AR385
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What Airline Will Finally Dare To Fly MTY-EUROPE?

Fri Nov 12, 2004 3:13 pm

I'm really dissapointed that having the traffic that MTY generates to Europe, no Mexican airline has started a route. We all have to fly to other hubs and catch a foreign carrier, mostly. Maybe 6A will do it?
 
mtyfreak
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RE: What Airline Will Finally Dare To Fly MTY-EUROPE?

Fri Nov 12, 2004 6:24 pm

Who ever starts the route first is going to make a lot of money, IB, LH, AM, 6A, it doesn't mater!!!!! WE REALLY NEED A DIRECT FLIGHT TO EUROPE!!!

It is NOT fun to fly to DFW, IAH or ATL in order to get a flight to Europe, the only real option is MEX or a direct flight from MTY.



Sort it out carriers!!!!!!!!



AR385:if you live in MTY you can catch me djing at the Havana and Motel bar's

[Edited 2004-11-12 10:25:28]
Only here for the beer...
 
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TS-IOR
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RE: What Airline Will Finally Dare To Fly MTY-EUROPE?

Fri Nov 12, 2004 6:54 pm


...i guess AeroMexico, Mexicana, Air Madrid or Iberia could succeed in a MTY-MAD service...let's say twice or thrice a week !!!
Next flight TUN-YUL Tunisair A330-243.
 
767-332ER
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RE: What Airline Will Finally Dare To Fly MTY-EUROPE?

Fri Nov 12, 2004 8:16 pm


You guys think it would fill an A340 and also get a high yield for it from MTY-MAD? I agree with Ts-ior...maybe twice or thrice a week. Just because you can fill the airplane doesn't mean you're going to make money. Yield is the concept in question here and the airlines know they will not be able to have a high yield where it'll warrant the use of a direct flight.
Twinjets...if one fails, work the other one twice as hard!!!
 
bobnwa
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RE: What Airline Will Finally Dare To Fly MTY-EUROPE?

Fri Nov 12, 2004 10:51 pm

Do you have any numbers as to the DEW (daily each way) in this market. If the numbers are as good as you say, then some carrier ought to start it.
 
pzurita1
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RE: What Airline Will Finally Dare To Fly MTY-EURO

Sat Nov 13, 2004 12:21 am

I have mixed thoughts about a route from MTY to Europe.

On one hand, you see tons of regios going to Europe everyday. As has been pointed out, all regios have to make tedious connections in US or in MEX. However, I cannot produce figures about traffic, it is just a perception. I am sure that having a direct link to Europe (in the right price) could increase the current number of pax whose final destination is Europe.

On the other hand, MTY has not been able to support services such as JFK. I know, AM killed it when they changed the schedule of the flight avoiding its pax to make connections in JFK (it arrived much too late). However, it had GDL as a tag-on and was only 4x. Nor YVR nor YYZ. Somebody said AM would reinstate MTY-JFK flight by December (let's see)

Anyway, I trully believe that a well scheduled flight to a very relevant hub could prove succesful. Most regios fly to France or Italy, not Spain. Besides MAD is not the best hub to connect to the rest of Europe or Middle East. Therefore, if a service to Europe is going to be established, CDG, AMS, or LHR could have more chances than MAD.

I do not see a service to Europe in the short term. IB had its chance when they had MIA hub. May be a daily MTY-MIA would've worked. But then again, it would reach MAD after one stop and if you had PRG as your final destination you would reach it after 2 connections (MIA and MAD). After IB announced they would close MIA and would not consider CUN as an alternative, they offered Mexican government to start services to GDL and MTY. That was almost a year ago and I have not seen any real intentions on this.

There were also plans of LH and MX to have a MEX-MTY-FRA. That really could become a killer, only if it really happens. Or an AM/AF service to CDG. In fact, that is my strongest bet: a MEX-MTY-CDG with either AM or AF metal.

Mexican airlines have two restrictions: lack of a/c, and lack of long-haul planning. 6A is planning services to JFK... but that and crossing the pond are two very different things.

I wish the market is as strong as we imagine and any airline could see this potential. May be in 2 or 3 years.

PZ
Next flight: IAH-DBX-MRU-ANT
 
hardiwv
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RE: What Airline Will Finally Dare To Fly MTY-EUROPE?

