flymunich
Posts: 169
Joined: Wed Mar 03, 2004 8:15 pm

Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Tue Nov 09, 2004 8:47 pm

New Varig flights to Munich/Germany:

Munich - Sao Paulo:
------7  1145  1905  RG  8773  M11  06.02.05
----5--  1950  0310+ RG  8771  M11  04.02.05
--3----  2015  0335+ RG  8771  M11  02.02.05
1------  2135  0455+ RG  8771  M11  07.02.05

Sao Paulo - Munich:
------7  1615  0850  RG  8772  M11  06.02.05
1-3-5--  2105  1340  RG  8770  M11  02.02.05
 
HB-IWC
Posts: 4033
Joined: Fri Sep 22, 2000 1:09 am

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Tue Nov 09, 2004 8:52 pm

What about the proposed extension to PEK? Nothing's been heard about this project for quite some time now, although it was supposed to happen in August of this year. By now, also CA is crowding the route... Incidentally, have you taken a look at these arrival times into GRU? Wouldn't want to be getting in there at 03.10 am.

Edited to add that the operating days seem not to be correct. A Varig plane cannot leave GRU for MUC and return to MUC the same day. GRU-MUC is an overnighter.

[Edited 2004-11-09 12:57:23]
 
flymunich
Posts: 169
Joined: Wed Mar 03, 2004 8:15 pm

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Tue Nov 09, 2004 9:01 pm

Sorry HB-IWC,

the complete routing ist MUC-GRU-GIG!!!

Timetable MUC - GIG:

------7 1145 2105 RG 8773 M11 via GRU 06.02.05
----5-- 1950 0510+ RG 8771 M11 via GRU 04.02.05
--3---- 2015 0535+ RG 8771 M11 via GRU 02.02.05
1------ 2135 0655+ RG 8771 M11 via GRU 07.02.05
 
Udo
Posts: 4288
Joined: Tue May 18, 1999 5:16 pm

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Tue Nov 09, 2004 9:03 pm

I'm wondering how long the service will last. Last time Varig was successful on the route, big boss LH introduced own flights and kicked Varig out. Let's wait and see...


Regards
Udo
Me & You & a Plane Named Blue...
 
hardiwv
Posts: 4341
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 11:30 pm

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Tue Nov 09, 2004 9:45 pm

Very interesting news!

Yesterday a read a press interview with VARIG CEO, Mr. Martins, and he said that RG would start services to PEK, via MUC, in late December/05. However, negotiations with AC and Chinese authorities are still ongoing. This month a big Chinese delegation is arriving in Brazil, including the Chinese President, and RG flights GRU-MUC-PEK will be part of the side-line discussions. The intention is to operate codeshare with AC, mix crew RG/AC, with RG metal. Flights to MUC would then operate with the 777 - RG would received two additional 777s in December.

Flymunich:
HB-IWC:

"Incidentally, have you taken a look at these arrival times into GRU? Wouldn't want to be getting in there at 03.10 am."

I think the travel time is an excellent alternative for two reasons. 1) Simply because if you are an experienced traveler to GRU you will note that at about 6-7am the rush hour starts and to go from GRU (Guarulhos) to downtown Sao Paulo you can get stuck on the traffic. From GRU to downtown at 3-4am it may take you only 20min and clear traffic, but at rush hour in the morning it is easily over 1h; 2) so early in the morning the immigration line is not crowded. At 6-8am, when a lot of interncontinental flights arrive, you can easily spend about 2h in the immigration line.

-------
Wow, so RG now is operating three daily flights to Germany:

GRU-FRA (B777)
CPQ-GIG-FRA (MD11)
GIG-GRU-MUC (MD11) - maybe this gets extended to PEK in December

Let's see and wait for LH reaction!

Rgs,
Hardi
 
N1120A
Posts: 26467
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:40 pm

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Wed Nov 10, 2004 1:54 am

What does Air Canada have to do with this? Big grin
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
hardiwv
Posts: 4341
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 11:30 pm

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Wed Nov 10, 2004 1:57 am

Sorry, I meant CA and not AC!!

