VSXA380X800
Topic Author
Posts: 401
Joined: Wed May 19, 2004 10:03 am

No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 12:12 am

It was proven that the A380 will not be operating in North America. Fedex wasn't really a mile stone that could be prove that it is possible to operate the A380 in North America. UPS chance their mind and otp for the A380 than the A300. May I remind you that this was the same thing the 747 went though.

747.
1. Was made to be a cargo transporter for the military
A380
1. Was made to be a Super Jumbo for Commercial Aviation.
747
2. Wasn't successful in the military but won over with the airlines.
A380
2. Was successful with the airlines in Asia and Europe freighter version was successful with one American Cargo Airline Fedex.
747
3. Growing faster than predicted, became a very successfully, starting with very little believers it still became successful.
A380
3. My prediction is that when the airlines see how sufficient the A380 is on long hall routes they will start to buy the A380s. This is what BA is doing to see if the A380 is capable to do what it was mend to do.

In the end no one can see how the A380 could replace or even become as successful as the 747.
Just wait and see.

THIS IS NOT MENT TO BE A VS B WAR . PLEASE. Please try to be mature about the situation.

Thanks
4 decks 4 engines 4 long haul
 
Alitalia744
Posts: 3777
Joined: Thu Mar 30, 2000 8:22 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 12:16 am

my opinion is that you are trying to start an a vs. b war -

comparing the 747 to the A380 with a challenging statement like "THINK AGAIN."

Let's face it - UAL is downsizing, AA is not interested, DL is not interested, CO is not interested

Your only hope is NWA and again - currently not interested.

so in the end - to quote you - 'try to be mature about the situation.'
Some see lines, others see between the lines.
 
artsyman
Posts: 4516
Joined: Wed Feb 28, 2001 12:35 pm

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 12:17 am

The difference in this case is that the US carriers have been on a very clear path of downsizing for a long time now, and seem to prefer frequency to size. They have been removing the 747 out of their fleets as it is, and if they do not need the 747 capacity, then why would they need the A380 capacity.

While I am sure that some US carriers routes could use it, these planes really need to be able to be filled year round in order to make some decent returns and thus will more than likely not be ordered.


J
 
7e72004
Posts: 3440
Joined: Thu Apr 01, 2004 12:15 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 12:19 am

I don't know about anybody else but i am tired of this a v. b crap. Let's just see what happens in 2006 and 2008...shall we  Big thumbs up
The next generation of aircraft is just around the corner!
 
cancidas
Posts: 3985
Joined: Thu Jul 03, 2003 7:34 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 12:29 am

i for one don't think that this airplanes makes much sense economically. there are few markets where you need to carry that many people. think of the cost in human life if someone really wanted to bring one down, and you know what... people like that exist. ah well, lets just wait and see.
"...cannot the kingdom of salvation take me home."
 
VSXA380X800
Topic Author
Posts: 401
Joined: Wed May 19, 2004 10:03 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 12:31 am

Comparing the 380 and the 747 is not starting a A vs B war according to my terms . On airliners.net a healthy debate is needed. Why would I start a war between two manufactures. ??. People say that no North American Airline will accept the A380s. What makes you think that those airlines will not change their minds after they see the many A380s being operated be the Cargo Airlines and what makes you think that there won't be any new North American airlines looking for something like a A380.
Who cares is American Airlines does not chose to by the A380s  Insane ,they don't even have a 747 or an aircraft that can hold as much as it. American airlines wasn't on the list on trying interest in the A380s.
I'm trying to show that being bias on a aircraft or a aircraft manufacture will not last. The Americans were bias on the 747 aircraft and how long did that last ???
4 decks 4 engines 4 long haul
 
Vorticity
Posts: 324
Joined: Thu May 20, 2004 9:09 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 12:32 am

Unfortunately you cannot simply compare the rollout of the 747 with the A380. They were designed differently, marketed differently, and all in different times.

Currently it doesn't look like the major US passenger carriers are interested, but we'll see what the future holds.
Thermodynamics and english units don't mix...
 
DIA
Posts: 3053
Joined: Sun Jan 28, 2001 2:24 pm

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 12:34 am

IMO: I know that we will all see the A380 flying about in a few years. . .so I just look forward to the awesome photos they will generate. In terms of the airlines/cargo carriers ordering the type. . .they will come in time. Maybe less than Airbus expected. . .maybe more.
Ding! You are now free to keep supporting Frontier.
 
