ORD777
Posts: 252
Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2003 10:09 pm

Why No Southwest At Denver

Thu Feb 19, 2004 1:23 pm

Hope this hasn't been discussed too many times before. Anyway, I was wondering why SWA hasn't begun service to Denver. I'm sure there must be some specific reasons because it seems like a natural choice for the airline. Any info is appreciated. Thanks!
 
OPNLguy
Posts: 11191
Joined: Tue Jun 15, 1999 11:29 am

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Thu Feb 19, 2004 1:28 pm

Costs. The landing fees and rental rates on space at DEN are extremely high, and higher than SWA wants to pay.
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
AirframeAS
Posts: 9811
Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2004 3:56 pm

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Thu Feb 19, 2004 1:52 pm

Not only landing fees and rental rates are ridiculous at DEN like OPNLguy stated, WN didnt see much benefit to DEN flying. UA and F9 already dominate DEN and flying there didnt make much of a difference to WN since they wanted to fly to smaller airports that were compatable to their 20 min turn time.
A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
 
Air1727
Posts: 318
Joined: Mon Aug 25, 2003 10:57 am

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Thu Feb 19, 2004 1:58 pm

Actually Southwest used to fly to Denver; however, with the fierce competition between United and Continental at the time at Stapleton, plus the delays, it was not worth the headache for their business model and pulled out.
In the Alaska bush I'd rather have a two hour bladder and three hours of gas than vice versa.
 
F9Widebody
Posts: 1475
Joined: Thu Sep 18, 2003 5:47 am

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Thu Feb 19, 2004 2:00 pm

Ord777, my friend, the real question is why haven't they come to COSBig grin

Regards,
F9W
YES URLS in signature!!!
 
planenutz
Posts: 1156
Joined: Fri Dec 31, 1999 5:50 am

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Thu Feb 19, 2004 2:18 pm

SWA did serve DEN at one point but withdrew because of the high cost of doing business a the airport and because of air traffic delays. The same reason that SWA left SFO.

SWA has only ever left four markets in it's history: DEN, SFO, DTW (re-entered later), and Beaumont, TX. Their reason for leaving DTW was the result of a rather nasty battle with NW. When SWA decided to enter the DTW marlek, the only available gates were already leased by NW. NW subleased gates to SWA at rates 18 times higher than NW's costs. NW refused to re-negotiate the leases and SW couldn't force the airport to terminate its leases with NW (NW has an agreement with DTW Airport that because of its heavy investment in the new airport, its the only carrier that can maintain dominate hub status). So SWA withdrew service and re-entered when NW's financial status resulted in it's giving up leases at DTW and therefore SWA could lease directly from the airport.

Not all who wander are lost....
 
Guest

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Thu Feb 19, 2004 2:26 pm

Planenutz,

Are you thinking of NK? WN served DET but left for DTW because of DET's inadequacies & the airport's/Detroit mayor's empty promises to fix them. They moved into the "A" gates at DTW where they've been ever since... NW haver had any control over the "A" gates nor did NW lease those gates to WN. However, NW did sublease random gates to NK... NK claimed they were being raped but never gave figures, so nobody really knows.
 
tcfc424
Posts: 444
Joined: Mon Nov 17, 2003 11:56 am

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Thu Feb 19, 2004 2:37 pm

From what I have read/heard, the blood between WN and DEN is long standing. They flew into Stapleton, and when DIA was proposed, there were supposed to be some frills for WN and lower fees, however when Denver changed that, Herb balked and vowed never to fly to DEN again.
 
Air1727
Posts: 318
Joined: Mon Aug 25, 2003 10:57 am

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Thu Feb 19, 2004 2:56 pm

Southwest pulled out of 6 airports in its lifetime.

