QANTASpower
Posts: 515
Joined: Sat Aug 17, 2002 3:07 pm

QF Hong Kong Flights - Load Factors?

Thu Aug 12, 2004 8:13 pm

Hi,

Does anybody know what the loads are like of QF's Hong Kong flights.

I have heard reprts that flights such as QF 187 and 188 which is the second Sydney to Hong Kong flight have very low loads.

Reports are that some flights are lucky to have 30 or 40 people on board.

How could they continue to run such a service?

What are the loads like from other capitals?

Thanks

 
CXoneworld
Posts: 312
Joined: Thu Aug 12, 2004 1:59 am

RE: QF Hong Kong Flights - Load Factors?

Thu Aug 12, 2004 8:26 pm

I've heard of the same story too. This is quite unimaginable given the summer high season there in HKG!!

But I guess the cargo business is doing exceptionally well. Indeed one classic "rumour" that I've been hearing all the time is CX manages to make handsome profits just by filling up the A330 cargo belly, with not even a single passenger onboard!!

So finally, could anybody confirm this? This fairy tale sounds too good to me frankly...
oneworld alliance revolves around you
 
Beno
Posts: 422
Joined: Wed Aug 28, 2002 6:52 pm

RE: QF Hong Kong Flights - Load Factors?

Thu Aug 12, 2004 8:37 pm

There is alot of $$$ in cargo thats one of the reasons HKG was the first destination for the A333s.

Cargo is also one of the reasons QF are keeping the A332s on transcon SYD/MEL-PER services.
 
QF747
Posts: 157
Joined: Sat Nov 27, 1999 9:53 am

RE: QF Hong Kong Flights - Load Factors?

Thu Aug 12, 2004 8:38 pm

Not sure about the load factors but, QF 763s are going to be replaced with QFA333s on the route. This should mean that they get more seat and cargo capacity as well.

Maybe they are trying CX's approach to the HKG flights
Always fly QF!
 
carnoc
Posts: 758
Joined: Wed Oct 17, 2001 3:15 pm

RE: QF Hong Kong Flights - Load Factors?

Thu Aug 12, 2004 10:55 pm

I have also heard several times in last couple of weeks that the LF for QF's flights between Hong Kong and Australia are often below 50%, and there was a piece of research work I saw somewhere suggested the CX is still doing a lot better than QF on these routes, although there are many factors could be seen as 'possible causes'.

Best Regards.
 
Beno
Posts: 422
Joined: Wed Aug 28, 2002 6:52 pm

RE: QF Hong Kong Flights - Load Factors?

Fri Aug 13, 2004 9:59 am

Remember CX offers conections to Europe via HKG so that also helps fill planes.

Once QF start the LHR services via HKG as well as the skybed A333s operating on the route things should start to pick up towards the end of the year.
 
QANTAS077
Posts: 5176
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2004 5:08 pm

RE: QF Hong Kong Flights - Load Factors?

Fri Aug 13, 2004 10:41 am

i think it may also be more of a positioning flight so that Qantas can operate flights out of HK back to other Oz ports, the 2nd QF flight to HK ex sydney usually turns around and goes to Perth, this is also the same with the melbourne flight and Perth flight, though i did take QF from hk-per in april and the load was about 40 people!
 
CXoneworld
Posts: 312
Joined: Thu Aug 12, 2004 1:59 am

RE: QF Hong Kong Flights - Load Factors?

Fri Aug 13, 2004 3:43 pm

Sounds like a case of overcapcity to me, at least from the pax business point of view.

Wait till VS and Dragonair (the next Hong Kong based carrier) enter HKG-SYD!! Competition will sure go ever more nasty  Pissed
oneworld alliance revolves around you
 
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ClassicLover
Posts: 3955
Joined: Tue Mar 09, 2004 12:27 pm

RE: QF Hong Kong Flights - Load Factors?

Fri Aug 13, 2004 3:51 pm

Yeah, but you can bet your arse that QF flights will then be running at high capacity like all the other flights to and from London.

I'm going via Hong Kong in March, can't wait... Singapore is so boring compared to Hong Kong, so I reckon QF will absolutely plunder the route!

Trent.
I do quite enjoy a spot of flying - more so when it's not in Economy!
 
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ERJ135
Posts: 672
Joined: Thu Nov 09, 2000 4:04 pm

RE: QF Hong Kong Flights - Load Factors?

Fri Aug 13, 2004 5:09 pm

I fly often between Sydney and Hong Kong and have never had such a low load flight as has been mentioned, That's not to say it doesn't happen but I've never come accross it.

QF's decision to increase capacity with A330's seem to indicate a need for more seats rather than an over supply.
I remember when the DC-3 was new!
 
andrewtang
Posts: 368
Joined: Sat Jun 23, 2001 8:51 pm

RE: QF Hong Kong Flights - Load Factors?

Fri Aug 13, 2004 5:20 pm

One of the best selling point about A330 is that an airline could still earn profit even by flying the plane empty if they could get their belly filled up.

So obviously even if the load factor is indeed below 50%, they could still keep flying as long as they have that profit.