Hardi
 
N1120A
Posts: 26467
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:40 pm

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Wed Nov 10, 2004 2:03 am

>Sorry, I meant CA and not AC!!<

No worries. I think it is funny how a Nederlander knows Brazil better than most Brazilians. Thanks Hardi
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
hardiwv
Posts: 4341
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 11:30 pm

Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Sun Nov 14, 2004 5:02 am

Udo:

In order to avoid a reaction of LH in this newly established flight, it seems that RG will operated 4 x week MD11 and LH will operate 3 x week, therefore RG and LH will "share" the market.

Altogether, we will have the following flights Brazil-Germany:

RG:
GRU-FRA (MD11) = 7 x week;
CPQ-GIG-FRA (MD11) = 7 x week;
GRU-MUC (MD11) = 4 x week;

LH:
GIG-GRU-FRA (747-400) = 7 x week
GRU-MUC (A340) = 3 x week;

Flights MUC-GRU will start 1 February/05.

Rgs,
Hardi
 
HB-IWC
Posts: 4033
Joined: Fri Sep 22, 2000 1:09 am

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Sun Nov 14, 2004 8:57 am

The RG operated flights have been loaded in the CRS, and the earlier discussed very early arrival times at GRU seem not to be correct after all. Here's what's in the CRS:

RG8772 GRU MUC 1705 0850+ (-----6-)
GR8770 GRU MUC 2155 1340+ (-2-4--7)

RG8773 MUC GRU 1145 2015 (------7)
RG8771 MUC GRU 2135 0605+(1-3-5--)

As usual with RG Europe-GRU traffic, all flights originate in and continue to GIG.

As for LH operating thrice weekly MUC-GRU flights, that would be a resumption of this route for the airline and given its history of retaliating partner airlines' moves to operate new flights into Germany, I wouldn't be surprised at all if the airline were to soon make a press statement announcing its return to the route.

Last time something similar happened, was when SAA announced thrice weekly FRA-CPT nonstop operations. Lufthansa within days announced its own daily service on the route, thereby effectively withdrawing the quite successful MUC-JNB service.

 
hardiwv
Posts: 4341
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 11:30 pm

Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Sun Nov 14, 2004 10:27 pm

HB-IWC:

Thanks for the updates on the RG's flights, and posting the information that the flights will continue to GIG = MUC-GRU-GIG.

Apparently there have been some conversations between RG and LH about the operations to MUC, and they decided to "share" the flights in such a way that RG will operate 4 x week (MD11) and LH 3 x week (A340). This seems an adequate solution. But let's wait and see. Last time RG tried to go for MUC, LH killed RG intension by introducing competing flights...it shows how LH treats its partner airlines!

CHINA:

RG'S flights to MUC are also supposed to have a continuation to PEK starting in Feb/Mar-05. Exact details of the complete route GIG-GRU-MUC-PEK will be provided by RG at the end of the month. RG will then change the a/c to the B777. Two extra B777s are to be received until the end of the year.

Rgs,
Hardi
 
HB-IWC
Posts: 4033
Joined: Fri Sep 22, 2000 1:09 am

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Mon Nov 15, 2004 12:27 pm

Apparently there have been some conversations between RG and LH about the operations to MUC, and they decided to "share" the flights in such a way that RG will operate 4 x week (MD11) and LH 3 x week (A340). This seems an adequate solution.

Actually, it's anything but an adequate solution when you look at it from a commercial point of view. Once LH's schedules for the route are loaded, you will see daily service in one of the two directions (presumably MUC-GRU) and double services on certain days with no services on the other days in the opposite direction.

In the spirit of true partnership, and in the interest of offering a suitable schedule for passengers, only one of the partner airlines should operate this route, and do so on a daily basis if the demand is really there. Wasn't the Star Alliance all about offering more choices to its passengers...

But Lufthansa is apparently not subscribing to this philosophy. If they open their own MUC-GRU flights, then only 2 longhaul flights ex MUC will remain dormant: LH has withdrawn from both SIN and JNB. We are however guaranteed to see LH relaunch service on the route if either SQ or SA should decide to operate the flights themselves.

 
s.p.a.s.
Posts: 916
Joined: Sun Mar 11, 2001 2:04 pm

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Tue Nov 16, 2004 3:53 am

hardi,

Just for the records, RG 5th B772ER arrived a few days ago at GIG and is undergoing maintenance work, they are planning EIS in about 20 days or so.

