ArgInMIA
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Joined: Fri Nov 09, 2001 4:07 pm

Air Canada's YYZ-SCL-EZE

Wed Feb 18, 2004 1:05 pm

After 4 months of operations.. how is the YYZ-SCL-EZE doing for AC ? also why are they doing it YYZ to Chile and then to argentina when the Non stop market to buenos aires should be much bigger than SCL.. simple math.. Buenos aires has over 13 Millon people in it.. and Santiago just 5
Alto.. Mucho mas alto.. hasta la cumbre
 
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yyz717
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RE: Air Canada's YYZ-SCL-EZE

Wed Feb 18, 2004 1:44 pm

Canada has stronger economic ties to Chile than Argentina. Canada & Chile signed a free trade agreement (among the first in the Western hemisphere) several years ago. Cdn companies are also big investor in Chile esp with mining etc. Finally, the Chilean economy & Chilean PCI is strong....which explains why LANChile has a larger intl network than Aerolineas Argentinas.

I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
lima
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RE: Air Canada's YYZ-SCL-EZE

Wed Feb 18, 2004 5:35 pm

I think this flight can feed both markets safely. I doubt AC could support a flight only operating to Santiago, and the same only to Buenos Aires. Before the route to EZE was served via Sao Paulo.
 
AeroArgentina
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RE: Air Canada's YYZ-SCL-EZE

Thu Feb 19, 2004 2:54 am

I think the larger intl network of LAN is better explained by the fact that the airline has been growing for the past 10 years bc of good management. AR on the other hand has had horrible management and only in the past 2 years has it made a turnaround.

EZE is a bigger market than SCL (in general, maybe not from Canada) and the fact that usually flights from Europe stop in EZE first on their way to SCL (not the other way around) shows this.
 
MAH4546
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RE: Air Canada's YYZ-SCL-EZE

Thu Feb 19, 2004 3:00 am

EZE is a bigger market than SCL (in general, maybe not from Canada)and the fact that usually flights from Europe stop in EZE first on their way to SCL (not the other way around) shows this.

No it doesn't. All it shows is that Buenos Aires is closer to Europe than Santiago de Chile.

I am not doubting Buenos Aires is a larger market, however. The fact that a much larger amount of European carriers serve EZE instead of SCL is what shows it.
a.
 
TBCITDG
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RE: Air Canada's YYZ-SCL-EZE

Thu Feb 19, 2004 4:00 am

AeroArgentina
What does Lan or the mangement of AR have anything to do with the topic?
 
pzurita1
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RE: Air Canada's YYZ-SCL-EZE

Thu Feb 19, 2004 4:51 am

I love this... This is a Chile v Argentina fight!!!!!

PZ
Next flight: IAH-DBX-MRU-ANT
 
Lan_Fanatic
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RE: Air Canada's YYZ-SCL-EZE

Thu Feb 19, 2004 5:08 am

It's obvious that EZE is a larger market than SCL, Buenos Aires doubles Santiago's population.

I think the reason of making the stop in SCL before EZE is just merely geographical. SCL is closer to YYZ than EZE.
 
dutchjet
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RE: Air Canada's YYZ-SCL-EZE

Thu Feb 19, 2004 5:15 am

The populations of BA vs Santiago is not really the issue.....there is more business traffic between Santiago and Toronto due to the Free-Trade Agreement and due to the strong Chilean economy, thus the flight operates nonstop between these 2 markets. It is likely that much of the traffic that continues on to BA is lower yield, thus, BA is the second stop on the flight.

Many flights between Santiago and Europe (metioned above) stopover in Sao Paolo or Buenos Aires, this is simply a matter of geography and aircraft range, and a different issue that the AC flights being discussed.
 
FLYACYYZ
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RE: Air Canada's YYZ-SCL-EZE

Thu Feb 19, 2004 6:17 am

AC's flight 092/093 have enjoyed load factors in the mid 90's since it's introduction. There is also local carriage rights between SCL-EZE-SCL, at competitive fares with LA & AR. Cargo carriage has been virtually 100% every operation.

