blackbird615
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Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 1:38 am

Starting with the 737/DC9 era who builds the best planes based on longevity, structural integrity, efficiency, flyability and longevity etc. For example, a personal belief is Lockheed's L1011 was a great airplane both from a technical standpoint and a passenger friendly aircraft yet failed to survive. I personally enjoy flying Airbus products but have some question on longevity and engineering. This is not intended to be A vs. B but a request for input on all jet products from various manufacturers including Russian AN24's and specifics on why readers would personally purchase one manufacturer over another without regard to politics or cost. Simply put, who builds the very best commercial product and why?

Apologies in advance if this is a previous subject I may have missed, your reponses and opinions will be appreciated.

Blackbird615
Never fly the "A" model of anything!
 
GoAibusGo
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 1:45 am

The Douglas DC-3

It seems that every older airline in the (free) world had them or started operation with them. And they still fly around in operation these days.




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PA110
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 1:45 am

There is no doubt it must be Boeing. Look at all the 707 / 727 / 737 old series still in service after 40+ years!!!


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LAN767Andres
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 1:46 am

No doubt Boeing!

Just look at the 707..its still in service...
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Starlionblue
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 1:52 am

This topic is soooo subjective. for example, how can an Airbus even be in service more than 35 years?
"There are no stupid questions, but there are a lot of inquisitive idiots." - John Ringo
 
sovietjet
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 1:56 am

DC-3 also used in Russia under designation Li-2. Boeing is probably the best currently but Airbus is catching up and Douglas's DC-8 is also in service just like 707. Dont forget all those NWA DC-9s, MD-80s, and all the DC-10s and if it wasnt for Boeing, Douglas(Mcdonnel Douglas) more of their planes would be flying. But I also think Tupolev have done alot when it comes to civil aviation although many people don't recognize what the Russian manufacturers have done. Still a lot of tu-134s and -154s out there also the -144 SST, but I dont think any Tu-104, Tu-124 are still flying.
 
blackbird615
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 2:59 am

To clarify the question is who builds the best commercial aircraft today and why? Certainly the question is subjective but from a purchasing standpoint regardless of politics or nationality my goal was to identify a product that excels above the competition and most importantly support your reasoning with fact. Thanks.
Never fly the "A" model of anything!
 
Areopagus
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 3:25 am

I once saw Flight International claim that the VC-10 turned out after all to be no more expensive to operate than the 707 in the long run, because it was better corrosion-proofed.
 
jmc1975
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 10:25 am

The A318/319/320/321 is superior to the B736/73G/738/739

The B752/753 is in a class of its own, therefore it is superior.

The B762/763 is superior to the A300/310

The A330 is superior to the B763/764

The B772 is superior to the A340

The B744 is in a class of its own, therefore it is superior.

The A380 will be in a class of its own, therefore it will be superior.

The B7E7 will be in a class of it's own, therefore it will be superior.
.......
 
CRFLY
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 10:28 am

Boeing, Boeing, Boeing...
With Age comes Wisdom...
 
FLYtoEGCC
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 10:30 am

Jmc1975
Why do you think that about the A320/737 and the A330/767?

No offence, but if you don't give reasons, the Airbus and Boeing die-hards in here are going to have a field day and it'll turn into another A v B rant.
Come fly with me, let's fly, let's fly away...
 
aviaar
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 12:28 pm

Define "BEST".

Every individual has their loyalties and reservations about their favorite company. Most Americans will say Boeing, Europeans Airbus. Determining which company is the best depends on how many people post.

I'm American, I'll say Boeing, not knowing/considering any specific technical differences between Boeing and other companies. It's all loyalty.
I'd rather be flying (real original)
 
ozzie
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 12:43 pm

Boeing Aircraft Company Seattle, WA

A Proud Stockholder
 
Spike
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 12:53 pm

Ozzie: I thought Boeing were from Chicago now...?
 
