747400sp
Topic Author
Posts: 3845
Joined: Sat Aug 09, 2003 7:27 pm

Was The A320 Built To Compete With The 757

Thu May 13, 2004 9:06 am

I been wondering this for a some time now. The A320 was bigger than 737 300 and I believe it has a longer range. I been told that the a320 was built to go after the 757 market. So anybody who know please tell me.


Thank You
 
mrniji
Posts: 5382
Joined: Sun Feb 29, 2004 11:51 am

RE: Was The A320 Built To Compete With The 757

Thu May 13, 2004 9:09 am

I only know that IC in the mid-80s previously selected the 757 for its operations, but then switched in favor for the A320 (in a political move of the Rajiv Gandhi Govt). This supports your assumption.

I sounds likely that the 320 was supposed not only to compete with the 757, but also with the 737 - especially the development of the 31x-32x family makes it a competitive product against the 737 and 757 (and for some lovers, the 727  Smile )

Interested in some other opinions
"The earth provides enough resources for everyone's need, but not for some people's greed." (Gandhi)
 
Guest

RE: Was The A320 Built To Compete With The 757

Thu May 13, 2004 9:12 am

No, but the 321 was.
 
DfwRevolution
Posts: 8572
Joined: Sat Jan 09, 2010 7:31 pm

RE: Was The A320 Built To Compete With The 757

Thu May 13, 2004 9:23 am

The A320 has a typically carrier 150 pax in a two-class arangement. Given that the 757 typically carrier 225 passengers, I don't see how they compete.

Airbus was not trying to make a flat copy of the 733, but rather trump it. Not unlike Boeing's decision to build the 738 slightly larger than the A320?
 
henpol747
Posts: 563
Joined: Mon Jun 25, 2001 5:53 am

RE: Was The A320 Built To Compete With The 757

Thu May 13, 2004 9:30 am

I don´t think the A320, but the A321 certainly was!!!
Vive la France! ¡Viva México!
 
access-air
Posts: 1576
Joined: Thu Sep 21, 2000 5:30 pm

RE: Was The A320 Built To Compete With The 757

Thu May 13, 2004 9:35 am

No, the A320 was built to diplace the 727 from service...point in fact most every airline that flew 727s (the 200 series) with a typical coach layout of 135 passengers has been replaced with A320s seating a similar lot....

I think we tackled the 757 vs A321 issue in another thread....

Access-Air
Remember, Wherever you go, there you are!!!!
 
gilesdavies
Posts: 2271
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2003 7:51 pm

RE: Was The A320 Built To Compete With The 757

Thu May 13, 2004 9:43 am

Wait until the morning UK and CET time when all the Airbus buffs come online and give their views! (Im only teasing before any one is insulted!!!)

 Smile/happy/getting dizzy  Smile/happy/getting dizzy  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

I definately dont think the A320 or A321 were meant to compete with the 757.

In Europe the Charter Airline market have the A320's and 757's to compliment each other.

There is quite a big difference in range between the A321 and 757 and quite a few other differences between the two.
 
User avatar
RayChuang
Posts: 8005
Joined: Sat Jun 24, 2000 7:43 am

RE: Was The A320 Built To Compete With The 757

Thu May 13, 2004 3:18 pm

The A320 was designed for these following reasons:

1. To replace older Boeing 727's.

2. To produce a true single-aisle airliner of European origin that replaced the aging Caravelle, Trident and Mercure fleets.
 
AirframeAS
Posts: 9811
Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2004 3:56 pm

RE: Was The A320 Built To Compete With The 757

Thu May 13, 2004 3:19 pm

I thought the A318/19/20 was to go after the 737 family, classic and NG. And the A321 was to go after the 752.
A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
 
ua777222
Posts: 2987
Joined: Mon Dec 22, 2003 11:23 am

RE: Was The A320 Built To Compete With The 757

Thu May 13, 2004 3:21 pm

I think that the A320 was for the B737-7/8/900 but that the A321 was for the 757. They both share the same size and range. It's a bummer to see the 757 production line shut down.. :-(


UA777222
"It wasn't raining when Noah built the ark."
 
