727LOVER
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NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Wed Apr 21, 2004 12:54 am

Which aircraft types in the fleets of UA and NW

will NOT get the new colors?




Also, what types WILL BUT HAVE NOT YET have the new colors?


Thanx.

[Edited 2004-04-20 17:56:16]
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GVROYphx
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Wed Apr 21, 2004 1:00 am

Well obviously NW has gonna paint them all....look at the DC-10 posting. And UA the same...think about it...

- Roy
 
727LOVER
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Wed Apr 21, 2004 1:02 am

So NW DC-9-10 and UA 762 are going to be repainted?
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redtailmsp
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft

Wed Apr 21, 2004 1:02 am

NWA's DC9-10s will not be painted, all other fleets will be. The freighters will in time have the new tail colors and presumably some change to the fuselage too (with regards the non-painted fuselages that is). Too bad about the DC9-10 - I think the shortened fuselage would look good. I don't know about the Mesaba Saabs, but the ARJs will be painted - and some of them REALLY need it too.
 
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jetjack74
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repain

Wed Apr 21, 2004 1:03 am

For NW, I can say that the DC9-10 won't be repainted in the new colors. I would guess and say that the SF3 will probably be given a pass. Possibly the ARJ's will be painted in the NC. The rest of the fleet has an example repainted.
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StevenUhl777
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Wed Apr 21, 2004 1:12 am

I have a very hard time believing that UA is going to repaint their 762 fleet. They have publicly stated that they intend to retire them, so it wouldn't make sense to repaint airplanes that they will soon be sending to the desert or wherever else.

And the winner for best actress is....REESE WITHERSPOON for 'Walk the Line'!!!!!!!!
 
727LOVER
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Wed Apr 21, 2004 1:21 am

intend to retire them, so it wouldn't make sense to repaint airplanes that they will soon be sending to the desert or wherever else.

 Nuts

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UA744Flagship
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Wed Apr 21, 2004 1:58 am

UA has already sold off its 767-200s. They will be gone soon, before there is any need to repaint them.
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United_fan
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Wed Apr 21, 2004 2:12 am

From www.unitedsvcs.com .....
"Five Model B767-222EM (ETOPS) and two Model B767-222 aircraft available now. A total of 16 aircraft will be available by June 2005. "


B767-222EM N611UA 21872 1982
B767-222 N601UA 21862 1983
B767-222EM N602UA 21863 1983
B767-222EM N608UA 21869 1982
B767-222EM N609UA 21870 1982
B767-222EM N610UA 21871 1982
B767-222 N615UA 21876 1983

So it looks like UA744Flagship is right.
I would have loved to see a 727 in new colors  Smile
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aviatortj
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Wed Apr 21, 2004 5:43 am

AFAIK, there is no word on painting any of the XJ aircraft. The Saabs, if repainted, will not have a livery change. As far as the Avros, if NW and XJ can decide who is responsible for painting them, there is a chance of it. It could be possible that they will hang onto the bowling shoe for the remaining ~2 years of service. The replacement of the ARJ will be delivered in new colors.

DC-9-10s will be retired by the end of the year and will not have a repaint.

NWA Repainted:
CRJ
DC-9-30
DC-9-40
DC-9-50
A319
A320
757-500
757-600
757-300
DC-10-30
A330-300
747-200
747-400

NWA NOT Repainted:
SF-340
ARJ-85
DC-9-10
 
dc8jet
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Wed Apr 21, 2004 8:20 am

What exactly are a 757-500 and 757-600?
 
Thrust
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Wed Apr 21, 2004 8:26 am

What exactly are a 757-500 and 757-600?


--Dc8jet, they don't exist. I'm having a hard time telling whether you are clueless or are being sarcastic. Well, either is justified, becaused AviatorTJ has no idea what he is talking about either  Big grin
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nwa man
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Wed Apr 21, 2004 8:28 am

Edited to add this lil' intro...

I'm having a hard time telling whether you are clueless or are being sarcastic. Well, either is justified, becaused AviatorTJ has no idea what he is talking about either

Or maybe you don't know what you're talking about. Read on.



What exactly are a 757-500 and 757-600?

NW's two models of the 757-200 (this can get confusing, can't it?).

The 755 is the newer model and seats 180...

http://www.nwa.com/travel/trave/seatm/755/


The 756 is the older model and seats 184...

http://www.nwa.com/travel/trave/seatm/756/index.shtml


As a side note, NW's website shows a 756 in an international configuration, which seats 182. Can't say I've flown on this type, but here's the link. Do these planes serve the flights out of NRT?

http://www.nwa.com/travel/trave/seatm/756int/index.shtm



Regards,

N-Dub


[Edited 2004-04-21 01:30:10]
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Thrust
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Wed Apr 21, 2004 8:40 am

Now I'm just confused. How on earth can NW create its own type of 757? Yes, NWA man, you've proven I'm wrong. Apologies to AviatorTJ, you have every reason to say the 757-500 and the 757-600. So the 755 and the 756 are variants of the 752. But why did Boeing never talk about giving the two different types of window arrangements different model names of the 752? The Boeing website says absolutely nothing about them, neither does my Boeing book which gives complete coverage of the 757's introduction and entrance into service. Has NW just decided to call them these to distinguish the two window arrangements?
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Guest

RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Wed Apr 21, 2004 8:41 am

The 756 is the older model and seats 184...

