mrniji
Posts: 5382
Joined: Sun Feb 29, 2004 11:51 am

Difference Between LHR And LGW In Destinations?

Sat Jun 05, 2004 11:15 pm

Hi,

I am sorry if this has already been discussed:

Is there any geographical difference of destinations from the airports LGW and LHR, for example do flights to continent A rather depart from LGW while flights to continent B rather from LHR?

BA operates from LGW and LHR... do they also depart from LGW for longhaul?

Are there many international airlines - especially intercontinental airlines - operating from both airports?

Is there any chance to bypass visa regulations with direct shuttle service? I.e. when a pax from a country with compulsory visa for the UK arrives in LHR but wants to continue from LGW: can he take some direct bus and do without Transit visa? Is baggage transported by the Airline?

Ia LGW rather good for point-to-point or can it be considered as a bub?


Then, last: do you think this costs BA, VS (do they operate from LGW??) and the BAA lots of customers, since interchange between these gateways is everything but convenient. Before changing from LHR to LGW I would rather book a flight via AB) (FRA / FRF / EDDF), Germany">FRA, AMS (or CDG, although this is probably even worse than travelling from LHR to LGW)... Personally, if I operated for an airline, I would of course try to get a slot at bigger LHR in order to catch more other traffic!

"The earth provides enough resources for everyone's need, but not for some people's greed." (Gandhi)
 
Horus
Posts: 5131
Joined: Sun Feb 22, 2004 1:04 am

RE: Difference Between LHR And LGW In Destinations?

Sun Jun 06, 2004 12:04 am

BA base most, if not all, their Caribbean operations at LGW
EGYPT: A 7,000 Year Old Civilisation
 
anstar
Posts: 2864
Joined: Sun Nov 23, 2003 3:49 am

RE: Difference Between LHR And LGW In Destinations?

Sun Jun 06, 2004 12:10 am

If you want to do a rough analysis of the London airports

London City (LCY) - European business centres/regional airports
London Stansted (STN) - Mainly LCC operators - UK & European destinations
London Luton (LTN) - Mainly LCC operators - UK & European destinations
London Gatwick (LGW) - Mainly Lesiure European & USA routes mainly. Quite a few LCC & Charter carriers
London Heathrow (LHR) - Everywhere!
 
RICARDOAB
Posts: 162
Joined: Thu Apr 15, 2004 7:07 pm

RE: Difference Between LHR And LGW In Destinations?

Sun Jun 06, 2004 12:16 am

Traffic at LGW is mostly to holiday destinations and BA's operations are usually Caribbean flights. Their franchise airlines like GB Airways and CityFlyer operate routes to Europe and North Africa.

Virgin Atlantic operates much of its holiday destination flights such as Florida and the Caribbean as most of its lucrative destinations have been transfered to LHR

easyJet operates a number of services and it is the only London airport to be served by Continental, NWA and Delta. A number of Eastern European airlines serve LGW such as Estonian Air, Belavia, Transaero, Pulkovo and Hemus Air. It is the case that the majority of the flights operated into LGW are from secondary airlines, i.e. they are not the principal flag carrier, and despite operations of LCCs mostly being at LTN and STN, easyJet andRyanair both serve here.

There are a large number of charter airlines that tend to dominate the South Terminal in the summer months such as Nouvelair, Thomas Cook, TUI, MyTravel, etc. American Airlines and Emirates also operate flights to LGW, despite having numerous operations at LHR.

Hope this has been of some help.

Regards
 
planesarecool
Posts: 3208
Joined: Sun Nov 11, 2001 12:37 am

RE: Difference Between LHR And LGW In Destinations?

Sun Jun 06, 2004 4:18 am

British Airways' long haul ops from LGW include:

Orlando (high density a/c)
Tampa (high density a/c)
Tobago
Grenada
St. Lucia
Kingston (high density a/c)
Antigua
Bermuda
Atlanta
Houston
Dallas Ft Worth
Barbados

British Airways also operate to many European destinations, and offer flights to the lesser cities that aren't served from Heathrow (i.e. Nice, Marseille, Verona, Naples etc).