Interesting to note is that, in future all HONG KONG - AUSTRALIA and vice versa flights will be operated by Airbus with the exception of a 744 flight from Qantas and occassion CX744 ad hoc rosters.

CX A330/A340
KA A330
QF A330/B744
VS A340

[Edited 2004-08-13 10:27:25]
 
wingtip
Posts: 52
Joined: Mon Sep 04, 2000 8:49 am

RE: QF Hong Kong Flights - Load Factors?

Fri Aug 13, 2004 6:00 pm

CX 134/135 (HKG-MEL-HKG) will soon be operated by B744 on a daily basis.
 
aussie747
Posts: 1005
Joined: Thu Aug 14, 2003 11:15 pm

RE: QF Hong Kong Flights - Load Factors?

Fri Aug 13, 2004 6:07 pm

What must be remembered yield per passenger is quite high on routes to HKG especially through SYD.

The economy cabin may be half empty. However the premium in J and F is frequently full. All too often a few days before a flight there are many people on J class waitlists.

The advent of flights to LHR throught London and the upgrading of services from 763 to A333 (in terms of product) wll only serve to enhance and boost the market throught HKG for both the Business J class market and VFR Y class market.

The entry of KA and VS onto the scene will have some impact on Y and J average yeilds.
 
Victor
Posts: 93
Joined: Fri Aug 31, 2001 11:21 pm

RE: QF Hong Kong Flights - Load Factors?

Fri Aug 13, 2004 8:05 pm

is that cx will add one more daily flight SYD flight this winter ?

cx-- 3 flights a day to syd
qf-- 2 flights a day to syd
vs-- soon to be 1 flight a day to syd
and also
ka-- will operate daily flight to syd next year
------
7 flights a day to SYD .. is that a little bit too much ?
 
senliture
Posts: 404
Joined: Sun May 14, 2000 5:28 pm

RE: QF Hong Kong Flights - Load Factors?

Fri Aug 13, 2004 8:36 pm

Speaking as a person who live in Melbourne, I would choose CX than QF. First of all is about the price, usually QF is just about A$5 to $10 cheaper than CX during promotion period. Secondly is coz i am 100% sure that CX has better services than QF: while QF still use their old 767, they don't have PTVs. 9 hours flights without entertainment is a bit too boring, and I can't fall asleep in a plane anyway (but the only time that i fall asleep natually is on QF domestic, SYD-MEL heh). Oh yea, I still reckon CX's fligthcrew is more friendly then QF, maybe coz of my bad experience once so not really interested in trying QF again.

Had wanted to book QF for this Christmas time, but in the end i choose SQ, coz I wanna have a stopover in Singapore. Cheers!
 
aussie747
Posts: 1005
Joined: Thu Aug 14, 2003 11:15 pm

RE: QF Hong Kong Flights - Load Factors?

Fri Aug 13, 2004 10:18 pm

"Secondly is coz i am 100% sure that CX has better services than QF: while QF still use their old 767, they don't have PTVs. 9 hours flights without entertainment is a bit too boring"

QF only uses the A333 to HKG, complete with PTV Q entertainment system in economy and skybeds in J class.

 
CXoneworld
Posts: 312
Joined: Thu Aug 12, 2004 1:59 am

RE: QF Hong Kong Flights - Load Factors?

Tue Aug 17, 2004 4:34 am

QF only uses the A333 to HKG, complete with PTV Q entertainment system in economy and skybeds in J class.

Okay, just for argument's sake: CX actually offers more entertainment channels than QF on its PTV system!!  Big grin Nevertheless, I am giving the new Qantas international A333 a big happy "trial" next month, flying between PER and HKG.

Also that today I had a little chat with my travel agent who insisted that QF hires HKG-based crews on its flights, although I wasn't ready to agree with her...

So was she correct or I've just been mistaken?? Thanks  Smile
oneworld alliance revolves around you
 
OH-LGA
Posts: 1253
Joined: Thu Oct 07, 1999 1:42 am

RE: QF Hong Kong Flights - Load Factors?

Tue Aug 17, 2004 4:53 am

Tell that to me when I was trying to fly SYD-HKG back in February... both flights were full and I had to go to CX to get out  Smile

Kai
Head in the clouds... yet feet planted firmly on the ground.
 
VH-BZF
Posts: 740
Joined: Fri Oct 29, 1999 1:28 pm

RE: QF Hong Kong Flights - Load Factors?

Tue Aug 17, 2004 4:21 pm

CXoneWorld,

Qantas only has long haul bases in Sydney, Melbourne & Perth. Qantas has contract crew (employed by Adecco) in Auckland & Bangkok! I have seen some literature that they have some Japan based crew as well, however I am not sure about that???

Brisbane will open as a new long haul base either by year end or early next year & following that London will be the only other long haul base & that is scheduled to open (Qantas cabin crew UK) by July 2005. From what I have been told, the london based crew will do all the London to Sin/Bkk & Hkg flights, with Australian based crew making up the rest of their flights! Of course the BKK & AKL based crew also fly those routes as well!

As far as Hong Kong flights go I understand that loads with QF have been quite good on Syd & Mel sectors, with Perth flights increasing to 4 a week.

Cheers - BZF



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