Sat Nov 13, 2004 1:06 am

"Somebody said AM would reinstate MTY-JFK flight by December (let's see)"

This will not happen. AM already announced its new routes, and MTY is not included.

"Therefore, if a service to Europe is going to be established, CDG, AMS, or LHR could have more chances than MAD."

I dont think there is traffic from MTY to CDG, AMS, LHR, as AF, KL and BA already have flights to MEX and probably the next destination would be CUN instead of MTY.

"Or an AM/AF service to CDG. In fact, that is my strongest bet: a MEX-MTY-CDG with either AM or AF metal."

Here I agree with you, and the flight would be operated with AM metal.

Rgs,
Hardi



 
pilotcoex
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RE: What Airline Will Finally Dare To Fly MTY-EUROPE?

Sat Nov 13, 2004 1:53 am

Guadalajara has a higher chance of getting a direct flight to Europe I think. Many times it comes down to tourism, not industrial demand. GDL receives a lot more tourism than MTY.
 
pzurita1
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RE: What Airline Will Finally Dare To Fly MTY-EURO

Sat Nov 13, 2004 3:05 am

Pilotcoex,

GDL has already its share of European services. Airpullman tours is flying on scheduled basis twice a week GDL-MAD in a 747. As you mentioned, GDL has a good share of tourism travelers.

It could be interesting to see GDL-MTY-Europe. May be tagging these two cities could produce more traffic.

PZ
Next flight: IAH-DBX-MRU-ANT
 
aa777jr
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RE: What Airline Will Finally Dare To Fly MTY-EUROPE?

Sat Nov 13, 2004 3:12 am

Does IB fly into MEX? They definitely have the metal to make a trip to MTY.

AA777jr
A liberal is a man who is right most of the time, but he's right too soon.
 
bobnwa
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RE: What Airline Will Finally Dare To Fly MTY-EUROPE?

Sat Nov 13, 2004 3:58 am

Aa777jr,

After exhaustive research, Iberia does fly to MEX. Now give some valid financial reasons they should fly to MTY. Remember their route planning people know how many people travel between Europe and MTY every day yet have decided not to fly the route. The same goes for the Mexican carriers. I would be interested in your reasoning.
 
AR385
Topic Author
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RE: What Airline Will Finally Dare To Fly MTY-EUROPE?

Sat Nov 13, 2004 5:24 am

The JFK service is seasonal, that's why it was cancelled. It will be reinstated in May. The problem with having to connect in any hub in the US is the number of passengers that lack a VISA. Therefore, MEX is the only alternative.

MTY is a strong catchment area. Don't forget Saltillo, Reynosa, Laredo, Linares, Torreon, etc. those are important cities within a reasonable car travel time.

There is a lot of European business, specially French. So I agree, the ideal would be MTY-CDG, plus all the regios who go there in the summer.

Mtyfreak,
I'll try and catch you in Havana this Thursday.
 
pzurita1
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RE: What Airline Will Finally Dare To Fly MTY-EURO

Sat Nov 13, 2004 5:32 am

AR385,

I would not count Linares as a strong origin using MTY.... If so, let's count Cadereyta, which I find it a joke!!!!

Anyway, let's make an Avioncitos meeting at Havana Bar!!!!

PZ
Next flight: IAH-DBX-MRU-ANT
 
cx340
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RE: What Airline Will Finally Dare To Fly MTY-EUROPE?

Sat Nov 13, 2004 5:36 am

I think the problem with a MTY-Europe non-stop is that while many "regios" do fly to Europe, they do it mostly for tourism, meaning that in principle they look for a lower fare and therefore (again in principle) the yeilds for any airline are low. That is most likely why GDL is served by a leisure carrier as opposed to a "regular" and the service is intended for vacation travellers. As we all know, a "trunk" carrier's main profits come from business travellers or high paying passangers. Who knows, maybe an Air Pullmantur or similar service to MTY once or twice a week could work.

Just my thoughts.

Mtyfreak: I didn't know Havana was reopened. Well, I don't really live in MTY there and this past weekend I didn't have tim to go on club watch, but it sure is a great bar. I'll try to go next time I'm there.
 
AR385
Topic Author
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RE: What Airline Will Finally Dare To Fly MTY-EUROPE?