Virgin Atlantic have flights to:

Orlando x2 daily(x3 on friday, saturday and sunday)
Las Vegas (4x weekly)
Tobago/Grenada (1x weekly)
Barbados (6x weekly)
St. Lucia (3x weekly)
Antigua (3x weekly)
Port Harcourt (2x weekly)

Charter operators (mainly Excel Airways, Britannia, First Choice Airways, Monarch, Thomas Cook, MyTravel and Astraeus) operate to ski destinations in the winter from Gatwick, such as:

Geneva
Salzburg
Innsbruck
Lyon
Toulouse
Turin
Grenoble
Chambery

And they operate services to the Greek islands, Italy and some destinations in Spain limited to the summer:

Corfu
Rhodes
Kos
Thessaloniki
Skiathos
Mykonos
Lemnos
Lesbos
Samos
Preveza
Heraklion
Chania
Kefallinia
Catania
Bastia
Reus
Almeria
Gerona
Ibiza
Mahon
Brindisi
Venice
Zakynthos/Zante
Figari
Calvi
Dubrovnik
Zadar
Kavala


On a year round basis, most charter operators fly from LGW to:

Alicante
Malaga
Palma
Tenerife
Arrecife
Las Palmas
Fuerteventura
Faro
Funchal

Long/medium haul ops by these charter ops from LGW(most year round, some restricted to summer/winter ops):

Sanford
Barbados (mostly winter)
La Romana
Puerto Plata
Punta Cana
Tobago
Grenada
Margarita
Toronto (mainly summer)
Calgary/Vancouver (mainly winter)
Goa (mainly winter)
Malé
Bahrain
Luxor
Sharm el Sheikh
Marsa Alam
Banjul
Montego Bay
Cancun
Puerto Vallarta
Taba
Ovdah

Air Transat serve LGW year round but most of their operations are in the summer. Zoom also serve LGW in the summer. Phuket Air will soon be starting flights to Phuket and Dubai, and Emirates fly to LGW 3x daily from Dubai.

American Airlines serve Gatwick:

Dallas Ft Worth: 2x daily (3x on some days) B777
Raleigh Durham: 1x daily - B777

Continental:

Cleveland: 1x daily - B757
Newark: 2x daily - B777
Houston: 2x daily - B777

Delta Airlines:

Atlanta: 3x daily - 1x B777 2x B767
Cincinnati: 1x daily - 1x B767

Northwest:

Detroit: 1x daily DC-10
Minneapolis: 1x daily DC-10

US Airways:

Philadephia: 1x daily A330-300
Charlotte: 1x daily A330-300
Pittsburgh: 1x daily B767-200

Easyjet fly from Gatwick to the following destinations using A319's and B737-300's:

Alicante
Amsterdam
Athens
Barcelona
Belfast
Bilbao
Cologne (not yet began)
Edinburgh
Faro
Geneva
Ibiza
Inverness
Madrid
Malaga
Marseille
Milan Linate
Naples
Nice
Palma
Prague
Toulouse

Other Gatwick ops:

Ryanair fly from Gatwick to Dublin
Germanwings fly from Gatwick to Cologne
Bmi Baby fly from Gatwick to Prague and Cork
Mytravel Lite used to fly from Gatwick to Tenerife but that was packed up almost as soon as it began
FlyBE fly from Gatwick to Jersey, Guernsey and Belfast City.
Air Malta fly from Gatwick to Malta and Catania
Eurocypria and Helios fly to Cyprus from Gatwick
Olympic Aviation fly to Thessaloniki from Gatwick
Air Ukraine fly to Kiev
Lithuanian fly to Vilnius
Adria to Ljubljana
Air Southwest to Newquay and Plymouth
Nationwide to Johannesburg
TravelCityDirect to Sanford, Phoenix, Sharm el Sheikh and more
Aurigny AirServices fly to Guernsey
TAP Air Portugal fly to Lisbon, Faro, Porto and Funchal
Air Luxor to Lisbon
Air Nostrum to Pamplona/Oviedo
Lauda to Innsbruck and Bratislava
Air France regional to Bordeaux, Nantes, Strasbourg and Brest
Braathens fly to Bergen and Oslo
Maersk to Billund and Copenhagen
Air Zimbabwe to Harare
Meridiana to Florence, Catania etc
ASA to Mombasa
Air Gabon to Libreville
Flyjet to various charter destinations
Belavia to Minsk
Pulkovo to St. Petersburg
Transaero to Moscow

And many more!

