DeltaBoy777
Topic Author
Posts: 394
Joined: Sat Jun 16, 2001 4:22 pm

Future Of Delta At DFW

Sat Apr 17, 2004 11:42 am

Hello Everyone-
Delta was recently discussed in the Dallas Morning News regarding their future as a airline and their financial status or lack there of. I have been flying Delta forever and have never seen their status and respect at DFW diminish so greatly! I was wondering where do you see DL ops at DFW or systemwide in 5 yrs? 10 yrs.? There have been talks of a 737 base for Delta at DFW, as well as a complete regional operation, this I find hard to believe considering the facilities Delta currently operates at DFW. What do you think?

Regards,
~DeltaBoy777~
Thanks and Gig Em!
 
dfwneedsqf
Posts: 60
Joined: Sat Apr 17, 2004 10:31 am

RE: Future Of Delta At DFW

Sat Apr 17, 2004 11:48 am

Maybe. But I can't see a 737 operation working very well at DFW. A Regional route with CRJ's might work since it is already in operation to an extent. The Whole restructing of Delta is strange as well as a loss of Jobs for Delta pilots based out of DFW. It would be nice to see Delta make DFW a Larger and take advantage of the new international terminal soon to be opened, but I dont see Delta at DFW much longer with this new idea. Mayeb the regional operation, but not competing well with AA and other airlines based out of DFW.
~Josh
 
COEWR
Posts: 225
Joined: Sun Oct 05, 2003 5:05 am

RE: Future Of Delta At DFW

Sat Apr 17, 2004 11:53 am

Let me start by saying I have never been to DFW...On DL or anyone else for that matter...I just wanted to get my $0.02 in here real quick.

I think the future of commercial aviation is in the RJ...As much as we hate it and don't want it to happen, that's the way it goes...I think it is this way because people would rather fly from point A to point B, none of this HUB/spoke thing anymore. This has changed greatly since deregulation when superhubs dominated the landscape (yes I know I was small and/or not yet born when deregulation happened but I have read enough books to understand it)...Anyway that's just my $0.02.

The future is in RJ point to point services so I think we will see more HUBs turned into RJ centers so to speak...Maybe not true for the International gateways (ie. JFK, EWR, LAX, SFO, IAH, ATL...Forgive me if I forgot some but you get the idea) but definitely the second and third rate HUBs and larger outstations...Anyway...It seems to me that DLs presence in DFW is not that of a superhub (as theirs is in ATL) it will eventually be reduced to an RJ outstation/HUB.

like I said just my $0.02 but I would love to hear other opinions on this topic!

--C
 
Okie
Posts: 3610
Joined: Wed Jul 16, 2003 11:30 am

RE: Future Of Delta At DFW

Sat Apr 17, 2004 12:02 pm

A recipical question would be what about AA presents at Atlanta?
I am in agreement on the down sizing of DL at DFW, you can barely tell that they are there anymore.
I have always been under the assumption that there is sort of an unwritten agreement between DL and AA as to their respective hubs ATL and DFW. You don't step on our toes here we won't step on your toes their sort of thing.

Okie
 
DeltaBoy777
Topic Author
Posts: 394
Joined: Sat Jun 16, 2001 4:22 pm

RE: Future Of Delta At DFW

Sat Apr 17, 2004 12:02 pm

Quite frankly, COEWR, people I have seen hate flying on regional jets, and would much rather fly large jets. Even at the expense of a few extra dollars. Cramped seats, small or no legroom, limited overhead and underseat storage all carry revenue away from regional airlines. People used to think this was the way to go, but realize now it's not. Thanks for your opinion!

~DeltaBoy777~
Thanks and Gig Em!
 
MSYtristar
Posts: 7543
Joined: Sat Aug 27, 2005 12:52 am

RE: Future Of Delta At DFW

Sat Apr 17, 2004 12:04 pm

Delta could not make it work in DFW even in happier times in the industry. Before 1996 or so,they still had a huge operation in DFW with numerous daily 757/767/L10 flights, with at least five banks of flights to the major cities, plus nonstops to FRA and HNL. Around '96, they cut back operations greatly, to three core East and West banks. And more recently, DFW has been turned into RJ central. If Delta is not making any strides at DFW in its current form, then I really don't think it has much of a future in the DL route system as far as a big time hub is concerned. Sure, they'll probably always offer nonstops from Big D to key leisure and business markets (if for no other reason then to appease the numerous DL frequent flyers in the DFW area), but don't look for much expansion.