Sat Nov 13, 2004 5:57 am

Pzurita,

I'm not trying to keep beating a dead horse, but Linares has a lot of money and traditional families that fly to Europe regularly. We are currently trying to reactivate the airport there and get a carrier to fly to MTY and MEX. Anyway, when I said Linares, I meant to include the whole South part of the state, the famous "Zona Citrica".

Now Cadereyta, is really part of MTY. It's actually closer to the airport than other parts of the metro area.
 
anxebla
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RE: What Airline Will Finally Dare To Fly MTY-EUROPE?

Sat Nov 13, 2004 6:03 am

MTY-CDG? I think it had more profitable and more logic a MTY-MAD leg!
Pzurita1.... I can't agree with you on the MAD's hub matter. MAD is a good hub, another different thing is you dislike MAD as hub.
Boys... if there's a chance to offer flights from mexican airports, other than MEX or CUN towards Europe is with MAD like final destination... proof is that Air Pullmantour is the unique european carrier in doing GDL-MAD

AIRBUS 320 The world's most advanced single-aisle aircraft
 
pzurita1
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RE: What Airline Will Finally Dare To Fly MTY-EURO

Sat Nov 13, 2004 4:03 pm

Anxebla,

It is not me disliking MAD as a hub. I have never been to MAD airport. I just refered to fewer connecting posibilities to other European cities compared to LHR or CDG; not to mention that it take 1,5 hours more to reach MAD than LHR or 1 hr more than CDG.

I do not have solid figures, but I see more destinations being served in Europe, North Africa and Middle East from LHR, CDG, AMS, FRA. It is trying to compare ORD with PIT.

Cx340,

I do agree with you, regios fly more often to Europe on vacations. Therefore service in Airpullman tour style could be very well suited. But there is also an important business activity between MTY and Europe. So, who knows!

AR385,
Re: Linares and all Carretera Nacional cities doesn't not sum more than 120,000 people. It is an important number as a catchment area, though. I do not want to neglect it, but it is obviously the smallest of the urban centres you mentioned. Sorry if I was not clear enough in my previous post.
Good luck in trying to open commercial services to Linares. Is there already an aiport there? I guess it will take a lot of work trying to convince any airline to fly there as it is midway to MTY or CVM. Wish you the best in that project!

PZ
Next flight: IAH-DBX-MRU-ANT
 
ghost77
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RE: What Airline Will Finally Dare To Fly MTY-EUROPE?

Sat Nov 13, 2004 5:01 pm

Air Pullmantur is not a 'trunk' carrier but they are offering a 3 class config on their 747 to GDL.

I only see two possible routes as pointed out above.

In first instance MTY-CDG followed by a MTY-FRA. Currently MAD is well served from MEX by AM/IB and also there's this additional flight to GDL. Adding extra flights to MAD from MTY won't be that smart because of all the competition from MEX mainly.

So this new service needs definitely be a little more focus on airports with a lot more connections to offer such as CDG, FRA and probably LHR or LGW.

I only see four possible carriers that could probably start service to Europe from MTY, which are: AM, 6A, LH and AF.

Unfortunately, AM is not showing much interest on GDL or MTY at the moment nor seeing the big potential markets those cities could become in the near future. I at least hope they get on time before they turn their head to those airports a little late after having European carriers serving the market.

Aviacsa is my other big hope. I think they're going on the right track!

ANXEBLA

WHO said we dislike MAD or IB in THIS thread? WHO? Please DON'T START! Im tired to read things from you telling the world we don't like IB or MAD. I think all anet members have understood your point very well and perhaps you won't change their ideals but try to defend IB or MAD as a f.p.p. of view with FACTS from IB and MAD instead of biased comments from yourself!

I haven't been to MAD therefore I won't say anything against or in favor of the airport but telling MAD offers more destinations and comparing it to LHR, FRA, AMS? OK.... you again with your ideals and lack of facts.

Boys... if there's a chance to offer flights from mexican airports, other than MEX or CUN towards Europe is with MAD like final destination... proof is that Air Pullmantour is the unique european carrier in doing GDL-MAD

Another non-sense comment. PVR is only 45mins away (by plane) from GDL and another destination very well served by other european carriers from several countries and other destinations, its not only Air Pullmantur from MAD flying to PVR. In fact even Air Greenland A332 frequents PVR. Proof is that MAD is not the only possible airport as a final destination from other mexican airports.

Ricardo APM

Ricardo Morales - flyAPM - ¡No es que maneje rapido, solo estoy volando lento!