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Tue Feb 10, 2004 1:06 am

The A310s were certainly used on services out of ATL - they were the scheduled equipment for Delta's daily ATL-MAN flights in 1991/1992. Later in 1992, L1011-500s took over the service.

Regards
CROSSWIND
 
hirisk
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Tue Feb 10, 2004 2:36 am

thanx for correcting me MD11.i wasen't even alive when DL had 741's. Laugh out loud guess you learn something new everyday! thnx for the pics Big thumbs up
happy contrails
 
DeltaMIA
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Tue Feb 10, 2004 4:00 am

DL A310's were used on what was considered low yield routes. They were configured with 3 different 3 class configurations and yes even flew on some domestic routes when not being used international. Because of the low-yield routes you will notice DL no longer flies to many of these destinations.
FRA-VIE-OTP-VIE-FRA
FRA-ATH-FRA
FRA-IST-FRA
FRA-SVO-FRA
JFK-FRA-WAW-FRA-JFK
JFK-HEL-JFK
JFK-LIS-NCE-LIS-JFK
JFK-CPH-TXL-CPH-JFK
JFK-NCE-JFK
CVG-ORY-CVG

JFK-PDX-JFK
I also remember the A310 doing an ATL-CLE-ATL run, but the aircraft itself primarily flew out of JFK and FRA.

As for the 747-100 (way before my time) it flew some high density routes for DL such as ATL-DAL-LAX, I know it did ATL-JAX-ATL and few others.
It was also used in conjunction with Pan Am on their IAD-LHR-IAD route, 3 or 4 days a week this flight would be operated on a DL aircraft by a DL crew, but sold as a PA flight number and flight.
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gigneil
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Tue Feb 10, 2004 4:06 am

Delta did place a separate order for A310-300s. The ones delivered new to DL were not part of an outstanding Pan Am order.

N
 
rutankrd
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Tue Feb 10, 2004 4:17 am

For those that said Delta have never served LHR this is not strictly true .
In fact in the seventies they had a joint service with Pan Am that actually saw one of their B747s' visit most days !
If memory is correct they operated an Atlanta service via Dullas with the domestic service having DL code and the trans-Atlantic leg a clipper number.The A310s acquired from Pan AM flew the shorter Atlantic services MAN-ATL for instance and were employed extensively from Frankfurt along with B727 aircraft on their inherited East European routes as well.

Back in seventies the ludicrous 2 airline Bermuda 2 rules weren't in place and their were actually daily US flights into heather by Pan AM/TWA/ National and the Delta joint flight and Seaboard World Cargo those were the days !
 
rutankrd
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Tue Feb 10, 2004 4:23 am


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Joint Pan-AM flight by Delta B747 at Heathrow
 
toltommy
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Tue Feb 10, 2004 4:40 am

Think about the widebody fleet during that time...

Boeing 767-200
Boeing 767-300
L1011
DC-10-10 (from Western merger)
MD-11
A310

--------------------------------------------------------
HlywdCatft -

The A310 and DC10 were NOT in the DL fleet at the same time. The DC10 was long retired before "PanAmMonium" struck Delta.

The original PanAm A310's were replaced by new A310's that is correct. DL then bought a number of L1011-500's that were retired by Air Canada. Between those TriStars, some 767-300ER's that were on order already, and the withdrawl of service from many of the former PA routes, the A310's were no longer needed.

I flew on both the PA equipment and the replacements. The old PA planes were worn out, smelled like cigarettes and urine at the back, and had no ovens for biz class. Just a service galley. All meals had to be run from the FC galley, thru the FC cabin. The new ones were much nicer, and were actually one of my favorite planes to work. I liked flying it more than the 767-300.
 
luv2fly
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Tue Feb 10, 2004 4:44 am

DL never served LHR from DTW! I knew about the shared flights with PA. I was pointing out that the route DL bought from PA, after PA sold the LHR routes to UA now was flown into LGW.
You can cut the irony with a knife
 
MTChemNerd757
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Tue Feb 10, 2004 4:54 am

ok, stupid question, but what is the 'bermuda 2' (and when) and why does it only allow 2 US carriers into LHR?
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DeltaMD11
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Tue Feb 10, 2004 5:31 am

Hirisk,
That's what we're here for--to learn  Smile
Too often we ... enjoy the comfort of opinion without the discomfort of thought. - John Fitzgerald Kennedy
 
panamair
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Tue Feb 10, 2004 6:27 am

In total, 7 A310-200s (N801PA - N807PA) and 14 A310-300s (N811PA - N824PA) went over to Delta from Pan Am in November 1991. No A300s (N201PA - 213PA, N216PA) ever went over to DL; they remained with the slimmed-down Pan Am with Latin American routes until the shutdown in Dec 1991.

DL used the A310s on many, many routes before getting rid of them entirely - mostly out of JFK on transcons as well as to FRA, BRU, AMS, FBU, CPH, TXL, HAM, HEL, ARN, CDG, NCE, LIS, MUC; and also on the intra-European flights from FRA to Eastern Europe and IST, as well as on the aforementioned DTW-LGW. Delta during this period also got 9 additional A310-300s directly from Airbus (N835AB - N843AB) but disposed of them by the mid-90s.

Interestingly, DL also got some ex-PA L1011-500s third hand. These were known as PUDs (PanamUnitedDelta) as they came from Pan Am through the United Pacific route sale. UA got rid of them a few years after the 1985 Pacific route purchase. I believe some of these in DL's fleet were N755DL, N756DR, N759DA, N760DH, N761DA.
 
AirGAbon
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Tue Feb 10, 2004 6:36 am

DL still flies a daily JFK-NCE-JFK with a B763. (in the past with an A313).

In the past, DL flew daily ATL-BRU-NCE-BRU-ATL with a L1011.
 
JohnJ
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RE: What Was The Demise Of Delta's A310s?

Tue Feb 10, 2004 6:50 am

I flew on a Delta A310 from LGW-ATL back in 1992 or so. The equipment was scheduled for an L1011, but it was switched out for the A310 at the last minute due to light loads. Good thing, as it was likely my only chance to ever fly on an A310. I've flown on plenty of L1011s, so it was no big deal missing that chance.

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