It's the other way around. The 5500 series a/c are the 33 original deliveries (1985-1988) whereas the 5600 series are the newer deliveires (1995-1996 and 2001-2002).

NW's website shows a 756 in an international configuration, which seats 182.

These are the aircraft based in Japan. NW removed a row of seats in F (errrr... WorldBusinessClass) on the right side of the a/c, giving a few extra inches of pitch to that side only.
 
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Wed Apr 21, 2004 8:43 am

How on earth can NW create its own type of 757?

They didn't. The 5500 and 5600 designations refer to the ship numbers (as described in my posting above); NW's internal code for these a/c is 755 for the former and 756 for the latter. It's just internal coding only.
 
aviatortj
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Wed Apr 21, 2004 8:48 am

I have no idea  Wink/being sarcastic. Perhaps I should have clarified 757 of 500/600 series for the non NW person.

755 ----------------- 756


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Edit: Typing

[Edited 2004-04-21 01:50:33]
 
dc8jet
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Wed Apr 21, 2004 8:52 am

Thrust I wasn't being sarcastic, I had never heard those terms used before. I was sitting here going thru all of my 757 info trying to figure out what the heck they were. Thanks NWA Man for setting us straight!
 
Thrust
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Wed Apr 21, 2004 8:55 am

Sorry, meant nothing personal to you, Dc8jet. I had never heard of these terms before either, as you no doubt read. I was not making fun of you.
Fly one thing; Fly it well
 
nwa man
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Wed Apr 21, 2004 9:01 am

It's the other way around. The 5500 series a/c are the 33 original deliveries (1985-1988) whereas the 5600 series are the newer deliveires (1995-1996 and 2001-2002).


Damn, I told you this can get confusing!  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

Here's what threw me off... I remembered flying on newer 75s and seeing that the aircraft was a 757-5600. So logically, I thought that meant 755, instead of 756. Thanks for the directions back to the right path.

The easy way to tell what type you're on... if you walk into the plane at 2L, take a look to your left (hopefully you'll be going that way anyways). If you see two rows of Y seats, it's a 755. If you see First Class, it's a 756.



Regards,

N-Dub


edited to add: Nothing personal to Thrust either... I screwed up in my post too. Happens to the best of us.

[Edited 2004-04-21 02:02:28]

[Edited 2004-04-21 02:03:00]
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isitsafenow
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repain

Wed Apr 21, 2004 9:28 am

The AVROS will be repainted in the silver bullet scheme. The planes belong to NW and are leased to Mesaba. I watch NW close and wasn't aware the Avros are to be replaced in the near future. There was talk of parking the whole fleet(36 planes) just before the deadline of the Mesaba pilot possible strike but that's history now.
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N312RC
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Wed Apr 21, 2004 10:13 am

755... 756... theyre just internal designations for two differently configured 757-200's. Its kinda like everybody else calling them M80 and American calling theirs "S80".
N/A
 
aviatortj
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Wed Apr 21, 2004 10:41 am

Safe, as of right now the Avros will not be repainted. There is nothing written up saying whether NW or XJ is responsible for painting the planes. That is why you only see ones with touch up paint instead of a whole clean livery.

The Avros are here indefinitely, but I would not be surprised if when the ARJ contract expires in a few years, that NW finds a two engine alternative.

__TJ__
 
hammer
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Wed Apr 21, 2004 10:12 pm

The easiest way to see if it a 5500 or a 5600, look at the coach seating...if there is 3 by 3 seating with no dividers and lavs all the way in the back by door 4L and 4R it is a 5600....the 5500 has 3 by 3 but the lavs are by door 3R and 3L...very simple way to see what you are on...plus the exit's over the wings is a dead give away that is a 5600, whereas the 5500 does not...
 
alphascan
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Thu Apr 22, 2004 1:48 am

Why are the Saabs not going to be repainted? Are their days numbered?
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azo
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Thu Apr 22, 2004 1:50 am

I have flown on both 5600 and 5500. I love the NW 752s!


Yet you hate NW as a company?

http://www.airliners.net/discussions/general_aviation/read.main/1524940/
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KaiGywer
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Thu Apr 22, 2004 2:18 am

The problem with replacing the ARJ, is that NW will have to cancel their ASE flights, which are always full in the winter time. No other jet can get to ASE without severe restrictions.
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xjramper
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Thu Apr 22, 2004 2:32 am

Why are the Saabs not going to be repainted? Are their days numbered

Nope...Mesaba owns them not NW.