Reg. is PP-VRE ex-N207UA

Cheers
"ad astra per aspera"
 
hardiwv
Posts: 4341
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 11:30 pm

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Tue Nov 16, 2004 5:56 pm

S.p.a.s.:

Excellent news! Apparently a sixth B777 is arriving before the end of December/04, right!?

Do you know the route they will use the fifth B777?

Currently VARIG serves the following cities with the B777:
MIA, MEX, CCS, SCL, EZE.

Any chance to see RG flying the B777 to CDG-AMS again?

Tks,
Hardi
 
JoFMO
Posts: 1840
Joined: Wed Jul 14, 2004 1:55 am

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Tue Nov 16, 2004 10:34 pm

Hardiwv:

The 777 is also used for their daily GRU-FRA run.
 
hardiwv
Posts: 4341
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 11:30 pm

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Wed Nov 17, 2004 12:14 am

JoFMO:

Thanks for the correction.

Indeed, RG B777s serve FRA (which is Star's hub), MIA, MEX, SCL, EZE, and CCS.

As pointed out by Spas, a fifth B777 already arrived, and I think it will serve CDG-AMS. The sixth B777 should go for JFK or LAX-NRT - this is my opinion!

Anyone knows about the routes of the next two B777s???

Tks,
Hardi


 
JoFMO
Posts: 1840
Joined: Wed Jul 14, 2004 1:55 am

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Wed Nov 17, 2004 12:32 am

Are their 777 significantly different equipped than their MD11?

Is there an advantage from a custumers point of view flying their 777 vs MD11?
 
Udo
Posts: 4288
Joined: Tue May 18, 1999 5:16 pm

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Wed Nov 17, 2004 12:39 am

B777s are equipped with PTVs in Economy, MD-11s aren't. However, in this particular case and as a holy exception, I would take the "11" over the 777...  Love


Regards
Udo
Me & You & a Plane Named Blue...
 
hardiwv
Posts: 4341
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 11:30 pm

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Wed Nov 17, 2004 12:42 am

Are their 777 significantly different equipped than their MD11?

JoFMO:

I already travelled in both RG's MD11 and 777, and I can guarantee that the 777 is MUCH better, by the single fact that all seats have PTVs and they are newer. I have no doubt that the 777 is a superior a/c, and Im' glad to see RG phasing out the MD11s so as to introduce the 777s. It makes a real difference...Many airlines use the 777 for what they consider their "prime" routes. Sorry, but I cannot give you a more technical explanation...

Anyone knows the routes where the fifth, and sixth RG's B777 wil be deployed??

Tks,
Hardi
 
JoFMO
Posts: 1840
Joined: Wed Jul 14, 2004 1:55 am

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Wed Nov 17, 2004 12:59 am

phasing out?

Have they serious plans to replace their complete MD11 fleet with 777?

Are there some outstanding orders or do they collect teir 777 on the second hand market?
 
hardiwv
Posts: 4341
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 11:30 pm

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Wed Nov 17, 2004 1:42 am

JoFMO:

I see this is phasing out, but there is no serious "program" for fleet renewal from MD11s to 777s. Everybody knows RG's situation, with debts of about USD2.5 billion. As such, RG's collects the 777 in the second-hand market (ex-BA, ex-UA)

RG is faced with very strong competition in the international flights to/from GRU, in which airlines use their top products, and sometimes even launch their newest a/c and service (e.g. KL, SA). Just out of my memory, look at the products on offer to GRU: JJ (A330), LAN (A320), AA (B777), AF (B777), KL (B777), LX (A340), AZ (B777), SA (A340),...they are ALL superior than RG!

...if RG does not move, it will simply be left behind, something which is already happening...as it's now, people chose RG based on: 1) RG's quality name from the past (until mid-90s), 2) price; 3) "necessity", i.e. if you are travelling beyond GRU to a destination in Brazil.

