FJWH
Topic Author
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Joined: Fri May 14, 2004 4:50 pm

No More Paper Tickets By 2008

Wed Jun 09, 2004 4:35 am

The IATA (http://www.iata.org) has decided in Singapore that ALL airliners will say goodbye to the paper tickets by 2008. This should give lower costs and convenience.

I know that for example that the Dutch airline HV don't give paper tickets anymore but (already)electronic ones (like by 2008 every Airline should do). And I believe that in a few months KL also is going to give electronic tickets.
How is this with other (big) airliners like AA, SQ, BA and what about the other dutch airliners like MP and Dutchbird?


FJWH

(Dutch news source: http://www.nu.nl/news.jsp?n=335838&c=50)
FlightS in the next 3 months: MSP, PHX, MEM, NCE, TFS, BCN. All round trips from AMS
 
Sabena332
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RE: No More Paper Tickets By 2008

Wed Jun 09, 2004 4:45 am

Good decision in my opinion, when I have the choice between an ATB and an e-ticket, I always choose the e-ticket.

Patrick
NZ1's mother is a disgusting crack-whore and his father is a worthless alcoholic!
 
7e72004
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RE: No More Paper Tickets By 2008

Wed Jun 09, 2004 4:47 am

what airlines still issue paper tickets anyway?? I think the last time i had a paper ticket was 7 years ago.
The next generation of aircraft is just around the corner!
 
SNBA319
Posts: 286
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RE: No More Paper Tickets By 2008

Wed Jun 09, 2004 4:50 am

I know SNBA are trying to get E-tickets as much as possible, it makes sense as it is cheaper and easier for the ticketers. But what implications does this otherwise have for travellers?

But how well do booking systems work for travellers who have special tickets, i.e. for long periods, many stops and especially through alliance members??

If you dont have it in paper it makes you dependent on the systems of the airline i suppose?!
 
FLY777UAL
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RE: No More Paper Tickets By 2008

Wed Jun 09, 2004 4:53 am

7E72004--

From what I gathered from another article, paper tickets include the tickets which most of us are familiar with--the ones issued in the ticketing lobby or even at the gate.

While many passengers travel on an E-Ticket per se, they are infact on an e-reservation and receive a paper ticket upon check in.

The hopes of the IATA is to also eliminate the magnetic strips on the back of the tickets and replace them with barcodes and scanners so passengers can print off tickets at home, or if they cannot, then print "tickets" on cheap, thin thermal paper at the gate or upon check in in the ticketing lobby.

F L Y 7 7 7 U A L

 
SNBA319
Posts: 286
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RE: No More Paper Tickets By 2008

Wed Jun 09, 2004 4:56 am

No they receive a boarding pass, not a ticket.
 
FLAIRPORT
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RE: No More Paper Tickets By 2008

Wed Jun 09, 2004 5:00 am

i still recieve Delta tickets...but they say e-ticket or itinerarry (I know, an airline enthusiast who cannot spell itinerarry!) or whatnot...whats the difference, really. As long as you can still talk to a human if you want, i don't think there is a difference.
NEXT FLIGHT: FLL-ATL-HPN on FL
 
Espion007
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RE: No More Paper Tickets By 2008

Wed Jun 09, 2004 5:33 am

Then what do you do if your last name is misspelled on something and you cannot check-in electronicly? happened to my mother on a recent trip to chicago.We couldnt use the self-checkin machines.
Snakes on a Plane!
 
RJNUT
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RE: No More Paper Tickets By 2008

Wed Jun 09, 2004 6:03 am

some of the more complex interline-type itineraries will probably be eliminated unless the E tkt capabilities eventually allow more than 3 carriers on one ticket...i am sure the technology could be developed but the incentive to do so would be limited.
 
RJNUT
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RE: No More Paper Tickets By 2008

Wed Jun 09, 2004 6:12 am

it also forces airlines to upgrade their participation levels in the GDS sytems in order to accomdate e ticketing.. some may opt out altogether.

It WILL limit consumer choice, in very subtle and indirect ways!
 
Cory6188
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RE: No More Paper Tickets By 2008

Wed Jun 09, 2004 6:25 am

Without paper tickets, what would you do if you need to transfer airlines that aren't codeshare partners? For example, wouldn't NW's BUMP program then be obsolete because they would no longer be able to take other carriers tickets?

Oftentimes, carriers within an alliance have trouble accessing each other's tickets, so how would they handle it once there is no paper ticket to fall back upon?
 