AIR757200
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 1:03 pm


How about.. they both build good airplanes?
 
cancidas
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 1:12 pm

this sounds like flamebait....
"...cannot the kingdom of salvation take me home."
 
LVZXV
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 1:16 pm

Let me be even-handed: Airbus builds comfortable (esp. the A320 family, A340), while the US builds durable (all Boeings, DC-9 family, DC-10, TriStar), and the UK built solid (BAC 1-11, VC-10, BAe 146 family). Regional aircraft are a separate category, but I am impressed by the longevity of the Fokker classics; the F27 and F28, many of the former of which are flying well past their 40th birthdays, and both of which are pretty roomy. I'm not quite convinced by the build-quality of Bombardiers, ATRs and EMBRAERS, however, in addition to looking fairly cramped.
How do you say "12 months" in Estonian?
 
CWUPilot
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 1:17 pm

Yakolev. No, wait, Tupolev!
Ok, just kidding, Boeing all the way. Yes I'll make a few people angry by saying this but I cannot tell a lie. There's a feeling of safety and security you get when boarding a boeing that I never feel when I climb aboard a bus. Just my opinion.

-CWUPilot
"The worst day of flying still beats the best day of real work."
 
rockyracoon
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 1:20 pm





DOUGLAS
 
skymileman
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 1:24 pm

Just to be honary, I think I'll say Martin did. I do have some reasons, though. Martin built the 202's and the 404's that did wonders for Northwest, and I like Northwest. Really, I think they're all comparable quality.
 
SHUPirate1
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 1:28 pm

Has any of us died in a Boeing or Airbus crash...thought so...I prefer to ride in an A32x over a 737-Classic, but can we really say that one is better than the other?
Burma's constitutional referendum options: A. Yes, B. Go to Insein Prison!
 
BA747400
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 1:39 pm

Airbus has its ups and downs; as does Boeing....But there's just something about Boeing that is just.......Better. They have a longer history, better reliability (IMHO), that and they have the 747...Nough' said!

Both these companies make good products and offer their own unique style; so I don't think any answer is wrong to be honest.

Regards,
Mike
 
skymileman
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 1:41 pm

BA747400,
I would have to agree with you about that there's just something about Boeings. I think it is the history.
-Lane
 
regupilot
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 1:43 pm

Just to comment on Pirate's post.. I know lots of people that would rather fly on and old model plane, with a history of safety, than ina newer model, because they are not sure of how safe it will be. Funny, ain't?

To my thinkings, both Airbus and Boeing! They both deliver what the customer expects! And, what if we had an all Boeing or an All Airbus world? Woudn't that be boring?

Cheers!

Ragu
 
747400sp
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 2:02 pm

It's either Boeing or Lockheed
 
QIguy24
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 2:12 pm

I go for Boeing as well. Even though I really like the A343 my favorite will still be Boeing 744
 
vikkyvik
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 2:13 pm

I will say Douglas because for a company that doesn't even exist anymore, there's certainly a lot of their plane's floating (or flying) around. Also, there's no point in comparing Boeing and Airbus; it's pointless to do so.
~Vik
I'm watching Jeopardy. The category is worst Madonna songs. "This one from 1987 is terrible".
 
CanadianNorth
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 2:25 pm

well keeping with my list i would say the following for the diff categories, for various reasons.

Twin Otter... Known for is superb STOL performance and is very rugged/durable. Hell of a bush plane.
Dash 8... Its reliable, efficient, quick, and gets the job done.
Fokker F28... Its a gas guzzler, but its built solid and it does a job good.
Boeing 737... Its durable, rugged, reliable, and is possibly one of the worlds greatest Jetliners.
Boeing 767... Its durable, reliable, and does well for many airlines on many routes. Right a/c for the job.
Boeing 777... Modern, Efficient, Comfortable, Reliable. A all-round good aircraft with a great future.



CanadianNorth
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Cessna172RG
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 2:29 pm

The A300 has been in production since when...the 70's, and they're still being built? Can Boeing do that?!?!

Oh, and there is NOTHING that beats a good old DC-8.