VSXA380X800
Topic Author
Posts: 401
Joined: Wed May 19, 2004 10:03 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 12:41 am

If I can not compare the A380 to the 747,(Vorticity), why are people doing it.

Than that means that the A380 is way out of the 747-400 league. Should I then compare the 747-5/600s??, Even though they were dropped
4 decks 4 engines 4 long haul
 
scottysair
Posts: 6442
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2000 4:07 pm

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 1:12 am

They don't have any orders with new A380 for American Operator. Maybe will see them in the future and they already make orders with FedEx to A380.
 
PHXinterrupted
Posts: 461
Joined: Thu Apr 25, 2002 6:41 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 1:34 am

"THIS IS NOT MENT TO BE A VS B WAR . PLEASE. Please try to be mature about the situation."

Wow, sure sounds like it! You didn't provide any new information, only your opinion on how great YOU think the 380 is going to be. Lame.

Keepin' it real.
 
mark777300
Posts: 377
Joined: Wed Apr 21, 2004 3:30 pm

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 1:51 am

It's still ridiculous to compare the A380 to the 744 when the A380 will seat 100 more passengers than the 747. So would you say that this warrants a direct competion? Aside from UA and NWA, no other us carrier has expressed any interest in an aircraft the size of the 744 let alone even the 773ER or the A346. Taking this into account, why would we then believe that the A380 would be of any interest to US carriers? It's not an A vs B war, it's just simple facts that you can clearly see. That doesn't mean that any airline won't change their minds down the road, but when you factor in the trends that US airlines have been following over the past years and when you also factor in LCC's into the market, you find yourself looking at the possibilities as being slim. Most US carriers have been content with widebody twins to solve their long range high capacity needs. On the cargo side? Sure, I wouldn't rule out the possibilities of seeing an A380 in UPS colors one day. But like I said before, read the stats on the A380 and compare it with the 744, they may be used in similar markets, but the A380 is a much larger aircraft to even consider it to be a competitor to the 744. They simply both hold their own categories.
 
7e72004
Posts: 3440
Joined: Thu Apr 01, 2004 12:15 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 1:56 am

I just don't see any US airlines ordering the A380...especially right in the middle of this economy downturn in the airline business. I have to even wonder about ATA looking at other aircraft..considering they just replaced their fleet.
The next generation of aircraft is just around the corner!
 
bjg231
Posts: 157
Joined: Thu May 20, 2004 2:30 pm

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 2:20 am

"747.
1. Was made to be a cargo transporter for the military "



I was always under the impression that the 747 was designed specifically for Pan Am and its long haul routes. Where did you get this from?
If at first you don't succeed, then skydiving is not for you.
 
garnetpalmetto
Posts: 5351
Joined: Tue Oct 21, 2003 1:38 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 2:30 am

The statement that the 747 was designed to be a cargo aircraft for the USAF is not entirely correct. The 747 was designed, in part, after Boeing's failure to win the contract for a large cargo aircraft (Lockheed won that contract, which resulted in the C-5). In desparation, Boeing designed the 747, Pan Am ran with it, and the rest is history. While the 747 did incorporate some of the lessons learned from Boeing's failed attempt at winning the contract, it hardly is the same aircraft.
South Carolina - too small to be its own country, too big to be a mental asylum.
 
startknob
Posts: 148
Joined: Tue May 11, 2004 11:43 pm

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 2:36 am

It was proven that the A380 will not be operating in North America.
A: Any evidence for this funny thesis? URLs? Sources?
B: If you want to bet money on that, be kindly advised to keep the sum you'll loose low. I'll be back in this forum exactly on 21st May 2010 and think that besides regular services to LAX, SFO, EWR and JFK of course there will be 380s flying at least between these routes.

Fedex wasn't really a mile stone that could be prove that it is possible to operate the A380 in North America.
A: Any evidence for this funny thesis? URLs? Sources?
B: I admire people very much that are able to foresee the future.
C: If it's about operations, everywhere a 777 could land an A380 would be able to land even today. The rest is done in the years to come. Keep cool and get used to the idea to see the A380 flying - even in the USA.

In the end no one can see how the A380 could replace or even become as successful as the 747.
SQ orders A380 to replace A310's or what?
QF orders A380 to replace ATR72's or what?
Oh yeah!
- Early 747s will be phased out by the A346 and perhaps 777ERs for the same demand class unless Boeing maybe comes up with a 747X, Adv, XYZ thingie.
- For lower demand there is a variety of options for airlines to replace 747-Service.
- And for higher demand - guess it - A380. Especially on slot restricted or "full" airports.


