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FlyCaledonian
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BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Fri Nov 05, 2004 10:25 am

Seems a few things emerging about BA's longhaul plans over the coming months. I know various things have been mentioned elsewhere but thought I'd provide a summary on one thread.

Winter '04

LHR-MIA goes from 14 to 16 weekly from 4th December with an additional two 747-400 services on a Monday and Saturday (BA205/BA204). This seems to be for winter only.

LHR-CPT goes from daily to twelve times weekly, as of 2nd November, all 747-400 operated. Monday and Sunday are the two days that see only one flight. (Additional flights are BA043/BA042). Again, winter only.

LHR-DXB goes from 14 flights per week to seventeen on 4th December with an additional three 747-400 flights (Tuesday, Thursday, Sunday), then an additional two 767-300 flights are added from 15th December (Wednesday, Friday) giving nineteen flights in total. )All five additional flights operate as BA105/BA104). Again, Winter only.

An additional LHR-NAS-PLS flight is added from Monday 13th December, giving a twice weekly 767-300 operated service, the other flight being on a Sunday. (Flights BA253/BA252). Again, Winter only.

LHR-CCS-BOG flights are withdrawn from 6th Feb 05. Current schedule is a thrice weekly 777 flight on Tuesdays, Thursdays and Sundays (BA249/BA248).


Summer '05

LHR-HKG goes from 17 weekly to three times daily on 3rd June, all 747-400 operated.

LHR-YVR goes from daily to ten times weekly from 4th June, all 747-400 operated. Additional flights operate on a Monday, Tuesday and Saturday (BA087/BA086). Likely Summer only.

LHR-YYZ goes seventeen times weekly for the summer from 28th March, BA093/BA092 being a daily 747-400, BA099/BA098 a daily 777 (No First) and BA097/BA096 a three times weekly (Monday, Thursday, Saturday) 777 (No First). Again, likely Summer only.

LHR-PEK returns to a five times weekly operation with a three class 777 (No first). No flights on a Tuesday or Thursday (BA039/BA038).

LHR-MEX returns to a four times weekly 747-400 operation on Mondays, Wednesdays, Fridays and Sundays (BA243/BA242).

LHR-LAX goes to a three times daily operation, all 747-400s, from 1st June. Prior to that it will be a seventeen times weekly operation, with BA279/BA278 operating on a Monday, Wednesday and Saturday from 28th March.

LGW-IAH goes to a thirteen times weekly operation, with BA2025/BA2024 operating daily, and BA2027/BA2026 Tuesdays excepted.

LGW-BDA goes to a summer frequency of five times weekly, with a four class 777 operating Wednesdays and Fridays excepeted.

[Edit] Also, depending on the outcome of the CAA convened meeting on 17th Novemebr, involving BA, BD and VS, we may see BA adding additional frequencies/destinations to India, with an additional seven weekly flights allowed to be added in Winter 04, Summer 05 and Winter 05, giving a total maximum of 40 flights per week between the UK and India.

[Edited 2004-11-05 02:29:57]

[Edited 2004-11-05 02:37:58]
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behramjee
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Fri Nov 05, 2004 12:26 pm

Notes :

1. DXB always sees a capacity increase for a few weeks in the summer and winter months.

2. Where are BA getting the additional B 744s from to operate LAX + HKG each triple daily + new India flights + increase YVR services !!!

How do BAs Islamabad-ISB flights do load and yield wise? BA currently flies 3 weekly B 772ERs to ISB.

Also why has BA withdrawn F class from many B 772ERs?
 
HB-IWC
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Fri Nov 05, 2004 12:41 pm

Where are BA getting the additional B 744s from to operate LAX + HKG each triple daily + new India flights + increase YVR services !!!

They likely have more online capacity during the summer schedule than during the winter schedule to start with, as the LAX and SFO increases are a yearly recurring phenomenon. BA is likely performing relatively more of its heavy maintenance on its longhaul fleet during the winter months. Apart from that, there's a couple of B744s that free up during the summer months because they're used for winter-only reinforcements to destinations like CPT, MIA and DXB.