AirframeAS
Posts: 9811
Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2004 3:56 pm

RE: Was The A320 Built To Compete With The 757

Thu May 13, 2004 3:27 pm

The A320 was built WAYYYYYYY before the 736, 73G, 738 and 739 ever came into existance so there was no way it would be in competition against each other like it is now. Just my opinion, but I could be wrong.
A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
 
mark777300
Posts: 377
Joined: Wed Apr 21, 2004 3:30 pm

RE: Was The A320 Built To Compete With The 757

Thu May 13, 2004 3:27 pm

I was always under the impression that the A320 was built to compete with aircrafts within the 150 pax category, 737-300/400, MD-80/90 family. But the 757 was a slightly larger aircraft than the A320 to be a direct competitor. The A321 was more of a competitor.
 
col
Posts: 1692
Joined: Thu Nov 27, 2003 2:11 am

RE: Was The A320 Built To Compete With The 757

Thu May 13, 2004 6:37 pm

The 757 and 320 were designed to replace the 727, just as every man and his dog designed a plane to replace DC3. The 757 was too much of a plane, hence fewer orders, whereas the 320 was direct replacement. Boeing also produced the 734 to do same thing. Airbus then did the 321, 319, 318 to give it a family to compete with 737. The Airbus family took a few years to develop, which is why the 737NG has sold so many so quickly, the family was developed over a very short period.

So you could say that they did compete for a specific market, but the 757 had more capability in other areas, and opened up other markets.
 
User avatar
solnabo
Posts: 5015
Joined: Fri Jan 11, 2008 8:53 am

RE: Was The A320 Built To Compete With The 757

Thu May 13, 2004 7:31 pm

Boeing quits 757 in Oct-04, thats an open market for 321, dont you think? If A-bus buildt a 321-300 (HGW, and with bogies?) they would fill that gap, or do you think I´m dead wrong?
Just my 25 öre Big grin

Michael//SE
Airbus SAS - Love them both
 
col
Posts: 1692
Joined: Thu Nov 27, 2003 2:11 am

RE: Was The A320 Built To Compete With The 757

Thu May 13, 2004 7:52 pm

The 321 already flies across USA, US Airways. By making HGW you may need wing and engine changes. Are you thinking of European charter airlines?
 
azmd80
Posts: 276
Joined: Tue Nov 11, 2003 8:19 pm

RE: Was The A320 Built To Compete With The 757

Thu May 13, 2004 8:37 pm

No I think that 757 and a321 are not direct competitor, or almost not ever.
A321 is a streched version with lower range than a320, 757 is an aircraft born for medium range (some atlantic also) route without penalization.
They are competitor only in short high density route or charter where dey do the same works.

Bie
 
skymileman
Posts: 577
Joined: Sat Jul 21, 2001 2:32 am

RE: Was The A320 Built To Compete With The 757

Thu May 13, 2004 8:50 pm

I don't know about the A320, but I have always thought that the A321 sure looks like a 757, so I bet it was.
 
COAB767
Posts: 1313
Joined: Thu Nov 13, 2003 6:32 pm

RE: Was The A320 Built To Compete With The 757

Thu May 13, 2004 9:10 pm

I believe the A320 was built to compete with The Boeing 737-400 series.
Continental Micronesia: "Fly With The Warmth Of Paradise"
 
col
Posts: 1692
Joined: Thu Nov 27, 2003 2:11 am

RE: Was The A320 Built To Compete With The 757

Thu May 13, 2004 10:59 pm

The 321 in USA is used on same mission as 757. 757 is better on longer haul flights out of USA, where 321 does not have range. Not sure what percantage is, but I would guess that 321 can cover a high percentage of 757 routes on domestic USA flights today.

When Airbus first came out with 320 in 1984, it was designed as 727 replacement. It entered service in Apr 1988. The 734 was developed to expand 737 family and compete with 320, and entered service in Oct 1988.
 
747400sp
Topic Author
Posts: 3845
Joined: Sat Aug 09, 2003 7:27 pm

RE: Was The A320 Built To Compete With The 757

Fri May 14, 2004 12:36 am

The 757 was design and built as a 727 replacement. It looks like the Boeing over built the 757 which is a good thing.
 
dutchjet
Posts: 7714
Joined: Sat Oct 14, 2000 6:13 am

RE: Was The A320 Built To Compete With The 757

Fri May 14, 2004 12:59 am

Its interesting to look at a time line and what was going on as the 737, 757 and 32X series were developed. Until the mid 1980s, the 727 dominated the short to medium haul fleet of many airlines, especially the large US carriers. Many carriers that purchased 727s in the 1960s simply replaced them with new 727s in the late 1970s and early 1980s.

