LambertMan
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AA Adds A Few Flights At STL

Wed Jun 23, 2004 11:47 am

One extra at
ATL bringing it to 7x daily
PHL bringing it to 7x daily
PIA which they didn't announce
MKE bringing it to 4x daily
SGF will also see an increase which was also unannounced

Brings the total to 219

Well at this rate, by 2050 we could be back at our oct. 03 AA schedule. Big thumbs up
 
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mariner
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RE: AA Adds A Few Flights At STL

Wed Jun 23, 2004 12:00 pm

LambertMan:

I have this list of cities:

http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/040622/datu027_1.html

cheers

mariner
aeternum nauta
 
LambertMan
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RE: AA Adds A Few Flights At STL

Wed Jun 23, 2004 12:07 pm

Whoops, forgot to put Denver on the list..

Add a BDL daily that was scheduled to start awhile ago to that DEN, and that equals an extra seven flights. Those flights bump up the schedule from the current 212 to 219.

I would expect something like a daily flight increase on MCO, RSW, and SAN runs in the future.
 
blhp68
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RE: AA Adds A Few Flights At STL

Wed Jun 23, 2004 12:10 pm

Lambertman:

Do you think AA will ever run flights up to MCI again. If I remember correctly those flights were very full, probably due to connections. Anyhow do you even see American Connection running a few dailies up here?
 
LambertMan
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RE: AA Adds A Few Flights At STL

Wed Jun 23, 2004 12:19 pm

Blhp,

Maybe if connecting opportunities to the east coast opened up it could become a possibility. I've heard of moanings and groanings from the Kansas City business community about the lost link between STL and MCI, but I dont' know if that alone could sway AA to restart the route. I would think that the yield has to be darn near piss poor for them to be running exactly zero flights. I think if they do re-enter the market it would be aways down the road.

DTW seems to be the most tossed about as a new destination, and apparently it was a go for 3x ER4 in April. Something fell thru however, and I'm not really that in depth at what exactly went on.
 
MAH4546
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RE: AA Adds A Few Flights At STL

Wed Jun 23, 2004 12:30 pm

I have heard rumblings of a few daily RJs on STL-MCI (5 on weekdays/3 on weekends), though I don't see it happening within the short frame. MCI will likely see MIA service before they see STL return. I do think, though, that MCI-STL will return to AA's route network in the future, but it will be Connection.
a.
 
AIR757200
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RE: AA Adds A Few Flights At STL

Wed Jun 23, 2004 12:34 pm

LambertMan,

Yeah, the DTW rumor was really hot- my former supervisors and the agents were very much expecting AmerConn service earlier in the year. Maybe WN being on the route continues to remain a factor on whether they want to return.
 
atrude777
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RE: AA Adds A Few Flights At STL

Wed Jun 23, 2004 1:02 pm

Good to see the routes, i think the WN i a factor, notice all those cities, are cities WN doesnt serve from STL or even serve period. except PHL, but its not N/S. Is AA afraid to compete with WN?? surely we can see mainline for STL-DEN/ATL with 7 DAIL surely ONE MD80 can be suporrted...oh well glad AA sees profit..hopefully
Alex
Good things come to those who wait, better things come to those who go AFTER it!
 
scottysair
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RE: AA Adds A Few Flights At STL

Wed Jun 23, 2004 1:05 pm

Can you tell me about those load factor was doing from STL hubs?
 
LambertMan
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RE: AA Adds A Few Flights At STL

Wed Jun 23, 2004 1:31 pm

I certainly agree that MIA will see MCI before STL ever does, considering the competition it would be a shoe in to fill a daily md80.

Air757,

Over spring break I was actually expecting some kind of new service announcement but obviously nothing ever came of it. Hopefully in the future....

Scotty,

I don't have any indepth numbers I can provide for you, but I have some pretty good insight as to how most of the mainline flights do. Some of the good performers LF wise, meaning 80-100% full consistently would probably include
MSY, LGA, LAX, MIA, FLL, TPA, RSW and SAN

Some of the more middle of the road performers meaning 60-80% full may include
DFW, ORD, BOS, DCA, SFO, SNA, and SEA

There are no flights when it comes to load factor that seem like they are in severe danger of getting the axe. Maybe if you factor yield into it, the story could change.

I've seen some BOS and SFO flights go out darn near empty on several occasions, so I wouldn't be surprised to see one daily from each dropped. Places like MSY, MIA, or LGA could sure use the extra daily. I would expecct some kind of a/c shifting coming up in the future similar to what we saw in March '04.
 
atcboy73
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RE: AA Adds A Few Flights At STL

Fri Jun 25, 2004 1:20 am

Does anyone else think this is in competition driven?

It seems like the increase in MKE flying is timed to meet the one daily NW flight.

I really cant believe NW is only going to operate one flight a day. Surly they will add at least one other in the future.

************


What about Moline? Why havent they started at least two a day from STL to MLI?
 
