L410Turbolet
Topic Author
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An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Tue Jul 27, 2004 5:38 am

Browsing through various destination maps I noticed that Minsk, Belarus (MSQ) seems to be completely ignored and forgotten by vast majority of European Airlines. Reason? Is it Lukashenko's oppressive regime that prevents any business interests to develop there? Or just the geographic proximity of Vilnius and Warsaw being not too distant as well. But both countries are EU members now, which makes cross border travel more difficult.
Anyone with more insight, please explain.
 
planesarecool
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Tue Jul 27, 2004 6:19 am

Also destinations like Bratislava, Tirana and Tallinn aren't exactly served by much from what i know.

-Stephen
 
CaptOveur
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Fli

Tue Jul 27, 2004 6:23 am

I hear the main airport in Elbonia is pretty desolate... The Elbonian member of the forum can probably give details on who flies there though.
Things were better when it was two guys in a dorm room.
 
swissgabe
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Tue Jul 27, 2004 6:36 am

I most cases, the reason would be, that there is NO demand ...

There are hundreds of such destinations where we could argue why not more carriers fly there. Just to name a few: WDH, BWN, VTE, BRN, ULN, FNJ etc (to list capitals only)

Smooth as silk - Royal Orchid Service /// Suid-Afrikaanse Lugdiens - Springbok
 
stirling
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Tue Jul 27, 2004 6:50 am

As for Minsk and why it remains an aviation black-hole, L410turbolet, you hit the proverbial nail on the head! (as we say in America)
You see, there is virtually no market for air travel in the country as the Belarusian economy is hampered by high inflation, persistent trade deficits, and ongoing rocky relations with Russia, Belarus' largest trading partner and energy supplier. Business is bad, and the local population worries more about being able to afford a loaf of bread, let alone an airline ticket to anywhere.
Belarus has seen little structural reform since 1995, when President Lukashenko launched the country on the path of "market socialism." In keeping with this policy, Lukashenko reimposed administrative controls over prices and currency exchange rates and expanded the state's right to intervene in the management of private enterprises.
As a business owner or even a manager, one must cope with frequent and arbitrary changes in regulations and retroactive application of new business regulations. Ignorance of the law is no excuse. Penalties can range from steep fines to even prison! It all boils down to how much money the local or central government needs on that particular day!
With all this said, it appears that Belarus is lucky even to see any airline service at all. It would seem that the Belarusan government does everything in its power to discourage airline service, among other things.
One would say, why don't they throw this idiot Lukashenko out of office? Well, in the last general election, he received over 75% of the vote.
Rigged? Good question.
I hope this helped.
Delete this User
 
L410Turbolet
Topic Author
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Tue Jul 27, 2004 7:07 am

TALLINM - Estonian Air, SAS, Lufthansa, Volare, Czech Airlines, Air France, Finnair

TIRANA - Adria, Malev, Alitalia, Austrian, Volare, Olympic, JAT, Turkish

BRATISLAVA - Czech Airlines, SkyEurope, LOT, Slovak Airlines, Air Slovakia, Austrian, Aeroflot

MINSK - LOT, Belavia, El Al, Austrian, Lufthansa

interesting statistics about Minsk airport:

passengers

1996 - 531,567
1997 - 514,024
1998 - 480,372
1999 - 404,664
2000 - 401,239
2001 - 422,778
2002 - 394,594

a/c movements

1996 - 6,337
1997 - 5,217
1998 - 5,001
1999 - 4,748
2000 - 4,329
2001 - 4,321
2002 - 4,106

 
L410Turbolet
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Tue Jul 27, 2004 7:14 am

Swissgabe,
I was talking about Europe only!  Insane So listing Pyongyang or Ulanbatar is rather pointless. And Bern is in Switzerland and ZRH or GVA are hardly "ignored" or "forgotten" by airlines.
 
Horus
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Tue Jul 27, 2004 7:19 am

L410Turbolet, why is Minsk in constant decline? anything to do with the break up of the Soviet Union?

Horus

EGYPT: A 7,000 Year Old Civilisation
 
stirling
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Tue Jul 27, 2004 7:28 am

Horus-
Read reply #4
That explains everything and answers your question.
Stirling
Delete this User
 
squirrel83
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Fli

Tue Jul 27, 2004 7:28 am

The major airlines seem to fly there HERE IS A TIMETABLE OF AIRLINES AND TIMES ECT http://www.airport.by/timetable.php
A346, 7E7, 747, 777, Sonic Cruiser
 
newkai
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Tue Jul 27, 2004 8:56 am

Bratislava is know being promoted in Vienna as "Vienna-Bratislava" (as if it were a Vienna airport). Some airlines such as Sky Europe offer free parking and free transportation to/from Vienna. I think there are also plans to extend Vienna's CAT (City Airport Train) to that airport.

