A350
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VS Beat BA Hands Down In Poll!

Mon Aug 30, 2004 10:05 pm

British Airways' advert's used to style it "the world's favourite airline", but according to the poll by the Daily Telegraph, it is not even close to being the nation's favourite.

BA was rated consistently worse than rival Virgin Atlantic in a poll conducted for the Daily Telegraph.

Out of 4,200-plus people asked, BA scored worse than Virgin in areas such as the cleanliness of its aircraft and courtesy of staff, and was also rated as bad as budget carriers airlines easyJet and Ryanair for punctuality, comfort and baggage handling, among others.

The poll, in which respondents only rated airlines they had flown on, showed BA lagging some way behind Virgin in terms of overall customer satisfaction.

In all, 73 percent of those who had flown Virgin rated the overall experience as good or excellent, against an equivalent figure of 61 percent for BA, slightly above easyJet's 51 percent and 49 percent for Ryanair.

What does the future hold for BA?


[Edited 2004-08-30 15:06:27]
 
kl911
Posts: 3981
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RE: VS Beat BA Hands Down In Poll!

Mon Aug 30, 2004 10:11 pm

Very good! Virgin employeees deserve this.

On the other hand the BA employees don't seem to be motivated anymore, which might be a part of this reult as well. I hope for BA that they find a solution soon.

KL911
 
bhxforever
Posts: 549
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RE: VS Beat BA Hands Down In Poll!

Mon Aug 30, 2004 10:13 pm

Funny that, considering VS operates only a small number of flights in comparison to BA, they have one of the worst punctuality rates in the UK, and double the average delay of BA.

http://www.flightontime.info/
 
kl911
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RE: VS Beat BA Hands Down In Poll!

Mon Aug 30, 2004 10:17 pm

Bhxforever,

True, but on a 10+ hours flight the 30minutes delay is not that much, but what counts then is the service onboard and on the ground. I must say that the word 'service' is very special for VS, they try to do everything they can, while at my last 2 BA flights the crew wasn't interested in service at all.

KL911
 
aa61hvy
Posts: 13021
Joined: Fri Nov 05, 1999 9:21 am

RE: VS Beat BA Hands Down In Poll!

Mon Aug 30, 2004 10:21 pm

But one has to question the validity of the poll. Who was surveyed? What were the demographics etc? Most of the time surveys like this are biased.
Go big or go home
 
Arsenal@LHR
Posts: 7510
Joined: Tue Mar 20, 2001 2:55 am

RE: VS Beat BA Hands Down In Poll!

Mon Aug 30, 2004 10:21 pm

It doesn't mean much, a poll is just a poll, passengers numbers show a different story. BA carries 4 times as many passengers as BA, British Airways, was, is and will be the UK's favourite carrier. Even though most of the pax BA carries are non-British, it still is the numero uno airline for most people. Having never flown on Virgin, i can't comment on them, but i have flown BA many times and their service is top notch.
In Arsene we trust!!
 
AEROFAN
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RE: VS Beat BA Hands Down In Poll!

Mon Aug 30, 2004 10:28 pm

Having flown both, for business and pleasure, I can claim without bias that VS is the better company.

And those delays - on my flights most of them were caused by idiotic passengers who checked in and did not board the flight. Bags then had to be located and removed. Some were caused by late boarding passengers. The rest were caused by late arriving aircraft.
 
777236ER
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RE: VS Beat BA Hands Down In Poll!

Mon Aug 30, 2004 10:30 pm

Virgin isn't a domestic airline, which makes the poll useless. Also notice when the poll was carried out - after a period of very bad publicity for BA. Coincidence they didn't get good marks?

Compare BA to Lufthansa, Air France, UA, AA, Qantas, Emirates, Singapore, JAL, ANA, Cathay etc and you get a fair comparison.
Your bone's got a little machine
 
BestWestern
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RE: VS Beat BA Hands Down In Poll!

Mon Aug 30, 2004 10:33 pm

The BA economy and Premium Economy product is better than VS. The VS J class product is excellent.

VS lives on marketing and Spin - something richard Branson is excellent at. The Press love to kick BA.
You are 100 times more likely to catch a cold on a flight than an average person!
 
AEROFAN
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RE: VS Beat BA Hands Down In Poll!

Mon Aug 30, 2004 10:47 pm

Perhaps BA helps to kick them selves?!

"Compare BA to Lufthansa, Air France, UA, AA, Qantas, Emirates, Singapore, JAL, ANA, Cathay etc and you get a fair comparison "

Let me see now

About the same as LH
Better than AF, UA, AA
Worse than QF, JAL, ANA
Definitely worse than Emirates, Singapore and yes Virgin (spin or no spin)
 
777236ER
Posts: 12213
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RE: VS Beat BA Hands Down In Poll!