Rgs,



[Edited 2004-11-16 17:46:20]
 
glennpower
Posts: 92
Joined: Wed Jul 14, 2004 2:41 am

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Wed Nov 17, 2004 7:44 am

Hardiwv,

You are absolutely right about RG,remember recently when they got i think it was 5 ex swiss MD11s ( i travelled on one from LHR to GRU,old and scruffy),at the same time swiss started A340 service to brasil,you can make your own conclusions,i am writing this sitting in the Americas lounge at Mia,i flew BA AMS to LHR then AA LHR to MIA today all in Y class,good flights especially
the AA flight,(only complaint a couple of the stewardesses were a bit dour).
I am now waiting to fly RG to GIG F class then from there to SSA J class on one of RGs new,oops sorry second hand Iberia 757s,am using my smiles miles as quickly as possible if Rg go belly up,which will proberbly happen unless they get Financial help from Brasilian goverment,I am a RG Diamond card holder and have been using Rg to Brasil for the last 14 or so years,but now i can not take it anymore,truly woefull service,thats why i have joined JJs Fidelidade program and flew AA today to start getting miles with JJ,hopefully within a few months i will get there Red card and soon after be able to try there J class,and who knows there F class product,and if as predicted they join Oneworld even better.Just a quick side note i will be trying Virgins new skysuite soon in the new year,really excited about that.
Always very interesting reading your posts.
Kind Regards Glenn Power.
 
hardiwv
Posts: 4341
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 11:30 pm

Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Thu Nov 18, 2004 8:14 am

Glenn:

You are absolutely right about RG,remember recently when they got i think it was 5 ex swiss MD11s

Indeed, RG introduced in its fleet about 5 (old) ex-LX MD11s, and guess what? The next day LX introduced a brand new A340 on its route ZRH-GRU. It just shows that RG is really going downhill. Of course, any top airline acquires itsa/c new so that it is tailor-made, such as JJ and even GOL does. Buying MD11s? Is RG a pax or cargo company?

second hand Iberia 757s

Yes, RG bought two second-hand 757s ex-IB. One after two weeks had an emmergency landing in POA...

I am a RG Diamond card holder and have been using Rg to Brasil for the last 14 or so years,but now i can not take it anymore

Completely uderstand your position. The problem is that RG dominates the international market to/from Brazil, and if your destination is not GRU you really need RG so as to connect. I'm FF of KL so I can also earn miles with JJ.

I think JJ has to be more aggressive in the international market, even if it entails flying routes which overlap with RG. At the end, RG cannot win a one-to-one competition with JJ, (just look at what happened in MIA and CDG!). JJ will also end its domestic + EZE + ASU codeshare agreement with RG, something it should have done a long time ago, othewise people cofuse the image of JJ with the one of RG.

predicted they join Oneworld

It makes all the sense for JJ to join OW, especially because of its excellent relations with, mainly AA, and also IB and BA. Maybe we could soon see JJ flying to LHR and MAD. It seems that JJ will start 3 x day flights to MIA.

Always very interesting reading your posts

Thank you! I hope we can get some more contributions fro you!

Rgs and enjoy SSA!

Hardi

 
MAH4546
Posts: 24522
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RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Thu Nov 18, 2004 8:28 am

It seems that JJ will start 3 x day flights to MIA.


Any more news on this? I have heard it will be GIG-MIA 6x a week and GIG-FOR-MIA on Wednesdays. Is this going to be the case?
a.
 
hardiwv
Posts: 4341
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 11:30 pm

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Thu Nov 18, 2004 8:31 pm

MAH4546:

You're correct. JJ is about to increase its service to MIA, and the 7 x week additional flights would be 6 x week GIG-MIA and 1 x week GIG-FOR-MIA. Total number of flights to MIA would then be 21 x week.

Question: anyone knows on which routes is RG going to deploys the fifth and sixth B777s? My guess: CDG-AMS and JFK.

Rgs,
Hardi
 
erikwilliam
Posts: 2122
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2004 12:30 am

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Thu Nov 18, 2004 9:24 pm

MAH: there´s also a flight GIG-SSA-MIA on wed., seasonaly

JJ flights to MIA are: JJ8090 GRU-MIA daily
JJ8094 GRU-MIA mon-sat
JJ8092 GRU-MIA only sun

If U add everything gives U 14weekly flights GRU-MIA.

About Varig´s 777, I´m guessing first to GRU-CDG-AMS, due to heavier competetiton there, with JJ AF KL(AMS-CDG) and RG.

To JFK/EWR there´s JL CO AA RG.

