FATFlyer
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Allegiant Cancels Plans For BTR-LAS

Sat Apr 03, 2004 11:46 am

Allegiant just announced that they have decided to cancel the planned BTR-LAS service due to light bookings. The service was just announced 3 weeks ago and was not planned to start until May.

Bad news for BTR, but it may mean another city will be announced soon instead.
http://home.businesswire.com/portal/site/google/index.jsp?ndmViewId=news_view&newsId=20040402005513&newsLang=en
"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." - Mark Twain
 
scottysair
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RE: Allegiant Cancels Plans For BTR-LAS

Sat Apr 03, 2004 11:48 am

Oh man!! Thish is why Allegiant Air did make cancels plans with those flight to BTR.
 
BA
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RE: Allegiant Cancels Plans For BTR-LAS

Sat Apr 03, 2004 12:14 pm

When did Allegiant discontinue DEN?

Regards
"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
 
FATFlyer
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RE: Allegiant Cancels Plans For BTR-LAS

Sat Apr 03, 2004 12:25 pm

They ended the DEN-LAS service Jan. 6. They have continued operating charters at DEN for Apple Vacations. That is now the basis of their application to offer DEN-CUN scheduled (instead of charter) service
"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." - Mark Twain
 
BA
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RE: Allegiant Cancels Plans For BTR-LAS

Sat Apr 03, 2004 12:28 pm

Thanks for the info. Were they unsuccessful in DEN because of competition from Frontier and United?

Yup, I heard about the scheduled DEN-CUN service.

Since this will be a scheduled service, will this mean they will also launch LAS-DEN to get the aircraft to DEN to fly to CUN? Or will they be stationing an aircraft in DEN?

Good luck to them.

Regards
"Generosity is giving more than you can, and pride is taking less than you need." - Khalil Gibran
 
FATFlyer
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RE: Allegiant Cancels Plans For BTR-LAS

Sat Apr 03, 2004 12:53 pm

I believe it was the competition on the route that ended the DEN-LAS service.

IIRC G4 has been stationing an aircraft and crews in DEN to service the Apple Vacations contract. DEN-LAS was started to take advantage of having the plane there. So not much would change if they convert from charters to scheduled.
"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." - Mark Twain
 
NIKV69
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RE: Allegiant Cancels Plans For BTR-LAS

Sat Apr 03, 2004 12:57 pm

Wow that's funny. A little surprising though I think if Allegiant is to start becoming more of a player in the commercial airline market they need to upgrade their fleet a bit. I mean in this day and age of jumping on NG 737s and the like flying an old MD-87 is not so appealing except for charters, and with Embraer beginning to gain momentum you got to get with the times. One day soon I want to be at IFP and see a beautiful 737-800 with Allegiant's livery right next to Sun Country's! Or maybe even a 190!  Smile/happy/getting dizzy
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USAFHummer
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RE: Allegiant Cancels Plans For BTR-LAS

Sat Apr 03, 2004 1:03 pm

Instead of flying from DEN, Allegiant now sorta serves the Denver area from LAS by flying to KFNL, Fort Collins/Loveland Regional Airport, which is about 55 miles or so from central Denver...it is the airport's only scheduled service, operated at 5x weekly at present...

Greg
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FATFlyer
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RE: Allegiant Cancels Plans For BTR-LAS

Sun Apr 04, 2004 2:06 am

Here is the media coverage from BTR today.

http://www.2theadvocate.com/stories/040304/new_airport001.shtml
"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." - Mark Twain
 
ual777contrail
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RE: Allegiant Cancels Plans For BTR-LAS

Sun Apr 04, 2004 4:10 am

usafhummer,
I would hardly call KFNL serving DEN. They also serve COS 2X's, 5 days a week.
airport to airport is 72 miles, this is kinda serving DEN? naw


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ConcordeBoy
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RE: Allegiant Cancels Plans For BTR-LAS

Sun Apr 04, 2004 4:30 am

For one thing, they didnt advertise it worth a damn. Absolutely no one in BTR that I've spoken to knew about it.