 
6thfreedom
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Fri Nov 05, 2004 2:39 pm

Any likelihood of BA adding daily LHR-BKK-MEL services on top of their daily LHR to MEL via SIN?

There is much needed capacity on BKK-MEL, as well as London/Europe?

 
ZK-NBT
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Fri Nov 05, 2004 3:03 pm

Or service to AKL for that matter? Probably still dreaming though. Yes I am aware they codeshare with QF and CX but still.

What was the most services BA had to Australia and NZ at one time? They had 24 services a few years back with
LHR-SIN-BNE daily
LHR-SIN-PER daily
LHR-BKK-SYD daily
LHR-KUL-SYD 3x weekly
all 744's, did they have more than that?
 
AA B777-200
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Fri Nov 05, 2004 4:57 pm

FlyCaledonian,

Thanks for the info! See why I miss those paper printouts of their timetables! Too bad BA is stopping BOG/CCS.

Robin
 
HB-IWC
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Fri Nov 05, 2004 5:38 pm

LHR-BKK-SYD daily

BA009/010 flew LHR-BKK-SYD-MEL for quite some time, before the SYD-MEL tag was cut. BA consequently didn't fly its own equipment into MEL for while until one of the SIN service was extended into MEL.

 
LHR27C
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Fri Nov 05, 2004 5:50 pm

Is the increased LHR-CPT a recurring phenomen? I know SAA upped their CPT services last winter and at the moment operate more LHR-CPT, and indeed LHR-South Africa services, than BA. Maybe a response to SAA's move?
Once you have tasted flight, you will walk the earth with your eyes turned forever skyward
 
hardiwv
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Fri Nov 05, 2004 6:56 pm

FlyCaledonian:

GRU

Add to your list that as of 1 November BA increased capacity to GRU introducing the 747-400 (before was the 777). BA has daily flights LHR-GRU, load factor this year is 80%, with particularly good results on business and first. The LHR-GRU continues to EZE (4 x week) and to GIG (3 x week).

Hardi
 
ZK-NBT
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Fri Nov 05, 2004 6:58 pm

BA009/010 flew LHR-BKK-SYD-MEL for quite some time, before the SYD-MEL tag was cut. BA consequently didn't fly its own equipment into MEL for while until one of the SIN service was extended into MEL.

Oh yes sorry forgot that one, they stopped MEL altogether from 1999-2001 wasn't it?

They used to have an AKL-MEL flight I think? Is that correct? This was 1995 and before.
 
TLVFred
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Fri Nov 05, 2004 11:01 pm

Seems crazy that they dont add to LHR-TLV with almost 100% capacity on every flight. Used to be 3x daily 777 pre Intifada 2000 but now with tourism right back up there, 2x daily 767 just isnt coping.
 
srbrenna
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Fri Nov 05, 2004 11:19 pm

When are they going to do LHR - DOH non-stop. The wait at BAH is horribly dull especially now that they don't let you off the plane...
 
Horus
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Fri Nov 05, 2004 11:24 pm

Seems crazy that they dont add to LHR-TLV with almost 100% capacity on every flight. Used to be 3x daily 777 pre Intifada 2000 but now with tourism right back up there, 2x daily 767 just isnt coping

BA never served TLV with 3x daily flights.

BA services peaked at 18x weekly B777 flights between 29th October 2000 and 24th March 2001 (BA165-daily, BA163-daily and BA167-4x weekly).

Flights were reduced to 17x weekly B777 flights between 25th March 2000 and 27th October 2001.

The service was then significantly cut back to 14x weekly B763 flights on the 28th October 2001 and has remained the same ever since.

I doubt the airline will increase frequency for some time due to constrainst by the Israeli authorities to protect ELAL (similar problem with LH, OS and AZ). Also tourism numbers are no way as high as they were previously. The Palestinian conflict still effects tourism in the region, especially Israel and to a lesser extent Jordan.