Mon Aug 30, 2004 10:52 pm

About the same as LH
Better than AF, UA, AA
Worse than QF, JAL, ANA
Definitely worse than Emirates, Singapore and yes Virgin (spin or no spin)


But that's completely subjective on your behalf, it's not an unbiased poll at all.
Your bone's got a little machine
 
kl911
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RE: VS Beat BA Hands Down In Poll!

Mon Aug 30, 2004 11:42 pm

'''The Press love to kick BA'''

That's something they should have done during the 'dirty tricks' period.
They lost my respect forever with that stupid action.

The Dirty tricks campaign :

In January 1993, Virgin Atlantic chief Richard Branson won a libel suit against Lord King's British Airways, which admitted to having launched a "dirty tricks" campaign against its rival. Among its many dodgy tactics? BA operatives leaked stories to the press impugning Virgin's safety standards; hacked into Virgin's reservations system; called Virgin customers, lied about cancellations, and switched them to BA flights; and circulated rumors that Branson had AIDS and that garbagemen were unwilling to collect the trash at a Branson-owned nightclub because it included HIV-infected needles!

http://www.anecdotage.com/index.php?aid=16740

http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/january/11/newsid_2520000/2520189.stm


KL911
 
BestWestern
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RE: VS Beat BA Hands Down In Poll!

Tue Aug 31, 2004 1:07 am

Emirates better than BA.... come off it

Is it the 10 abreast 777 economy you like on emirates?
Is it the crummy business class Emirates seating you like? Emirates has some good product on the 345, but apart from that they are poor in terms of passenger comfort.
You are 100 times more likely to catch a cold on a flight than an average person!
 
geoffm
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RE: VS Beat BA Hands Down In Poll!

Tue Aug 31, 2004 2:25 am

Having flown BA, Virgin, and Emirates all long haul in the last couple of years, my opinion is BA are worst, pure and simple. Emirates were best, and even the 10 abreast seating in a 777 was fine (try 14 hours in 2 segments - not really a problem at all). EK business, okay not the world's best product but that was okay too (I got economy one way and upgraded on the way back).

Today I stepped off a BA plane from CPH where I had crumbs on my seat, the seatbelts were not laid out (okay, minor point), and the service was pretty substandard. I seem to get poor service on all my BA flights over the years.

However, I will give BA this: their European snack service was very good - hot panini, fruit salad, muffin, water, and a Kit Kat.

Geoff M.
 
Pe@rson
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RE: VS Beat BA Hands Down In Poll!

Tue Aug 31, 2004 2:33 am

I beg your pardon, but FR's punctuality is second to none - in fact, its weekly ontime performance is always 90-95% of all flights, and 98-100% of all flights arrive within one hour. Neither BA nor VS get anywhere near that. To illustrate, I've flown FR about 45 times to date and have only been late 1 time - and that was due to the de-icing maching at not arriving on-time at STN one very cold and snowy February morning!

Also, the overwhelming majority of bags carried by FR reach their owns as they should - in fact, only 0.31 of 1,000 bags go astray or otherwise don't reach their owners as they should. This is EXTREMELY low - far lower than for BA and VS.

Lastly, EXTREMELY few of FR's flights are ever cancelled, proving that it is an exceptionally reliable airline.

Dear me, talk about ignorance.
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
 
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Richard28
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RE: VS Beat BA Hands Down In Poll!

Tue Aug 31, 2004 3:23 am

I beg your pardon, but FR's punctuality is second to none - in fact, its weekly ontime performance is always 90-95% of all flights, and 98-100% of all flights arrive within one hour. Neither BA nor VS get anywhere near that. To illustrate, I've flown FR about 45 times to date and have only been late 1 time - and that was due to the de-icing maching at not arriving on-time at STN one very cold and snowy February morning!

This is a consequence of FR mainly operating out of very small airports, which are less crowded, meaning fewer delays.

Also, the overwhelming majority of bags carried by FR reach their owns as they should - in fact, only 0.31 of 1,000 bags go astray or otherwise don't reach their owners as they should. This is EXTREMELY low - far lower than for BA and VS.

FR do not offer any bag handling services for connecting flights, this is why the figure is so low.

Lastly, EXTREMELY few of FR's flights are ever cancelled, proving that it is an exceptionally reliable airline.

Fair enough, dont know the stats on it though!


back to the thread, I've flown longhaul on BA and VS, and would choose VS everytime, and only fly BA when they fly somewhere VS do not.

BA are still a very good airline though.
 
Pe@rson
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RE: VS Beat BA Hands Down In Poll!

Tue Aug 31, 2004 7:56 am

FR are exceptionally punctual, it's as simple as that. The fact that it serves small and thus quiet and uncontrainted airports is just pure genius for them, for it means its passengers can arrive ontime or - in most cases - early. Its punctuality is peerless. Passengers want to arrive ontime and FR delivers this overwhelmingly more frequently than BA. This week, 91% of FR's flights arrived ontime and 98% arrived within one hour. That says enough.