FLAIRPORT
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RE: AA Adds A Few Flights At STL

Fri Jun 25, 2004 8:09 am

I hope STL gets some more mainline flights...my friends dad is a purser out of STL and I know she groans when she mentions it (partially becasue she can't see him, but also because nowadays it is the ultimate demotion!)
NEXT FLIGHT: FLL-ATL-HPN on FL
 
scottysair
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RE: AA Adds A Few Flights At STL

Fri Jun 25, 2004 12:42 pm

This is one of those day will might get extra flight to Florida or California.
 
AA717driver
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RE: AA Adds A Few Flights At STL

Sat Jun 26, 2004 1:15 am

STL will continue to get more flights because the reason AA acquired TWA is beginning to reassert itself. ORD is a mess. I just talked with a friend(S80 pilot) and he confirmed that it's almost as bad(delays/traffic) as it was in 2000.

Unless UA significantly downsizes at ORD, AA will continue to build up STL(although slower than we'd like...).TC
FL450, M.85
 
juanchie
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RE: AA Adds A Few Flights At STL

Sat Jun 26, 2004 1:28 am

Im hoping to see AA switch the jax-stl service from an erj back to the md-80s we used to have for so many years. But only wishfull thinking...


Juan Carlos
God, forgive me for who I am, and help me be the man I want to be.
 
LambertMan
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RE: AA Adds A Few Flights At STL

Sat Jun 26, 2004 4:32 am

According to the director of sales in St Louis, they are looking at a "handful" of destinations to change from rj's to mainline a/c. It might include
ATL
DEN
PHL
RDU
EWR

Beyond those I'm stumped

Every other destination I listed besides the RDU is logical thinking. I was just told that RDU is one of the strongest perfomers for American Connection.
 
canoecarrier
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RE: AA Adds A Few Flights At STL

Sat Jun 26, 2004 4:43 am

I'd have to agree it will be a long time before MCI sees service. I never flew TW between the two, but every WN flight I took was never full. As recently as mid Dec. I flew WN to MCI on a Friday, it was half empty and the walk up fare was somewhere around $59.

The yield just isn't there to justify it at this time.
The beatings will continue until morale improves
 
atrude777
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RE: AA Adds A Few Flights At STL

Sat Jun 26, 2004 9:24 am

lambertman- when you mention the cities possible changing from RJ to Mainline, are you saying ALL flights will be a mainline flight? or a mix of RJ and Mainline service? Because 7 daily flights on an RJ is alot different from 7 MD80 or 757(im assuming they will use MD80) daily. so if they switch mainline does this mean we will se a REDUCTION of amount of flights to accomodate the more seats added??

Otherwise, thats great news.
AA717DRIVER- I was looking at flights into ORD and at AA.com the timetables gave each on time performance no hgiher then 30%!!! so will these aircrafts be switched from ORD to STL or I am not totally clear on how AA can change flights or aircrafts from ORD to STL.??


Alex
Good things come to those who wait, better things come to those who go AFTER it!
 
stock1985
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RE: AA Adds A Few Flights At STL

Sat Jun 26, 2004 9:33 am

Good discussion everyone... I was wondering what you all thought of AA bringing back STL-TUL, I know that STL-OKC came back with 3 dailies, and I was wondering how that was doing? Could anyone shed some light on this issue please...
 
Okie
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RE: AA Adds A Few Flights At STL

Sat Jun 26, 2004 9:57 am

Stock1985
OKC came back with 3 dailies and about a $50 increase in ticket price for a ride in an RJ.
Charge what the market will bear, what's your time worth not routing through DFW or heaven forbid ORD saves about 3-4 hours. Its worth $50 to me.

The situation that I see is AA, UA, or anybody else is going to back off of ORD and will be holding position until ORD is forced to slot. There are bunches of RJ's holding future slot positions at ORD.

When that happens then STL will start getting the overflow and picking up flights when AA can justify refocusing on STL. Until then its just going to be a few flights at a time. Even with a 5% growth-5 years would be 25% increase in passenger count most of that will be taken up by shifting to 717-195 size aircraft at ORD to replace RJ's. So from that stand point probably 10 years before STL starts to really grow. Unless of course the business travelers start whining and figure out that STL is a wonderful alternative to DFW or ORD of course that just my opinion.

Okie


 
LambertMan
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RE: AA Adds A Few Flights At STL

Sat Jun 26, 2004 10:14 am

I would like to know which congressman wrote those letters to AA asking for OKC and TUL back. I read it in the papers somewhere but I can't remember. Talk about shooting high, he was asking for mainline a/c!

TUL most likely will not come back unless if WN drops it....

Make no mistake about it people, (disregard the bottom of first post, that was jokingly) AA will never beef up STL to the point of oct. 03. I'm hoping that we can eventually see it top off around 300 flights...
 
Okie
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RE: AA Adds A Few Flights At STL

Sat Jun 26, 2004 11:42 am

I believe the congressman was E. Istook. Never hurts to have some leverage in Washington DC. or maybe he sits on a committee that AA needs some support.
Typical congressman, surprised he did not ask for an A-380, hoping to compromise on mainline.