And I would say that the L-1011 is superb, but if it wasn't for that issue with Rolls Royce when they first were being made, I think they may have had a chance to outsell the DC-10. But, that's just my semi-biased opinion.

I'm not usually either pro this or pro that in terms of airplanes, as I think that each manufacturer can make a plane to be considered their forte. Look at the A320 family...what are the numbers, over 2000 sold so far? Then again, look at the 737 and 727...

Maybe you should slim this topic down and say "who builds the best 100-180 seat plane" or something...
Save the whales...for dinner!!!
 
Areopagus
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 3:54 pm

The A300 has been in production since when...the 70's, and they're still being built? Can Boeing do that?!?!

No, sorry, Boeing has never built an A300.

However, the 747 has been in continuous production since the 60's.

 
QantasA332
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 4:08 pm

Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes?

...and who would like to get flamed?! What a thread... Insane

QantasA332
 
AirframeAS
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 4:12 pm

I thought Boeing were from Chicago now...?

Boeing was NEVER from Chicago. They are originally from BFI. They just moved their WHQ to that location because it they felt that it made geographically sense to relocate there for their customers dont have to travel to Seattle all the time. (Which I thought was pointless, what was the difference anyway?) Boeing builds a majority of its products in Everett, WA or Renton, WA with delivery centers in PAE and BFI.
A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
 
FlySSC
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 9:47 pm

When posting a Topic like this one, how can you write :

This is not to be intended A vs B. ...  Insane ...

It's like posting " Which country was the leader in the 70's in the Space conquest"

and saying : this is not to be intended Soviet Union vs U.S.A....
 
blackbird615
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Thu Mar 04, 2004 11:37 pm

FLYSCC, the topic was intended to discuss members thoughts on quality and engineering, why fliers prefer specific planes and who in the readers opinion builds the best quality airplane. Understanding every reader has favorites my goal was to illicit specific reasons why some readers for example might believe Douglas built a better quality plane than Boeing, the DC9 being a great example of dependability and longevity. From a crew members perspective which planes qualify as having the best characteristics for flight crew, F/A's etc. Personaly my opinion was Douglas built the best engineered planes designed to last without a 'expiration date.' My attempt was to avoid brand favoritism vs and honest discussion regarding a manufacturers quality and why readers find particular planes and companies better than others.

No magic here, simply a forum to discuss planes and personal thoughts on quality of airplanes.

Blackbird615
Never fly the "A" model of anything!
 
Tolosy
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Fri Mar 05, 2004 12:43 am

Yakolev. No, wait, Tupolev!
Ok, just kidding, Boeing all the way. Yes I'll make a few people angry by saying this but I cannot tell a lie. There's a feeling of safety and security you get when boarding a boeing that I never feel when I climb aboard a bus. Just my opinion.

-CWUPilot


CWU,

According to me, Airbus and Boeing are the same. THE SAME

I like Airbus and Boeing (and I am French  Wink/being sarcastic ).

Please explain why you feel safer in a Boeing and not in an Airbus.

I don't see any reasons to feel safer in a Boeing. A & B are the strongest A/C for me.

I appreciate these two competitors because the bring competition and innovation. they both are very safe.


Also explain to me what is the difference between security and safety.  Smile/happy/getting dizzy


No offence, I am just wondering.

Cheers,

nick
 
BMAbound
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Fri Mar 05, 2004 12:54 am

To you guys that simply writes "Boeing or Airbus is best" or similar, please focus on different threads. Your input is quite useless since a technical motivation is not provided.