Yes, FR does not offer connecting possibilities - just like U2 and most other low-cost carriers - but that's irrelevant to the average consumer, who is simply concerned with whether or not his or her bag will arrive. With FR, extremely few bags go astray.

You'll just have to trust me when I say that I follow FR's flights and extremely few have been cancelled.
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
 
DfwRevolution
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RE: VS Beat BA Hands Down In Poll!

Tue Aug 31, 2004 8:20 am

Oh good lord the "A350" was coined less than a week ago and someone already snatched it as a username....  Big grin
 
AEROFAN
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RE: VS Beat BA Hands Down In Poll!

Tue Aug 31, 2004 9:27 am

Of course the poll was biased. Just as all polls are. Just as if they were to ask you and you state that BA's service is better.

Well as a consumer who has flown all of the carriers listed in both Y class and the J cabin. I stand by my rating.Be it biased and all. A flight getting in on time is not really that important to me. I am never in a mad rush to get nowhere quickly, even if I am travelling on business. I rate my experience on cleanliness of the cabin, the quality of food provided, assistance and response when something goes wrong. VS stands out.

LCCs - I've only ever flown one. Jet Blue. Service was ok. It was cramped and I did not care for the much talk about live tv. (i'm not into golf, fly fishing or nascar racing. So I can't speak to any of them.
 
AApilot2b
Posts: 451
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RE: VS Beat BA Hands Down In Poll!

Tue Aug 31, 2004 9:21 pm

FR rocks! Great fares and timely service are synonymous with Ryanair. I remember the days when timeliness was not their strong point, but that has certainly changed. Anyhow, the poll was about BA and VS. Besides being a poor comparison, it is a poll taken by the "Daily Telegraph." Just the use of the words "Daily Telegraph" translate into meaningless garble. Big grin
 
FLVILLA
Posts: 316
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RE: VS Beat BA Hands Down In Poll!

Tue Aug 31, 2004 10:25 pm

I never believe these polls, I still think BA will always be better. Also it varies from flight to flight, I have had some awful ones with VS, but some fantastic ones with BA. And I'm a VS FF and still fly BA.
Don't get me started with media coverage, the Daily Mail has printed some really bad stories about BA, always lying about service on what routes and getting airports mixed up. They did an article the other day ripping BA to pieces, while offering half price flights with VS on the front page. How convenient of Virgin to just show up on that day's paper.

FLVILLA
I hope in life i can work to live, not live to work
 
jetset7e7
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RE: VS Beat BA Hands Down In Poll!

Tue Aug 31, 2004 11:21 pm

A national carrier will always come bottom in their own country its a fact, it happened in Scadinavia where SAS/Snowflake came bottom.

Mark
Retrofitted Blended Winglets - The Future Is On The Wing
 
AEROFAN
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RE: VS Beat BA Hands Down In Poll!

Wed Sep 01, 2004 8:21 am

FlVilla

I've always wondered something - perhaps u can answer it for me. Why do you remain a FF member of an airline on which you receive shoddy service?
 
soaringadi
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RE: VS Beat BA Hands Down In Poll!

Wed Sep 01, 2004 11:30 am

**** "Out of 4,200-plus people asked" "but according to the poll by the Daily Telegraph, it is not even close to being the nation's favourite" ****

Wow thats a pretty Big nation then.... anyways which nation are we talking about ?? "Vatican City ?"

Btw. I think 20% of those "4,200" are the ones who like their planes to have "4" engines right ?

I am not partial to any of the airlines, and also no offense intended to any airline, or the guy who started this thread.

 Smile
If it ain't Boeing, I'm not going !
 
scotron11
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RE: VS Beat BA Hands Down In Poll!

Wed Sep 01, 2004 2:16 pm

Let's not forget we are talking about a former nationalized carrier here. Privitization came at a time when the world economy was soaring so BA enjoyed quite a good run from the late 80's and all of the 90's, especially their premium traffic from LON-NY with their 2 SST's and 7 subs. Also, being a former "state run" airline I am sure there are many employees (unionized) which are abhorrent to their company giving good service.

And if it wasn't for "fortress" LHR.....well, where would it be then?
 
G-KIRAN
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RE: VS Beat BA Hands Down In Poll!

Wed Sep 01, 2004 4:57 pm

I take these polls with a couple of handfuls full of salt. You should really look this:

http://www.oag.com/about_oag/a_of_y/summary.asp

British Airways

Nominated for:
Airline of the year
Best airline based in western europe
Best economy class
Best business class
Best international first class
Best trans-atlantic airline
Best europe to far east airline

Winners in:
Best airline based in western europe
Best transatlantic airline

Virgin Atlantic

Nominated for:
Best trans-atlantic airline

I would rather follow a poll/survey like the OAG, instead of something in the newpaper that mostly likely surveys some people whom they just pciked of the street.