Horus

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Lindy
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Fri Nov 05, 2004 11:27 pm

BWI is getting upgrade to 777 from 767 for the winter.

Rafal
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Horus
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Fri Nov 05, 2004 11:30 pm

Forgot to mention in my previous post that CAI has been upgraded from B772 to B744 (BA154/155) for the winter.

Horus

EGYPT: A 7,000 Year Old Civilisation
 
TLVFred
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Fri Nov 05, 2004 11:32 pm

Thanks Horus. I stand corrected on the 777 service.

If not increase frequency, maybe go back to 777. The fact remains that BOTH BA and LY are at capacity even in off season let alone peaks - eg no seats available on either carrier during XMAS / APRIL or at silly prices.

Tourism up 48% on last year....
 
KateAA
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Fri Nov 05, 2004 11:38 pm

Hello,

Pleased to see that British Airways seem to be doing well. My Mum lives in the UK and where possible (if I or she is paying) I fly BA First. Got to love it!

Kate
 
HB-IWC
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Fri Nov 05, 2004 11:39 pm

As Horus stated, BA will likely stick to double daily B763 service for the time being because of considerable capacity constraint imposed by Israeli government in their quest of protecting LY. Lufthansa and Swiss are currently under intense scrutiny from the Israeli Government because of their conceived dominant position between Israel and their respective home markets.

 
texdravid
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Fri Nov 05, 2004 11:54 pm

When will BA cancel LGW-DFW? The flight's return leg back to DFW is almost always empty, and now that GWB has been re-elected, I don't think that most Britons would want to go anywhere near Dallas, GWB's main power base.

Just my two cents...BTW, I have flown BA 2192/2193 many times, so I am eminently qualified to make the above observation.
Tort reform now. Throw lawyers in jail later.
 
cloud4000
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Fri Nov 05, 2004 11:58 pm

Brits don't want to go to DFW because it's GWB's hometown? Are they afraid of getting cooties, or something?
Boston, USA
 
KateAA
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Fri Nov 05, 2004 11:59 pm

Good Morning,

I have flown this route three times, as I was once based in DFW with American and when I flew back to the UK to see friends (and had to pay for it) I always flew BA.

The first two times I flew on this route I found that Club was around 80% full and First was around 60% full, as for coach, 60/70%.

The last time I flew on this route there where a load of French people onboard going to conference in Dallas. Because of this there was not an empty seat to be found!

Txdravid,

I would say you do have a point. I have a number of friends who are crew (both pilots and cabin crew) for British Airways and the CC always say they like the DFW sector because its not too busy! As for pulling out, I don't think we will see that anytime soon.

Kate.
 
texdravid
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Sat Nov 06, 2004 12:00 am

No, they are just scared of being overrun or manhandled by a evangelical voeter running to the polls!!
Tort reform now. Throw lawyers in jail later.
 
MAS777
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Sat Nov 06, 2004 12:24 am

ZK-NBT - BA did operate a MEL-AKL link. BA9 in the early/mid 1990s flew LHR-BKK-KUL-MEL-AKL, LHR-BKK-KUL-PER-ADL, LHR-BKK-KUL-PER-AKL and a variety of other combinations.

The Malaysian authorities are pressing ahead for another round of talks with the UK CAA for a third daily service for Malaysia Airlines at LHR and a daily Manchester flight - ahead of Virgin's full migration of services to Singapore Airlines. BA is said to be interested too in these talks and staff are already looking forward to returning to Kuala Lumpur - so watch this space.
 
PanAm747
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Sat Nov 06, 2004 12:55 am

Unfortunately, there's nothing in these lists about the resumption of service to SAN...sigh...I guess we'll just have to keep wishing...and hoping...and praying...and chanting...and calling upon the great Goddess of the Airways for the return of the 777.  Big grin

Maybe someday!!
Pan Am:The World's Most Experienced Airline - P(oor) S(ailor's) A(irline): San Diego's Hometown Airline-Catch Our Smile!
 
BA001Concorde
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Sat Nov 06, 2004 4:28 am

British Airways has announced today it is to begin operating daily services to Tripoli (TIP) from 01 January 2005.