Please keep in mind that the A380 was NOT repeat NOT designed or built for the US market.
It's a tool to get more people moved with the same number of slots in slot-restricted or "full" airports, especially in the Far East, Australia, China, the Mid-East and Europe. If you please would be so kind to go to the "Website of evil" and have a look at the marketing materials of the A380 you'll find a LOT about everything - but the US.

Besides that - all this has been written by non-American a.netters now over and over again and obviously only a few ones in the US want/like/have heard it.

Yes, it's true: The A 380 was NOT designed for North America.

Yes, it's true: The A 380 has no need to fly in the US and would be still a success. But despite of this it will fly to and in the US also (as mentioned above)

Yes, it's true: the A380 will phase out a Lot of 747s, together with the 346 even more.

Sorry Boeing, sorry America. But this is the way it's just running wherever you look.

Please let me add one thing: BIGGER IS NOT AUTOMATICALLY BETTER!
It's so common to Americans that they implicate BIGGER with BETTER ("Texas is bigger than France" etc.) Have you ever thought about the "tremendous" micro-mechanic abilities of an Elephant? Or just do a google about the "tremendous success" of the biggest flying boat ever, the Dornier Do-X.

Please make up your minds. Only because A has a bigger plane in the pipeline B is far from being busted! Perhaps the strategy behind the A380 (concentration) is wrong and the strategy behind the is right 7E7 (segmentation). That would maybe lead in Billions of $'s sunk by Airbus and a tremendous success for the 7E7. And then? Is Bigger still better?
Think twice! And perhaps both strategies are correct and valid? Think again.


Airbus is seemingly very proud that especially many of our US-a.netters flash, blame, hate, bash and bang the A 380 as it would be the combination of devil and hell in form of an airplane. Why Airbus is proud of this? Because it shows (besides uncertainty and fear concerning Boeing) a LOT of respect of these people in the abilities of Airbus. These guys don't hope but being everything but sure, that Airbus is despite all odds simply makes it happen - again.

For being "only" 30 years in the biz of civil aircraft and manufacturing "only" civil aircraft this imposing and great level of US-American respect and consciousness for their work and their abilities are a thing Airbus can really be proud of.

Thank you, guys!  Wink/being sarcastic
Best Regards,

Kojak

[Edited 2004-05-21 19:44:12]

[Edited 2004-05-21 19:45:47]
When playing cat and mice it's imperative to know, who's the cat.
 
User avatar
PA110
Posts: 1897
Joined: Sat Dec 06, 2003 1:30 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 2:37 am

As previously stated here, the U.S. carriers have been concentrating on frequency rather than capacity. They have been downsizing aircraft so that they can operate more than one frequency to certain destinations, without flooding the market with excess capacity. This is a good strategy, because it takes maximum advantage of alliance partner banks of connections, and at the same time allows the O&D business travel greater flexibility. I can't see the U.S. majors reversing this policy anytime soon. Even NW is ultimately downsizing their 747 and DC10 service to Asia to A332 aircraft as they come into the fleet.
It's been swell, but the swelling has gone down.
 
ltbewr
Posts: 12362
Joined: Thu Jan 29, 2004 1:24 pm

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 2:57 am

I would say that maybe 5-8 years from now, 2 USA based carriers will have several A380's to serve important slot restricted airports and to remain competitive with non-USA airlines. Most likely would be with those airlines that have already or will have large numbers of Airbus a/c. I could see them in/out of JFK, LAX and maybe ORD servicing LHR, various major far east and European cities. While frequency on more mid-range a/c may be desirable from some, after a while, IF demand grows, then must go to larger a/c if cannot expand frequency.
 
taca
Posts: 134
Joined: Mon Feb 11, 2013 7:50 pm

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 3:03 am

Just a couple of questions:

Does anybody knows when is the A380 schedule to perform it's first testing flight (i.e. not exact date, but approximately)?

Which is going the very first airline receiving that beauty?

Thanks,
 
User avatar
PA110
Posts: 1897
Joined: Sat Dec 06, 2003 1:30 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 3:08 am

Does anybody knows when is the A380 schedule to perform it's first testing flight (i.e. not exact date, but approximately)?