The 733 was basically a follow-up of the 732, more seats, better range and new features.....the original plan was for the 732 and 733 to remain in production side by side, but to increase sales and to satisfy customer demand, Boeing went on to develop the 734 and 735.....the 734 with more capacity was a type of 72S replacement but it did not sell well in the US and the 735 carried on for the 732. The 734 was more aimed at the MD80 series than anything else.

The 757 was designed and developed to be a 757 replacement, the original 757-100 had about the same passenger capacity of the 72S but this model never went into production. Launch customers EA and BA convinced Boeing to build the 752 as both wanted the extra seats......early customer DL agreed and the 752 became the baseline aircraft. However, the 757 ended up being a lot more aircraft than the 72S, with the ability to fly US transcon and even trans-atlantic flights as well as the more typcial 500-1500 mile segments flown by the 72S and carry about 30 more passengers. The 757 sold in huge numbers, but never really replaced the 72S.......there was a hole in Boeing's lineup between the 734 and 757.....Boeing did not have an exact replacement for the 72S.

About then, Airbus was thn developing its single-aisle airliner series and very smartly sized the first model, the A320, at 150 seats, which just happened to be the perfect size as a 72S replacement and the airliner sold well because it was the right size and the right time. Many airlines purchased the A320 as 72S replacements. The later A319 and A321 expanded the market, with the A319 being a sensible replacement for 733/734 aircraft and the A321 adding more seats......although the A321 carries roughly the same number of passengers as the 757, they are very different aircraft with the 757 having more range and capability (nothing against Airbus, that was the intent of the design). The A321 is ideal for high density short to medium haul operations, and can fly many of the routes that a 757 can, but the 757 is designed to do more.

With the later 737NG, Boeing updated the 737 line to fill the gaps in its lineup. While the 736 is the same size as the 732/736, and the 73G is the same size as the 733, the 738 was streched and is larger than the 734 so that the 738 could directly replace the 72S (which it has in many cases, examples are AA and DL) and better compete with the A320. The so-far unpopular 739 is a simple strech of the 738 to add more seats at the cost of range - look for Boeing to improve the 739 in the near future as it is now Boeing's largest narrow-body.
 
bmacleod
Posts: 2499
Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2001 3:10 am

RE: Was The A320 Built To Compete With The 757

Fri May 14, 2004 1:26 am

The 321 looks more like a 757 so I believe it's main competition was the 757. I know AC chose the 320 to replace its 727s and the 319 to replace its DC-9s. The 319 was also a good replacement for older 737s such as the 737-200.
"What good are wings without the courage to fly?" - Atticus
 
sandiaman
Posts: 85
Joined: Thu Nov 20, 2003 1:53 am

RE: Was The A320 Built To Compete With The 757

Fri May 14, 2004 1:45 am

You might say that changing market conditions favored the 737 and A320 over the 757. There's a good article written by R. Aboulafia on the subject the the 757 entitled "Requiem for a Narrowbody"

An interesting quote from the article:

"A new “clean sheet of paper” aircraft designed today for the 757 market would look a lot like the 757. The intriguing aspect of the 757’s demise is that this is the first Boeing jetliner program to end because of market conditions, not technological obsolescence."

The full article can be found at this link:

http://www.aiaa.org/aerospace/Article.cfm?issuetocid=451
 
gigneil
Posts: 14133
Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2002 10:25 am

RE: Was The A320 Built To Compete With The 757

Fri May 14, 2004 1:50 am

The 321 looks more like a 757 so I believe it's main competition was the 757.

I don't understand why looks matter. Yes, they had overlapping seat counts but the 757 was in a different performance class.

The 739 now competes with the 321.

N

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Abraham00, Baidu [Spider], Blankbarcode, EIA359, Elmdon, euroflyer, ezola, IslandRob, KarelXWB, LAX772LR, nipoel123, nu, tnotten and 203 guests