MY7E7
Topic Author
Posts: 75
Joined: Thu Apr 29, 2004 10:37 pm

Ticket Has No Value Policy

Wed May 05, 2004 12:16 pm

How many of you have booked a flight, couldn't make it for one reason or another and didn't rebook before or on the day of departure and had to throw the ticket away?

Eat your heart out CO!

I'm not always right but that's no reason to insult me
 
robsawatsky
Posts: 477
Joined: Thu Dec 18, 2003 7:07 am

RE: Ticket Has No Value Policy

Thu May 06, 2004 2:31 am

Hasn't happened to me but I have heard several complaints about this particular ticket rule and how it is "unfair". My response is always to question why they expect the airline to waive the rules for them? What is unfair about following the terms and conditions of a contract?
 
MY7E7
Topic Author
Posts: 75
Joined: Thu Apr 29, 2004 10:37 pm

RE: Ticket Has No Value Policy

Thu May 06, 2004 2:54 am

It's not really a question of fair or unfair. I agree with you that both parties entered into a contract, basically. COs reservation agent did admit that if I would be a CO high tier member she would rebook me on a future flight to ZRH and I could still use that expired ticket. I don't remember reading about that 'exception' in the 'contract' either. It was a $600 ticket, it's not the end of the world and I fly every week anyway, just not on CO.
I'm not always right but that's no reason to insult me
 
goingboeing
Posts: 4727
Joined: Sat Dec 04, 1999 1:58 am

RE: Ticket Has No Value Policy

Thu May 06, 2004 3:10 am

What is "unfair" about it is that the ticket is also not transferable - if it were, you could give or sell it to someone else who COULD take the trip. They like to use the "super bowl" or "theatre tickets" excuse...if you can't make it to the performance, you won't get your money back, and the ticket has "no value". But I can SELL my superbowl or theatre ticket to someone else for them to use and not suffer a loss. Can't do that with airline tickets.
 
MY7E7
Topic Author
Posts: 75
Joined: Thu Apr 29, 2004 10:37 pm

RE: Ticket Has No Value Policy

Thu May 06, 2004 3:13 am

yeah that was exactly what they told me, it's like not showing up for a broadway show. They told me that I just have to rebook before or on the day of departure. It's an international flight that had a $200 rebooking fee and I didn't know when I was going for sure, so I asked, I just keep rebooking and paying $200 a couple of times until I know for sure when I can go? the CO agent said: yes
I'm not always right but that's no reason to insult me
 
TFJamie
Posts: 117
Joined: Thu Mar 04, 2004 6:16 pm

RE: Ticket Has No Value Policy

Thu May 06, 2004 3:30 am

This is of course the airline's way of being able to offer cheap fares. If you get a cheap fare it is very important to read the rules. If it weren't for rules like that fares would be much higher. Nothing unfair about that. If you have to change your flight, buy an unrestricted ticket or travel insurance

About the non-transferability issue. It's the airlines' way of tracking who flies them it's both a security issue and about an airline being able to have control of their own ticket prices.

So this is really not unfair. Whithout these rules fares would be much higher and loads would be much more unpredictable.
 
goingboeing
Posts: 4727
Joined: Sat Dec 04, 1999 1:58 am

RE: Ticket Has No Value Policy

Thu May 06, 2004 3:36 am

I don't buy the security argument. All it would take is one phone call to the airline to say "change confirmation # 5GHF4W to John Smith at 123 Main Street, Omaha Nebraska". There's a way around the unpredictability of loads also...still make them valueless after the flight - just allow someone to transfer the ticket. If they can't sell it, then the airline gets to double book the seat and take one person for the price of two.
 
ORDagent
Posts: 580
Joined: Wed Dec 17, 2003 6:24 am

RE: Ticket Has No Value Policy

Thu May 06, 2004 6:34 am

so I asked, I just keep rebooking and paying $200 a couple of times until I know for sure when I can go? the CO agent said: yes

Thats a load of BS! CO's current policy sates that you have one year from the date of issuance to reuse the ticket as long as you have cancelled the reservation prior to the time of departure.
 
MY7E7
Topic Author
Posts: 75
Joined: Thu Apr 29, 2004 10:37 pm

RE: Ticket Has No Value Policy

Thu May 06, 2004 9:47 am

ORDagent: If I would have rebooked the ticket PRIOR to departure, I wouldn't have started this discussion. It's been a while since this happend to me, maybe it's change but on that ticket I had which was highly discounted, there was a rebooking fee of $200 every time I would change the reservation.
I'm not always right but that's no reason to insult me
 
goingboeing
Posts: 4727
Joined: Sat Dec 04, 1999 1:58 am

RE: Ticket Has No Value Policy

Thu May 06, 2004 10:40 pm

Thats a load of BS! CO's current policy sates that you have one year from the date of issuance to reuse the ticket as long as you have cancelled the reservation prior to the time of departure.