That depends on if they ever get the thing assembled. There have been numerous recent threads concerning assembly problems, thwarted by environmentalists across Europe. They can't seem to ship the wings to the main assembly plan in Toulouse due to size restrictions of the ferry boat, and then they can't seem to fly it to Hamburg for final fittings and paint without extending the runway.
It's been swell, but the swelling has gone down.
 
Danny
Posts: 3714
Joined: Thu Apr 25, 2002 3:44 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 3:08 am

Once foreign carriers gain competetive advantage on highest load routes using 380, US ones will have to reconsider it.
Think how precious are slots at LHR. Operating 767 or 777 as a competition for 380 would not be smart.

Daniel
 
startknob
Posts: 148
Joined: Tue May 11, 2004 11:43 pm

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 3:09 am

@Taca:
(1) 1st A380 is currently in static testing (bend the wings until they brake) and will never fly. The second one built will be the first one to fly, scheduled in spring correction! 2005. Enginge tests are underway on a A340 currently on schedule and over expectations.

(2) SQ.

Best Regards,

Kojak

[Edited 2004-05-21 20:14:43]

[Edited 2004-05-21 20:21:11]
When playing cat and mice it's imperative to know, who's the cat.
 
irishpower
Posts: 370
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2003 2:18 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 3:14 am

Only time will tell if any US carriers will buy the A380--in the mean time "WHO CARES"!!!!--This is all speculation anyway. If the A380 is chosen by UA or NWA--GREAT, if not-FINE. Why do we ALWAYS have to fight this ridiculous campaign of "what if's".

Come on people---Boeing fan's--It doesn't matter
Airbus fan's---It doesn't matter

Both aircraft are pretty @#$#%$# COOL!!! Include in that statement the 772,773,772LR,773ER,7e7,A330,A342,A343,A345,A346!!!
 
N766UA
Posts: 7843
Joined: Thu Jul 29, 1999 3:50 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 3:14 am

Okay, for the first several lines I had no idea what you were talking about. As a result, I'm simply going to reply to your topic line: FedEx is an American operator and one of the first to order the A380, so....yeah that negates your topic right there. Otherwise, good work trying to start a riot.

THIS IS NOT MENT TO BE A VS B WAR . PLEASE. Please try to be mature about the situation.

My ass.
This Website Censors Me
 
SonicKidatBWI
Posts: 154
Joined: Thu Feb 19, 2004 4:03 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 3:19 am



Bjg231

I thought that most every aviation enthusiast knew the story behind the 747. as Garnetpalmetto stated, the 747 was designed in response to a need for a very large military transport for the U.S. Army. The Lockheed C-5A design won out. Boeing was then left with a very large and very capable aircraft and they converted the program towards commerical/passenger services. PanAm needed an aircraft larger than a 707 and the 747 seated twice as much. So, thus came the entry of the 747 into service with PAA.

 
n757kw
Posts: 387
Joined: Sat Sep 13, 2003 3:08 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 3:31 am

Being from a cargo carrier, I have a question. I understand that the A380F will not have a nose door. Will this change? I seem to remember the cockpit is in the way.

I realize that this might not be a big deal, but I have loaded many shipments thru the nose door on the B747. I just wish we were not height limited to 96". Granted many other freighters do not have a nose door.

Also, you are going to have to lift pallets up pretty high to get to the second main deck. Does anybody know what kind of weight the pallets can be on the second maindeck?

N757KW
"What we've got here, is failure to communicate." from Cool Hand Luke
 
DfwRevolution
Posts: 8549
Joined: Sat Jan 09, 2010 7:31 pm

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Agai

Sat May 22, 2004 3:37 am

I'll be back in this forum exactly on 21st May 2010 and think that besides regular services to LAX, SFO, EWR and JFK of course there will be 380s flying at least between these routes.

On 5/21/10 brag all you want, but in 2006 when the A380 enters service, have fun taking a bus out to the plane at these airports.

If it's about operations, everywhere a 777 could land an A380 would be able to land even today

Not true. The pavement a 777 lands on could land an A380, but in terms of runway length and taxiway width... you are very limited with the A380.

Keep cool and get used to the idea to see the A380 flying - even in the USA

By FedEx and forgein carriers flying into the U.S. In major fleet planning, carriers like AA, UA, and DL need to start thinking about a 762/763 replacement in the next 5-10 years, and I don't think that aircraft will be the A380. They don't need the A380 to be competitive with international carriers, UA and AA have pleanty of slots at LHR, I could go on...

The A380 is a niche-market aircraft, IMO the true demand for a 550+ seater is still 2 decades away.

