Topic Author
Posts: 39
Joined: Tue Mar 09, 2004 7:00 am

Pan Am At DFW

Mon Apr 05, 2004 2:32 am

Hello everyone,

Last month I viewed a couple of older pictures of DFW International on this forum showing a Pan Am 727 and an L-1011 at the airport. I was not living in Dallas at the time so I was wondering if Pan Am had much of a presence at DFW. Where did they fly to/from and how often?

Thank you
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Joined: Sun Dec 10, 2000 4:08 am

RE: Pan Am At DFW

Mon Apr 05, 2004 2:42 am

In 1985, I flew a PA 727-200 from SFO to DFW. I remember the seats being pretty ratty at the time. The went on to JFK I believe.
18 year airliners.net vet! 2000-2017
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Joined: Mon Jun 18, 2001 11:13 am

RE: Pan Am At DFW

Mon Apr 05, 2004 2:46 am

Lucky for you, I bought three Pan Am timetables at the DFW Airliners memorabilia show yesterday.

In 1983:
To Austin:
Daily flt. 591 2130 2215 727

To Miami:
Daily flt. 576 1745 2112 727

To New York JFK:
Daily flt. 592 1145 1555 727

To San Francisco:
Daily flt. 575 1035 1209 727

In 1986:
To Austin:
Daily flt. 401 900P 941P 727

To Miami:
Daily flt. 576 710P 1024P 727

To New York JFK:
Daily flt. 402 1240p 448p 727

To San Francisco:
Daily flt. 575 1015a 1135a 727

In 1989:
To Austin:
Daily flt. 2001 940p 1031p 727

To Miami:
Daily flt. 574 1150a 330p 727
Daily flt. 576 550p 930p 737

To New York JFK:
Daily flt. 2002 1215p 443p 727

America's chickens are coming home to rooooost!
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RE: Pan Am At DFW

Mon Apr 05, 2004 2:52 am

I think it was in 90' my dad took me to the AA hangers and went around this road that brought us REALLY close to 18L and 18R, the road is gone now, has been since 93' but i still have a great photo for a Pan Am 727 approaching 18L. I didnt know they flew the L1011 in there but the 727 was pretty common.
Topic Author
Posts: 39
Joined: Tue Mar 09, 2004 7:00 am

RE: Pan Am At DFW

Mon Apr 05, 2004 5:13 am

My mistake in regards to the L-1011 - that was a Delta Airlines aircraft.

carnival air
Posts: 81
Joined: Sun Sep 05, 1999 4:22 am

RE: Pan Am At DFW

Mon Apr 05, 2004 6:02 am

Hey Jcs17, If it is not too much problem, can you tell me where they flew from Puerto Rico (SJU, PCE, BQN, others) on those dates and the planes they used. Also the other caribbean destinations.

Thanks for the help!!!
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Joined: Thu Jan 27, 2000 1:04 pm

RE: Pan Am At DFW

Mon Apr 05, 2004 6:15 am

PA did not have much of a prescience at DFW. I suspect that the L1011-500 photo that you saw was probably a WX diversion from IAH. PA at a time in the early 80s was building a small hub at IAH (more like a focus city, actually). L105s, DC-10 (formerly NA's birds) and 741s as well as 721s and 722s were daily sights at terminal B. I believe that at one time they had up to 70 or so daily flights from IAH. Sadly, with PA's then poor financial situation and Houston's then weak economy this was to be a very short lived romance.

"Show me the Braniffs"
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RE: Pan Am At DFW

Mon Apr 05, 2004 11:34 am

Pan Am offered DFW-MSY-MIA service twice daily starting in 1990 and lasting until mid 1991. Both flights were operated with B727's. I remember fondly that they had a $100 roundtrip fare MSY-DFW for a good while. Pan Am in fact usually had the lowest fares in the market. They also did DFW-JFK nonstop at that time.

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Joined: Fri Oct 13, 2000 11:53 pm

RE: Pan Am At DFW

Mon Apr 05, 2004 8:41 pm

There was a time in the early 80's when PA had non-stop service to JFK with a 707, continuing on to LHR with a plane change (747, I'm pretty sure). I was on a standby for a flight once, but no seats opened up and I went instead to LGW on Braniff, going out on "The Great Pumpkin", and returning on the 747SP. Not a bad tradeoff, I guess. I used to see a PA 707 parked out there on ocassion.
Flying Colors Forever!
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RE: Pan Am At DFW

Mon Apr 05, 2004 9:12 pm

DFW was not an important city for Pan Am - in Pan Am's glory days, say the 1950s-mid 1970s, the DFW area had not yet developed into the major metro area that it is; much of the growth in the SUNBELT cities starting booming later on. (Also, in this era, pre-Southwest and pre-AA and pre-DL hubs, Dallas was not the mega-important airline city that it now is.) In those years, Pan Am was really all about New York as the gateway to Europe, Africa and the middle east, Miami as the gateway to latin america, and San Fran and Los Angeles for flights to Hawaii and the Far East.

Its interesting that during these years, Houston had a more important role in the Pan Am system. I believe that Pan Am offered service to europe from Houston, plus a odd service to Mexico City and Central America. Later, when Pan Am bought out National Airlines, Pan Am tried to develop Houston into a mini-hub (NA was big on the Florida-Houston-California routes) but it was not very successful.

Later, Pan Am tried to connect many US cities to its primary international gateways (JFK, MIA, LAX, SFO) and offered nonstop and odd one stop flights into these cities with 727 and 737 aircraft. It was not very successful as new nonstops to international destinations were then becoming available from cities allover the US.

I do not know about the 707 from Dallas to Kennedy - until deregulation PA was prohibited from carrying passengers within the continental US (they did get rights to JFK-LAX/SFO earlier), thus, the Pan Am 707 could at Dallas could only accept passengers going on to London (no traffic DAL-JFK)......however, Pan AM did have some unusual agreements with domestic US carriers on certain routes, where a Pan Am aircraft would operate a domestic service on behalf of another carrier. This was the case on the ATL-IAD-LHR route for years - a DL/PA arrangement; dont know if PA did the same thing with a Dallas route (would have to have been with AA or BN, the only carriers permitted to fly DAL-NYC at the time.)
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Joined: Tue Mar 01, 2005 5:31 am

RE: Pan Am At DFW

Mon Apr 05, 2004 10:21 pm

pre-AA and pre-DL hubs, Dallas was not the mega-important airline city that it now is.

Dallas Love Field was - throughout the 50s and 60s - one of the busiest passenger airports in the U.S. (top 5-6 or higher) due in part to American, Delta and Braniff all having sizable operations.

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