Seeing that it's only 45 minutes by car away from Vienna, I guess the name is ok... Unlike Frankfurt-Hahn, which is over two hours away from downtown Frankfurt!
 
ly7e7
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Tue Jul 27, 2004 1:31 pm

You guys are forgetting the Belorussia is so poor and undeveloped that people can't afford air traveling (especially not abroad) and business traffic is accordingly insignificant.

Of course Lukaschenko's policies have to do something with this too.
2 things are endless: ignorance and space
 
JGPH1A
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Tue Jul 27, 2004 5:01 pm

CWL !


 Smile/happy/getting dizzy





..........................................
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cambrian
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Tue Jul 27, 2004 5:11 pm

CWL !

Ouch- that hurt! :-(

But come and have a look at CWL when there is a rugby match at the Millenium Stadium....


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fraT
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Tue Jul 27, 2004 5:22 pm

Belarus and Albania are probably the most underdeveloped countries in Europe and therefore lacking air traffic.
But there are some flights a day between Moscow and Minsk as well as the above mentioned airlines connecting MSQ with European hubs.
 
FinnWings
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Tue Jul 27, 2004 8:11 pm

TALLINM - Estonian Air, SAS, Lufthansa, Volare, Czech Airlines, Air France, Finnair

You can add also Aero Airlines, Air Baltic, Airest, Avies, LOT and Lufthansa for the list of regular passenger airlines from TLL.

Best Regards,
FinnWings
 
JGPH1A
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Tue Jul 27, 2004 8:14 pm

Re: But come and have a look at CWL when there is a rugby match at the Millenium Stadium....

How old is that picture ? TAT ? Oooh - memory lane flashback !
Young and beautiful and thin and gorgeous AND BANNED ! Cya at airspaceonline.com, losers
 
Kuba74
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Tue Jul 27, 2004 8:24 pm

What about Moldova and it`s capital Kishinev (Chisinau)? Which airlines fly there?
Kuba
 
BestWestern
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Tue Jul 27, 2004 10:04 pm

Just look at any Ryanair non hub airport, such as CCF, VST, LDY, etc.
You are 100 times more likely to catch a cold on a flight than an average person!
 
manni
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Tue Jul 27, 2004 10:31 pm

Brussels!

(Message too short, but... That's all I have to say on this)
SUPPORT THE LEBANESE CIVILIANS
 
Beaucaire
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Tue Jul 27, 2004 10:42 pm

Nîmes in France - one Ryanairflight / day ( soon big improvement a secondRyanairflight!!)
Otherwise nothing ...
Please respect animals - don't eat them...
 
BMIFlyer
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Tue Jul 27, 2004 10:46 pm

How about Sheffield City (EGSY) in the UK?


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There is no longer an IATA code for it now either (was SZD).

I believe scheduled flights only lasted a couple of months after the airport originally opened.

Too much competition from LBA, MAN and HUY i believe.

Thanks

Lee
Sometimes You Can't Make It On Your Own
 
JGPH1A
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Tue Jul 27, 2004 11:27 pm

SZD is still a valid city/airport code. They have also linked Sheffield to Doncaster airport (is that Finningley ?)

SZD*C SHEFFIELD. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ./GB
. . . .A .SZD - SHEFFIELD. . . . . . . .- 0K. . . . . /GB
. . . .B .ZFG - SHEFFIELD BUS. . . . .- 0K. . . . . /GB
DSA C DONCASTER. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . ./GB
. . . .A.DSA - SHEFFIELD . . . . . . . .- 0K. . . . . /GB
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CXA330300
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Tue Jul 27, 2004 11:29 pm

And others....

Lugano:
Lugano Airport is tiny, Lugano, capital of the Ticino canton of Switzerland, is not.

Swiss to Zurich/Kloten
FlyBaboo to Geneva/Cointrin

Florence/Amerigo Vespucci:
This is somewhat underserved, with all the people visiting Tuscany, but still relatively big compared to some mentioned in this thread. There are two new airlines there: FlyBaboo, Swiss (op. by Denim Airways).