Houston Intercontinental - left in 1972 to HOU; reinstated 1980
Beaumont/Port Arthur - left after 18 months of unprofitable ops
Denver - left for reasons states above
Jackson Hole - seasonal service Dec 85 to Apr 86 from HOU; sat only
San Francisco - left because of severe delay expenses
Detroit City - started service in 88; all ops consolidated to DTW by 93

A total of four cities were removed from the system.
In the Alaska bush I'd rather have a two hour bladder and three hours of gas than vice versa.
 
ual747den
Posts: 1472
Joined: Sat Dec 27, 2003 1:29 pm

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Thu Feb 19, 2004 2:57 pm

Planenutz
In your post you I believe you are trying to give the vibe that WN is better than DEN and that is why they left. I would like to make it very clear that WN would love to have service to DEN however DEN is not an airport that caters to the trash that is a Southwest passenger. DEN has I believe at this time the highest fees of any US airport and can do that because it is the best facility in the US. DEN is full of upper class shopping and restaurants and seems like a high class shopping center. Passengers flying WN usually care nothing about any of this and just want to get to where they are going and that is why DEN would not give WN any lower fees. (Because they did not want WN customers more than any other airline) And that is why WN doesn't fly here.
THAT BEING SAID, I do think that WN has a GREAT business plan and if I owned an airline I would want it to be WN! I will fly WN if I am going on a short hop and it is a lot less money than the others, but we all know that most of the trash that flies does their flying on Southwest (Just watch Airline)
/// UNITED AIRLINES
 
SR 103
Posts: 1618
Joined: Sun Oct 01, 2000 6:19 am

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Thu Feb 19, 2004 2:58 pm

Planenutz,

Southwest never withdrew from DTW. They withdrew from DET (Detroit City) and it had nothing to do with NW. I am currently writing a substantial paper on Southwest for an Aviation consultant and am pretty well versed on Southwest's history and failed cities. The four cities that WN has pulled out of are SFO/DEN/DET/BPT(Beaumont, TX).

The reason they pulled out of DET was also as IP stated above, due to runway extension issues. You can look up a brief history of Southwest at their corporate site if you don't beleive us. The link is http://www.ifly737.com

SR 103
 
flyabr
Posts: 746
Joined: Fri Sep 19, 2003 11:42 am

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Thu Feb 19, 2004 3:00 pm

what is keeping southwest out of MSP...other than NWA hates them...
 
Guest

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Thu Feb 19, 2004 3:09 pm

UAL747DEN,

Do you really believe that WN doesn’t serve DEN because people living & traveling to DEN are wealthy enough to have other choices?  Innocent Then please explain to me how F9 has been able to survive for a decade -- I'd love to hear your response. "Duh, well, nobody in DEN flies F9 -- all of F9's traffic in DEN is merely connecting. Because we're rich and perfer UA." Some will argue that WN offers a higher class of service than UA...
 
Guest

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Thu Feb 19, 2004 3:12 pm

what is keeping southwest out of MSP...other than NWA hates them...

How is NW keeping WN out of MSP? WN serves DTW but isn't overly successful - in fact, DTW is one of the few markets in which WN has shrank over the past several years... the Saturday service to LAS that begin in the fall got the ax pretty quickly...
 
ual747den
Posts: 1472
Joined: Sat Dec 27, 2003 1:29 pm

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Thu Feb 19, 2004 3:18 pm

IndustrialPate
F9 has a very high standard of service and the prices on F9 are much higher than WN. F9 and UA have very comparable levels of service in coach and there prices are about the same in most markets. Now you must be crazy if you think that WN has a "higher Class" of service than UA. WN Doesn't try to have better service than UA or any other airline for that matter. They sell cheap tickets and give the cheapest service possible and that is why they make money. They also enable a lot of people who would otherwise not fly to do so on Southwest due to there cheap tickets and that is why they get a lot of trash flying them. Now what I was saying is DEN will not give WN a break on the fees that they charge due to the fact that the airport doesn't need WN to fly here.
/// UNITED AIRLINES
 
Guest

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Thu Feb 19, 2004 3:19 pm

WN lives cheap and DEN costs too much to operate out of. Simple as that.
 
Guest

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Thu Feb 19, 2004 3:28 pm

UAL747DEN,
Any reasonable person should be able to read your post and laugh his/her ass off. According to you, the reason WN doesn't serve DEN is because everybody there is rich enough to fly better airlines & all WN would do is bring poor people to the city. Absolutely hilarious!