-Stephen
 
L1011aaron
Posts: 133
Joined: Thu May 27, 2004 2:57 am

RE: Difference Between LHR And LGW In Destinations?

Sun Jun 06, 2004 4:49 am

You can get to more US destinations from Gatwick than you can at Heathrow:


LGW -
Atlanta
Baltimore
Boston
Charlotte
Cincinnati
Cleveland
Denver
Detroit
Houston
Las Vegas
Miami
Minneapolis/ St Paul
New York JFK
Newark
Orlando
Philadelphia
Phoenix
Pittsburgh
Raleigh/ Durham
San Diego
Sanford
St Louis
Tampa

You can also go to more destinations on British Airways from Gatwick than LHR

BA LGW -
Aberdeen
Abidjan
Abuja
Accra
Alicante
Almaty
Antigua
Antwerp
Athens
Atlanta
Baku
Baltimore
Barcelona
Belgrade
Bermuda
Bogota
Bremen
Bridgetown
Bordeaux
Bristol
Brussels
Bucharest
Beunos Aires
Cancun
Caracas
Casablanca
Charlotte
Cologne
Cork
Dallas
Dar es Sallam
Denver
Dharan
Dublin
Dusseldorf
Edinburugh
Eindhoven
Entebbe/ Kampala
Faro
Florence
Frankfurt
Funchal
Gdansk
Geneva
Genoa
Gibraltar
Glasgow
Gothenburg
Grand Cayman
Grenada
Geurnsey
Hamburg
Hanover
Harare
Havana
Houston
Inverness
Jersey
Kiev
Kingston
Lagos
Lilongwe
Lisbon
Ljubljana
Luanda
Lusaka
Luxembourg
Madrid
Mahe
Malaga
Malta
Manchester
Marrakech
Marseilles
Maritius
Miami
Milan
Montego Bay
Montpellier
Moscow
Munich
Murcia
Nairobi
Nantes
Naples
Nassau
Newcastle
Newquay
New York
Nice
Orlando
Oslo
Palma
Paris CDG
Phoenix
Pisa
Plymouth
Porto
Riga
Rio de Janierio
Rome
Rotterdam
St Lucia
St Petersburg
Salzburg
San Diego
San Jose
San Juan
Santiago
Sao Paulo
Seville
Shannon
Skopjie
Sofia
Stockholm
Tampa
Tangier
Tel Aviv
Tobago
Toulouse
Trieste
Tripoli
Tunis
Valencia
Verona
Vienna
Villinus
Zagreb
Zurich


Concluding the queston i think that LGW has better access to more regional and local destinations aswell a better links to Africa.
GO LGW.

 
planesarecool
Posts: 3208
Joined: Sun Nov 11, 2001 12:37 am

RE: Difference Between LHR And LGW In Destinations?

Sun Jun 06, 2004 5:25 am

L1011aaron,

I don't know how old that list is, but i would never use it...

LGW -
Atlanta
Baltimore - (now LHR)
Boston - (no flights to Boston from LGW, all LHR)
Charlotte - (now LHR)
Cincinnati
Cleveland
Denver - (now LHR)
Detroit - (Served from both LHR and LGW)
Houston - (Served from both LHR and LGW)
Las Vegas
Miami - no flights to MIA from LGW, just LHR
Minneapolis/ St Paul
New York JFK - All (20+) flights to JFK from LHR
Newark - Served from both LHR and LGW
Orlando
Philadelphia - Served from both LHR and LGW
Phoenix - Now LHR
Pittsburgh
Raleigh/ Durham
San Diego - Changed to LHR/Now stopped
Sanford
St Louis - Stopped
Tampa

THEN....

