alphascan
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XJ Saabs

Wed Jun 02, 2004 11:46 pm

What is the fleet plan for XJ? When will the Saabs be replaced?

BRDFlyer
"To he who only has a hammer in his toolbelt, every problem looks like a nail."
 
xjramper
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RE: XJ Saabs

Wed Jun 02, 2004 11:55 pm

about the same time as NW's DC-9s. Laugh out loud The Saabs are workhorses, NW realizes that. People would much rather fly on a jet, but how cost effective is a jet on a route like TOL-DTW or STC-MSP. I don't see XJ replacing all of the Saabs, however, I think that you might see a transition as to the amount of Saabs you see up at WorldGateway or MSP.

XJR
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KaiGywer
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RE: XJ Saabs

Wed Jun 02, 2004 11:56 pm

Saabs won't be replaced in the near future. They are a perfect fit for XJ ops. Personally I prefer the Dash 8, but like the VP of Gnd Ops, said in the town hall, it's like comparing a Cadillac to a Toyota, both in quality and costs... As far as the A and B models, they will be the first to go.
“Once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, an
 
azjubilee
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RE: XJ Saabs

Thu Jun 03, 2004 12:04 am

There actually is a plan to retire the saabs... only it seems to change each quarter. By the end of 2004 all the As were to be retired, followed b yall the Bs by 2007. But it seems that the As are remaining in the fleet for the time beings and no more saabs are being retired. FOR NOW. Our growth and business plan is completely controled by Northwest. So, XJ will do whatever NW wants/needs it to do.


AZJ
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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RE: XJ Saabs

Thu Jun 03, 2004 8:10 am

As said the plan was to only retain the B+ models for the long-term. As said all the older A's were to be gone this year, but there are still 2 around in service somewhere. The B's will stay for a while, and of course the B+'s. I believe the count now is at 64 Saab's and will remain around there for awhile. The CRJ's allocated to Pinnacle have been used for expansion, not replacing Mesaba or NW mainline for the most part. Without the Saab many markets would be unfeasible in the NW network.
 
EMBQA
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RE: XJ Saabs

Thu Jun 03, 2004 8:55 am

I would also say that since Mesaba has the 'newest' Saab 340 fleet in the world there is no reason to turn them in any time soon with their newest SF340, N457XJ being only 3-4 years old.
"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
 
kcrwflyer
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RE: XJ Saabs

Thu Jun 03, 2004 10:03 am

they are loud, slow, and bumpy to ride on. thats all we get to DTW in CRW, and those things hurt. Have you heard those things startup before? Its like, will the jet kick in or will the plane fall apart.
 
EMBQA
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RE: XJ Saabs

Thu Jun 03, 2004 10:18 am

they are loud, slow, and bumpy to ride on. thats all we get to DTW in CRW, and those things hurt. Have you heard those things startup before? Its like, will the jet kick in or will the plane fall apart.

Yea, and the SF-340 is built like a tank, easy to work on, don't break that often, have no real issues or AD to be concerned about...they have fantastic customer support and service for the operators. Mark my words...had Saab designed the SF340 with the PW 120 Series engines, they'd still be building them today..
"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
 
NLINK
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RE: XJ Saabs

Thu Jun 03, 2004 10:21 am

Only if Saab could have built an airplane that had a useful load.
 
kcrwflyer
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RE: XJ Saabs

Thu Jun 03, 2004 10:31 am

Mark my words...had Saab designed the SF340 with the PW 120 Series engines, they'd still be building them today..


Arent they still? The website says that they are.
 
NLINK
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RE: XJ Saabs

Thu Jun 03, 2004 10:50 am

The Saab isn't being made anymore. Think XJ took the last one off the line or close to the last. Think back in 1999 or 2000 the last one came off the line.
 
EMBQA
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RE: XJ Saabs

Thu Jun 03, 2004 10:54 am

Nope.....SF340 production ceased in 2000 with the final deliveries going to Mesaba. Production ended with s/n 459.


Only if Saab could have built an airplane that had a useful load
They did..its called the Saab 2000. Unfourtunetly the market strongly shifted towards RJ's and only 50 where ever made.
"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
 
leelaw
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RE: XJ Saabs

Thu Jun 03, 2004 11:02 am

Actually 63 SAAB 2000's were built before production ended in 2000.
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FoxBravo
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RE: XJ Saabs

Thu Jun 03, 2004 12:25 pm

It's really too bad about the Saab 2000...it was doomed simply due to the fact that it had propellers in front of its engines. I'm sure its economics can beat any RJ, and I can tell you from a passenger's perspective that it's a joy to ride on. Fast, smooth, quiet...on the inside, it's virtually indistinguishable from a jet. But once everyone started jumping on the RJ bandwagon, it didn't have a chance. Sure, RJs have opened all kinds of new "long, thin" point-to-point routes that never would have been possible with turboprops. But they are also being used on many shorter routes where something like a Saab 2000 would be optimal.
Common sense is not so common. -Voltaire
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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RE: XJ Saabs

Fri Jun 04, 2004 9:12 am

I'm sorry you're forced to ride to Saabs, its too bad Charleston, WV isn't the epicenter of the universe.

Sounds like some good ole' irrational fear of props. If CRW could economically support more CRJ flights to DTW, then you'd get them, for you unfortunetely the costs are more oriented toward the Saabs. For a relatively short low-density route it works great. You'll see CRJ's more in the future, but it just isn't that high on the priority list right now.

The Saabs are only rivaled by the Dash-8 in terms of a well built and lasting prop. Unfortunetely you are probably too young to remember much other than the RJ era. They haven't been around that long, and everyone used to fly a lot more on props. You think the Saab is bad, go fly on the B-1900's (the C model that you can't stand up in), some J-31's, a Shorts 360, or even a Metro, then come back and complain about the Saab.

 
EMBQA
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RE: XJ Saabs

Fri Jun 04, 2004 9:31 am

FoxBrovo-

The 'true' demise of the Saab 2000 was a late design change to a powered rudder design. Saab did not want to put the aircraft out just to later modify the rudder system for the early production aircraft....that along with design problems with the changes pushed the 1st delivery's back, and by then the RJ market had come alive. The really sad part about it......the Saab 2000 is actually only slightly slower then the Canadair CRJ200 and offers a better fuel economy burn and carries the same number of passangers.
"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
 
kcrwflyer
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RE: XJ Saabs

Fri Jun 04, 2004 9:40 am

every other airline that flys into CRW has Crj's, and are prospering. Some airlines boardings have doubled since they haev switched from props to Jets. And no, i dont have a fear of props, i love the D0328, and the dash 8- 300, i just dont like the saabs and Js-41, -31.
 
N766UA
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RE: XJ Saabs

Fri Jun 04, 2004 9:46 am

What else is NW or XJ gunna fly into Alpena?  Big thumbs up
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