As pointed out, Canada-Chile trade ties are stronger given the free trade agreement, but as economic stability rebounds in Argentina, the demand has AC marketing looking at the entire operation. Of all regions in the world, Carribean/South America has seen the biggest gains, and there is repeated talk of increased frequency and/or splitting the flight into two separate operations. Also rumours of LIM/CCS & GIG in the future.

Wonder if S.A. carriers are thinking of revisiting Canada. Many have come and all have gone over the years....

Aerolineas Argentinas
Lan Chile ??
Ladeo
Varig
VASP
VIASA
Above and Beyond
 
lima
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RE: Air Canada's YYZ-SCL-EZE

Thu Feb 19, 2004 6:30 am

Air Canada predecerors served the same route.

CP Air used to fly Toronto-Lima-Santiago-Buenos Aires


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Later Canadian Airlines the same route. During a period it served some days nonstop to Buenos Aires continuing to Santiago and others the other way around.


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Photo © Sebastián Popovsky


 
EddieDude
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RE: Air Canada's YYZ-SCL-EZE

Thu Feb 19, 2004 2:51 pm

I agree with Lan_Fanatic and Dutchjet. I guess that the reason why the plane stops in SCL first is that it is closer to YYZ and that Canada has a stronger economic relationship with Chile than with Argentina.

BTW, did LA use to have a SCL-YUL flight in the past? If so, did it have a stop somewhere in between? Or was it Ladeco before it was acquired by LA?
Next flights: MEX-LAX AM 738, LAX-PVG DL 77L, SHA-PEK CA 789, PEK-PVG CA A332, PVG-ORD MU 77W, ORD-MEX AM 738
 
AeroArgentina
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RE: Air Canada's YYZ-SCL-EZE

Thu Feb 19, 2004 5:05 pm

TBCITDG
I was refuting Yyz717's claim that the larger international network of LA is because of its stronger economy and higher PCI. I said it is bc of the good management at LA that knows how to run a company compared to the Iberia management of AR during the 90's.
 
lanperu
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RE: Air Canada's YYZ-SCL-EZE

Thu Feb 19, 2004 5:23 pm

I also have to agree with Lan_Fanatic...the YYZ-SCL is pushing the 767 alittle, and if it's full of cargo and pax, then that plane has to land somewhere closer. I believe the flight is about 12hours? please correct me if I am wrong. I would have liked to see Air Canada going YYZ-LIM-SCL..but these days that might be wishful thinking.
 
TBCITDG
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RE: Air Canada's YYZ-SCL-EZE

Thu Feb 19, 2004 5:36 pm

MAH4546,
There is no doubt that there is a larger European carrier presence in EZE from airlines that serve Buenos Aires directly and then move onto SCL. Distance has nothing to do with it as the distance between EZE and SCL is not that great!! We are not talking of an additional 5 hour flight!
If there was a market demand for a carrier to fly directly to SCL I am sure European carriers would do it. One must look at the closer ties that Argentina has with Europe as opposed to Chile.

Pzurita:
This has nothing to do with ARG vs CHI . Not sure where you got this. Simply stating the obvious.

Aeroargentina:
Thanks for pointing that out.
 
ArgInMIA
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RE: Air Canada's YYZ-SCL-EZE

Fri Feb 20, 2004 2:14 am

I really don't think the PCI has ANYTHING to do with this..
According to Nations Master Website http://www.nationmaster.com/graph-T/eco_gro_nat_inc_cap the PCI for Argentina is $6,875.98 per person and Chile's is $4,556.4 per person
Alto.. Mucho mas alto.. hasta la cumbre
 
b752fanatic
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RE: Air Canada's YYZ-SCL-EZE

Fri Feb 20, 2004 2:56 am

I think that if some European Airlines decide to fly to SCL with a stop in EZE is not because of range, is because they dont do anything with the aircraft parked in EZE an entire day until its departure to Europe.

They send it to SCL and then back to EZE when they are ready to catch up for morning arrival in Europe.

It makes sense? right? The A340 could go farther than SCL from Europe, I even say it could go to Easter Island non stop from Europe.
"Truth is more of a stranger than fiction." Mark Twain