Rather doubt they'll switch the flights to MSY... too much competition from WN (nonstop) and CO/HP/DL/AA (well-timed 1stops)

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7e72004
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RE: Allegiant Cancels Plans For BTR-LAS

Sun Apr 04, 2004 4:32 am

seems like Allegiant is always cancelling service/plans. Just give it up! THey are just wasting time and putting off the inevitable!
The next generation of aircraft is just around the corner!
 
NIKV69
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RE: Allegiant Cancels Plans For BTR-LAS

Sun Apr 04, 2004 9:34 am

Your right, it's hard to compete with WN when you are small and only fly old MD-87s. Plus you don't advertise and WN is all over the media. Like I said they need some money, some new planes and most of all GORDON BETHUNE!! Now you have a chance! See you at IFP!!
Hey that guy with the private jet can bail us out! Why? HE CAN AFFORD IT!
 
SegmentKing
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RE: Allegiant Cancels Plans For BTR-LAS

Sun Apr 04, 2004 11:11 am

I don't think the "new" allegiant has pulled out of any markets like they have this one. I believe most had advance notice.

-n
~ ~ ~ ~ pRoFeSsIoNaL hUrRiCaNe DoDgEr ~ ~ ~ ~
 
MSYtristar
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RE: Allegiant Cancels Plans For BTR-LAS

Sun Apr 04, 2004 11:20 am

NIKV69,

Allegiant has MD-87's and MD-80's. They are not ancient aircraft by any means. Especially the M87's, you're talking late 80's technology. Sure the 80's are in mid life as far as airliners are concerned but it's not like Allegiant is flying around a bunch of ex-USAir 737-200's. M80's are still pretty relaible aircraft when all is said and done. They most likely serve Allegiant well.

As for their planned BTR service, they never really gave it any chance to succeed. An airline can't really judge the success/failure of a route by the bookings just a couple of weeks (or less) after the service is announced. The company has to build up some name recognition in the market and do some advertising. Loads tend to be light on new flights for the first few weeks. I guess Allegiant just doesn't have the resources to wait and see. Unfortunate, but this isn't exactly a big time carrier here.


Steve/MSY

 
NIKV69
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RE: Allegiant Cancels Plans For BTR-LAS

Sun Apr 04, 2004 11:39 am

Steve,

In this market you need exposure and you need word of mouth, not to mention some NG 737s. Not everyone is aviation enthusiasts like us and most people have never even heard of Allegiant, but WN is a whole other story. I am not a huge fan of WN but they are what they are, being a winter resident of Laughlin going on my 4th year I know about Allegiant and like them, BUT their fleet is not conducive of a popular commercial airline, it's more that of a small charter airline with some commercial service. Which may suit them fine, but IFP is booming and with the rise of the LCC in the airline industry, if Allegiant wants to ever get bigger they must get some newer planes. MD-87s are fine, and a good plane but WN is winning the war with 737s and Jetblue is giving chase with new Airbus. It's the nature of the business and maybe why these new routes are not happening for them.
Hey that guy with the private jet can bail us out! Why? HE CAN AFFORD IT!
 
Coronado990
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RE: Allegiant Cancels Plans For BTR-LAS

Mon Apr 05, 2004 5:23 am

Now that TransMeridian will discontinue OKC-LAS, I would think Allegiant would want to utilize the aircraft for this route instead...a market that has some maturity to it. Allegiant should stick to Midwest markets. They seem to do better there.
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wedgetail737
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RE: Allegiant Cancels Plans For BTR-LAS

Mon Apr 05, 2004 10:09 am

Allegiant Air does plenty of advertising in Wichita.
 
USAFHummer
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RE: Allegiant Cancels Plans For BTR-LAS

Mon Apr 05, 2004 10:49 am

Well somehow I don't think the appx. 100,000 strong population of FNL alone can support 5x weekly to LAS...Im sure a significant percentage of people on the FNL-LAS flight are from Denver and the surrounding area...needless to say FNL is just a straight shot up I-25 from Denver, prolly around a 50 minute drive or so, which is not horribly far IMO...