And BTW, only a fool would deny that DEN's high costs did not contribute to UA's woes -- hell, even UA admits that!
 
Guest

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Thu Feb 19, 2004 3:33 pm

UAL747.... Did you forget that the Denver area is loaded with washed up tree huggin' hippies? All wealthy... Riiiiiiighhht...
 
ssides
Posts: 3248
Joined: Fri Feb 09, 2001 12:57 am

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Thu Feb 19, 2004 3:34 pm

Let's not forget that Denver only has its airport because its former mayor became US Transportation Secretary and was able to save a grotesquely over-budget, behind-schedule airport that ended up costing the taxpayers billions more than they bargained for.
"Lose" is not spelled with two o's!!!!
 
alphascan
Posts: 795
Joined: Mon Nov 24, 2003 12:04 am

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Thu Feb 19, 2004 3:36 pm

F9's traffic distribution is:

33% originate at DEN
33% DEN is destination
33% connecting

-Jeff Potter, CEO Frontier Airlines, 1/29/04

Will get a little more complicated in April.

I will fly WN .....but we all know that most of the trash that flies does their flying on Southwest (Just watch Airline)

ROFL



"To he who only has a hammer in his toolbelt, every problem looks like a nail."
 
ual747den
Posts: 1472
Joined: Sat Dec 27, 2003 1:29 pm

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Thu Feb 19, 2004 3:37 pm

IndustrialPate
Please point out to me where I said anything about DEN's high costs and UA. I did not say that everyone in Denver is rich and WN would bring the poor. I said that DEN has high fees and that they weren't going to give WN a break so WN would not make any money operating flights to DEN. WN has said in many interviews that the price of a cab in Denver to get from the airport to the city would cost more than their ticket price and that their customers are not the type of customers willing to pay that. Now I did try to point out that DEN is a very expensive airport and that WN is an extremely cheap airline that caters to they type of person looking for a cheap flight. DEN Would not benefit from those type of passengers coming through the airport and again that is why they did not give WN any kind of special deal.
On a side note, almost every other US airline operates flights to DEN and non of them get any special deal on the fees, so it should be obvious why WN doesn't come to DIA when they did used to fly to Stapleton...
/// UNITED AIRLINES
 
ual747den
Posts: 1472
Joined: Sat Dec 27, 2003 1:29 pm

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Thu Feb 19, 2004 3:43 pm

BoeingGoingGone
Again where did I say that? And you are wrong the Denver area is one of the most economically rich cities in the country. Denver is the telecomm hub of the United States. If Denver is such a bad city why are there so many international flight here per day compared to other cities of Denver's magnitude???
/// UNITED AIRLINES
 
Guest

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Thu Feb 19, 2004 4:11 pm

UAL give it up. I lived in Denver for 7 years. Their financial stature is no where near other cities such as San Diego, Chicago, Madison, WI, Minneapolis. Yeah. Madison.
 
ual747den
Posts: 1472
Joined: Sat Dec 27, 2003 1:29 pm

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Thu Feb 19, 2004 4:23 pm

BoeingGoingGone
Im not surprised by your post, this is the same junk that you always post. The members here have just learned to not listen to anything that comes out of your mouth. I think you need to look at the actual statistic's before typing trying to trash Denver.....
/// UNITED AIRLINES
 
Guest

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Thu Feb 19, 2004 4:35 pm

Ummm... Yeah whatever. Breathe in a little more of that smog layer that's hanging around.

[Edited 2004-02-19 08:42:01]
 
MAH4546
Posts: 24522
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 1:44 pm

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Thu Feb 19, 2004 4:41 pm

DEN is full of upper class shopping and restaurants and seems like a high class shopping center.