BA LGW -
Aberdeen - Both LHR and LGW
Abidjan - Now LHR
Abuja - Now LHR
Accra - Now LHR
Alicante
Almaty - Now LHR
Antigua
Antwerp - Ceased
Athens - Both LHR and LGW
Atlanta
Baku - Now LHR
Baltimore - Now LHR
Barcelona - Both LHR and LGW
Belgrade - Ceased
Bermuda
Bogota - Now LHR
Bremen - Ceased
Bridgetown - LGW and LHR (in winter)
Bordeaux
Bristol - Ceased
Brussels - Ceased/op from LHR
Bucharest - Op by Malev
Beunos Aires - Now LHR
Cancun - Ceased
Caracas - Now LHR
Casablanca - Now LHR
Charlotte - Now LHR
Cologne - Ceased
Cork - Ceased
Dallas
Dar es Sallam - Now LHR
Denver - Now LHR
Dharan - Ceased
Dublin - Op by Aer Lingus
Dusseldorf - Ceased/op from LHR
Edinburugh - From both LHR and LGW
Eindhoven - Ceased
Entebbe/ Kampala - Now LHR
Faro
Florence - Ceased
Frankfurt - Both LHR and LGW
Funchal
Gdansk - Ceased
Geneva - Both LHR and LGW
Genoa
Gibraltar
Glasgow - Both LHR and LGW
Gothenburg - Ceased
Grand Cayman - Now LHR
Grenada
Geurnsey - Ceased
Hamburg - Op from LHR
Hanover - Ceased
Harare - Now LHR
Havana - Ceased
Houston - Both LHR and LGW
Inverness
Jersey
Kiev
Kingston
Lagos - Now LHR
Lilongwe - Now LHR
Lisbon - Now LHR (although i hear returning for the summer/op from both LGW and LHR)
Ljubljana - ceased
Luanda - Now LHR
Lusaka - Now LHR
Luxembourg - Ceased
Madrid - Both LHR and LGW
Mahe - Op from LHR/Ceased
Malaga
Malta
Manchester - Op from both LHR and LGW
Marrakech
Marseilles
Maritius - Now LHR
Miami - Now LHR
Milan - Now LHR
Montego Bay - Ceased
Montpellier
Moscow - Now LHR
Munich
Murcia
Nairobi - Now LHR
Nantes
Naples
Nassau - Now LHR
Newcastle - Both LHR and LGW
Newquay - Ceased
New York - Now LHR
Nice
Orlando
Oslo - Now LHR
Palma
Paris CDG - Both LHR and LGW (and LCY)
Phoenix - Now LHR
Pisa
Plymouth - Ceased
Porto
Riga - Ceased
Rio de Janierio - Now LHR
Rome - Both LHR and LGW
Rotterdam - Ceased
St Lucia
St Petersburg - Now LHR
Salzburg - Ceased/Winter charters only
San Diego - Op from LHR/Ceased
San Jose - Ceased
San Juan - Ceased
Santiago - Ceased
Sao Paulo - Now LHR
Seville
Shannon - Op by Aer Lingus/Now LHR
Skopjie - Ceased
Sofia - Now LHR
Stockholm - Now LHR
Tampa
Tangier - Now LHR
Tel Aviv - Now LHR
Tobago
Toulouse
Trieste - Ceased
Tripoli - Ceased
Tunis
Valencia
Verona
Vienna - Now LHR
Villinus - Ceased
Zagreb - Ceased
Zurich - Now LHR

Of course, some of the ones i put as "Now LHR" were already operated from out of LHR and some which were "Ceased" may have never even operated for BA. You might wanna check the reliability  Big grin

-Stephen
 
L1011aaron
Posts: 133
Joined: Thu May 27, 2004 2:57 am

RE: Difference Between LHR And LGW In Destinations?

Sun Jun 06, 2004 5:40 am

Sorry
The book was published in 2000.
Title:
abc Gatwick Airport

By the way i know that half of them are also served form LHR.
 
geoffm
Posts: 2082
Joined: Fri Feb 27, 2004 5:58 am

RE: Difference Between LHR And LGW In Destinations

Sun Jun 06, 2004 5:49 am

To answer the question about LHR-LGW transfers, you need to enter the country in order to do that transit. Some kind of transit visa I believe. There are direct bus services between the two airports.