According to the penalty rules for a CO fare I checked at random, I found this:

ON/PRIOR TO TICKETED DEPARTURE TIME OF EACH
FLIGHT - CHANGES ARE PERMITTED - USD 100.00
CHANGE FEE APPLIES.


So it looks like you can change the ticket and reuse it prior to departure, minus a $100 change fee.

I do know that UAL will charge the change fee each time a ticket is changed - had it happen to me (almost) when I had to change an MCI-ORD ticket outbound and return - As the agent was making the change and preparing to charge my card I happened to mention that it would have been cheaper for me just to buy a full fare ticket for less money than I have been charged for the original ticket and the first change fee and the change fee she was getting ready to assess. She stopped a minute, handed me my card back and said "You're right - it's pretty stupid" and made the change without charging me again.
 
N6376M
Posts: 2310
Joined: Tue Aug 12, 2003 12:54 am

RE: Ticket Has No Value Policy

Fri May 07, 2004 12:32 am

The problem with analyzing an airline ticket under a contract scrutiny is that the obligations are mostly onesided.

Once you've paid for your ticket the airline has your money. If the flight is late or cancelled for stuff within their reasonable control, they don't owe you anything for consequential damages. If you purchase a ticket to go from Point A to Point B on a specific date at a specific time, why shouldn't the carrier be liable for damages arising out of their breach of contract. The disclaim all such liability including if it is caused out of their own negligence or willful misconduct.

Furthermore, this game they play with announcing pricing and waiting to see what their competitors do boarders on anti-trust violation. Have you ever noticed that they all act in lock step with one another?
 
jwenting
Posts: 9973
Joined: Mon Apr 23, 2001 10:12 pm

RE: Ticket Has No Value Policy

Fri May 07, 2004 12:42 am

If the airline can't get you to your destination within a reasonable time and the reasons why are not outside their control they ARE obligated to compensate (though there are strict limits to the amounts to avoid insane lawsuits from people demanding a billion dollar compensation for getting home 5 minutes late).
I wish I were flying
 
SJU767
Posts: 114
Joined: Fri Feb 13, 2004 11:29 pm

RE: Ticket Has No Value Policy

Fri May 07, 2004 12:43 am

MY7E7

Next time buy a fare without any restrictions, usually a Y. The cheaper the fare the more restrictions.
 
N6376M
Posts: 2310
Joined: Tue Aug 12, 2003 12:54 am

RE: Ticket Has No Value Policy

Fri May 07, 2004 12:48 am

Jwenting -

They are obligated to compensate you based on a formulary rate (something like $200 + the cost of your ticket if you're 2 hours late and $400 + the ticket if you're more than 4 hours late), NOT for your actual damages EVEN IF those damages can be demonstrated.

While I agree that there would be people demanding ridiculous sums of money for very little actual damage, sometimes there are real damages that arise. I'm not aware of any other industry where actual damages due to negligence or willful misconduct are capped.
 
User avatar
EA CO AS
Posts: 13438
Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2001 8:54 am

RE: Ticket Has No Value Policy

Fri May 07, 2004 1:40 am

The reason the carrier is not responsible for any damages arising from delays or cancellations is that the ticket, as has already been mentioned, is a non-transferable contract between the customer and the air carrier.

Over the past few decades, the airlines have become VERY good at making the verbiage in the contract so that it insulates them from lawsuits for things like not being on time:

Carrier undertakes to use its best efforts to carry the passenger and baggage with reasonable dispatch. Times shown in the timetable or elsewhere are not guaranteed and form no part of this contract. Carrier may without notice substitute alternate carriers or aircraft, and may alter or omit stopping places shown on the ticket in case of necessity. Schedules are subject to change without notice.

When the customer purchases a ticket, they're giving their tacit acceptance to these terms, even if they may not have taken the time to review the terms fully.

"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
robsawatsky
Posts: 477
Joined: Thu Dec 18, 2003 7:07 am

RE: Ticket Has No Value Policy

Fri May 07, 2004 6:08 am

"Furthermore, this game they play with announcing pricing and waiting to see what their competitors do boarders on anti-trust violation. Have you ever noticed that they all act in lock step with one another?"

No, that is called competition. If there was collusion, they would agree to raise prices so they could all make a profit and prices would fluctuate very little.

 
zrs70
Posts: 3313
Joined: Sun Dec 10, 2000 4:08 am

RE: Ticket Has No Value Policy

Fri May 07, 2004 6:47 am

Solution:

If you can't use the ticket, pay the change fee and buy a refundable ticket to anywhere for whatever day you wish. Then, when you have cause to use the ticket, rebook at a restricted rate, get a refund on the refundable part (obviously not to be mroe than the original non-refundable part), and off you go.

No need to pay a fee each time you change.
17 year airliners.net vet! 2000-2016

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