Air France to Paris/CDG
Alitalia to Milan/Malpensa and Rome/Fiumicino
Austrian to Bologna and Vienna
Carpatair to Timisoara
Club Air to Verona, Bucharest and Tirane
Denim Airways, for Swiss, to Zurich/Kloten
FlyBaboo to Geneva/Cointrin
Lufthansa to Frankfurt am Main and Munich/F.J. Strauss
Meridiana to Amsterdam/Schipol, Barcelona, London/Gatwick, Catania, Olbia/Costa Smeralda and Palermo
SN Brussels Airlines to Brussels/Zaventem

Cardiff:
The Underserved Welsh capital only has four scheduled airlines, but has many charters, even trans-Atlantic. The scheduled airlines are:

Air Wales to Amsterdam/Schipol, Dublin, Jersey, London City, Newcastle, Plymouth and Swansea
bmibaby to Cork, Belfast Int'l, Glasgow, Edinburgh, Jersey, Prague, Paris/CDG, Geneva/Cointrin, Toulouse, Palma, Alicante and Malaga
KLM to Amsterdam/Schipol
Ryanair to Dublin

Exeter:
Flybe's base is also nearly entirely flybe: the only other airline is Isles of Scilly Skybus.

Flybe to Dublin, Faro, Alicante, Malaga, Belfast City, Edinburgh, Glasgow, Guernsey, Jersey and Newcastle
Isles of Scilly Skybus to St. Martin?

Nimes: Ryanair to Stansted, once a day. Wow.

AC/AA/UA/DL/B6/WN/US*/CO*/FI/BA/IB/AF/SK/LX/Sabena*/TK/LY/SA/MN/SW/AM/CE*/CX/CA/MU/JL/SQ/TG/MH/KA/5J
 
chris78cpr
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Tue Jul 27, 2004 11:41 pm

SOU and SEN!  Big thumbs up

Chris
5D2/7D/1D2(soon to be a 1Dx) 17-40L/24-105L/70-200F2.8L/100-400L/24F1.4LII/50F1.2L/85F1.2LII
 
newkai
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Wed Jul 28, 2004 12:08 am

Oh, I'd have to add BRQ (Brno, Czech Republic). It's the second-largest city in the Czech Republic with a population of nearly 400,000 and its county has around a million. I've visited the city twice in the last month and there were ads for a new, twice-daily service to Prague with CSA. As far as I can tell, this is about the only service.

I guess the Czech are happy using one airport. In the States we often want an airport every fifty miles or less!

Update: I checked the airport's site http://www.airport-brno.cz/english/index_e.htm and I am about right... But there are a lot of charter flights to the Mediterranean area. And... Funnily enough, there are flights to Minsk (MSQ)!

[Edited 2004-07-27 17:14:12]
 
newkai
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Wed Jul 28, 2004 12:25 am

Oh, and Manni,

If you think Brussels is bad, try Berlin!

3.4 million people and no non-stop flight to the US. Same goes for Hamburg with around 1.8 million.

On the other side of things, Stuttgart (pop. 590,000) has the daily DL ATL service, and even worse, Zurich (pop. 365,000), with all those LX flights (justified because of the hub) and the AA, UA, and CO flights (which somehow fill up).
 
JGPH1A
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Wed Jul 28, 2004 12:47 am

Re: On the other side of things, Stuttgart (pop. 590,000) has the daily DL ATL service, and even worse, Zurich (pop. 365,000), with all those LX flights (justified because of the hub) and the AA, UA, and CO flights (which somehow fill up)

On the other side of things, Stuttgart (pop. 590,000 AND THE MERCEDES FACTORY ) has the daily DL ATL service, and even worse, Zurich (pop. 365,000 AND ALL THE MONEY IN THE WORLD IN VAULTS BENEATH THE BAHNHOFSTRASSE), with all those LX flights (justified because of the hub) and the AA, UA, and CO flights (which somehow fill up).

Kind of makes sense with those little additions.
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sulman
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Wed Jul 28, 2004 12:55 am

"SOU and SEN!

Chris"



Oi! You'll take that back when Flybe orders the mythical 737s!  Laugh out loud
It takes a big man to admit they are wrong, and I am not a big man.
 
eclipseflight7
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Wed Jul 28, 2004 1:18 am

What about Moldova and it`s capital Kishinev (Chisinau)? Which airlines fly there?

I don't know about airlines, but there is a flight with three young men from Moldova that sing about being under a tree. That and Air Moldova, which have some EMB-120's and a pair of A320's, I think.

And remember, Zurich is a superhub for business and banking so ZRH can get some serious traffic.
Holy sh*ts and burritos.
 
radelow
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Wed Jul 28, 2004 1:27 am

It still amazes me how small Hamburg's airport is. I have been traveling there almost every year for 20+ years now and it hasn't grown much at all!!!! STILL NO DIRECT FLIGHTS! I do recall that, for a time, Delta had some kind of direct flight via Dallas or Houston or Atlanta (don't remember exactly).

