trijetfan1
Posts: 1098
Joined: Sun Feb 01, 2004 5:29 am

Would Southwest Ever Go To Canada Or Mexico?

Wed Aug 18, 2004 4:05 am

I was just wondering if Southwest would ever have a chance to fly something like MDW-YYZ or LAX-MEX? or something of that nature.
Earned PPL June 26, 2007
 
NWAFA
Posts: 1843
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2003 10:30 pm

RE: Would Southwest Ever Go To Canada Or Mexico?

Wed Aug 18, 2004 4:08 am

Nope..Nada...don't see it for many reasons...

Can NOT turn an aircraft in 20-30 minutes internationally. The cost of International Clearance...the cost of having all WN's FA get passports. The cost of Security..all international airlines must have security while the A/C is on the ground. To go to Mexico they would have to Over Water equip their A/C which would be MILLIONS of bucks to do it.
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kim777fan
Posts: 497
Joined: Fri Aug 06, 2004 11:47 pm

RE: Would Southwest Ever Go To Canada Or Mexico?

Wed Aug 18, 2004 4:09 am

Then again, you DO have WestJet now about to serve US destimations and JetBlue flying internationally, so you never really know.
 
lnglive1011yyz
Posts: 1502
Joined: Thu Oct 23, 2003 12:23 pm

RE: Would Southwest Ever Go To Canada Or Mexico?

Wed Aug 18, 2004 4:10 am

I agree with NWAFA -- There really isn't a market northbound from US to Canada that you could do low-cost.

Southbound would be a market, but that is being quickly sucked in by your Jetsgo's and Westjets.

I would love to see it though..

1011yyz.

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NWAFA
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RE: Would Southwest Ever Go To Canada Or Mexico?

Wed Aug 18, 2004 4:12 am

Kim,

True, however how many FA's do JetBlue have?? Their Airbus's are over water equipped from the factory....so no cost for that....
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ltbewr
Posts: 12427
Joined: Thu Jan 29, 2004 1:24 pm

RE: Would Southwest Ever Go To Canada Or Mexico?

Wed Aug 18, 2004 4:14 am

Probably not as Canada has it's own discount airlines serving in to the USA and Mexico wouldn't allow the competition vs. Mexicana. There is also the legal tangle it would mean to operate internationally, the issue with the unions on the hiring non-US citizens at much lower wages and benefit costs to work for the suggested flights. WN and other USA based LCC's has plenty enough opportunites within the USA to explore yet. Besides, WN serves serves cities near both the borders of Mexico (Texas, Arizona, Southern Calif.) and Canada (DTW, BUF). JetBlue for example is expanding service to the Carribbean, such as to the Dominican Republic, thus offering competition to AA. That may be the better direction for WN to go to.
 
AirframeAS
Posts: 9811
Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2004 3:56 pm

RE: Would Southwest Ever Go To Canada Or Mexico?

Wed Aug 18, 2004 5:24 am

You know, NWAFA hit it on the nail there completely. WN has already emphasized that they will never fly internationally, per Herb himself. It costs too much money to fly there (international tax and customs tax) and they dont want to carry on that price to the pax. And most of it has to do with customs and turn around times.

So no, its never gonna happen so dont count on it. Just because WestJet and jetBlue do fly internationally does not mean that WN has to fly internationally.
A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.
 
Byrdluvs747
Posts: 2377
Joined: Thu Jul 15, 2004 5:25 am

RE: Would Southwest Ever Go To Canada Or Mexico?

Wed Aug 18, 2004 5:36 am


Probably not as Canada has it's own discount airlines serving in to the USA and Mexico wouldn't allow the competition vs. Mexicana.


We're not talking about intra-Canada/Mexico ops.

If I recall correctly, the Mexico-US agreement says only two airlines can serve any route between the two countries. That being said, many of the choice routes are already filled up.

However, if WN can find a route that's open, all they would need to do is apply with both governments(If they so desired)


There really isn't a market northbound from US to Canada that you could do low-cost.


HP has been doing it for a number of years.

I hope we never have to subject Canadians and Mexicans to the hideous sight of WN planes.
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SWAFA30
Posts: 436
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RE: Would Southwest Ever Go To Canada Or Mexico?

Wed Aug 18, 2004 5:49 am

The question was will WN ever begin transborder service? Soon? doubtful but (n)ever is a very, very long time. Herb has never said it won't happen, he simply says that WN currently has "bigger fish to fry" here in the lower 48. What happens when all those fish have indeed been fried?

A few points, first, Herb can't live forever. Eventually, the reins...all of them will have to turned over to the next generation of management. We assume that they will be Herb devotees who will keep the business model intact but that is just an assumption. Second, WN stockholders and Wall Street types have come to expect growth, constant growth from Southwest. Eventually, there will come a point where there is no place left to go in the United States. It might be years, it might be decades, but eventually a saturation point will be reached and if WN is to continue to grow, it will have to head either north, south or both. Third, the 20(acutally 30 now) minute turn is an important part of the SWA formula but there are exceptions....we are witnessing that exception in Philadelphia. Management entered that market knowing full well our on-time performance there would be in the toilet...and yet they went in anyway? Why? Because sometimes the cost of not serving a market is higher than the cost of extended turn times or any of the other myriad cost that would come with this new endeavor. In short, WN will bite the bullet and spend the $$ to leave the country when it becomes too expensive not to....and not a moment sooner.

Just my two cents.
 
radelow
Posts: 415
Joined: Thu Jul 15, 2004 3:07 am

RE: Would Southwest Ever Go To Canada Or Mexico?

Wed Aug 18, 2004 5:53 am

If Herb keeps smoking the way he does he won't last long at all(!!!). What are the chances of Southwest equipping a couple of ETOPS 73G's and flying to Hawaii? $200/roundtrip sounds good to me.

Mark
 
NWAFA
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RE: Would Southwest Ever Go To Canada Or Mexico?

Wed Aug 18, 2004 5:55 am

Radelow,

Again that would be to the sum of millions of dollars....
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AirframeAS
Posts: 9811
Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2004 3:56 pm

RE: Would Southwest Ever Go To Canada Or Mexico?

Wed Aug 18, 2004 6:28 am

Once again, I agree with NWAFA..... WN wasnt set up to do what most people think WN should be doing.
A Safe Flight Begins With Quality Maintenance On The Ground.