BA898 / Dep: LHR 09:20 / Arr: TIP 15:00 (Dep LHR T1)
BA899 / Dep: TIP 16:05 / Arr: LHR 17:45 (Arr LHR T1)
Fly with a veteran, not a "Virgin".
 
milehigh69
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RE: B Lingual Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Sat Nov 06, 2004 6:28 am

What about the rumored LHR - YYC that was to begin in April 05?
 
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FlyCaledonian
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Sat Nov 06, 2004 8:41 am

PanAm747, I think BA's return to SAN will be a long while off, especially as the carrier is going back to three times daily on the LHR-LAX route. BA cancelled the third daily when it when nonstop to SAN a few years back, and only started increasing services to LAX above twice daily again last year after SAN had been dropped. Be interesting to see if BA reduces frequency back to twice daily next winter, or if only a couple of flights are dropped. HKG and NBO have kept their additional flights afterall, though DXB and CPT retain their seasonal nature.

If BA were to return to KUL the question is what impact would that have on BKK and SIN flights. By that I mean that BA is currently restricted to 21 flights a week to Australia, which are operated via BKK to SYD daily, and via SIN to SYD and MEL daily. Either KUL would have to be an out and back service, or BA would continue it to say SYD, in which case either BKK or SIN would see an out and back service. (Before anybody asks why BA can only have 21 flights to Oz when QF has 28 to the UK, it's because VS has the other 7 for its pending service to SYD via HKG).

Anyone know which destinations in India BA is likely to press for on the 17th? I'd imagine VS wants daily to DEL and BOM, which when added to BA's dailys plus the 3x weekly to CCU and 2x weekly to MAA would leave 7 frequencies up for grabs (Assuming VS gets what it wants).

In addition, anybody know anything further on plans to allow BA and VS more access to China? I thought something was agreed back in February? I'd imagine BA would want access to PVG, but any other destinations it might be interested in?
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MAS777
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Sat Nov 06, 2004 8:24 pm

BA did contemplate operating KL on an O&D basis but the route fell through before as it calculated that the route would not be profitable. KUL needs a tag-on and when Jakarta was axed KL could not be sustained further. Together KUL and CGK were 'two peas in a pod' and after the initial aftershock of the '97 financial crash in Asia - BA had notified its Malaysian office and crew that BA33 was to revert back to the 747-400 equipment (from the 777) until the decision to withdraw was finally confirmed shortly after that notification.

(The information I have was that BA33 was to operate using 747-436 flying 6 times a week with 3 services continuing to CGK and 3 services terminating at KUL with the aircraft sitting on the ground at KL from 1530 until 2335)

BA also has found in the past that it HAS to operate KUL as a non-stop service as travellers on the route have almost 3 daily nonstop flights to choose from with Malaysia Airlines - so the option of tagging KL to India or Bangkok is not a possibility.

I think BA should look seriously into flying to Ho Chi Minh or restarting flights into Perth - both of which could then be tagged on with KUL.
 
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FlyCaledonian
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Sun Nov 07, 2004 8:15 am

With the removal of FIRST from BA098/BA099 to YYZ, this flight joins DEN, YUL, DHA, CCU and PEK in being operated by three class configured 777-236ER aircraft from LHR.

The longhaul 767 routes from LHR are also set to lose their FIRST cabins as the aircraft are reconfigured with Club World flat beds, World Traveller Plus and World Traveller over the coming months.

At LGW the leisure routes will also served by three class configured 777s - ANU, TAB, GND, UVF, KIN, MCO and TPA. The reconfiguration of the LGW 777s operating these services to the dusk layout has been delayed until February 2005, with the World Traveller Plus and Club World Flat beds available for sale from 1st March 2005.
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behramjee
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Sun Nov 07, 2004 8:25 am

Out of the 21 remaining frequencies left for UK carriers to India, I expect VS to be awarded 14 for daily BOM and DEL routes leaving 7 for BA and BMI to fight over.