You have got to be kidding yourself. Do realize that Denver's upper class shopping and resturaunts cannot even hold a candle to that in Los Angeles, San Francisco, or Miami, and Southwest serves all three metros. That is just a ridiculous statement. It has nothing to do with why Southwest does not serve Denver.
a.
 
ual747den
Posts: 1472
Joined: Sat Dec 27, 2003 1:29 pm

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Thu Feb 19, 2004 7:06 pm

MAH4546
For you information DEN charges higher fees than all of the places that you mentioned. The point was that WN wanted DEN to give them a special deal on the fees, they thought that they shouldn't have to pay as much as other carriers DEN didn't see a good reason why WN shouldn't have to pay as much as the other carriers so they wouldn't drop the prices and WN left. Now my point was that if WN was bringing something to the airport DEN might have given them a better deal. If DEN didn't already have 2 airlines using the airport as a hub they probably would have needed WN, but with every airline in the US serving DEN along with our 2 hubs WN wasn't going to bring any additional money to the airport and got shut out. Now to add on your comment please tell me what LAX, SFO, or MIA have that DEN does not? They are all old rundown airports and most would agree with me that DEN is a much nicer airport. Have you ever been to DEN???
/// UNITED AIRLINES
 
goingboeing
Posts: 4727
Joined: Sat Dec 04, 1999 1:58 am

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Thu Feb 19, 2004 11:36 pm

Denverites apparently must have TV. F9 has TV. Therefore, they are "higher quality" than Southwest, and there success in Denver is assured. But as for the "quality" of people who must have TV...have you actually watched TV lately? Heck...that bachelor may be wearing a tux, but he's about as sleazy as they come. Same for the bachelorettes.

UAL747DEN - you're right about the rundown airports...That's why the last tiime I needed to go to San Francisco, I flew into Denver instead. I would venture to suggest that should UAL need just a tad more cost reductions to emerge from Chapter 11, they might just tell Denver that they want the rents to come down (I guess that would qualify them as a "low rent" airline), or else they'll pull out of Denver. IF the largest tenent pulls up stakes, that purty little airport - Pena's palace - might start to find themselves needing all the money they can get....heck...they might even make Southwest an offer they can't refuse.
 
OPNLguy
Posts: 11191
Joined: Tue Jun 15, 1999 11:29 am

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Fri Feb 20, 2004 12:59 am

>>>SWA has only ever left four markets in it's history: DEN, SFO, DTW (re-entered later), and Beaumont, TX. Their reason for leaving DTW was the result of a rather nasty battle with NW.

To reiterate, that's not the way it was re: Detroit. We started ops at DET, and it was a very peformance-restricted airport with a short runway, The runway was also narrower than most (100 ft wide versus the normal 150 ft) so that imposed my more stringent crosswind limitations, and when those occurred, we diverted to DTW. Then we started service to DTW (the diversions, when they occurred, went more smoothly). After unmet promises re: DET's improvement/expansion, we yanked the plug on DET and consolidated everything at DTW. NWA had nothing to do with it.


As far as SWA having left DEN (Stapleton) back in the 1980s, it had to do with the ATC delays that frequently occurred because of the centerline separation of 35L and 35R in IMC conditions, and the effect of those delays on the rest of the SWA system. The loads from DEN to ABQ and PHX were usually pretty good, as I recall, and had we stayed in DEN and added more destinations, I think those loads would have been just as good, or better, since both UA and CO were pretty "high-cost" way back then.

Once Stapleton had been replaced with the much more expensive new airport, the costs of operating there were just too great compared to other airport costs in the SWA system. Theoretically, SWA might have -considered- operating at the new airport (before it was done), but once all the problems and delays at DIA caused the costs to increase even more (remember the baggage system?) there was just no way.
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
N766UA
Posts: 7843
Joined: Thu Jul 29, 1999 3:50 am

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Sat Feb 21, 2004 6:52 am

UAL747DEN: Are you serious? High fees are charged at DEN because of all the construction that's been going on, not just because they can charge them. Also, I dunno when you flew WN last but it's clear your vision is impaired. "Trash" does not fly WN, in fact about 70% of the last flight I was on was businessmen. You're crazy if you think Southwest flying from DEN would bring in a "lower class" of person. Heck, F9 is by no means a high class airline itself. And who the hell are you to say why Denver makes certain decisions? Were you in the meeting when they said "Let's not give Southwest a break, they only bring hobos to the airport."
This Website Censors Me
 
