Thom@s
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Chaos In Cockpit During Takeoff. (Norway)

Sat Oct 30, 2004 10:49 pm

The co-operation between the 45 year old captain, and 30 year old female co-pilot, was non existent as the plane they operated was cleared for takeoff.

The episode occurred on 27th November 2002, onboard a Scandinavian (SAS) flight from Oslo-Gardermoen to Stavanger-Sola in a Boeing 737-600.

After the plane had finished the de-ice, the two pilots forgot to run through the takeoff checklist. This resulted in the plane having flaps, slats, and stability trimming in the wrong position. Flaps/slats were not deployed as the plane rolled onto the runway, and the trimming was set to push the nose down.

After some debate, the captain decided that he would execute the takeoff. At 1000 feet, he would hand over to the co-pilot. But as they rolled onto the runway, and had lined the plane up, he suddenly changed his mind. As the plane was cleared for takeoff he said to the co-pilot "your controls" surprising her.

She accepted the command, and took over control, without a new brief before takeoff. She held the manual brakes on while giving power, resulting in the warning "takeoff power" becoming active. The captain interpreted this as a warning that the manual brakes were still on, and accepted the takeoff roll.

The warning kept going, and while the plane rolled down the runway, the co-pilot finally realized that the flaps were not set. She set the flaps and slats in correct takeoff position, and expected the captain to take over control, and abort takeoff. But the captain did not take over control. Takeoff was completed, but the plane was very heavy on the nose. Instead of lifting off at the usual 224 km/h, the plane didn't take off until the speed reached 298 km/h.

The rest of the flight went as normal, but both pilots requested the rest of the day off as they landed at Stavanger-Sola.

Thom@s

[Edited 2004-10-30 15:56:42]
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Rick767
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RE: Chaos In Cockpit During Takeoff. (Norway)

Sat Oct 30, 2004 11:26 pm

Very interesting, I assume the report you refer to is this one?

Would you / anyone care to translate it into English for us to read?
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Thom@s
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RE: Chaos In Cockpit During Takeoff. (Norway)

Sat Oct 30, 2004 11:41 pm

Yep, that's the one. Unfortunatly I don't have time to translate the whole thing, but it reads roughly what I posted.  Smile If there is anything in particular you are wondering about, just ask.

Thom@s
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Rick767
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RE: Chaos In Cockpit During Takeoff. (Norway)

Sun Oct 31, 2004 12:43 am

"both pilots requested the rest of the day off as they landed at Stavanger-Sola"

If the report reads like you have summarised, they should both have been invited to take the rest of their careers off!
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Thom@s
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RE: Chaos In Cockpit During Takeoff. (Norway)

Sun Oct 31, 2004 1:06 am

From what i could read from the report, the male pilot was stepping in for someone, and had previously requested to be taken off duty, due to a family illness, aswell as feeling stressed at work lately.

The female pilot had recently received a letter telling her that she would become fired from SAS due to cutbacks in the company. The combination of the two situations the pilots were in, made them unable to concentrate 100% she says in the report.

I could not find anything about what happened to the male pilot, but the female was obviously sacked.

The report ends with a remark that companies should get a psycological check of their pilots in situations like in this episode.

Thom@s
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spacecadet
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RE: Chaos In Cockpit During Takeoff. (Norway)

Sun Oct 31, 2004 6:05 am

The report ends with a remark that companies should get a psycological check of their pilots in situations like in this episode.

It's standard procedure in this country to have pilots evaluated for mental stress levels after a case like this.

I would think the captain would have been disciplined in some way; he should have aborted the takeoff rather than continue it. This is a pretty serious infraction, taking off without going through the proper checklist and without verifying that takeoff configuration has been set properly even as you're rolling on the runway... then electing to continue takeoff anyway. I'm glad I wasn't a passenger on that flight...
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stealthpilot
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RE: Chaos In Cockpit During Takeoff. (Norway)

Sun Oct 31, 2004 10:50 am

“The female was obviously sacked."
?????? You can’t blame one person for this and not the other. If both have to be sacked then ok, both reprimanded them that’s ok as well but why sack only the female pilot? It’s both their fault in my opinion.
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mischadee
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RE: Chaos In Cockpit During Takeoff. (Norway)

Sun Oct 31, 2004 6:17 pm

Wow. I would have been freaked out if I was a passenger at that aircraft. I am always seated right behind the wing to watch the flaps. I also always are concerned about forgetting about the flaps. Hmm I wonder what would have happened if I would begin to scream to the other passengers that the flaps was not set right. They would sure think I was mad???