BA should seriously look at obtaining 2-3 for upgrading Chennai-MAA to a 4-5 weekly B 744 service. I dont think so CCU needs an increase in frequency.

BMI should ask for a minimum of 4 for the MAN-DEL-MAN route enabling pax to connect from MAN to important "NRI-Indian cities" in North America such as IAD-ORD and YYZ.

Do you think BMI should instead ask for MAN-BOM-MAN 4 weekly A 332s or MAN-DEL-MAN 4 weekly A 332s...I feel DEL because there are more North Indian NRIs living in UK and USA-CAN than there are from Western India.
 
behramjee
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Sun Nov 07, 2004 8:35 am

Can someone tell me how good are loads and yields on BAs daily B 763ER MAN-JFK-MAN flight please...thanks  Smile
 
gkirk
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Sun Nov 07, 2004 9:33 am

Behjamree...supposedly MAN-JFK is very profitable for BA. All they need to di us get rid of G-TECH  Big grin
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behramjee
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Sun Nov 07, 2004 11:54 am

The UK Civil Aviation Authority will allocate a further 21 direct flights per week to India on Thursday. BA currently owns the rights to all 19 flights a week, which are typically sold out months in advance.

However, BA has requested all 21 new flights, which have become available after negotiations between the British and Indian governments. Experts say the UK to India market is worth around £200m a year in revenue, but is expected to grow substantially.

The battle will be settled at a so-called "scarce capacity hearing", the first since 1999 and the first to involve the UK's three biggest airlines.

Around 60 per cent of those travelling to India from the UK are forced to go via another airport, usually Frankfurt or Dubai, on flights operated by Lufthansa or Emirates.

BA will claim that giving it the slots would be in the best interests of consumers and the UK economy. It says Virgin and bmi would be unable to withstand competition from foreign airlines. However, Virgin and bmi are so confident of winning that they have already started selling tickets.
 
flyyul
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Sun Nov 07, 2004 11:57 am

Behramjee,

BMI is going to cease in YYZ.. AC will take-over.

 
behramjee
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Sun Nov 07, 2004 1:08 pm

Yes but even if AC take it over for MAN...wont they still be codsharing with BMI on this route? If so then its ok.
 
sleak76
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Sun Nov 07, 2004 5:57 pm

LHR/JED/LHR (BA133/132) gets upgraded from 772 to 744 effective Jan 2nd til Feb 20.
Reason: Hajj (pilgrimage) season in Saudi.
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behramjee
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Sun Nov 07, 2004 6:32 pm

This part 2 of Reply # 32 (my post) on this thread derived from the THE OBSERVER newspaper Business section :

BA believes it should get all the remaining slots, arguing that it can get the greatest capacity by using Boeing 747-400s, while linking in to the most comprehensive international network from India.

BMI and Virgin say that greater competition will benefit consumers.

BMI has guaranteed to the CAA that its fares will be 10 per cent below those currently offered by BA. BMI's CEO Nigel Turner said that he was 'not anticipating failing' to win some of the licences.

BMI is not bidding for all the licences, but wants to operate services to Mumbai, Bangalore and Chennai.

 
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FlyCaledonian
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Sun Nov 07, 2004 10:28 pm

While I'm in favour of competition I don't believe letting bmi have access to India at this time will be beneficial. If VS are wanting to operate daily to BOM and DEL then that would leave just seven frequencies to open up new routes, e.g. Bangalore, Hyderabad, or add frequency to Chennai - routes which would be better served by BA with its greater network at LHR, both shorthaul and longhaul. And if bmi wants to serve DEL or BOM from MAN then again, why I favour regional expansion it shouldn't come at the expense of new Indian destinations with Anglo-Indian capacity so scarce.

[Edited 2004-11-07 14:29:36]
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FlyCaledonian
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Thu Nov 11, 2004 8:23 am

Came across an article on Reyters UK today regarding comments by BA's Commerical Director Martin George about longhaul flights.