swacle
Posts: 360
Joined: Wed Oct 15, 2003 1:41 pm

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Sat Feb 21, 2004 7:30 am

UAL747DEN

DEN is not an airport that caters to the trash that is a Southwest passenger

If UA's product is sooo much better, then why is your company in Ch. 11 and losing a billion dollars a year? Its this simple: WN delivers a consistent product to its customers, has some of the best people in the world, and therefore has one of the most loyal customer bases in the industry. Our level of service is low--no one is going to deny that--but that doesn't make us a second class airline, and that most definitely does NOT mean we attract any more "trash", as you so nicely put it, than any other airline. Last I checked most of the majors match WN's lowest advanced purchase fares and therefore all airlines seem to be equal opportunity for the local trash. What makes WN a successful airline with the loyal customers it has is simple: consistent product, lower fares (don't check advanced purchase, check any fare from 14 days in...I guarantee WN WILL WIN!!), and a great staff.

Think about it, man, before you make an ass of your self again.
Aircraft Flown: SF3 DH8 DH4 328 ERJ CRJ CR7 CR9 E70 E75 D9S M80 712 72S 732 733 734 735 73G 738 739 739ER 752 318 319 32
 
gigneil
Posts: 14133
Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2002 10:25 am

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Sat Feb 21, 2004 7:34 am



UAL give it up. I lived in Denver for 7 years. Their financial stature is no where near other cities such as San Diego, Chicago, Madison, WI, Minneapolis. Yeah. Madison.


This is a false statement in its entirety. Chicago may offer a higher "financial stature" but Denver beats the others handily.

UAL747DEN - your comments are pointless. Keep them to yourself.

N
 
OPNLguy
Posts: 11191
Joined: Tue Jun 15, 1999 11:29 am

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Sat Feb 21, 2004 8:06 am

>>>Swacle

While I have respect for people's right to their own opinions (even when they diverge from mine) arguing with UAL747DEN about his statement is pretty pointless. I mean, that kind of opinion can't be substaniated or quantified, any more than one can say that Airline "A" has better swizzle sticks (or prettier F/As) than airline "B", i.e. it's all in the eye of the beholder a more a matter of personal perception than fact.

The original question posed in this thread was why SWA wasn't at DEN, and I think the point has been made more than once that it was becuse of the high costs associated with oft-delayed opening of the expensive new airport. Like an increasing number of threads on a.net of late, it seems, this one has strayed far from the original topic and also become a meaningless "tastes-great!" versus "less-filling!" lite beer argument.

Next topic....
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
yanksn4
Posts: 1367
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2003 10:05 am

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Sat Feb 21, 2004 8:15 am

As long as United Airlines and Frontier Airlines are alive, then Denver International Airport dosn't need Southwest Airlines. First, where can you now put Southwest Airline's gates? Concourse A and C are pretty filled up, and United Airlines would never allow Southwest to take any gates on Concourse B. If you are looking for a low-cost airline to fly on into or out of Denver, then you have Frontier Airlines, America West Airlines, Ted Airlines, and Spirit Airlines.
2013 Airports: EWR, JFK, LGA, LIS, AGP, DEN, GIG, RGN, BKK, LHR, FRA, LAX, SYD, PER, MEL, MCO, MIA, PEK, IAH
 
jmy007
Posts: 540
Joined: Thu Feb 19, 2004 2:18 am

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Sat Feb 21, 2004 8:30 am

Working with selling flights, day in and day out, DIA, with all the high taxs, landing fees, etc, is not expensive to fly into by any stretch of the imgianation.
Esp. with all the airlines. 2 hub airlines (F9 and UA) and other carriers. Depending on where you are flying from, and what time of the week, prices into Denver are great.

