FlyATL
Topic Author
Posts: 14
Joined: Sun Aug 29, 2004 2:33 pm

Frontier And Independence Code Share?

Wed Sep 22, 2004 2:24 pm

This past week at ATL I was near the Independence gate talking to some folks who work there. I over heard a woman from Dulles (Independence Corp) talking to an agent. She indicated that Frontier and Independence were negotiating a code share agreement. Frontier takes on the western half and Independence takes on the eastern half of the US.

Any thoughts on this? Has anyone else hear anything to this topic?
 
kim777fan
Posts: 497
Joined: Fri Aug 06, 2004 11:47 pm

RE: Frontier And Independence Code Share?

Wed Sep 22, 2004 2:41 pm

That would certainly be a first for LCC's but possibly one of the more sensible code share systems since Frontier being based out of Denver has a primarily Western route structure, while IAD based Indy is obviously predominantly Eastern in nature.

Can't say that UA would care very much for it!!
 
flamant15
Posts: 48
Joined: Wed Apr 28, 2004 12:39 pm

RE: Frontier And Independence Code Share?

Wed Sep 22, 2004 2:50 pm

I think this would be great for both airlines.

United fliers would have a true alternate choice.

Go LCCs.
 
uadc8contrail
Posts: 1636
Joined: Thu Sep 11, 2003 1:23 am

RE: Frontier And Independence Code Share?

Wed Sep 22, 2004 2:53 pm

maybe hannigan can confirm this rumor but i have read that kerry wants to go at this venture alone.....no ticketing,code share,baggage agreements....
bus driver.......move that bus:)
 
kim777fan
Posts: 497
Joined: Fri Aug 06, 2004 11:47 pm

RE: Frontier And Independence Code Share?

Wed Sep 22, 2004 3:01 pm

You aren't by chance referring to Sean HanniTY are you?
 
uadc8contrail
Posts: 1636
Joined: Thu Sep 11, 2003 1:23 am

RE: Frontier And Independence Code Share?

Wed Sep 22, 2004 3:03 pm

no kim, there is some one on here that goes by hannigan, he is a indy employee and usually has some info on what is going on there....
bus driver.......move that bus:)
 
FlyATL
Topic Author
Posts: 14
Joined: Sun Aug 29, 2004 2:33 pm

RE: Frontier And Independence Code Share?

Wed Sep 22, 2004 3:13 pm

Thinking on this I now have the following questions.

Would DH not push west past ORD and keep the new A319s for the north/south routes and redeploy the RJs to the FL market?

Atlanta could be served by a few daily A319s and move the 16 or so RJs to inter FL service.

Also, would Atlanta be more of a focus since both Frontier and Independence service the airport? Infact their gates are D9 and D7. While they are in sequence, they are not next to each other as there are shops and such in between.

Just thinking more about this.
 
RJNUT
Posts: 1182
Joined: Thu Dec 30, 1999 1:58 am

RE: Frontier And Independence Code Share?

Wed Sep 22, 2004 7:12 pm

Where exactly are these 'code share' flights going to show up?
code share isnt required if you don't participate in any GDS systerm...you can simply program your own website to build connections to another carrier and sell them as such(an interline connection it would be)!
 
ny-jfk-lga
Posts: 331
Joined: Sat Jan 22, 2000 2:09 am

RE: Frontier And Independence Code Share?

Wed Sep 22, 2004 11:40 pm

Hey guys, I work for IDE. As far as I know, there's no such codeshare agreement between us and F9. What recently happened is that we got a reciprocal jumpseating agreement for flight crew on F9. By the way, I did it, and I love F9, I think they're awesome.
Bring back McDonnell Douglas & T W A!!
 
FlyATL
Topic Author
Posts: 14
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RE: Frontier And Independence Code Share?

Thu Sep 23, 2004 2:18 am

What I heard was her tell a DH employee was that they, were negotiating a code share agreement and she hoped that it would come to pass as it would fill out the west.

I know that DH has entered into several jumpseat agreements of late, but I had the distinct impression that this was customer related. Who knows, I could be totaly wrong.
 
FlyATL
Topic Author
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Joined: Sun Aug 29, 2004 2:33 pm

RE: Frontier And Independence Code Share?

Thu Sep 23, 2004 11:36 am

Hannigan, have you heard anything about this?
 
MSYtristar
Posts: 7543
Joined: Sat Aug 27, 2005 12:52 am

RE: Frontier And Independence Code Share?

Thu Sep 23, 2004 11:43 am

What do you guys think of a DH/F9 merger? Hmmm.....
 
flyibaby
Posts: 717
Joined: Wed Aug 25, 2004 5:23 am

RE: Frontier And Independence Code Share?

