Topic Author
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Delta 767-400ER Routes, Major LAX Expansion

Fri Feb 11, 2000 6:11 am

The new 767-400ERs will be based out of ATL and LAX, and orders for more are possible as they will be replacing the aging 767-200s. The Pacific base will slowly be shifted to LAX with the MD-11s and -400s as more flights are added to Asia and Hawaii. United won't be too happy.

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RE: Delta 767-400ER Routes, Major LAX Expansion

Fri Feb 11, 2000 6:23 am

The -400's will be used to replace some 762's? That's interesting. I would think that more 757's would make an ideal 767-200 replacement. Hell, the -400 holds roughly the same # of pass. as the L10. If it's thru, that's good news for cities like MSY which have 762/763 service.........nice!!!!

Sorry I moved from SXM, looking for a new house on Anguilla now!
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Pacific Base

Fri Feb 11, 2000 6:26 am


Does it mean PDX will be dropped ?
How much do they plan to grow at LAX ?
Will they order the 777X for asian ops ?

Best regards,
Alain Mengus
Topic Author
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RE: Pacific Base

Fri Feb 11, 2000 7:14 am

Your guess is as good as mine. You might ask around AF and see if they know anything. I know a -400ER pilot and he says it will replace the L-1011 and -200, but I am not sure that PDX will disappear.

Korean Air and Delta, if Korean Air joins would likely both order the 777X for expansion, to attempt to boot United and Northwest out.
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RE: Pacific Base

Fri Feb 11, 2000 7:53 am


I will ask. But Delta must have some great growth plans to compete effeciently with UAL...
A large 777-200ER order coming ?

Best regards,
Alain Mengs
Topic Author
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RE: Pacific Base

Fri Feb 11, 2000 8:01 am

Thats what pilots around ATL are rumoring.
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764 Replacing 762?

Fri Feb 11, 2000 8:17 am

Why would a 275 pax plane replace a 181 Pax plane
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RE: Delta 767-400ER Routes, Major LAX Expansion

Fri Feb 11, 2000 9:35 am

I am curious where did you here this?

The 767-400's are to replace the L1011's

I doubt DL will push UA/AA/NW Pacific ops out of LAX. They haven't even been able to get good loads out of PDX where they are the only game in town.

I think someone is rumor-mongering again.
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RE: Delta 767-400ER Routes, Major LAX Expansion

Fri Feb 11, 2000 11:50 pm

I don't believe Delta is going to build up LAX into a major hub to compete with United. First of all, they've been downsizing LAX for years, to the point where they now have half as many flights as they had several years ago (approx. 50 vs. 100). Second, to my knowledge they have not applied for any international routes out of LAX. When the Japanese agreement was signed a few years ago, Delta applied for ATL-NRT, JFK-NRT, CVG-NRT, HNL-NRT and ATL-KIX. LAX wasn't even in the plans. Third, as American has figured out, in order to make LAX into any kind of sizeable hub operation you need feeder service from within California. Delta has none of that, and I don't see them shifting smaller aircraft to these types of markets when there is already so much competition from United, American, Southwest and Alaska. Just my feeling, but if Delta wants to build up their west coast operation they'd be better off adding flights to Salt Lake City where they have a very solid market position. I like a Delta a lot, but they seem to drag their feet when it comes to expansion other than Atlanta. CVG is down in departures from a few years ago (about 195 vs. 225), DFW has been cut back and SLC hasn't seen any growth in 10 years. If Delta wants to play with the big boys (UA and AA) they need to expand outside of Atlanta.


Sat Feb 12, 2000 12:15 am

Just a slight correction on the No International Flights; Tokyo Narita IS served by Delta Air Lines from Los Angeles using MD-11s operating as flight DL79, with the return service designated as DL78.

Just to put something right........

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Sat Feb 12, 2000 1:55 am

I agree that DL will not be able to or have a VERY hard time booting Northwest, United and American in the Pacific.
"History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or timid." D. Eisenhower
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Sat Feb 12, 2000 4:08 am

Not applied

I do know that Delta has a flight from LAX to Tokyo. What I said was that they haven't applied for any NEW international routes out of LAX. Sorry if there was some confusion.

RE: Sorry Ord!

Sat Feb 12, 2000 5:19 am

Sorry ORD - I think I misread the post slightly - my fault!
And you're right that there are no new applications for routes out of LAX - quite odd for a supposedly growing hub.....