Greg


[Edited 2004-04-05 03:54:01]
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NIKV69
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RE: Allegiant Cancels Plans For BTR-LAS

Mon Apr 05, 2004 11:40 am

True, I think Allegiant probably does better on their charters to Harrah's and others. Maybe it's why they have no scheduled service to IFP at all and had to cancel BTR to LAS after terrible bookings. Who knows I would love to see them grow.
Hey that guy with the private jet can bail us out! Why? HE CAN AFFORD IT!
 
wedgetail737
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RE: Allegiant Cancels Plans For BTR-LAS

Mon Apr 05, 2004 1:21 pm

Allegiant Air has been touting large loads from the beginning. Their first "long-range" flights to Wichita were very popular from the start. Their service is covered in the newspaper and radio, along with word-of-mouth. I have yet to see an Allegiant flight with less than 50% of the seats filled.

Also, Allegiant hasn't requested subsidies from the airport or city here in ICT. BTR probably just doesn't have the gambling addicts as people in the Plains and Upper Midwest.

I agree with NIK that Allegiant could use some 737NG's, but I'm sure leases on MD-80's are too low to pass up. And they meet all noise requirements.

Maybe we'll see them with 737NG's in the not-too-distant future.

I'm surprised FATFlyer hasn't said anything here.
 
ouboy79
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RE: Allegiant Cancels Plans For BTR-LAS

Mon Apr 05, 2004 1:33 pm

Perhaps they could try taking over OKC-LAS with TMA pulling out of that market. I wouldn't mind seeing them in TOL competing with TMA to LAS, since they are only running 3 (soon to be 2) flights a week to LAS.
 
NIKV69
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RE: Allegiant Cancels Plans For BTR-LAS

Mon Apr 05, 2004 8:46 pm

Wedgetail,

I believe any move forward for Allegiant must include updating their fleet with at least 3 NG 737s. In 2 years or so IFP is going to become an airport that will need much more service. Vegas continues to just attract so many people. I believe their are routes Allegiant can get and make money with. I still think that a shuttle with say a Embraer RJ from IFP to LAS can make money. I myself would fly it at least 5 times from New Years still mid March. We will have to see what Allegiant's plans are. Especially after Gordon Bethune takes over as CEO after he retires from CO!!  Smile/happy/getting dizzy


Bethune 2004
Hey that guy with the private jet can bail us out! Why? HE CAN AFFORD IT!
 
wedgetail737
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RE: Allegiant Cancels Plans For BTR-LAS

Mon Apr 05, 2004 10:28 pm

NIK...it's too bad that no one has picked up the slack from Morris Air when they served Laughlin during the 1990's. I worked for DAL during the summer and Morris Air's gates were next door. The Morris Air agents told me that they were doing pretty good from OAK to IFP.

I agree...I think Allegiant would do pretty well at IFP. But I think LAS is overshadowing a lot of what Laughlin has to offer. We have occasional junket flights between ICT and IFP, usually operated by G4. In the not-to-distant past, I used to see other charter airlines like Casino Express, Sun Pacific and Southeast make that run.

Like you said, we'll have to see what happens. Are there more casinos going up at Laughlin?
 
NIKV69
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RE: Allegiant Cancels Plans For BTR-LAS