Thu Sep 23, 2004 12:42 pm

MSYtristar,
I work for DH and I love the idea. I haven't heard anything about a codeshare however, maybe its just being kept on the downlow. The positive thing would be fleet similarities with both going to a similar AirBus fleet and the fact that even F9 has seen the bonus of using CRJ's from Horizon on short hop markets.
 
wgw2707
Posts: 1110
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2003 10:37 am

RE: Frontier And Independence Code Share?

Thu Sep 23, 2004 1:04 pm

Such a codeshare would pose a definite liability to Frontier. Independence is a pathetic airline doomed to failure, whereas Frontier is a highly viable hub and spoke carrier (no, they're not an LCC, at least by the traditional definitions, considering the regional codesharing agreements they already have in force and the overall style of their operation).


-WGW2707
 
flyibaby
Posts: 717
Joined: Wed Aug 25, 2004 5:23 am

RE: Frontier And Independence Code Share?

Thu Sep 23, 2004 1:12 pm

WGW2707,
I personally think Frontier is a great airline, with a good business plan. Out of curiosity though, what drew you to the conclusion that DH is a pathetic airline? Be logical though, don't just take a vendeta position if you happen to work with UA or something...

 
SHUPirate1
Posts: 3428
Joined: Sat Sep 20, 2003 2:53 pm

RE: Frontier And Independence Code Share?

Thu Sep 23, 2004 1:51 pm

Flyibaby-I wouldn't exactly call the airline pathetic, in fact they have some great people working within the airline, but the corporate office seems to have four square wheels as far as I am concerned...I'd mention what they did to me when I applied for a job, but I think that I've brought up the circus that ensued from that about as much as the rest of the collective a.net community brings up a comment about the status of a certain 5-abreast fleet from a certain airline that has red tails, not mentioning the suggestion, the type of plane, or the airline...
Burma's constitutional referendum options: A. Yes, B. Go to Insein Prison!
 
wgw2707
Posts: 1110
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2003 10:37 am

RE: Frontier And Independence Code Share?

Thu Sep 23, 2004 1:59 pm

I have no connection with United Airlines. My disparaging view of United is that it was a great airline, 40 years ago, but ever since Pat Patterson's departure has tried somewhat feebly to make up for a lack of strategic focus with chic advertisements. They've had moments of success since Patterson's departure, but also a lot of downturns, whereas American has been on the rise the whole time.

I view Independence as a pathetic airline because they took a sustainable business model, threw it out the window and decided to become a "cooler" LCC. Nevermind that their CASMs are the highest in the industry, which basically tosses their "Southwest with Regional Jets" business plan out the window right next to their United Express plan.

-WGW2707
 
nwa747-400
Posts: 1325
Joined: Fri Sep 08, 2000 2:54 am

RE: Frontier And Independence Code Share?

Thu Sep 23, 2004 2:52 pm

WGW2707 : A319s are to the rescue for the CASM which is supposed to drop with each Airbus delivery. Also P2P RJ flying seems very smart too.
 
airplaneboy
Posts: 555
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RE: Frontier And Independence Code Share?

Thu Sep 23, 2004 2:56 pm

I've heard nothing but positive remarks about FlyI (or Independence Air to be more politically correct).  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

I love their brand, and think that Independence is a catchy name and quite appropriate for being a carrier based out of our wonderful nation's capitol.

As always, it depends on who you speak with and whether or not a bad experience was an isolated event. Nonetheless, I've heard a lot about I-Air and nothing but props for them. Big grin

As far as codesharing--- I haven't heard anything. But I wouldn't discount it. In today's industry conditions, airlines are taking drastic measures just to stay alive. No need to cite examples... I would definitely not mind a codeshare with I-Air. That would give our passengers easier access to east coast cities we do not yet serve. Dulles would be a good point of transfer. If I-Air flew to Denver, they can have their PAX transfer onto our westbound flights to cities they do not serve. But who knows? Anything's possible.

I do recall Independence Air working on getting crew jumpseat agreements with us.

Travis/LAX Big grin
 
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mariner
Posts: 18187
Joined: Fri Nov 23, 2001 7:29 am

RE: Frontier And Independence Code Share?

Thu Sep 23, 2004 3:20 pm

"I overheard a woman from Dulles...."

Oh, come on, give me a break.

If anything, code share or whatever, was in the works, if a woman in an airport had heard about it, all the staff of both airlines would have heard something.

Last week, it was taken as gospel that AA was going to merge with (read "buy out") Frontier. Just because someone heard it from someone who...