Slots from the US to Heathrow are limited by the Bermuda agreement (II?). Basically, only the US/UK airlines that currently serve LHR can serve it, and no more. IE no Continental at LHR for the forseaable future.

Geoff M.
 
mrniji
Posts: 5382
Joined: Sun Feb 29, 2004 11:51 am

RE: Difference Between LHR And LGW In Destinations?

Sun Jun 06, 2004 8:23 am

Thanks for all the info, great!

Stephen, thanks for the great list. Interesting to see that BA serves some US cities, especially DFW (and Orlando and Philadelphia) from Gatwick. So So they, as I imagine, loose a lot of traffic from countries like India and Pakistan for these destinations, since it is much more convenient to transfer in other gateways.

Do you guys think that in the long term LGW could be a serious 'competitor' for LHR? Is LGW easier to expand?
"The earth provides enough resources for everyone's need, but not for some people's greed." (Gandhi)
 
acho
Posts: 318
Joined: Sat Jan 10, 2004 2:06 pm

RE: Difference Between LHR And LGW In Destinations?

Sun Jun 06, 2004 2:25 pm

I think BA used to fly to Mexico City from both LHR and LGW pre 9/11. Is this true? What schedule did they use?

 
planesarecool
Posts: 3208
Joined: Sun Nov 11, 2001 12:37 am

RE: Difference Between LHR And LGW In Destinations?

Sun Jun 06, 2004 4:31 pm

Mrniji,

No, Philadelphia is served from Gatwick through US Airways, British Airways have never flown there from Gatwick. British Airways fly twice daily Heathrow-Philadelphia. US Airways used to fly twice daily between PHL-LGW using an extra B767-200, but unfortunately that wasn't resumed this year.

A lot of passengers coming from Pakistan especially would use Manchester, typically because PIA flies from Karachi/Islamabad to New York/Chicago/Toronto/Houston (on selected days) via Manchester, so they would not really need to connect at all. And US Airways operate a service to Philadephia, AA to Boston and Chicago, DL to Atlanta, CO to Newark, VS to Orlando and BA to New York, Bmi to Washington, Chicago and Toronto, so there is a lot of choice for passengers coming from Pakistan to connect to from here without changing terminal in most cases. (PIA operate into T2 as do US, DL, CO, VS. AA and BA operate from T3 and Bmi from T1).

Also it is thought that Manchester is a lot nicer an airport to transfer through.

Acho,

As far as i know Mexico City was never served from Gatwick, or if it was it was never served from both airports at the same time with BA. BA used to have a flight to Cancun from Gatwick, but that was packed up with a few more caribbean/central American destinations (Montego Bay and Havana to name a couple).

-Stephen
 
User avatar
jfklganyc
Posts: 3932
Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2004 2:31 pm

RE: Difference Between LHR And LGW In Destinations?

Mon Jun 07, 2004 7:21 am

Correct me if I am wrong, but I was under the impression that BA had hubs at LGW and LHR until 9/11. Then, when as the rumors were floating that they would go under, LGW was closed and they moved everything they could to LHR. I guess that list confirms that assumption.
I have always been under the impression that LGW is the overflow because LHR is slot-restricted. Don't get me wrong, I am sure LHR is important to the region, but I know all of the US airlines would start or move ops to LHR in a second if they could.

PJ
 
btv92
Posts: 50
Joined: Thu Dec 25, 2003 10:46 pm

RE: Difference Between LHR And LGW In Destinations?

Mon Jun 07, 2004 8:40 am

As of June 1st,Delta serves Gatwick from Atlanta with 4 flights daily,all 763's.The 777 flight went out when they went to 4 a day,Cheers,Tim
 
flyboy36y
Posts: 2897
Joined: Sun Mar 19, 2000 1:45 pm

RE: Difference Between LHR And LGW In Destinations?

Mon Jun 07, 2004 9:58 am

I'm actually flying EDI-LGW-RDU-LGA on EasyJet/AA/AAeagle in Aug...

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