Anyway it would have been a scary take-off.

Mischa.
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theflcowboy
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RE: Chaos In Cockpit During Takeoff. (Norway)

Sun Oct 31, 2004 10:26 pm

Uhh - how do you forget the checklist? Isnt that kind of ... you know...obvious?
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Thom@s
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RE: Chaos In Cockpit During Takeoff. (Norway)

Sun Oct 31, 2004 10:32 pm

Stealthpilot, if you read my posts, maybe you remember this sentence?

"The female pilot had recently received a letter telling her that she would become fired from SAS due to cutbacks in the company."

 Smile So she wasn't sacked because of the takeoff episode, that had already been decided...

Thom@s
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stealthpilot
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RE: Chaos In Cockpit During Takeoff. (Norway)

Mon Nov 01, 2004 9:23 am

hahah i apologise thom@s ........ i got it. no harm meant. sorry for the confusion
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Thom@s
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RE: Chaos In Cockpit During Takeoff. (Norway)

Mon Nov 01, 2004 7:21 pm

No problem Stealthpilot.  Smile

I wonder if any passengers reacted to the takeoff. Most haven't a clue what procedure is followed during takeoff, so how many thought it was weird that the flaps were up, and that they were going REALLY fast when they took off?

Too busy reading their newspapers anyway.  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

Thom@s
"If guns don't kill people, people kill people - does that mean toasters don't toast toast, toast toast toast?"
 
L410Turbolet
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RE: Chaos In Cockpit During Takeoff. (Norway)

Mon Nov 01, 2004 8:48 pm

The positive thing is that they didn't start beating each other like those two Turkish Airllines pilots. Anyone remembers details of the story?
 
pilotaydin
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RE: Chaos In Cockpit During Takeoff. (Norway)

Mon Nov 01, 2004 8:54 pm

yeah i remember....it was an A340 flight to Asia. They had known each other since military days and were always in competition. They had an argument about what the controller said in english. Those days at TK are almost over THANK GOD, and now it's our turn as civilian pilots to fly....phew

ayd
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MADtoCAE
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RE: Chaos In

Mon Nov 01, 2004 9:02 pm

Do you have a link to that story L410Turbolet?
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IDAWA
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RE: Chaos In Cockpit During Takeoff. (Norway)

Mon Nov 01, 2004 10:12 pm

How did authorities came to know about this incident? Did they listen to the CVR? I don't think that pilots went around to tell about this story after landing...

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airgeek12
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RE: Chaos In Cockpit During Takeoff. (Norway)

Mon Nov 01, 2004 10:17 pm

Yea! ~ I'm just wondering why they wern't fired! They put the life of every pax aboard in jeapordy!
 
pilotaydin
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RE: Chaos In Cockpit During Takeoff. (Norway)

Mon Nov 01, 2004 10:18 pm

they complained about each other, plus at this partcular airline...gossip and news spread faster than lightning. The CVR was pulled indeed afterwards.
The only time there is too much fuel onboard, is when you're on fire!
 
L410Turbolet
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RE: Chaos In Cockpit During Takeoff. (Norway)

Mon Nov 01, 2004 10:29 pm

How did authorities came to know about this incident?

I imagined how they picture this sort of stuff in cartoons. You know, sounds of breaking glass, thumps, bangs, door bending, puffs of smoke coming from beneath the cockpit door... Big grin Big grin Big grin
 
highflier92660
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RE: Chaos In Cockpit During Takeoff. (Norway)

Mon Nov 01, 2004 10:41 pm

That was priceless Thom@s. Fortunately events did not become tragic. What makes this so incredible is the complete breakdown of cockpit procedures training and discipline. Of course what makes this comedy of errors all the more delicious is the male/female interpersonal interaction taking place. In front of a disciplinary panel I can visualize the female F/O responding like most women; pointing to the poor hapless male and saying, " he made me do it. It's all his fault."
 
stealthpilot
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RE: Chaos In Cockpit During Takeoff. (Norway)

Tue Nov 02, 2004 9:59 am

can someone post additional info about the turkish airline pilots........ links maybe ?????? sounds very very interesting  Smile
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heisan67
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RE: Chaos In Cockpit During Takeoff. (Norway)

Wed Nov 03, 2004 4:20 am

A pilot or cabin crew may call themselves "unfit for flight" and from what I understand this is the case here.

From what I read the pilots do not work as a team and misunderstand eachother.