In my view they are both great carriers. I would not fly Virgin because it is not a memeber of any international alliance and also I cannot stand their new "herring-bone" arrangement of their new upper class, so if i had the cash I wont not fly business with them. I also wont really fly BA because you have to pay close to full economy fares to get 100% mileage.
 
BCAL
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RE: VS Beat BA Hands Down In Poll!

Wed Sep 01, 2004 5:07 pm

I agree with FLVILLA. Polls are unreliable. They question a minority - say hypothetically 25 out of a 100. 13 say A is better and 12 say B is better, yet the poll results says A is hands down winner, despite the fact that 12% say otherwise and 75% has not been questioned. VS beats BA hands down. You have to be kidding. BA knocks out VS in the first round as far as I am concerned.

MOL on SRB's latest attack at BA: "It's like a little Chihuahua barking at a dying Labrador. Nobody cares."
 
FLVILLA
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RE: VS Beat BA Hands Down In Poll!

Wed Sep 01, 2004 5:57 pm

"FlVilla

I've always wondered something - perhaps u can answer it for me. Why do you remain a FF member of an airline on which you receive shoddy service? "

Aerofan
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

Well I've been a VS FF for 5 years now, and 5 years ago I was too young to be an Exec club member. And for the last 2 years I've flown Delta and earned my VS FF miles on them because the flight is way cheaper than direct and I like their service, especially Biz-elite. Oh and also back when I was a loyal VS flyer I never got upgraded on all of the over 20 return flights, even though I was on full fare tickets, but the times I fly BA on the cheapest and I mean dirt cheap ticket, I get upgraded to CW.

I do like both airlines and I would like to try out the new VS suite on a flight as posed to just looking at it at the Motor Show, but it annoys me to see all the media hype over VS success and not their failings like sending all three of their flights to MCO when BA cancelled theirs 2 days earlier because of Hurricane Charley, which left two of the VS flights diverted and putting everyone up for the night.

FLVILLA
Loyal to both yet annoyed
I hope in life i can work to live, not live to work
 
LHR27C
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RE: VS Beat BA Hands Down In Poll!

Wed Sep 01, 2004 5:57 pm

G-KIRAN - was going to say about the OAG polls which are far more reliable and look at many more passengers than the Daily Telegraph going out and surveying 4,200 people. I know which I'd trust if given the choice.

It's also a period of bad publicity for BA when the press are going full out at lowering their image. Both airlines have their ups and downs and one poll from the Telegraph shouldn't be taken as fact.
Once you have tasted flight, you will walk the earth with your eyes turned forever skyward
 
srbrenna
Posts: 97
Joined: Wed Apr 28, 2004 12:26 am

RE: VS Beat BA Hands Down In Poll!

Wed Sep 01, 2004 7:27 pm

I'm surprised nobody has actually read the "poll".

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2004/08/28/nair28.xml

What you have to remember is that August is the silly season for news and the journalists are looking for anything to fill the column inches. Even today I read in the paper that BA had cancelled 3 flights causing "chaos" and "misery" to passengers. These flights were to places like Zurich and Brussels where I expect the persons were put on the next flight an hour later. Still that's not very interesting for a newspaper article.

I pretty much always fly BA and think they have a pretty good product. Haven't flown VS recently but they were pretty good as well but I judge these things differently. I am aware that I am on a plane and my seat will not be as comfy as my sofa at home and also the food might not be as good as a top restaurant.

Anyway the respondents weren't a happy bunch anyway - "None of the airlines will draw comfort from the survey's findings that many British people hate the whole experience of flying. More than 40 per cent say they do not mind flying but say it is "not much fun", while one in six dislikes flying altogether"
 
BA380
Posts: 1441
Joined: Mon May 17, 2004 9:59 pm

RE: VS Beat BA Hands Down In Poll!

Wed Sep 01, 2004 9:50 pm

What lazy journalism... to say that VS beats BA 'hands-down' is ludicrous: he poll gives VS 73% rating excellent and BA 61%. That's a win, but it's not a hands-down win.

I accept that these are real people, talking about actual experiences and the sample size is statisically relevant... however, it makes very little sense:

BA comfort rating 1/5, VA 3/5 -- the Y products are frankly pretty similar for comfort (I personally think the BA seat is marginaly more comfortable), PE and WTP are almost identical and the J/F are great on both. So I simply cannot believe the rating. Either the journos are 'creatively' interpreting it, or the people questioned are infrequent flyers, who are basing their opinions on limited flights, not an informed comparison of both over many flights.
cabin crew: doors to automatic and cross-check...

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