The NRT market is just JL and RG from GRU. GRU-JFK-NRT with 747-400´s on JL and GRU-LAX-NRT with MD-11´s on RG.

Guess that´s it.

nice day guys.
Dida, Cafu, Lucio, Roque Junior, Roberto Carlo, Emerson, Ze Roberto, Ronaldinho, Kaka, Adriano, Robinho, Ronaldo
 
MAH4546
Posts: 24522
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 1:44 pm

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Fri Nov 19, 2004 5:29 am

JJ flights to MIA are: JJ8090 GRU-MIA daily
JJ8094 GRU-MIA mon-sat
JJ8092 GRU-MIA only sun

If U add everything gives U 14weekly flights GRU-MIA.


JJ 8092 on Sundays stops in Salvador da Bahia.

Also, any timeline on when TAM will launch MIA-GIG and MIA-FOR-GIG?

[Edited 2004-11-18 21:33:17]
a.
 
erikwilliam
Posts: 2122
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2004 12:30 am

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Fri Nov 19, 2004 8:32 pm

MAH: I really don´t know about MIA-GIG, and MIA-FOR-GIG.
Right now JJ is doing great with flights from GRU, and connecting SSA, MAO.
Also, they need planes for it, and right now all of them are in use, or loaned to other carriers.
I mean, that´s my guess, but I could be wrong.

nice day fellas.
Dida, Cafu, Lucio, Roque Junior, Roberto Carlo, Emerson, Ze Roberto, Ronaldinho, Kaka, Adriano, Robinho, Ronaldo
 
MAH4546
Posts: 24522
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 1:44 pm

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Sat Nov 20, 2004 2:26 am

also, they need planes for it, and right now all of them are in use, or loaned to other carriers.

They are getting more A330s (two, IIRC), soon.
a.
 
b741
Posts: 677
Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2004 3:09 pm

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Sat Nov 20, 2004 5:22 am

I presume San Pablo has a large German,Japanese and Italian population.
Being Bilingual, I Speak English And Aviation
 
PPVRA
Posts: 7864
Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2004 7:48 am

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Sun Nov 21, 2004 4:21 am

Going back to the 'topic', what are the chances of RG returning to HKG? There must be some demand... specially if they fly it through MAD (IB isn't flying to China anymore, right?) or as a matter of fact maybe even through LIS? Sometimes I feel they lack the widebodies they need to start some fights...

PPVRA
"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
 
HB-IWC
Posts: 4033
Joined: Fri Sep 22, 2000 1:09 am

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Sun Nov 21, 2004 10:04 am

IB isn't flying to China anymore, right?

Have they ever? Not in the last decade for sure. Their last flight into the Far East was the MAD-SVO-NRT flight, which I think operated thirce weekly with B742.

 
PPVRA
Posts: 7864
Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2004 7:48 am

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Sun Nov 21, 2004 12:47 pm

Indeed, I was reading the other threads and there was something about IB and their flights to China, I'll be more careful next time. Embarrassment

PPVRA
"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
 
JJMNGR
Posts: 924
Joined: Wed May 26, 2004 9:06 pm

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Sun Nov 21, 2004 10:35 pm

TAM intl flights indeed starts in GIG, with one stop in GRU and aircraft change.
 
persotvik
Posts: 265
Joined: Wed Nov 24, 1999 12:38 am

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Mon Nov 22, 2004 10:23 pm


Hi folks!

RG does NOT use the B777 on the GIG-FRA route, they use the M11. B777's are sometimes used on the MAD flights.

persotvik
Just love flying
 
hardiwv
Posts: 4341
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 11:30 pm

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Mon Nov 22, 2004 11:00 pm

Persotvik:

RG does use the 777-200 to FRA. Please look at their webpage http://www.varig.com/

Note that RG has TWO daily flights to FRA, one with the MD11 (departing GIG) and one with the 777-220 (departing GRU).