"Texas is bigger than France"

And don't you forget it  Big thumbs up
 
VSXA380X800
Topic Author
Posts: 401
Joined: Wed May 19, 2004 10:03 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 4:32 am

My opinion is that you are trying to start an a vs. B war

well you are absolutely wrong.


Yeah that negates your topic right there. Otherwise, good work trying to start a riot.

THIS IS NOT MENT TO BE A VS B WAR . PLEASE. Please try to be mature about the situation.
My ass.


Then what the F$*K do you think I should say  Pissed . --Hello I hate Boeing, Airbus has better aircrafts than Boeing. Boeing is too greedy, wanting too much at once, building the 7e7 and the 747x at the same time, how greedy--COME ON !!!!!!. If I wanted to say that I would have centuries ago. If I said this wasn't a goddamn A VS B war then it is not!!!!  Angry. It started with one simple statement and it continued to become a A vs B war. Trying put out a positive response towards Airbus in general and what happens, the bashing begins, and it was mostly, not mostly, EVERY American had a negative response. This topic was eaten up and regurgitated out. I'm disgusted!!

4 decks 4 engines 4 long haul
 
VSXA380X800
Topic Author
Posts: 401
Joined: Wed May 19, 2004 10:03 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 4:41 am

Topic Closed, ENDED , FIN. To end all the unnessary riots

Thanks for you replys and interest on the topic.

This topic has died as of now
4 decks 4 engines 4 long haul
 
nucsh
Posts: 181
Joined: Mon Apr 26, 2004 12:29 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 5:41 am

It started with one simple statement and it continued to become a A vs B war. Trying put out a positive response towards Airbus in general and what happens, the bashing begins, and it was mostly, not mostly, EVERY American had a negative response. This topic was eaten up and regurgitated out. I'm disgusted!!

I like the "American" remark. Edit: <--- *SARCASM* Just because we're "American" does not mean we have an inherant hate and a will to bash all companies/manufacturers that aren't American. I truely dont believe that the A380 is going to work, even in the desired routes. The only region I would ever see it succeeding in is Asia because of the vast population concentraion.

See, me not likeing the A380 without say a dang thing about Airbus. And, I guaruntee you, if you hadn't of mentioned the "don't want this to be an a vs. b war", no one would have said anything as harsh as they did. Its just the fact that you brought the *possibility* to everyones attention, that they blew up at the notion.

Im sorry, VSXA380, but you handled this topic totally wrong. Please, learn some compassion for other peoples feelings and ideas. You not an aviation "God", stop acting like one.
If landing is about "kissing" the ground, you just about raped it.
 
User avatar
Aaron747
Posts: 8529
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2003 2:07 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 5:43 am

Dear god what a stupid thread - how do we get dragged into this crap?
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
 
DIA
Posts: 3053
Joined: Sun Jan 28, 2001 2:24 pm

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 5:45 am

I'm an American and I don't think my post was at all negative. Careful on your borderline racist remarks there. . .
Ding! You are now free to keep supporting Frontier.
 
planesarecool
Posts: 3208
Joined: Sun Nov 11, 2001 12:37 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 5:52 am

Instead of bashing a topic why don't you ignore it if you don't like it. And stop going on about all this Airbus vs. Boeing crap. The way you guys seem to moan about A vs. B "wars" annoys me more than anything.

-Stephen
 
NWA742
Posts: 4505
Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2002 11:35 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 5:53 am

Dear god what a stupid thread - how do we get dragged into this crap?

Just another bullshit thread, all it is. Threads like these start when a biased author makes the tone and voice of the thread as though to ask for an argument. Then, ironically, the author says that it's not intended to ignite a war, but look what happens.

Another problem on these boards are the individuals who are, by all obvious accounts, very biased towards one company/country or another, yet will come up with whatever bullshit they can to deny it.

It's very easy to point a lot of people like that out.



-NWA742
Some people are like slinkies - not good for anything, but they bring a smile to your face when pushed down the stairs
 
VSXA380X800
Topic Author
Posts: 401
Joined: Wed May 19, 2004 10:03 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 5:57 am

I SAID THANK YOU!.

I have some learning to do, according to Nucsh.

You not an aviation "God", stop acting like one.

What the heck gave you that idea.

IM sorry, VSXA380, but you handled this topic totally wrong

I said three things... BANG BANG I'm dead, THAT was wrong.