Mark
 
OV735
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Wed Jul 28, 2004 1:37 am

I hear the main airport in Elbonia is pretty desolate... The Elbonian member of the forum can probably give details on who flies there though.

Where's Elbonia? I thought it only existed in the Dilbert comic strip.

About Minsk: I know that at least in 1998 LH flew there from Frankfurt and Munich, I don't know about now. Up until 1999 or someting also Estonian Air did from Tallinn, but due to lack of passengers the flights were dropped.

Bratislava shouldn't do very bad, they've got SkyEurope, Austrian and Slovak Airlines flying out of them + several other airlines.
 
JGPH1A
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Wed Jul 28, 2004 1:39 am

Elbonia is the small, mud-soaked region of France immediately surrounding Chambery, populated by bearded lefties in tall hats, and pigs. Its in the middle somewhere, near Switzerland, and is (quite rightly) largely ignored !  Laugh out loud
Young and beautiful and thin and gorgeous AND BANNED ! Cya at airspaceonline.com, losers
 
prosa
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Wed Jul 28, 2004 1:42 am

What about Moldova and it`s capital Kishinev (Chisinau)? Which airlines fly there?

The airport (KIV) has a site at http://www.airport.md, but it won't seem to load. I did a fare search through Orbitz, and the foreign carriers which serve it include RO, MA, OS (Tyrolean), and TK. None of the European majors like BA, AF, or LH.

"Let me think about it" = the coward's way of saying "no"
 
pelican
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Wed Jul 28, 2004 2:18 am

@Newkai
Stuttgart may have only 587.000 inhabitans but the agglomeration of Stuttgart has 2,59 million inhabitans, thus it's the third biggest metropolitan area in Germany. Stuttgart is also the heart of a prosper instustrial region.

Okay Berlin's transcontinental service is a joke, but this will change with the new airport within the next ten years. Although BBI (the new airport) will most likely never become a hub, because LH has already to hubs in Germany therefore there is no need for a third hub.

BTW I wouldn't call the following list (almost) no one: Airlines in TXL
Air Adriatic (AHR), Air Baltic,Air Berlin, Air Dolomiti, Air France, Air Malta, Alitalia, Atlasjet International Airways, Austrian Airlines, Blue1, British Airways, Bulgarian Air Charter, Cimber Air, Condor, Croatia Airlines, CSA, dba,
Estonian Air, Eurowings, Finnair, FreeBird Airlines, Germania, Germania Express,
Hamburg International,Hapag Lloyd, Hapag Lloyd Express, Iberia, InterAirlines,
Iranair, KLM, Lithuanian Airlines, LOT, LTU, Lufthansa, Malev, MIAT, MNG Airlines, Nouvel Air Tunisie, Olympic Airways, Onur Air, Pegasus, SAS, Sun Express, Swiss International Air Lines, Tarom, Transaero Airlines, Tunis Air, Turkish Airlines, Ukraine International,Volare Airlines

pelican






 
newkai
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Wed Jul 28, 2004 2:32 am

"On the other side of things, Stuttgart (pop. 590,000 AND THE MERCEDES FACTORY ) has the daily DL ATL service, and even worse, Zurich (pop. 365,000 AND ALL THE MONEY IN THE WORLD IN VAULTS BENEATH THE BAHNHOFSTRASSE), with all those LX flights (justified because of the hub) and the AA, UA, and CO flights (which somehow fill up)."

I just knew I was going to get that reply. Yeah, the Mercedes factory... But that can't be it alone. I remember reading that the service exists because of the US Military, but I don't know... Maybe it's a combination of the two.

As for the ZRH and the money... Can't this be accessed through wire transfer!? Or are so many exec smuggling money in briefcases!? I'm not saying that these two cities don't deserve flights (if this were the case they wouldn't exist anymore), I'm just saying there are larger cities in Europe with a great deal more of business travel that don't.
 
whitehatter
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Wed Jul 28, 2004 2:53 am

Carlisle

CAX/EGNC

Waste of a code....but there are apparently plans to develop the airport. Current services precisely zilch.
Lead me not into temptation, I can find my own way there...
 
airconti
Posts: 146
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Wed Jul 28, 2004 4:55 am

just found the following covering an interesting spot in Greece:
KZS - Kastelorizo http://www.hcaa-eleng.gr/kastelor.htm

just one daily flight out of RHO (exept Tuesday/Thursday) on OA/DH8. Could not find any other Destinations/Airlines - However has been significantly upgraded - in the past it was D28.
 