China
Plans to increase frequencies on existing routes (See Post #1 re HKG and PEK) but no immediate plans to add new destinations, i.e. Shanghai. While the UK and China signed a new air services agreement earlier this year George told a Foreign Press Assocaition that "Whether we go anywhere else in China we will wait and see."

India
BA Chief Executive Rod Eddington appears before the CAA tomorrow at a Scarce Capacity hearing to decide how many additional frequencies, and to where, will be awarded to BA, BD and VS. Eddington will argue the case for BA to be awarded a "generous slice" of the additional rights over the next 12-18 months.

South Africa
The UK and South African governments are to hold talks later this month with a view to increasing air traffic between the two countries. George indicated BA would look at bidding for any additional frequencies permitted if any agreement was reached.


So, looks like Chinese expansion is on hold for the present. Potential for LH, AF and KL to further strengthen their lead in the Chinese Europe market, though given the UK's position I'd guess BA would only be interested in O&D traffic (FRA and CDG are better placed for transfer traffic). The specific mention of Shanghai shows BA still interested in taking on VS given the chance.

India is in the hands of the CAA. South Africa is interesting Though. I'd imagine BA would primarily be interested in adding capacity to JNB, and possibly year round to CPT, rather than maybe adding Durban (Served by franchsie carrier Comair from JNB and CPT). As with India though, I'd imagine VS and BD would want a slice of this pie.
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madhatter
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Thu Nov 11, 2004 10:36 am

BA used to serve Durban up until a few years ago with a stop in JNB and although it would be busy there are destinations that they probably be more interested in serving as the yield would be greater. Johannesburg is packed year round and is very hard to gain a seat on and so I guess if they are pushing for added frequencies to SA then this would be where they would be after. As for China I am quite surprised as to why they are not interested in expanding to this area. Not knowing the current quota of flights they were allowed to do I was under the understanding that they were allowed one further city excluding Shanghai. China is a booming market at the moment and is fast becoming the workhouse of the world and if BA dont expand there soon what with AF and LH expanding rapidly into the market BA will be left behind. Whilst BA are somewhat limited on their connections from Europe there must be a fair amount of high yield traffic heading to cities such as Guangzhou?
 
behramjee
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Thu Nov 11, 2004 11:08 am

The problem with BA and China with regards to high yield connecting traffic and even Y class connecting trafficI feel is LHRs geographical location.

High yield F and J class pax dont find it appealing flying 11-12 hours to LHR, transit for 1-3 hours and then fly backwards (east) into main EU cities when it would be faster from China flying LH-AF-AY-KLM.

The main target market for BA and VS from China is O&D plus pax heading to other UK and Irish cities.

I would not think that BA carries a lot of pax from China and vice versa bound or from cities such as FRA-CDG-MXP-AMS-ZRH-BRU-MAD-BCN-LIS etc unless ofcourse its a budget conscious Eco class pax looking for the cheapest deal avbl in the market  Big grin
 
Cactus739
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Thu Nov 11, 2004 11:15 am

Is Phoenix going to keep its 747 for the winter or back to 777?
You can't fix stupid.... - Ron White
 
madhatter
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Thu Nov 11, 2004 11:30 am

It does seem that in terms of LHRs position in Europe the best area for BA to expand in would be to Africa and also to some respects areas in which they are already strong in such as the Middle and Near East. Whilst VS are certain to get a proportion of the Indian slots they have applied for I feel that on a completely non biased view BDs application is weaker than both BAs and VSs on the fact that they have very no long haul routes out of LHR and Mumbai and Chennai are destinations already served. BAs application stands more stead to maintain LHR as a worldclass hub so destinations such as Bangalore or Hyderabad do stand a better chance of a go ahead coupled with BAs short haul connection network out of LHR. Expansion in Africa down to Malabo and Port Harcourt and possible resumption of flights to Kano would give BA a more in depth network in this part of the world. Their un rivalled North American network gives BA connection opportunities to destinations up to the distance of possibly India so this is possibly where BA should concentrate and strengthening its position. I highly doubt there is a lack of high yield O&D traffic to some larger cities in Asia such as Osaka and Seoul and the Chinese cities now that Asia is beginning to finally expand again. At the end of the day though it does boil down to the limited slots available at LHR. With a possible merger with IB on the cards according to press reports this weekend of a rights issue to gain more capital to help this process along it will certainly be an interesting few months to see how BA changes. There are certainly more changes to come I feel.
 
ba97
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Joined: Sat Apr 10, 2004 9:42 am

RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Thu Nov 11, 2004 12:32 pm

Did I read this right on YYZ?