Blackbird615 didn't ask for your personal views, he asked for stats, figures and numbers...

johan
Altitude is Insurance - Get Insured
 
aircadet
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Fri Mar 05, 2004 12:58 am

No one , there all tubes filled with kerosene, bloody uncomfortable, no fresh air crap food, and generally no one can wait to get off them.
But as long as we get from a 2 b then it can be Boeing airbus Douglas Lockheed tupolev yakolev embrear BEA and cant think of anyone else.

sorry to pee on anyone's fire
tlaqna hi
 
bmacleod
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Fri Mar 05, 2004 3:30 am

BOEING BOEING BOEING
BOEING BOEING BOEING
BOEING BOEING BOEING
BOEING BOEING BOEING
BOEING BOEING BOEING
BOEING BOEING BOEING
BOEING BOEING BOEING
BOEING BOEING BOEING


[Edited 2004-03-04 19:32:19]
The engine is the heart of an airplane, but the pilot is its soul.
 
ual747den
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Fri Mar 05, 2004 3:50 am

AirframeAS writes:
Boeing was NEVER from Chicago. They are originally from BFI. They just moved their WHQ to that location because it they felt that it made geographically sense to relocate there for their customers dont have to travel to Seattle all the time. (Which I thought was pointless, what was the difference anyway?) Boeing builds a majority of its products in Everett, WA or Renton, WA with delivery centers in PAE and BFI.

Yes Boeing's Corp. Office is based in Chicago, therefore Boeing is a Chicago based company weather you like it or not! Boeing was sick of the crap that the city of Seattle was doing so they left them and they are now paying Chicago the taxes from sales.
/// UNITED AIRLINES
 
blackbird615
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Fri Mar 05, 2004 4:54 am

Thanks BMABound. Questions wasn't designed to be competitive - simply thoughts, facts and figures on what manufacturer provides the best commercial craft from crew and passengers standpoints. Does one firm provide a better design, build a stronger wing, have a better overall safety factor or a reputation within a.net community as providing a product meeting minimum spec vs building a plane with extra safety and convenience.

Thanks all,
Blackbird 615
Never fly the "A" model of anything!
 
QantasA332
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Fri Mar 05, 2004 5:02 am

To you guys that simply writes "Boeing or Airbus is best" or similar, please focus on different threads. Your input is quite useless since a technical motivation is not provided.

But, as we've seen already, the airliners.net gang are quite unable to keep their biases out of the way. It just doesn't work...

Questions wasn't designed to be competitive - simply thoughts, facts and figures on what manufacturer provides the best commercial craft from crew and passengers standpoints. Does one firm provide a better design, build a stronger wing, have a better overall safety factor or a reputation within a.net community as providing a product meeting minimum spec vs building a plane with extra safety and convenience.

My reply is as per above.........Also, it doesn't work to generalize on things like this, as it seems almost all of you are doing. Okay, maybe the 707 was a very sturdy craft, but is Boeing therefore the manufacturer of the best aircraft? No! Any other aircraft in their fleet could be horrible. Same goes for Airbus.

Cheers,
QantasA332
 
toBEYwithMEA
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Fri Mar 05, 2004 5:09 am

You can't answer this question. Both make great aircraft.
I have to side with QantasA332, as always he makes a good point
MEA FLYING HIGH AND RETURING TO IT FORMER GLORY!
 
blackbird615
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Fri Mar 05, 2004 5:20 am

QuantasA332, as a way of explanation I live in Peachtree City GA an enclave of Delta crews and ATC personnel. Frequently around the pool various Delta crews express preference for a particular manufacturer or plane. F/A's seem to like the 737-800 and pilots while many differ many will and have stated Douglas built a better overall product designed for long term use and built to a higher standard than other manufacturers. The exception being the MD11 which many did not enjoy. Within my circle of friends the all time favorite appears to have been 727Advanced. In the end it is and continues to be a subject of interest to me - I appreciate your input.
Never fly the "A" model of anything!
 
aloges
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Fri Mar 05, 2004 5:20 am

The best aircraft is always the one that fits an airline's demands best, and the manufacturer is not the most important thing about an aircraft.
Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
 
FlySSC
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RE: Who Builds The Best Commercial Planes

Fri Mar 05, 2004 7:08 pm

Blackbird615,

Thanks to clarify your intentions when posting this Topic... but check all the posts above...and you should admit I was right in mine...  Sad