I like the "American" remark. Edit: <--- *SARCASM*

HELLO, this topic was domninated by Americans( I have absolutly nothing agaisnt them) Like I said and I stand strongly to it. I'm disgusted by how this topic was eaten and regugertated out.
4 decks 4 engines 4 long haul
 
User avatar
STT757
Posts: 13176
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2000 1:14 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 5:58 am

VSXA380X800 is obviously new, my advice is to him/her is tone down the rhetoric.
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
aviatortj
Posts: 1694
Joined: Wed Jul 16, 2003 9:15 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 5:58 am

You have a big mouth for a 13-15 yr old! Be careful not to bite off more than you can chew. Eg: This thread.
 
planesarecool
Posts: 3208
Joined: Sun Nov 11, 2001 12:37 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 6:06 am

Oh so now we're bashing people by age. "Heh, the person who started this topic is only aged 13-15 so its bound to be completely bullshit."

Like I said, if you don't like a topic don't post in it, it's YOU who starts all the disputes.

-Stephen

PS. VSXA380X800, i see your reasonably new to the site. Welcome to a.net, sorry if you have been given a bad impression by some of these people. We're not all like that  Big grin
 
VSXA380X800
Topic Author
Posts: 401
Joined: Wed May 19, 2004 10:03 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 6:15 am

I know, I couldn't have been any more proud of my big mouth. I don't care what you think of me.

NWA742 What in gods name are you talking about.

I may have a big mouth but I am absolutely not bias or racist. I have not mentioned anything negative towards Boeing. I was raised to think freely of what I believe in, like everyone else.

4 decks 4 engines 4 long haul
 
VSXA380X800
Topic Author
Posts: 401
Joined: Wed May 19, 2004 10:03 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 6:22 am

You were the first person to welcome me to A.net, thank you. And I believe that the people on A.net is not usually like this. I don't really believe in first impressions I usually give a second chance. Although an exception was made today
4 decks 4 engines 4 long haul
 
VS11
Posts: 876
Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2001 6:34 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 6:38 am

You all seem to ignore the fact the A380 will allow the airlines to offer a very different flying experience from what currently flying is. Especially for the premium passengers so many ideas have been suggested by the airlines (notably VS, naturellement) : private suites, showers, game arcades, lounges and what not. Imagine what that means for passengers flying from Australia to Europe or the US. Even a short hop over the Atlantic can be an entirely different experience.

The US carriers may be in bad shape now but the US airline industry is slowly but steadily becoming healthier. True, all of the airlines are now like vultures waiting to see which one will go bust first, and frankly there are so many of them that most of them would make a good bet. The industry will eventually undergo certain transformations and there will be fewer but healthier carriers. This process is very similar to the one happening to European carriers, a process that the German Lufthansa CEO had predicted after 9/11 that in Europe there will be eventually only 3-4 big carriers, and this is what is currently happening - KLM was merged with Air France. Swiss is wobbly, so is Alitalia. The process of merging to stay competitive will continue and so will happen in the US.

I frankly fail to imagine why a US carrier would not want to use the A380 for a 14-hour flight to Australia or to Hong Kong non-stop. For instance, now only CO flights direct to HKG non stop from the East Coast and the return flights are usually weight restricted.

The situation is very similar to the GSM standard. American companies and government were so cocky about their mobile phone standards and were anti-GSM a few years ago, and see what happens now: T-mobile and AT&T both offer ever expanding GSM networks.

Competition will have the final word. If US carriers face stronger competition from other carriers due to A380, rest assured they will get it. Even CO, that Boeing fortress  Smile/happy/getting dizzy wouldn't wait to get one  Smile/happy/getting dizzy Bethune is not everlasting...

VS11
 
NWA742
Posts: 4505
Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2002 11:35 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 6:40 am

NWA742 What in gods name are you talking about.

I may have a big mouth but I am absolutely not bias or racist. I have not mentioned anything negative towards Boeing. I was raised to think freely of what I believe in, like everyone else.


I think you are biased, I never called you racist.

Here some a couple of quotes from you:

Why is the bashing being directed towards Airbus. I never see anyone bash any other manufacture. Especially Americans.

I'm not a fan of Boeing

First off, you're new here so you don't know crap about what happens here. An instant correction for you: There are just as many people bashing Boeing around here as there are Airbus. Take a look around, don't just focus on Airbus.

Then you say you're not a fan of Boeing, and obviously you are a big fan of Airbus, so why are you trying to say you're not biased?

the 747 is way to out dated............It will be absolutely useless once the airlines notice how more effecting the A380 will be.