XJR
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azjubilee
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Thu Apr 22, 2004 3:51 am

Actually... XJ doesn't own any of its planes. Not een the saabs. XJ leases the avros and all the B+ saabs from NW. The As and Bs are leased independantly by Mesaba. Those 2 subfleets are going to be retired eventually. The B+ saabs are on long term leases. As far as painting goes... it's really all NW's call, not XJ. According to our "CEO" NW hasn't approached XJ to paint the planes. Who knows if they'll be painted. The JetAirlink services agreement expires in 2007. But that doesn't mean they can't extend it. These planes really aren't as inefficient as everyone would like you to believe. They're certainly not operated in the way the design intended them to be operated (lower mach numbers for max fuel efficiency on short hops).


AZJ
 
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Fri Apr 23, 2004 12:19 am

I stand corrected...thanks Azj

The straight Bs are Pinnacle owned aren't they? Or is XJ subleasing them from PX?

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azjubilee
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Fri Apr 23, 2004 1:19 am

The former PCL Bs (N...PX) are leased from 3rd party lessors. I guess XJ basically took over their leases when NW phased the saabs out of their fleet.



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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Fri Apr 23, 2004 2:08 am

We're down to about 2 A models left in the fleet I believe. I haven't seen one fly into here since about early March. They should be gone very, very soon. Those aircraft have about 2000 lbs less payload than the B/B+'s.

Back in 2001 or 2002, all of the Pinnacle Saabs were transfered over to XJ into order to simplify Airlink operations. It made no sense to have two seperate Saab operators, especially since PCL was growing leaps and bounds and XJ was shrinking.

The former Pinnacle Saabs, (besides having the PX regs) are also noticably different than the XJ Saabs. (The B+'s that will remain) On the B's the lav is in the back of the cabin, seat 33, the seats are a blue leather, and the have different Passenger Service units. Plus they also sounds somewhat different in-flight. On the XJ B+ Saabs, they have tan leather seats, lav in the front by the galley, seat 34, (4 across in row 11), and have newer looking interiors. The condition of the B's somewhat varies. A few weeks ago I was on 360 and 370. 370 looked absolutely terrible inside, the cabin was rather worn, scratched up and the paint on the outside was looking pretty shabby. The seat in front of me 2A, was busted and would not stay in the up and locked position. Then I was on 360 on a connecting flight and it was in fine shape. The interior looked years newer, plus the paint job appeared a lot better. Its all dependent.

The new B+'s are pretty consistent. The older B's I guess you never know what you are going to get.

In the past few years there have been a bunch of odd-ball Saabs phased out of the fleet, both A & B models that were acquired from various leasing companies when NW was rapidly growing its Saab fleet back in the day.

The B+'s will remain for the long-term.
 
FlyGuyClt
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Fri Apr 23, 2004 2:17 am

All 757's in the NWA fleet are 757-251's and 351's. The 5500,5600 and 5800 are in house terms. The 5500 ship numbers have the number 3 drop down door. There are 4 floor level door exits on each side. The 5600's have 2 window exits on each side and only 3 floor level door exits. The 5800's are the 300's and have 4 floor level door exits and 2 window exits on each side.

Safe Flying  Smile

[Edited 2004-04-22 19:22:55]

5500

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5600

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5800

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[Edited 2004-04-22 19:24:15]
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BAGSMASHER
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Fri Apr 23, 2004 7:16 am

Why arent the Saabs being repainted in the new colors. NW is operating with two entirely different logos and marketing images and all that does is confuse customers. Of couse thats been a NW specialty forever!! But how about some uniformity?? That would be a start.
 
nwa man
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Fri Apr 23, 2004 8:38 am

Why arent the Saabs being repainted in the new colors. NW is operating with two entirely different logos and marketing images and all that does is confuse customers. Of couse thats been a NW specialty forever!! But how about some uniformity?? That would be a start.


Well if you want to get technical, the Saabs were in a different livery even before NW adopted the new scheme. You don't recall seeing any all red DC-9s or 744s at MSP, do you?

Keep in mind that even though they contract with eachother, Mesaba and NW are two different airlines. And even with the different liveries, I don't think any customers are "confused".

As much as you'd like uniformity, I can only think of one US major that has all of its planes and its affiliate's planes in the same livery... that, of course, is CO. AA and Eagle are painted differently, UA is in color scheme transition, US now has its "low cost" colors, etc. NW is just following industry trends.


Regards,

N-Dub
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aguilo
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RE: NW & UA: Which Aircraft Types Not To Be Repainted?

Fri Apr 23, 2004 10:17 am

Why is NWA getting rid of the DC-9-10s but keeping the other a/c types of DC9s?

Are the DC9-10s too old or too small to justify keeping around in the age of the RJs?