Here are all the filghts between Germany and Brazil:

RG:
GIG-GRU-FRA (B777) = 7 x week;
CPQ-GIG-FRA (MD11) = 7 x week;
GRU-MUC (MD11) = 4 x week - starting 1 February/05;

LH:
GIG-GRU-FRA (747-400) = 7 x week
GRU-MUC (A340) 3 x week - starting 1 February/05 - speculation only


Rgs,
Hardi
 
JoFMO
Posts: 1840
Joined: Wed Jul 14, 2004 1:55 am

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Mon Nov 22, 2004 11:14 pm

But CPQ-GRU-FRA has an equipment change in GRU following my informations from 733 to MD11. It has just the same flight number
 
mozart
Posts: 2022
Joined: Thu Aug 14, 2003 12:21 am

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Tue Nov 23, 2004 12:07 am

Not sure whether this brings some clarification, but here's an excerpt of the Star Alliance timetable for the week of Nov 22-Nov 29:

GIG-FRA is daily on MD-11

RG 8744 GIG 11:40pm FRA 2:30pm M11 MTWTFSS 13NOV04 19FEB05

GRU-FRA is daily on 777

RG 8740 GRU 11:25pm FRA 2:00pm 772 .....S. 13NOV04 19FEB05

RG 8740 GRU 11:25pm FRA 2:00pm 772 MTWTF.S 13NOV04 18FEB05


But indeed, RG in the past has already used the 777 to CDG-AMS, MAD, MIA and also JFK.

By the way, what happended to their 767s?
 
The777Man
Posts: 5912
Joined: Sun Jul 04, 1999 4:54 am

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Tue Nov 23, 2004 12:59 am

Good question, Mozart! Varig's 767s including the -300s seems to have disappeared from the scheduled, having been replaced by M11s. Any more info ?

The777Man
Boeing 777s flown: UA, TG, KE, BA, CX, NH, JD, JL, CZ, SQ, EK, NG, CO, AF, SV, KU, DL, AA, MH, OZ, CA, MS, SU, LY, RG, PE, AZ, KL, VN, PK, EY, NZ, AM, BR, AC, DT, UU, OS, AI, 9W, KQ, QR, VA, JJ, ET, TK, PR, BG, T5, CI, MU and LX.. Further to fly.. LH 777
 
hardiwv
Posts: 4341
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 11:30 pm

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Sat Dec 04, 2004 2:18 am

But CPQ-GRU-FRA has an equipment change in GRU following my informations from 733 to MD11

The correct flight itinerary is CPQ-GIG-FRA (the leg CPQ-GIG is made with the 737 and GIG-FRA with the MD-11 - same flight number and only one check in)

Mozart:

GRU-FRA is daily with the 777-200, as of December/04.

Currently, RG is using the 777 to FRA, LIS, CCS, SCL, MEX and EZE - it has decided to focus on the South American market due to increased competition.

---------

As of February/05, the direct flights between Brazil and Germany will be:

RG:
GIG-GRU-FRA (B777) = 7 x week;
CPQ-GIG-FRA (MD11) = 7 x week;
GRU-MUC (MD11) = 4 x week;

LH:
GIG-GRU-FRA (747-400) = 7 x week
GRU-MUC (A340) 3 x week - starting 1 February/05 - ?? speculation only

 
PPVRA
Posts: 7864
Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2004 7:48 am

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Sat Dec 04, 2004 6:06 am

correct, 1 February is when RG starts their fights to MUC, CA takes over from there to PEK.

BTW, RG recently upgraded their service to Milan from a 763 to a M11.

PPVRA
"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
 
hardiwv
Posts: 4341
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 11:30 pm

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Sat Dec 04, 2004 6:04 pm

PPVRA:

Wasn't RG going to fly to China with its own metal?

Tks,
 
PPVRA
Posts: 7864
Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2004 7:48 am

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Sun Dec 05, 2004 3:48 am

RG doesn't have enough metal to send off to Asia for a couple of days...

A Varig definiu a data de seu vôo para Munique. Começa em 1° de fevereiro a operação das quatro frequências da companhia aérea para a cidade alemã, utilizando as aeronaves MD 11, com capacidade para 285 passageiros. O diretor comercial da Varig, Marcelo Bottini, disse que anunciaria o vôo até dezembro. A idéia da Varig é voar para a China a partir de Munique, em code-share com a Air China.


Here is the link(portuguese only):

http://www.panrotas.com.br


...sorry but the specific URL doesn't change as you open new windows on the site...just do a search for RG/China related news.