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VS4ever
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Wed Jul 28, 2004 5:06 am

Can I add CVT to that little list too. I hear they have at least one flight (but I think it's a charter), but the rest I believe are down to cattle (do they count as PAX? perhaps on FR maybe?)

 Wink/being sarcastic
Bring Back Orion Airways, you were the best!
 
fraT
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Wed Jul 28, 2004 5:27 am

A smaller population doesn't mean that the city shouldn't deserve intercontinental flights. There are other reasons.
FRa only has a pop. of 500.000 and has the most intercontinental flights in Europe behind LON because the airport has a tradition as the international hub for LH in Germany. Frankfurt is also the financial center of Germany and the EU.
ZRH is the largest city in Switzerland and one of the most important financial centers in Europe.
One the other side there are much larger cities with no intercontinental flights.
 
Russophile
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Wed Jul 28, 2004 5:35 am

MINSK - LOT, Belavia, El Al, Austrian, Lufthansa

Plus Aeroflot, RubyStar, Kaliningradavia, Dagestan Airlines, UTair, Kish Air.

There are plenty of flights to all the necessary destinations by the necessary airlines.

How about Pardubice Airport in the Czech Republic? The only service of any note is a semi-regular flight to Moscow with GTK Rossiya. Plus the occasional charter flight.

Or how about Vagar Airport in the Faroes. Isn't Atlantic the only operator in/out?

But there's plenty of white elephant airports scattered around Europe, in France, Belgium, Czech, Slovakia, etc, etc
 
airconti
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Wed Jul 28, 2004 7:10 am

Russophile,
concerning FAE - Vagar - it's at least a once daily service by Maersk to CPH as well (op/b 735) and also occasional service to BLL. RZ offers CPH,ABZ,OSL,STN,RKV - so, in 'this kind of league', quite a lot of traffic, even, if it's not more than 2 A/C a day - добрый вечер (hope, that worked....) A.
 
alespesl
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Wed Jul 28, 2004 8:42 am

Dont forget airport like Ostrava (OSR), Brno(BRQ) in Czech Republic. There are almost no airlines that fly there. These airports would be dead except few charter flights and very few scheduled flights.

Also Vagar Airport as mentioned above.

Have a good day.

Ales
 
kl911
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Wed Jul 28, 2004 9:30 am

'''Nîmes in France - one Ryanairflight / day ( soon big improvement a secondRyanairflight!!)
Otherwise nothing ... '''

No, Ryanair has already 2 flights a day to London Stansted and will get another one to London Luton. So, 3 in total per day.

 
mika10021
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Wed Jul 28, 2004 12:58 pm

My hometown airport of Thessaloniki (SKG).Domestic flights only by Olympic and Aegean Airlines.International airlines are Cyprus Airways,Alitalia,Swiss,KLM and Lufthansa.But we get a lot of charter airlines.
 
transPac
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Fli

Wed Jul 28, 2004 1:17 pm

I know this might amaze some of you but Lutenblag, capitol of Molvania, isnt served by ANY airline!?! Big grin www.molvania.com
 
alespesl
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Wed Jul 28, 2004 1:55 pm

Mika10021:

dont forget that CSA Czech Airlines flies to SKG
 
Kuba74
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Wed Jul 28, 2004 6:42 pm

There are some Polish regional airports like Rzeszow /RZE/, Szczecin /SZZ/ where LOT Polish Airlines is the only scheduled flights operator. Some of them are being used by foreign operators though.
Kuba

 
Jaspike
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Wed Jul 28, 2004 6:47 pm

Can I add CVT to that little list too. I hear they have at least one flight (but I think it's a charter), but the rest I believe are down to cattle (do they count as PAX? perhaps on FR maybe?)
Thomsonfly are based at CVT  Big thumbs up


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gilesdavies
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RE: An Airport In Europe Where (almost) No One Flies

Wed Jul 28, 2004 7:35 pm

How about Manston in Kent, England.

It is in the very corner of the South East of England and surrounded by water on three sides. Miles from anywhere (other than people who live in Kent)

In recent years all it has been useful for is aid missions for charity donations to Africa and 2-3 charter flights a year from the US for Cruises departing from nearby Dover.

This is supposed to all be changing though soon as a new LCC called EU Jet will be flying there to Europe and UK destinations. (I give them 6 month's to a year before they pull out!)

Ryanair did consider it as a base but even they thought it was too remote!

On the positive side it has a very long runway and able to handle all aircraft.

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