BA is keeping WTP but dropping First? I thought I read a thread here a month ago that they were dropping WTP? I do hope they keep it. I live off of WTP-it converted me to BA as my only airline from YYZ for the last 2 years.
there is economy class, business class, first class...then Concorde..pure class
 
nomorerjs
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Thu Nov 11, 2004 12:37 pm

Will ORD see a 744 next summer? Nice to see this instead of the 10 daily T7s on the summer rotation (and the AI 744 3x per week).
 
LH423
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Thu Nov 11, 2004 2:29 pm

Yes, BA97, you read correctly. For some time now the 777s to YYZ have been with no FIRST. However, WTP is performing with good results. It's growth has been consistant. And with BA continuing to add WTP to the remainder of the 777 fleet and expanding it to the 767 fleet, I doubt very much that World Traveller Plus is going anywhere.

LH423
« On ne voit bien qu'avec le cœur. L'essentiel est invisible pour les yeux » Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
 
AV8AJET
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Thu Nov 11, 2004 2:33 pm

Doesn't LGW-ATL go to a B763ER? If so will this have 4-class or only 3-class without First? Also wondering if PHX-LHR will ever go daily and I hope to keep the current B744 service!!!
"To fly or not to fly there is no question!"
 
LH423
Posts: 5868
Joined: Sun Jul 11, 1999 6:27 am

RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Thu Nov 11, 2004 2:57 pm

Not as far as I know. ATL should remain a 777. Also, there will be no 4-class 767s. The FIRST cabin is being removed in favour of Club World flat beds, World Traveller Plus, and World Traveller. A 4-cabin 767 would have so little capacity that there would be very few routes it could be profitable on except maybe certain oil destinations like a new service to Port Harcourt, Nigeria or Middle East destinations.

I would also not figure on the LHR-PHX route being upgraded to daily. At least not in the near future. I think the 6x weekly service is doing well. Maybe at some point they could add the additional frequency and keep the 747, but for now I think things will stay as is.

LH423
« On ne voit bien qu'avec le cœur. L'essentiel est invisible pour les yeux » Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
 
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FlyCaledonian
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RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Fri Nov 12, 2004 3:23 am

Summary of first day at the two-day CAA Scarce capacity hearing from Reuters.

BA has applied for all 21 additional UK-India frequencies, VS 18 and BD 13.

Under examination from VS and BD lawyers the BA Chief Executive Rod Eddington underlined the importance of Indian services to BA, highlighting 75 years service and its importance both as a market within its own right and as part of the BA network.

If allowed to go double daily on LHR-BOM Eddington stated BA has predicted operating profits of £130 million over the next three years, with a further £100 million from a double daily LHR-DEL service. Yields would be predicted to fall by about 17% due to additional capacity, though BA would also be able to lower its cost base.

Also revealed that further Anglo-Indian are planned within the next 12 months to look at opening up even more frequencies and routes to India - potential for some expansion over the next few years.

Sir Richard Branson for VS and Sir Michael Bishop for BD are due to appear at the hearing tomorrow.
Let's Go British Caledonian!
 
saigonhouston
Posts: 373
Joined: Tue Apr 27, 2004 11:48 pm

RE: BA Longhaul Update - Winter 04/Summer 05

Sat Nov 13, 2004 2:41 am

Just wondering that if BA is doing so well in IAH market so why don't they utilize twice daily with B747 instead of B777 (twice daily IAH-LGW and daily IAH-ORD-LHR)?

Saigonhouston

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