I don't care if Southwest comes back, there is already great air service for Denver at great prices already, and IMHO better product, than WN
Cookies are the Gateway pastry. They lead to Éclairs and Bear Claws.
 
luv2fly
Posts: 11056
Joined: Tue May 13, 2003 2:57 am

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Sat Feb 21, 2004 8:37 am

Also WN started service to DTW before the short lived service to DET was started and stopped.
You can cut the irony with a knife
 
ltbewr
Posts: 12362
Joined: Thu Jan 29, 2004 1:24 pm

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Sat Feb 21, 2004 8:38 am

Another reason WN may not do DIA is that it is TOOOOOO far from the Denver market areas where most people live. Add the time it takes to get to DIA, along with the 1-2 hours you apparently must get to check in on a NW flight to get a good seat, along with very high fees, then no wonder NW won't serve DIA.
But why don't WN serve COS? Pacific Western did a pretty good voulme of business, with those colorful planes until majors hurt them. Does COS have wind shear problems like Stapleton had? Are there runway set up issues like Detroit city airport had? Ops costs/fees high at COS?
 
yanksn4
Posts: 1367
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2003 10:05 am

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Sat Feb 21, 2004 8:47 am

LTBEWR, do you mean Southwest Airlines instead of Northwest Airlines? If you mean Northwest, then check your facts. Northwest Airlines does serve Denver International Airport, and I don't think they are planning to move out.
2013 Airports: EWR, JFK, LGA, LIS, AGP, DEN, GIG, RGN, BKK, LHR, FRA, LAX, SYD, PER, MEL, MCO, MIA, PEK, IAH
 
ssides
Posts: 3248
Joined: Fri Feb 09, 2001 12:57 am

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Sat Feb 21, 2004 8:49 am

Distance doesn't seem to be that big of an issue for WN in many cases. For example, they don't mind serving MHT and PVD, but avoid BOS. They serve BWI, but not DCA. They serve PBI and FLL, but not MIA. They serve SJC and OAK, but not SFO. They serve ISP, but not JFK, LGA, or EWR.

Of course, you could also point to other examples of closer-in airports, such as MDW, DAL, or HOU, but I think the evidence shows that distance from the city center is not that much of a consideration for WN.
"Lose" is not spelled with two o's!!!!
 
gigneil
Posts: 14133
Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2002 10:25 am

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Sat Feb 21, 2004 9:16 am

But why don't WN serve COS? Pacific Western did a pretty good voulme of business, with those colorful planes until majors hurt them.

Lets be clear. Nobody hurt WP but WP management. They were doing great until the new idiot moved them to Denver.

Does COS have wind shear problems like Stapleton had?

There is obviously some shear, but its not nearly as bad as the mountain towns, and not as "problematic" as Stapletons were.

Are there runway set up issues like Detroit city airport had?

Colorado Springs has three beautiful runways, including a "brand new" (1995) 13,500 ft runway that could easily accomodate an A380, and older but still well maintained 11,000 ft runway, and the oldest is a bit over 8,000 ft.

The two long runways are aligned N/S in the best direction for wind along the Front Range.

Ops costs/fees high at COS?

Colorado Springs' commercial terminal is exactly the same age as DEN, with a newer East concourse that was built for MAX but never used. I'd imagine its pricey, but COS was completed well under budget.

N
 
jmy007
Posts: 540
Joined: Thu Feb 19, 2004 2:18 am

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Sat Feb 21, 2004 9:16 am

LTBEWR said

"Another reason WN may not do DIA is that it is TOOOOOO far from the Denver market areas where most people live. Add the time it takes to get to DIA, along with the 1-2 hours you apparently must get to check in on a NW flight to get a good seat, along with very high fees, then no wonder NW won't serve DIA."

A matter of perspective. From CBD of Denver, it about a 25 mintue drive via I-70 and pena blvd.
As far Away as Boulder it takes 45 mintues vis NW parkway/e470.
It not that far from the vast majority of folks who live along the front range.
Even if one lives in Highland ranch, they can hop on E470 and be at the airport in 40 mintues.
I don't by the argument that it is too far out. Yes, by most standards, it is far away, but not to far. Check in is quick, security doesn't take long at all.
One can park at long term parking, check in be through security just over half hour, (of course depending on time of day!  Smile

DIA is a great airport, we really don't need WN.  Big grin
Cookies are the Gateway pastry. They lead to Éclairs and Bear Claws.
 
OPNLguy
Posts: 11191
Joined: Tue Jun 15, 1999 11:29 am

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Sat Feb 21, 2004 9:42 am

>>>Also WN started service to DTW before the short lived service to DET was started and stopped.

Nope.