Mon Apr 05, 2004 10:43 pm

Wedgetail,

Oh I agree that someone whether it's SCY or another can do well flying into IFP. The town is just exploding. Also residents there, whether full time or part time like myself love Laughlin but realize the serious gaming is 85 miles to the North. I like to play 21 but don't like the $5 tables in Laughlin or the gutless players who play like idiots cause they are scared to lose $10. In fact if I wish to seriously play 21 in Laughlin I have to play after midnight when I can get a table by myself and play till the sun comes up. So I visit Vegas 5-6 times a winter. though I can drive there in just over an hour with the improvements to the highway I still would rather fly there on a shuttle and I think many others would as well. As for new casinos in Laughlin, I think one is zoned just past Harrah's. Lord knows we need an upscale casino to compliment the Nugget there. Don Laughlin's Riverside is a joke and I wouldn't be caught dead there, The Ramada is nice yet their casino is poor. The Belle and Edgewater are skeevy and the Flamingo and River Palms are ok but don't have enough table games. I never really cared for Harrah's so I play most of my 21 in the Nugget. I know there are a lot of people that would enjoy a new upscale casino with more gaming space and higher limits. I predict in 4 years there will be another casino., I know right before I left to come back east that the Nugget was doing a major renovation to their casino. Including doubling the size of their Blackjack pit. Should be nice. The In N Out burger just went up and the Home depot was built last year over the river in Bullhead and we all know of the news IFP is building a bigger terminal so Laughlin is boooooooming! I love that town!  Smile/happy/getting dizzy
Hey that guy with the private jet can bail us out! Why? HE CAN AFFORD IT!
 
FATFlyer
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RE: Allegiant Cancels Plans For BTR-LAS

Tue Apr 06, 2004 5:24 am

LOL I take off for the weekend and the thread grows. Didn't know that it was going to be so popular.

I don't know the specifics about BTR. But many of G4's new markets have seen high bookings very quickly. If BTR wasn't responding G4 might have been questioning their decision. Also its not like other airlines haven't announced new service then cancelled plans or pulled flights after only a short time. It's just more noticible with a small airline.

I was a little surprised that Allegiant announced BTR when they did. The city had not approved the incentive package yet. Without the incentive being approved Allegiant might not have done much marketing in the area.

I also don't know how popular gambling is in the BTR area. I have a consumer behavior study around somewhere that mentions how popular different activities are in each MSA. I'll have to see if I can find it and see what is said about BTR.

nikv69,
Laughlin is doing well but the way things are going around Fresno we may be giving it a run for its money as a gambling area in the future. There are now 5 tribal casinos within an hour of Fresno with something like 7000 slot machines plus lots of table games.

Now both Caesars and Station Casinos have announced deals with tribes to add more casinos to the local market while an existing casino is looking at adding another 1000 slots. All of that will give this area 12,000 slots, almost the same as Laughlin. We might soon start seeing gamblers flying to FAT to visit Yosemite and Sequoia then spend a little money.  Big grin  Big grin
"Travel is fatal to prejudice, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness." - Mark Twain
 
NIKV69
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RE: Allegiant Cancels Plans For BTR-LAS

Tue Apr 06, 2004 7:05 am

Your so right FATFlyer, the Indians are major competition. The AVI in Laughlin is popular among the amateur gamblers, which make up the majority. I would never go to a Indian reservation to play, they are not regulated and are usually crooks and treat players poorly. I get such great service and comps from the Nugget in Laughlin and the Mirage and MGM in Vegas but you are right Fresno could be attracting more gamblers. I still hold out hope on day at IFP I will see a nice 738 touch down in Allegiant's colors!  Smile/happy/getting dizzy
Hey that guy with the private jet can bail us out! Why? HE CAN AFFORD IT!
 
wedgetail737
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RE: Allegiant Cancels Plans For BTR-LAS

Tue Apr 06, 2004 9:28 am

I still would like to see Allegiant Air open more west coast cities like you mention, RDD and Santa Maria.

NIK...as for a shuttle between IFP and LAS, what about some of the little guys like Valley Air Express or Scenic? It's too bad Stateswest doesn't operate anymore.
 
NIKV69
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RE: Allegiant Cancels Plans For BTR-LAS

Tue Apr 06, 2004 9:34 am

Wedgetail,

Any airline would be fine! I would fly a Dash 8 or something like that! Anything, that drive is getting old and I would love to fly in one morning or afternoon. Play some serious 21 and leave the next morning. How sweet it is!
Hey that guy with the private jet can bail us out! Why? HE CAN AFFORD IT!