StanstedFlyer
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RE: No More Paper Tickets By 2008

Wed Jun 09, 2004 6:54 am

I think it is a cheek that booking agents are charging way over the odds for paper tickets. I recently booked 2 tickets to Zambia, and Opodo.com wanted £80 extra for paper tickets!!! Unreal. Of course we had to go with e-tickets, but when you go for a long trip, like 3 months, it's good to have a ticket in your hand.
e-bookers was also doing the same and I have no doubt others do as well.
View the photos by C Newman on Airliners.net!
 
nosedive
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RE: No More Paper Tickets By 2008

Wed Jun 09, 2004 6:58 am

Without paper tickets, what would you do if you need to transfer airlines that aren't codeshare partners? For example, wouldn't NW's BUMP program then be obsolete because they would no longer be able to take other carriers tickets?

Good point, Cory, but I'm under the impression that NW will upgrade their BUMP system to interact with this problem. Like alcohol, technology is the cause of, and solution to, all of life's problems Big grin. Or the Y2K bug may just hit us later than expected. As for the "abolishment" of paper tickets, I still have a few questions with this: what about (the "dying" art of) travel agents who issue paper tickets? And what compensation would someone be given if their itinerary was completely blanked out of the database? In other words, what proof do you have that you actually bought a ticket? Sure, you could have a copy of your credit card purchases, to indeed prove that you did purchase a ticket, but seriously, will the be enough to get you on the flight? As a fan of Eugene Burdock's Failsafe, I believe technology is a wonderful tool, but that it still needs to be counter-balanced by less advanced means.
 
Venezuela747
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RE: No More Paper Tickets By 2008

Wed Jun 09, 2004 7:01 am

7E72004,

A lot of airlines use paper ticket, there are some less fortunate countries in the world that don't have the capabilities to have everything electronized. I reember last time I flew within Venezuela in Aserca we had papaer tickets. Eventually they will dissappear.
ROLL TIDE!!!
 
FLY2LIM
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RE: No More Paper Tickets By 2008

Wed Jun 09, 2004 8:02 am

I only get e-tickets on AA. It's so much easier. Many of the problems that have been mentioned here are easily avoidable and handled with ease.
If you get bumped, the airline will issue you a "ticket" for you to use on another carrier. They do this anyway, even if you are on an e-ticket. Obviously, this is an unusual situation and all carriers will have exceptions to the rule.
When you check in on an e-ticket, they don't issue you a paper ticket on check-in. They issue you a receipt and a boarding pass. I'm sure these will also be altered or simplified.
What the IATA group was trying to do was unify the system and make it simpler for the passengers and cheaper for the airlines. I think they are headed in the right direction.
It would be almost impossible for there to be a name discrepancy. Many passengers already have their data in the systems. If you are not a frequent flyer and you give your name over the telephone, and your credit card to buy the ticket, the charge won't go through if the name does not match. Only if you walk up to an airline counter and pay cash (TSA, are you paying attention here?????) and they misspell your name, it would be possible that this happens. However, you should ALWAYS CHECK YOUR TICKETS before walking away.
If your data disappears completely, getting you on the flight will be the LAST THING on the airline's mind since their entire data has been destroyed and they are unable to operate because they don't have adequate backup systems. This would be a catastrophe of epic proportions.
Any type of "complicated" scheduling is easily handled because the entire itinerary is printed on the ticket, simply laid out for anyone to see. The agents simply enter the data on their computer and your record should appear. You hear about crappy airlines, poor service, nasty f/as, uncomfortable seats, lost luggage, lousy food, but you rarely hear about an airline losing someone's records. That is not a typical complaint.
Like I said, most, if not all, of the scenarios listed in the other posts already exist and are being handled. A lack of expensive paper tickets won't make a difference. They will come up with cheaper alternatives.
FLY2LIM
Faucett. La primera linea aerea del Peru.
 
boeingbus
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RE: No More Paper Tickets By 2008

Wed Jun 09, 2004 8:05 am

THANK goodness! this will prevent the airlines in double charging because the passenger misplaced their ticket... always that was the biggest rip off....
Airbus or Boeing - it's all good to me!
 