JFK and ATL are Delta's concentration (ATL as always) at the moment in the sense that from JFK they are trying to get approval to serve Beijing and Shanghai along with more and more transatlantics, and they are trying to get approval to serve flights such as JFK/ATL (- PDX) - HKG and some others I believe, tho what they are I could not say. Also, they are concentrating on improving a lot of flights out of ATL across the Atlantic aswell.

Sorry for any confusion and I hope this helps!

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Sat Feb 12, 2000 6:56 am

Not a problem. I appreciate all of your insight into Delta. And hey, I like a Delta a lot also. My very first flight was from Chicago to Miami on a Delta 747 -- my family had rented out the upstairs and we had it all to ourselves! I will never forget it.
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Sat Feb 12, 2000 10:57 am

DAL will use the -400's to replace the L10's. You'll see them flying to Hawaii eventually. The -400 does not have the range for year round Asia flights.

As far as west coast expansion goes, forget it. Delta does not care about much west of the Mississippi River. SLC is being pulled back and there is talk of taking down the hub altogether after the 2002 Olympics. Skywest has ambitious expansion plans for SLC if that happens.

As a prevoius poster noted, DAL has no intra-California feed and none on the horizon. Skywest is pretty well committed to UAL on the west coast. As far as PDX goes, as long as DAL wants to fly to Japan from Cincinnati, PDX is the gateway as designated by the gov't. DAL could petition to get it changed but its not likely. Besides, there is significant local PDX-NRT traffic, just like at LAX.

No, for DAL the future is ATL. Always has been, always will be.


Sat Feb 12, 2000 5:49 pm

Is it possible that we may have a 2nd US airline fly Syd-LAX, maybe Delta could use 777's or MD-11's as the 767-400 does not have the range?

Delta needs LAX as a major base to boost the importance of the attempted Air France, Korean Delta alliance.
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What Will The Routes Be?

Sun Feb 13, 2000 4:52 am

Do you think I could catch a flight from LAX-SLC or ATL on a 767-400 in the future just to fly on it?
When is the aircraft going to start scheduled service for DL? What will the inagural flight be?
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RE: Delta 767-400ER Routes, Major LAX Expansion

Sun Feb 13, 2000 7:59 am

Delta is already pretty strong in PDX, and I know the MD-11 has the range to go PDX-Auckland Non-stop, and the MD-11 and the 777 don't have the range to do LAX-SYD non-stop. I think a PDX-Auckland-SYD route would be pretty good though.

nwa man
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RE: Delta 767-400ER Routes, Major LAX Expansion

Sun Feb 13, 2000 2:45 pm

Delta and Korean booting United and Northwest out of the Pacific market? Give me a break. Both NW and UA have established strong presence in Asia, and especially UA out of LAX. United (and in my opinion, NW) both have superior products to Asia. United has legendary service and new aircraft, NW has the best frequent flyer program (InsideFlyer 2000) and state of the art turbulence avoidance systems, and both have established hubs at Tokyo Narita Airport. DL can't compete! And Korean Air? That will end as soon as they have another horrible avoidable crash and Delta drops them again. Good luck, Delta! You're gonna need it!
Create your own luck.
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RE: Delta 767-400ER Routes, Major LAX Expansion

Sun Feb 13, 2000 3:18 pm

Who says Delta is going to expand in the Pacific and beat out United and Northwest? This is pure nonsense,Delta is consentrating on Latin America and Europe for expansion.I don't think DL has any intention of trying to become a major player in the Pacific for the foreseable future. As far as the 767-400 is concerned it is a replacement for the domestic L-1011 at least for the initial order of 21.The other a/c on option may be used on international routes.
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RE: 777s So South Pacific

Sun Feb 13, 2000 7:02 pm

I do believe the 777-200ER has the range to fly nonstop LAX-SYD since it has the same range as the 747-400. China Southern flies LAX-CAN nonstop which is almost the same distance as LAX-HKG which is flwon by 744s. It would be nice if someone would fly LAX-SYD or perhaps LAX-BNE nonstop and with 777s. Maybe Continental or possibly Delta Air Lines if they are REALLY interested in expanding transpac service from LAX. Maybe they would reinstate the LAX-HKG flight also....The777Man
Boeing 777s flown: UA, TG, KE, BA, CX, NH, JD, JL, CZ, SQ, EK, NG, CO, AF, SV, KU, DL, AA, MH, OZ, CA, MS, SU, LY, RG, PE, AZ, KL, VN, PK, EY, NZ, AM, BR, AC, DT, UU, OS, AI, 9W, KQ, QR, VA, JJ, ET, TK, PR, BG, T5, CI, MU and LX.. Further to fly.. LH 777

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