This shows your extremely limited intelligence to the industry.

Do I have to even tell you that the 747 (744 if you'd like) is not an out-dated aircraft? It is perfectly modern and does the job like a modern airliner should.

Do I have to tell you that airlines will not replace 744s with A380s They're entirely different categories of aircraft, they have nothing to do with eachother at all. There is not an aircraft that Airbus offers that directly competes with the 744, not one at all.

You don't seem to know even the basic ABCs of the airline/aviation industry.

You act like you know it all with your big mouth, but the truth begs to differ.



-NWA742
Some people are like slinkies - not good for anything, but they bring a smile to your face when pushed down the stairs
 
NWA742
Posts: 4505
Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2002 11:35 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 6:43 am

You all seem to ignore the fact the A380 will allow the airlines to offer a very different flying experience from what currently flying is. Especially for the premium passengers so many ideas have been suggested by the airlines (notably VS, naturellement) : private suites, showers, game arcades, lounges and what not.

Wrong. Most, if not all airlines, that will operate A380s, will operate them stuffed with seats, NOT swimming pools, hotel rooms, showers, arcades, shopping malls, and whatever else. Aircraft the size of the 744, 773, A346, etc, are perfectly capable of several amenities on board, but do you see them, no, and there's a perfect reason for that.



-NWA742
Some people are like slinkies - not good for anything, but they bring a smile to your face when pushed down the stairs
 
Blackbird1331
Posts: 1740
Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2004 10:47 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 7:06 am

So you want American companies to buy the 380. No problem. They will form a consortium and buy a bunch of used 380s, then they will remove the wings, cut off the nose and tails and connect them to build a tunnel from EWR to JFK and solve the problem of connecting flights between the two airports.

Relax. I believe in free trade. If everyone is doing their job, and one company does better than the other, then maybe it is just that the best man won.
Cameras shoot pictures. Guns shoot people. They have the guns.
 
VS11
Posts: 876
Joined: Mon Jul 02, 2001 6:34 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 7:12 am

NWA742,

I do not think you are right. Airlines differ and those that are innovative will make a better use of the space. To the best of my knowledge, currently only VS offers bars and beauty therapy on board. Many other airlines could do the same but they do not. So, your conclusion is fairly inappropriate. A380 is a tool. How you use it (or any other tools), depends on your skills, intelligence and experience.

VS11
 
Vorticity
Posts: 324
Joined: Thu May 20, 2004 9:09 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 7:14 am

If I can not compare the A380 to the 747,(Vorticity), why are people doing it.

Than that means that the A380 is way out of the 747-400 league. Should I then compare the 747-5/600s??, Even though they were dropped


I said you cannot simply compare the two. Which is to mean it is not an easy comparison that can be made with 3 bullet points. Estimating a market, deciding what kind of a product to make, determining who would buy it, and how much to sell it for... that's no small task. It takes many high paid people a long time to develop a good analysis.

By all means you can compare, but I believe drawing on the original 747's introduction and reaching meaningful conclusions will take more than a few bullet points. This is in no way saying anything bad about the A380, I'm just saying it's a complex thing to study. No hard feelings bud.
Thermodynamics and english units don't mix...
 
VSXA380X800
Topic Author
Posts: 401
Joined: Wed May 19, 2004 10:03 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 7:16 am

WOULD YOU SHUT UP!!! And you say I've got a big mouth


''I'm not a fan of Boeing''

So what if i'm not a fan that doesn't mean I hate the Manufacture nor bias towards it. I bet your not a fan of airbus.


Then you say you're not a fan of Boeing, and obviously you are a big fan of Airbus

would you stop making assumptions There are hundreds of aircraft manufactures WORLD WIDE!!!. There is Embraer, Aerospatiale, BAC, Bombardier, CRJ, McDonnell Douglas.I could go on!!


Do I have to even tell you that the 747 (744 if you'd like) is not an out-dated aircraft?

When I said that the 747 was out dated I was not saying it is out dated by it technology. It is out dated by it air frame and design. It may have been extended, has more seats than in first 747, so what it is still 30 years old! You not going to beat me down into submission. it does not work that way- with me !!
4 decks 4 engines 4 long haul
 
727200er
Posts: 301
Joined: Tue Mar 09, 2004 5:18 pm

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 7:46 am

Ok first off the 744 is NOT a 30 year old design. There is very little that you can take from a 744 and use on a 741. They LOOK similar yes but they are not the same.