PPVRA
"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
 
mozart
Posts: 2022
Joined: Thu Aug 14, 2003 12:21 am

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Sun Dec 05, 2004 4:06 am

As an add-on to my earlier post, here's some info from Star Alliance downloadable timetable:

Sao Paulo-Manaus is 4x week B777-200 as well
As of Dec 4th, flight RG 2200 is a 772 as well on all days except 3/5/7.
On other days it's (still) the MD-11

@777Man,

B767 still in fleet on several runs in South America
I have identified the 767 on the following routes:
1x week GIG-IGU
1x day GIG-REC-PNZ
3x week GIG-CDG
1x day GIG-NAT-FOR-GIG

4x week GRU-BOG
1x day GRU-MXP

plus a couple of runs GRU-GIG-GRU
 
PPVRA
Posts: 7864
Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2004 7:48 am

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Sun Dec 05, 2004 4:26 am

Correction:

RG does still operates the 763 to MXP, M11 services will begin on 13 January.

--------------------------------

To translate a bit from my previous post:

RG will begin MUC services with the M11 begining 1 February. The MUC-PEK leg will be code-shared with CA.

Time table:

RG flights will depart on Tuesday, Thursday and Sundays at 20:50, from GIG with a stopover in GRU. On Saturdays it departs GIG at 16:00 and GRU at 18:05. The return flight departs MUC at 21:35 on Mondays, Wednesday and Friday. On sunday the flight will depart at 11:45.

PPVRA
"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
 
hardiwv
Posts: 4341
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 11:30 pm

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Sun Dec 05, 2004 5:00 am

Mozart:

Thanks for the update on RG's domestic flights GRU-MAO with the 777.

Regarding RG's 767, some corrections on your list:

1x day GIG-IGU
1x day GIG-REC-PNZ
1 x day GIG-FOR
1x day GIG-NAT-FOR
3x week GIG-CDG
4x week GIG-GRU-BOG
1x day GIG-GRU-MXP
1x day GRU-FOR
1x week GRU-MVD (RG/PU coeshare)
1x day MVD-GIG-MAD (RG/PU codeshare)

plus a couple of runs GRU-GIG-GRU

PPVRA:

Do you have the complete schedule RG/CA GIG-GRU-MUC-PEK? What a/c will be used in the MUC-PEk flight?

Tks,
Hardi
 
PPVRA
Posts: 7864
Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2004 7:48 am

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Sun Dec 05, 2004 6:58 am

Hardi,

Currently CA flies out of MUC with a 763 at 19:00 and arrives in PEK at 12:00. However, I don't have information if there will be any changes in equipment and/or schedule.

Apparently LH has the same type of agreement with CA that they made with RG. I checked LH website and it varies from day to day which airline (CA or LH) you'll be flying. LH operates an A343 in this route.

Muy amigos LH, don't you think?  Yeah sure

I've seen estimates of up to 100,000 Chinese may come to Brasil in 2005...seems like too much I know, but they are still predicting it...so I would definatly expect a change of equipment for CA on the MUC-PEK flight.

PPVRA

[Edited 2004-12-04 23:13:38]
"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
 
hardiwv
Posts: 4341
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 11:30 pm

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Sun Dec 05, 2004 5:08 pm

It seems that RG schedule to MUC will NOT allow for connections on LH and CA flights to PEK. RG flights to MUC are on Sundays, Thursdays, Tuesdays and Saturdays. AC flies MUC-PEK on Mondays, Wednesdays and Saturdays, with the 767-300, and LH on Saturdays and Wednesdays, with the A343.

I see this fact as a clear indication that RG will fly whit its own metal MUC-PEK. CA will continue flying MUC-PEK 3 x week and RG will fly 4 x week, this makes a perfect match!

Rgs,

 
mozart
Posts: 2022
Joined: Thu Aug 14, 2003 12:21 am

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Sun Dec 05, 2004 5:19 pm

Hardiwv,

thanks for the update. I had gotten my info from the Star timeteble, for the week starting Dec. 4. But I know that source isn't always 100% correct.

Cheers
 
flymunich
Posts: 169
Joined: Wed Mar 03, 2004 8:15 pm

RE: Varig MD11 From Sao Paulo To Munich

Sun Dec 05, 2004 11:03 pm

Air China operate next summer timetable 5/7 with B777-200 from Peking to Munich.

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