See messages #5, #6 #8 #10 and #28 in this thread...
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
ScottB
Posts: 5414
Joined: Fri Jul 28, 2000 1:25 am

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Sat Feb 21, 2004 9:50 am

I'm not sure I'd call fares to and from DEN "great," though they are not as high as they would be if UA were the only hub carrier at DEN. F9's average fares from DEN tend to be somewhere between comparable and 50% higher than WN's average fares for similar non-stop stage lengths.

With nearly the highest airport operating costs in the industry (that make PIT look like a bargain), as well as two airline hubs, it's unlikely that WN will enter DEN anytime soon. There are simply too many other opportunities for them which will make more money.
 
SafetyDude
Posts: 3654
Joined: Fri Sep 07, 2001 10:02 am

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Sat Feb 21, 2004 9:52 am

The simple word Frontier cannot get out of my mind  Big grin

-Will
"She Flew For What We Stand For"
 
freshlove1
Posts: 1245
Joined: Thu Jan 15, 2004 1:38 pm

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Sat Feb 21, 2004 1:14 pm

High costs and delays in DEN??, but yet they go into PHL. Do they know that PHL is notorious for ATC/WX delays 2/3 of the year??? They may second guess themselves once the ontime preformance numbers begin to drop and the cancellations begin to rise. I'm sure they will start out alright but in the long run I believe the service will be just average.
 
JumboBumbo
Posts: 168
Joined: Fri Aug 22, 2003 1:17 pm

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Sat Feb 21, 2004 1:29 pm

BoingGoingGone:
UAL747.... Did you forget that the Denver area is loaded with washed up tree huggin' hippies? All wealthy... Riiiiiiighhht...

What childish garbage... after about 1990 Denver was full of nothing but Yuppies with cell phones, SUVs, and cookie cutter houses in the suburbs from California and Texas. Boulder is now nothing but Trustafarian rich kids going to CU-is-college-enough-to-keep-daddy's-money-coming, and Aspen is full of 7 million dollar homes owned by Texan "business men" who should be in jail for knowingly ruining decent people's chances at a comfortable retirement.

UAL747DEN... being a native of Colorado I can say that Denver is NOT the "high class shopping" mecca you believe it to be. Yes, it has a few "lifestyles" malls with a couple big name anchor stores, but North Cherry Creek is no Rodeo Drive.
 
F9Widebody
Posts: 1475
Joined: Thu Sep 18, 2003 5:47 am

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Sat Feb 21, 2004 2:07 pm

UAL747DEN... being a native of Colorado I can say that Denver is NOT the "high class shopping" mecca you believe it to be. Yes, it has a few "lifestyles" malls with a couple big name anchor stores, but North Cherry Creek is no Rodeo Drive.

Are we sure he wasn't talking aobut the airport?

Regards,
F9W
YES URLS in signature!!!
 
ual747den
Posts: 1472
Joined: Sat Dec 27, 2003 1:29 pm

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Sat Feb 21, 2004 3:13 pm

JumboBumbo
I was talking about the airport. I would never conceder the city of DENVER to be any sort of shopping meca!

FreshLove1
Your right DEN is not known for delays anymore. We just completed the largest runway in the world so planes can land in most of the weather that we get here.

Swacle
That is a funny little comment! The reason UAL is in Cahp.11 is because they offered to much service! They gave the customer more than they could afford to be doing for them. Now if you think that WN and UA are the same type of airline you need to do some more research. I never said that WN was a bad airline I just said that it is the bare bones of an airline and you pay little and you get little. The airline gets you from point A to point B and if that is what you want then fly WN, if you want service then fly someone else. I would love to see WN start service in COS I think it would be great they could afford to operate there and COS would fill the planes, they are just not good for DEN and DEN isn't good for them... GROW UP
/// UNITED AIRLINES
 
I LOVE EWR
Posts: 803
Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2002 6:07 am

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Mon Feb 23, 2004 5:48 am

This is VERY funny!!



 
cmckeithen
Posts: 594
Joined: Sun Jul 20, 2003 9:31 am

RE: Why No Southwest At Denver

Mon Feb 23, 2004 5:56 am

F9 is there. A LCC.

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