Steve/New Orleans
 
dfwneedsqf
Posts: 60
Joined: Sat Apr 17, 2004 10:31 am

RE: Future Of Delta At DFW

Sat Apr 17, 2004 12:06 pm

I agree with DeltaBoy777. The RJ market could not take over becuase it could not be able to support the coustomers with long range or comfort. When I flew on the CRJ-200 I was not even allowed to carry on my carry on. I know confusing, but true. It makes me wonder how long the smaller RJ will last.
~Josh
 
ckfred
Posts: 4763
Joined: Wed Apr 25, 2001 12:50 pm

RE: Future Of Delta At DFW

Sat Apr 17, 2004 1:10 pm

If AA is planning significant growth at DFW over the next 5 years, WN grows at both Houston airports, and CO has even limited growth at IAH, I don't see how DL can keep its DFW hub open.

I think it will come down to flights to SLC, CVG, ATL, and maybe JFK, LGA, and BOS.

As for the issue fo RJs, as you know AA has been switching a lot of routes to a mainline/RJ mix or all RJ. A friend of mine who flies for AA says that customers are making their displeasure known clearly. But until AA can find a Fokker replacement (a plane that holds 90 to 110 passengers) and figure out who will fly it (mainline or Eagle), the RJs will continue to fly mainline routes.
 
ATLhomeCMH
Posts: 751
Joined: Fri Dec 19, 2003 3:25 am

RE: Future Of Delta At DFW

Sat Apr 17, 2004 2:08 pm

DL will probably never have anything more than a small regional RJ operation out of DFW, just like AA won't have much more than flights to ORD, MIA, DFW, and STL (at the VERY most) out of ATL...DFW and ATL are AA's and DL's palaces respectively, and I just dont think the front office folks on either team would let anything more than those very spartan scenarios occur.
"The most terrifying words in the Engligh language are, 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.'"-Ronald Reagan
 
Delta767300ER
Posts: 2436
Joined: Tue Dec 16, 2003 7:12 pm

RE: Future Of Delta At DFW

Sat Apr 17, 2004 8:41 pm

As much as I would like to see Delta have a huge presence out of DFW I know it will never happen  Sad AA has too much of a monopoly at DFW as does Delta at ATL.

-Delta767300ER
 
Guest

RE: Future Of Delta At DFW

Sat Apr 17, 2004 9:35 pm

This is why DL is focused on CVG, ATL and SLC. North East, Southeast flows, SLC to the West. WHen you look at a map of airports with air service, you can see why. See page 4 of the link below, it tells you a lot:

http://www.bts.gov/publications/airport_activity_statistics_of_certificated_air_carriers/2000/entire.pdf
 
MAH4546
Posts: 24725
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 1:44 pm

RE: Future Of Delta At DFW

Sun Apr 18, 2004 1:52 am

ORD, MIA, DFW, and STL (at the VERY most) out of ATL

AA flies ATL-BNA.
a.
 
ATLhomeCMH
Posts: 751
Joined: Fri Dec 19, 2003 3:25 am

RE: Future Of Delta At DFW

Sun Apr 18, 2004 1:03 pm

Lol Good for AA. As I said, they won't have an overwhelming presence in ATL. That would be like two worlds colliding at 500 knots.
"The most terrifying words in the Engligh language are, 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.'"-Ronald Reagan
 
aviaar
Posts: 227
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2001 8:16 am

RE: Future Of Delta At DFW

Sun Apr 18, 2004 2:13 pm

Carlson-

Wow man...you're really coming back strong. Here's my post:

For your sake, I hope Delta thrives/flourishes/is very successful at DFW.

To the RJ subject..they present an indirect variation. If the demand stays the same and the amount of seats goes down, the price for those same seats will go up. RJs can charge a lot more for less service because there is the same demand for a lot less seats. Plus, the airlines do not have to pay those pilots as much, they [the planes] do not require multiple flight attendants, and they are cheaper to purchase and maintain. They result in higher fill rates, which means higher profits.

Who knows,though, with planes like the A380 and 7E7 coming out. I don't think an airline would ever convert entirely to RJs, they might just utilize them for domestic use (they're kind of already doing this)

ALWAYS a pleasure talking about anything with you, especially aviation.

~Aviaar~
I'd rather be flying (real original)
 
vatveng
Posts: 1112
Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2004 11:49 pm

RE: Future Of Delta At DFW

Sun Apr 18, 2004 5:28 pm

But until AA can find a Fokker replacement (a plane that holds 90 to 110 passengers)

Didn't they dump TWA's 717's after the buyout because "we already have a 100-seat plane, the Fokker F-100".... then immediately turn around and announce the retirement of the F100?

My inner conspiracy theorist [who doesn't get out much] is wondering if the majors, other than generally being in the financial toilet, don't want to order 717s because in their minds if the 717 line closes it might be a hardship to one of the LCCs giving them such fits? Especially since AirTran flies upwards of a hundred 717s?

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