squirrel83
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Pros & Cons Of AS Flying Widebodys

Sun Jul 11, 2004 5:46 pm

I was just curious as to why doesnt alaska purchase wide body aircraft? 777 or 767, I think this would be a plus in the routes to ANC, MCO, DEN , JFK, BOS, IAD, ect ect. . . Cargo ect ~


What would be the pros and Cons of this?
Imagin ~ What would the paint job look like ~
Would Alaska ever do this?
A346, 7E7, 747, 777, Sonic Cruiser
 
COAB767
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RE: Pros & Cons Of AS Flying Widebodys

Sun Jul 11, 2004 6:19 pm

Pros would be ability to fly to international destinations, cons are they would need more crew per flight ie on a 777 a crew of 12 2 pilots + 2 reserve pilots plus a cabin crew of 8. I personally think AS is happy flying there aircraft with 6 or less crew. 2 pilots and 3 or 4 flight attendants.
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transPac
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RE: Pros & Cons Of AS Flying Widebodys

Sun Jul 11, 2004 7:39 pm

No offense, but that's a pretty wild idea. The 777 is simply WAY too big and expensive of a bird for AS to operate. Even the 767 wouldn't make sense. None of their routes could use the capacity and they don't need to fly international routes as they have very good codeshare system. AS is a US west coast focus carrier. Anything else would be a complete rebirth of what they are as an airline. However, I think if AS is doing exceptionally well a few years down the line, they could make good use of the 7E7-3 on transcons and popular routes.
 
AirframeAS
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RE: Pros & Cons Of AS Flying Widebodys

Sun Jul 11, 2004 10:03 pm

LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

You guys are really funny here!

AS only intention is to fly with one fleet type, period. No questions asked.
A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
 
as739x
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RE: Pros & Cons Of AS Flying Widebodys

Sun Jul 11, 2004 10:10 pm

LMOA even more then AiframeAS

Pros:
None that I can think of

Cons:
COST
more crew
new gates
new ramp equipment
new sims
new training for all
few route its justified on
may upset some coadshare partners
getting away from 1 fleet type
pilot contracts
flt. attn contracts

I could go on!

ASSFO
"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
 
AirframeAS
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RE: Pros & Cons Of AS Flying Widebodys

Sun Jul 11, 2004 10:15 pm

As739x......that it!! You and I are going head-to-head in a debate one of these days!! LMAO!  Big thumbs up
A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
 
HlywdCatft
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RE: Pros & Cons Of AS Flying Widebodys

Sun Jul 11, 2004 11:10 pm

It wasnt that funny.

I could see Alaska maybe one day ordering the smallest version of the 7E7 (the one to replace the 757). I don't know how many flights they have a day to MIA, but they fly two flights to MCO. If any airport they fly to has slot issues that they fly multiple times to, a 7E7 could be a good alternative to flying 2 737-900s.
 
AirframeAS
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RE: Pros & Cons Of AS Flying Widebodys

Sun Jul 11, 2004 11:16 pm

I could see Alaska maybe one day ordering the smallest version of the 7E7 (the one to replace the 757).

AS never has and never will operate a 752. So getting a 7E7 is a long shot dream for anyone so dont count on AS ever getting one. Like I said, AS is a one-fleet-type airline and they are stickin' to it.

AS is going to be flying 738s to MCO, cheaper than flying a 7E7 given to the fleet planning and costs they have now. Trust me on this one. Its not worth having a 7E7 in AS fleet. Widebodies and AS dont mix.
A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
 
as739x
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RE: Pros & Cons Of AS Flying Widebodys

Sun Jul 11, 2004 11:17 pm

Hlywdcatft.....won't happen! We are getting the 738 for Florida service. We had a chance at the 757 with an amzing deal and we said No. We may get a 7E7 offer, we will say No! We are looking for 1 fleet type as Airframe said. We do fly into a slot restricted airport (DCA) and our size plane fits just fine. Adding another type, specially one that we only need 10-15 at most, would cost way more then Alaska will spent. Remember, Alaska is a very conservative airline. I can assure you that you will not see a widebody in the next 10 years. Look for an order for 738's (with more 73G included) once the contract with pilots is worked out, and Alaska will be watching the development of the next series of 737 very carefully.

ASSFO
"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
 
AirframeAS
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RE: Pros & Cons Of AS Flying Widebodys

Sun Jul 11, 2004 11:49 pm

We had a chance at the 757 with an amzing deal and we said No..

I remember the day that ex-CEO John F. Kelly outrightly said no in an instant once Boeing offered AS for a 752 deal. Im glad Kelly said no.
A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
 
dutchjet
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RE: Pros & Cons Of AS Flying Widebodys

Mon Jul 12, 2004 3:12 am

AS really has no need for widebody aircraft, as mentioned above, AS even considered the 752 too big for their needs. (Do note that way back, Alaska place a order for the 747, 1 firm + 1 option, but this order was cancelled before the aircraft was built or delivered!)

To be honest, I also once thought that AS could make good use of a 767 size airliner on the busy Seattle-Anchorage route, sometimes AS flies up to 16 or more flights per day on that route especially during the busy summer tourist season......why not fly 8 or 10 flights per day with 763s? The answer is frequency and flexibility...AS is better off with smaller aircraft since (1) with smaller aircraft, they can offer more frequent departures as demanded by premium passengers and create more connection possibilities, (2) during the less busy winter season, the SEA-ANC schedule can be cut back to say 10 flights per day and the excess aircraft can be assigned to other routes (think Mexico), and (3) aside from the SEA-ANC route, AS really does not fly any other routes that require a 763 size aircraft.

Also, the costs of introducing, maintaining and operating an additional type would be very expensive....especially since AS would only have a small fleet (say 2 or 3) or larger widebody airliners.

While on paper, the idea of an Alaska widebody may make sense, in practical terms, Alaska is better off staying with its 737s.....one reason why Boeing developed the 737-900 was to offer airlines a large capacity airliner which was part of the 737 family, this way, airlines would not have to step up to the 757.
 
AirframeAS
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RE: Pros & Cons Of AS Flying Widebodys

Mon Jul 12, 2004 3:41 am

... AS even considered the 752 too big for their needs.

This statement is sort of not really true. The real fact was that AS wanted to go for ONE fleet type only. They never once said that the 752 was too big at all. It always has and always will be: ONE FLEET TYPE. Nuff said! Also, AS never really considered it. It was that Boeing approached AS about the idea and AS said no before even considering it. Like I said: ONE FLEET TYPE.
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yyz717
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RE: Pros & Cons Of AS Flying Widebodys

Mon Jul 12, 2004 3:53 am

AS could build a small longhaul network out of SEA. Routes could include NRT, HKG, LGW/LHR, AB) (FRA / FRF / EDDF), Germany">FRA, CPH. Similarly, summer ANC-NRT could operate. With daily or less than daily on these routes, a possible fleet of 3-5 763s could be supported.
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eastbay
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RE: Pros & Cons Of AS Flying Widebodys

Mon Jul 12, 2004 3:36 pm

Pros: Might look neat in an AS paint scheme.

Cons: the incredible beating their stock price would take the day the order was made.