AVPOH77
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RE: No More Paper Tickets By 2008

Wed Jun 09, 2004 8:06 am

Thank the Lord Almighty!!
Fly Delta Jets
 
NLINK
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RE: No More Paper Tickets By 2008

Wed Jun 09, 2004 9:26 am

I belive CO announced a short while ago that they were canceling there interline agreements with airlines that didn't do Etkts pretty soon.
 
terminal688
Posts: 87
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RE: No More Paper Tickets By 2008

Wed Jun 09, 2004 9:52 am

The E-tickets is the fastest and convinent way to procced the check-in' Here in australia because i do travel alot since 2001 they stop making paper tickets for Domestic passangers australia wide. Still tho getting just an E-ticket dosnt look that apearling because all it is just a paper form ith information itself and it dosnt actually look like a ticket at all. Because they have E-tickects is because at the time most people use to loose thier airline ticket and with this new idea all you need to do is show ID at the airport to the chec-in and thats all it takes. For me i still wish they did not had to change it so like this.. the airline tickects where realistic but of course this new E-tickects that will introduse to some countries know would be the easier way and hassle free. International flights comming out of australia still use normal paper tickects.
cheers.
 
aa757first
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RE: No More Paper Tickets By 2008

Wed Jun 09, 2004 10:18 am

Exactly how much does it cost for an airline to issue a paper ticket?

AAndrew
 
User avatar
EA CO AS
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RE: No More Paper Tickets By 2008

Wed Jun 09, 2004 10:34 am

some of the more complex interline-type itineraries will probably be eliminated unless the E tkt capabilities eventually allow more than 3 carriers on one ticket

Sabre already permits multiple carriers (that have reciprocal interline e-ticketing agreements) to be ticketed on the same electronic ticket with up to 36 flight segments.

AS can only do 16 segments at this time, but currently has reciprocal e-ticket agreements with:

AA
CO
DL
HA
UA
NW
KL
KS
7H

In fact, several months ago American Airlines (as part of their cost-cutting initiatives when threatening Chapter 11) had already announced they would phase out paper tickets entirely, and sever interline ticketing agreements with those carriers that could not support interline e-ticketing capability.

So IATA's action is actually in response to what many major carriers have already begun on their own.



"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
vatveng
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RE: No More Paper Tickets By 2008

Wed Jun 09, 2004 11:08 am

One thing about paper tickets from travel agents: They have not helped me in the past. I had one agent issue me paper tickets but not actually book the travel with the airline. There I am in the airport, (bogus) paper ticket in hand, and I can't get on the plane because the airline has no record of me and there is no confirmation number on the ticket. It was useless. I have had similar [though less severe than this] problems with the travel websites, any time I use a third party to book my flights, and get paper tickets, they manage to screw something up and I'm left with worthless tickets. At least with an E-Ticket you have an actual confirmation number every time.

It seems, though, that the airline check-in agents apparently see this happen with some regularity. In the case mentioned above, the agent asked for the name and phone number of my travel agent, then said I would have to purchase new tickets to get on the plane but "We'll straighten it out while you're in the air." And they did... by the time I landed the charge to my credit card had been reversed, and they gave me confirmation numbers for the return flight.

[hey, it's my 100th post! yay!]
 
md80fanatic
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RE: No More Paper Tickets By 2008

Wed Jun 09, 2004 11:27 am

You folks are gunna love what comes next.

Thank GOD we can finally scan our wrist installed microchip.... YAYYYYYYY [rolleyes]

What about those who might collect their paper stubs (like me)? Ahhhh, screw those old timers! I wanna be tracked and traced everywhere I go (like cattle) ..... afterall, it's for my SAFETY. AND it's just soooo much easier.

Jeeesh, we're doomed.....
 
jjbiv
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Joined: Mon Jan 08, 2001 10:58 am

RE: No More Paper Tickets By 2008

Wed Jun 09, 2004 11:40 am

EA CO AS,

You forgot TZ  Laugh out loud We send quite a few folks on us to EA / KSEA), USA - Washington">SEA and then on you to ANC. Especially so now with the push to sell customers traveling to markets we don't directly serve hybrid OA/online tickets.

IET is the wave of the future. Tickets issued always seem to work...if only VCR#CTRL worked as well as pulling a wad of paper tickets when rerouting we'd be set...CO is especially hard to get control of a coupon from.

joe
 
LH423
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RE: No More Paper Tickets By 2008

Wed Jun 09, 2004 12:25 pm

Md80fanatic: LOL! Easy on the "big brother is watching" mantra. Fact is, now-a-days if someone wants to watch your movements, they can do it with, or without e-tickets. In fact, these days an paper ticket is simply an e-ticket printed on paper. There are some differences, but, in the end, the reservations you make on e-tickets or paper will look very much the same. And the paper stubs you collect, or at least what most people collect, are from boarding passes, which aren't going anywhere, not paper tickets.