The people that are so set that American carriers MUST, buy the A380 are not capable of understanding the US airline business model. The american people (aka consumers you know the ones that buy the tickets?) don't give a rats ass what plane they are flying on. What they care most about right now is frequency. They want to be able to call up the airline and have several choices on when they can leave for Bugtussle. Now if airline A offers 1 daily service to bugtussle, with an A380 but, airline B offers 3 times daily with a 7E7 then they will take airline B because they have choice. It doesn't matter that the 7E7 is American made, what matters is that they can choose the time that they leave.

That point made if the airlines could FILL an A380 AND offer three times daily then they will buy the damn thing. Until that happens there is no need for the plane.

Will there BE a need for the plane from an American airline? Not soon no. Maybe in the future but right now I don't see it. Would I LIKE to see an American or Canadian airline flying the thing? YES! and I'm a Boeing fan so what does that tell you?
"they who dream by day are cognizant of many things which escape those who dream only at night" - Edgar Allen Poe
 
NWA742
Posts: 4505
Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2002 11:35 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 7:55 am

Airlines differ and those that are innovative will make a better use of the space.

And you know what airlines want most to come out of the extra space? Yep, it's money. And putting a bunch of amenities costs them more money. Do you they want more money from the extra space or to spend money on the extra space? VS does have a couple of goodies on their longhaul aircraft, but they don't take up much potential seat room at all. Mark my words: most, if not all, airlines who will operate the A380 will operate it stuffed with seats, and not all the proposed goodies.

WOULD YOU SHUT UP!!! And you say I've got a big mouth

You should be mad, but at yourself. Why do I have a big mouth?

So what if i'm not a fan that doesn't mean I hate the Manufacture nor bias towards it.

Making things up, again? I never once said you hate anything, I'm pointing out that YOU ARE BIASED. You're not a fan of Boeing, you're a major fan of Airbus, that means you're BIASED, TOWARDS AIRBUS. If you weren't biased, then you would not say some of the things you've already said in your short time here.

I bet your not a fan of airbus.

Of course I'm a fan of Airbus, they make wonderful aircraft. I prefer Boeing, as I think they make the superior products, so yes, I'm a little biased towards Boeing, BUT I HAVE THE GUTS TO ADMIT IT. I also don't let my bias towards Boeing overcome the reality of the industry, and I don't put Airbus products down because of it.

would you stop making assumptions There are hundreds of aircraft manufactures WORLD WIDE!!!. There is Embraer, Aerospatiale, BAC, Bombardier, CRJ, McDonnell Douglas.I could go on!!

Yeah, and of those manufacturors, it's very apparent that you are a fan of Airbus the most. Just look at your username, you're excitement over everything Airbus, the general tone of all your posts, all these things work as evidence to support my assumption. There's nothing wrong with making assumptions if you have good evidence to back them up.

When I said that the 747 was out dated I was not saying it is out dated by it technology. It is out dated by it air frame and design.

Why would you consider the ENTIRE aircraft out-dated just because of the age of the airframe? That's like saying my computer, a 2.4GHz PC with 512mb of RAM is out-dated because it has a motherboard, a processor, and a hard drive like the computers in the '80s did. It makes no sense at all, and it has no basis. The 744 has about as much in common with the 741 as Hilary Clinton does with good looks.



-NWA742

[Edited 2004-05-22 00:56:16]
Some people are like slinkies - not good for anything, but they bring a smile to your face when pushed down the stairs
 
VSXA380X800
Topic Author
Posts: 401
Joined: Wed May 19, 2004 10:03 am

RE: No American Operator For The A380s, Think Again

Sat May 22, 2004 8:05 am

--Ok first off the 744 is NOT a 30 year old design--

35 , are you happy now ?

--Now if airline A offers 1 daily service to bugtussle, with an A380 but,airline B offers 3 times daily with a 7E7 then they will take airline B because they have choice.

When you say this, you should think of the 747, the A380 is not meant to replace or compete with a 2-300 seat aircraft

I'm a Boeing fan so what does that tell you,
Tell me your bias. Now this ' NWA742' that clearly, means someone is bias. ( towards something.
4 decks 4 engines 4 long haul

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Andy33, BobMUC, Google [Bot], HALtheAI, Indy, JAMES1, MrBren, PlanesNTrains, RCS763AV, Roadcruiser1, rutankrd, thomasphoto60, tomaheath, transit, uberflieger, xiaotung and 179 guests