STL is typically non congested, seldom delayed airport, as long as you are not on a plane that connects through ATL, DFW, ORD, LAX, SFO. Hopefully when business travelers who have to watch their time and dollars figure out how to avoid major delays by getting around major hubs STL will thrive again.

Kind of like ONT, or Orange County (excuse me SNA) save a half a day over LAX for So. Cal.

So I am shooting for 2014 for 400 flights at STL.

Okie


 
atrude777
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RE: AA Adds A Few Flights At STL

Sat Jun 26, 2004 12:03 pm

okie----wow.....thats in 10 years!!! who knows. maybe or maybe not, i doub tit, i agree wiht lambetrman, we wont see pre-october but 300 sounds reasonbale and quite gerneorus for an airport like STL.
Alex

ps- thats all AA flights, ur still forgteting we have NW, AWA, F9(who is rumored ot add more flgihts) DL, UAL, USA all have tons fo flights to, so we have well over 250 already OVERALL At the airport. let alone 219 or whatever with AA.
Alex
Good things come to those who wait, better things come to those who go AFTER it!
 
Okie
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RE: AA Adds A Few Flights At STL

Sat Jun 26, 2004 12:25 pm

so we have well over 250 already OVERALL At the airport. let alone 219 or whatever with AA.

So that's only +15 a year overall or +19 a year for AA to hit 400 in ten years.
5% growth rate x 250 = 12.5. The airlines are going to have to do something with the glut of RJ's

That does not look like completely unobtainable objective.

Okie
 
Okie
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RE: AA Adds A Few Flights At STL

Sun Jun 27, 2004 12:29 am

http://nj.com/news/ledger/jersey/index.ssf?/base/news-6/1088147609105160.xml

here is a linked article from another thread refering to EWR, LGA, ORD, ATL, & PHL

The article states help will be needed by 2013
So 10 years 400 flights may look easily obtainable

Okie
 
AA717driver
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RE: AA Adds A Few Flights At STL

Sun Jun 27, 2004 2:19 am

Okie--Good thought on the slot issue. I thought AA was piling on to screw with UA's effeciency. AA can take a hit on delays, UA can't.

Arpey has stated that they won't even address the 100-seater issue until all the MD80's(I think down to 23 now) are out of the desert and on line. Those planes have to go somewhere and I don't see AMR kicking Eagle down to STL(although they should displace the Connection flights but that's another topic...).TC
FL450, M.85
 
TLHFLA
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RE: AA Adds A Few Flights At STL

Sun Jun 27, 2004 2:22 am

I wouldn't be surprised to see AA add a second TPA flight back sometime in the fall. My sister and brother-in-law recently took the AA STL-TPA and TPA-STL nonstop flights (I believe they are using 757s right now) and they said both flights were completely packed. I think at the very least, an additional flight with a RJ would work.
Bill in ATL
 
atrude777
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RE: AA Adds A Few Flights At STL

Sun Jun 27, 2004 6:35 am

okie- good work on bringing that point up. Never realized that. does STL have slot capacity, or can and will AA change the ORD flights to STL?

aa717driver-when u say the 23 md80 need to be returned i assume u mean TWA ones because AA has all of there MD80 flying in service, the only thing left is the ex-TWA ones. Why do you think Eagle should come down to STL? I think American Connection does a fine job flying the service, and I think its a better company then Eagle off topic-are the crews of American Connection ex-TWA crew members? I know they are under chuataqau, corporate and trans state, but anyway..)

TLHFA- I have a feeling they would add an MD80 instead of an RJ if they add service, i just cant see an RJ STL-TPA, I dont know what they were thinking by adding the STL-MCO as a 3rd sat flight, I wouldnt fly it!!!

Alex
Good things come to those who wait, better things come to those who go AFTER it!
 
TLHFLA
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RE: AA Adds A Few Flights At STL

Sun Jun 27, 2004 11:00 am

Atrude777, an extra MD80 flight is what I am betting on too (likely two MD80s to replace the one 757), but given AA's use of regional jets I guess a TPA flight on one wouldn't be out of the question. Since you mentioned the third Sat. only STL-MCO-STL flight, I rembered that there is a Sat. only ERJ flight to supplement the 757 flight for STL-TPA-STL.
Bill in ATL
 
Womack17
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RE: AA Adds A Few Flights At STL

Sun Jun 27, 2004 11:15 am

I would be very interested to know the RDU-STL pax numbers. My parents flew to STL last month and said both of their flights outbound and inbound very absolutely packed and that they were asking for volunteers to take another flight when they were flying back to RDU.
Oh how I miss Midway Airlines. A class act right to then end.
 
MAH4546
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RE: AA Adds A Few Flights At STL

Sun Jun 27, 2004 12:45 pm

okie- good work on bringing that point up. Never realized that. does STL have slot capacity, or can and will AA change the ORD flights to STL?

Lost O'Hare capacity would more than likely be made up for in Dallas, not St. Louis.
a.