LH423
« On ne voit bien qu'avec le cœur. L'essentiel est invisible pour les yeux » Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
 
terminal688
Posts: 87
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RE: No More Paper Tickets By 2008

Wed Jun 09, 2004 3:00 pm

to Vatveng i agree with you' but same time i gues E-tickets are safe. fast proccese and for asample if you loose the E-tickect then all you do is show your ID with photo identification. When i travel to domestic routes i get E-tickect it dosnt feel like i brought a ticket nor i feel unsecure while im at the airport just about to check in with no tickects but exept just a paper form with some stuff on it.. and i show the ID' the E-tickect does not give much details as in a papper tickect where it tells u the route number and all..
i dont like it because it feels like i dont have a tickect with me  Smile/happy/getting dizzy but then again E-tickects is been told its safe and good.. for these who say( Ops sorry i lost my airline tickect do i need to buy another one) witch E-tickects are all on the computer systerm by showing some ID and Photo identification card.

cheers
 
flflyguy
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RE: No More Paper Tickets By 2008

Wed Jun 09, 2004 6:09 pm

Remember also that the savings to the airline comes not primarily from just "not issuing a paper ticket". With Interline itineraries, the paper ticket has to be "cleared" by submitting it to the issuing carrier in order to get the actual funds. Similar to clearing a paper check.

With e-tickets, it is all done electronically so the transporting carrier gets paid much faster by the ticketing carrier. Similar to direct deposit.

That is why the carriers prefer e-tickets on interline itineraries. (Aside from the other reasons already mentioned).
The views expressed are my own, and not necessarily those of my employer.
 
jwenting
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RE: No More Paper Tickets By 2008

Wed Jun 09, 2004 7:44 pm

I prefer paper, much less that can go wrong...

Remember, your order confirmation is no good as proof of purchase and neither is a creditcard statement.
Unless it's in the computer when you get to the checkin desk you won't fly...

Personally I don't trust computer systems enough to give me peace of mind flying to remote areas where they have electrical power only intermittently let alone internet access to be able to retrieve my e-ticket that I purchased on the other side of the world weeks or months earlier...
I wish I were flying
 
JGPH1A
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RE: No More Paper Tickets By 2008

Wed Jun 09, 2004 8:11 pm

I would agree with Jwenting, certainly when it comes to flights booked on carriers with less-than-optimum res systems (eg. OA, MS, EK, PK etc etc) - we get lots of NOREC (No Record Found) claims against these airlines, when pax have been booked and ticketed but were not able to travel because the airline denied recieving the booking. At least with a proper paper ticket, you have some proof that a reservation was made in a GDS at SOME point, and most airlines will NOREC a pax onto a flight that isn't full with no questions asked, if the ticket presented is correct. With only email confirmations and unverifiable e-ticket receipts which anyone can forge, you can forget about it. If for whatever reason, the airline has no record of you or your e-ticket, kiss your trip goodbye.

I think 2008 is very optimistic for getting rid of paper tickets completely - there are still markets out there which don't even have a proper BSP never mind the facility to issue e-tickets - still on manual paper ticketing. What will happen is that in 2008 all interline ticketing arrangements between the big carriers that can e-ticket, and the little carriers that can't, will get torn up.
Young and beautiful and thin and gorgeous AND BANNED ! Cya at airspaceonline.com, losers
 
qm001
Posts: 288
Joined: Sat Mar 13, 2004 2:25 am

RE: No More Paper Tickets By 2008

Wed Jun 09, 2004 8:27 pm

Just my 2 cents worth all! This would be a total disaster for all travelers in Africa! I have been to places that are "Systemless!" Yes... "Systemless!" How would anyone ever expect to do any inter-African travel especially from smaller stations like ZZU, JRO,KGL,BJM,FBM,FIH and even some of the bigger ones which sometimes have no systems for a whole day due to a link problem. Doing away with paper tickets will only be truly feasible worldwide when Africa, South America and South Asia can be offered a problem free system, that can never go down.

Of course I was even "checking in" in JNB three weeks ago only to find that the systems were down and they checked our flight in manually. Fortunately I brought along a print out of my E-Ticket otherwise I would not have been allowed to board.

There are even some cases like when booking a QM flight from an LH Amadeus terminal on Non-rev tickets that the booking would not even show! And IATA wants it all done by 2008! Whilst I like and greatly appreciate E-tickets, I think that are being a little to optimistic with 2008!

As for CO's etickets.. Around three months ago I had a rather large itinerary throughout the US, Central America and Canada. With 19 Segments, CO is the first airline that I have ever flown a trip of this size without missing a connection, losing a bag or having a problem with an e-ticket! Well done CO! The only issue was that if you have a KLM FD card, the mile never arrive!

Cherio all!

QM001 (167 Air Malawi)
I wish there was still a flying boat service on the African Lakes!