The alarming thing was how many people seemed to believe it.

cheers

mariner
aeternum nauta
 
flyibaby
Posts: 717
Joined: Wed Aug 25, 2004 5:23 am

RE: Frontier And Independence Code Share?

Thu Sep 23, 2004 3:55 pm

Mariner,
In this case however, its not ness. wether people believe it; more so as a what if this is/were to be true?
 
ny-jfk-lga
Posts: 331
Joined: Sat Jan 22, 2000 2:09 am

RE: Frontier And Independence Code Share?

Thu Sep 23, 2004 11:06 pm

United Express "plan"? What is that? We never had a plan for uax, how could we or any other 'feeder' carrier. You simply fly the planes, get paid from the big boys for it and that's it. Tell me something, how long do you think we'd have stayed with United Airlines anyway, they're in bankruptcy. Think about what all the other regional airlines must be thinking, mesa, trans-states with both US and UA. Its a tough world. You know what, all of you who hate our airline, state your opinion on what you would have done if you were in our shoes and the name Independence Air never existed and UAL was offering you a crappy contract. Would you just think about yourself or all of your employees? Say what you would've done.
Bring back McDonnell Douglas & T W A!!
 
1MillionFlyer
Posts: 1937
Joined: Wed Sep 08, 2004 8:55 am

RE: Frontier And Independence Code Share?

Thu Sep 23, 2004 11:19 pm

WGW2707


Your opinion is flat out wrong concerning FLYI. I have a feeling you know nothing about the situation other than five minutes of reading on the internet.

Give it 9 months then make your comments.
Golf Foxtrot you are cleared for departure
 
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mariner
Posts: 18187
Joined: Fri Nov 23, 2001 7:29 am

RE: Frontier And Independence Code Share?

Fri Sep 24, 2004 12:28 am

Flyibaby:

That's fine. If someone wants to start a thread saying "Do you think Frontier and IAir or Midwest or AAI) should merge?", then I would have no problem.

I don't really have a problem anyway, because I think the rumors are amusing - and I think the sources are often as amusing.

Fwiw, I think the idea of a codeshare between Frontier and Independence is a very good idea.

I think it should have happened on Day 1 of IAir's ops.

If there had been a code share on IAD/DEN, it would immediately established (a) a route to the west for IAir and (b) feed from/to IAD and DEN, for both airlines and (c) it would have helped break the idea that IAir is all RJ's.

But will it ever happen? I have absolutely no idea.

cheers

mariner
aeternum nauta
 
FlyATL
Topic Author
Posts: 14
Joined: Sun Aug 29, 2004 2:33 pm

RE: Frontier And Independence Code Share?

Fri Sep 24, 2004 1:47 am

I don't really have a problem anyway, because I think the rumors are amusing - and I think the sources are often as amusing.

Amusing? Sure, made up, absolutely not. I was sitting on the backside of a grouping of chairs; the woman (who is in management for maintenance training with DH) was sitting on the other side of me. She was showing very nice pictures of their first A319 which she had taken on its initial approach into Dulles, on one of the new widescreen Apple laptops. While she and a gate agent were talking, she brought up the discussions about the proposed code share. She indicated that it was very preliminary and that she hoped that it would develop into a substantial deal. She also indicated that they may have some type of relationship at Denver in regards to ground handling.

After listening to their conversation I learned that she had been in Chattanooga doing maintenance training for new service that ACA was starting from Cincinnati on behalf of Delta. While there she said that she did the training for both the Dojets and the RJs, just in case that DH wanted to start service there after the contract with Delta ended.

All in all, rumor, just like many other posts on this board, but not simply because I thought it was a neat idea. I do not even know very much about Frontier, or their operations.
 
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mariner
Posts: 18187
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RE: Frontier And Independence Code Share?

Fri Sep 24, 2004 2:12 am

FlyATL:

I don't think it was made up. I believe absolutely that the woman may have said it and believed it.

My point is that something like this would be very big deal. It would have to be negotiated at the highest levels of management of the two airlines, and would be regarded as "top secret".

To discuss it in a public place would be unlikely and illegal. The SEC, would regard it as "priviledged information" which may affect the stock price of both companies. If it had any basis in fact, they would come down on the person involved like a ton of bricks.

I agree with you, however, that it is a very, very neat idea.  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

cheers

mariner
aeternum nauta
 
whlinder
Posts: 58
Joined: Fri Jun 02, 2000 12:47 am

RE: Frontier And Independence Code Share?

Fri Sep 24, 2004 2:20 am

What about frequent flyer programs? One would assume that should F9 and DH codeshare that they would have reciprocal FF program agreements. However, DH awards points based on dollars spent while F9 uses the traditional 'miles'. I wonder what the solution to this issue would be if such a codeshare were to come about.

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