DIA
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Outlook: 747s To Be Produced For Years To Come...

Tue Nov 16, 2004 6:39 am

I just caught this excerpt from Boeing's Marketing V.P. of of Boeing's website:

"On transoceanic routes and long transcontinental routes, the Boeing 777s and 7E7s provide the versatility to serve major and secondary city pairs," Baseler added. "The 747-400 will maintain a key role in hub operations for many years. In addition, we are studying the 747 Advanced, which will improve upon the current version." -Boeing Marketing V.P. Randy Baseler

This, more or less, firms up that Boeing is planning on following up with its earlier 747ADV thoughts. . . . . .just a tad more serious about it. I might be reading between the lines a bit, but IMO, I believe we'll see the 747ADV come to fruition.

I can feel myself tied to the stake with the flames rising on this one . . .
Ding! You are now free to keep supporting Frontier.
 
bennett123
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RE: Outlook: 747s To Be Produced For Years To Come...

Tue Nov 16, 2004 9:45 am


It sounds as if they will go for the B747ADV, which I have always believed thatbthey wouod.

However, they have been studying new versions of the B747 for years.

In less than 6 months the A380 will be flying.

The window of opportunity is closing fast.
 
Ruscoe
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RE: Outlook: 747s To Be Produced For Years To Come...

Tue Nov 16, 2004 11:26 am

Airlines aren't exactly falling over themselves to order 380's however.

They will be a lot harder to sell at "normal" prices also.

And if there is a performance shortfall Airbus will have some serious credibility problems.

Ruscoe
 
trex8
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RE: Outlook: 747s To Be Produced For Years To Come

Tue Nov 16, 2004 11:37 am

If Boeing don't commit to the 747Adv soon everyone who needs a 747 replacement will have gone to 773/A346 and/or A380. They need to offer something soon. I just hope this is not all talk like the prev 747 derivatives.
 
StickShaker
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RE: Outlook: 747s To Be Produced For Years To Come...

Tue Nov 16, 2004 5:40 pm

..."The window of opportunity is closing fast"....

The current window of opportunity exists until shortly after the EIS of the A380. This is when in service performance data will become available to airlines who may be considering the A380 but want proof of its performance. Many of these airlines will have large 744 fleets and would find integrating the 747Adv into their fleets a much cheaper exercise than the A380 due to commonality issues. Assuming the 747Adv will fit into existing gates, taxiways etc then there is also a much larger number of airports that could handle the stretched 747 rather than the A380.

The large number of 747's still currently giving good service (and earning revenue) suggest that the aircraft's demise would be premature at this point in time. There is a significant replacement market, not all of which is likely to be met by the B773/A346.

Cheers,
StickShaker
 
DLKAPA
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RE: Outlook: 747s To Be Produced For Years To Come

Tue Nov 16, 2004 5:57 pm

For romantic/nostalgia purposes, does anybody here really think that Boeing would let 747 Die without a fight? Seriously that airplane made Boeing.
And all at once the crowd begins to sing: Sometimes the hardest thing and the right thing are the same
 
kalakaua
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RE: Outlook: 747s To Be Produced For Years To Come...

Tue Nov 16, 2004 6:04 pm

Will Boeing launch the 747Adv.? Hopefully, since they're promoting it on their "747 e-Brochure."

http://www.boeing.com/commercial/747family/e_brochure/highres/flash_index.html
Gravity explains the motions of the planets, but it cannot explain who set the planets in motion.
 
bennett123
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RE: Outlook: 747s To Be Produced For Years To Come...

Tue Nov 16, 2004 7:58 pm


What they say is that the B747ADV would be the most efficient, elegent and ecological jetliner in the sky.

This may be true IF they launch it.

There is no indication that they will. I also noted that there is a spec for the B747-400ER, but no indications of the performances expectations for the B747ADV.

There have been several proposals in the last few years, all of which remained as paper planes.

Whilst the EIS is important, the first flight is another milestone.

Boeing need to decide soon what they are going to offer in this category.

 
LifelinerOne
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RE: Outlook: 747s To Be Produced For Years To Come...

Tue Nov 16, 2004 8:26 pm

Boeing Marketing V.P. Randy Baseler

Well, the mans job is to tell positive news about Boeing and their products. I can't see this as a definite proof that the B747ADV will come. I do hope the mighty B747 will be around for years to come.

Cheers!
Only Those Who Sleep Don't Make Mistakes
 
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scbriml
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RE: Outlook: 747s To Be Produced For Years To Come...

Tue Nov 16, 2004 8:56 pm

Many of these airlines will have large 744 fleets and would find integrating the 747Adv into their fleets a much cheaper exercise than the A380 due to commonality issues.

I don't think this is as true as it may look on the surface.

The plane may be the same shape (but a bit longer) than a 744, but just about everything else in it will be different. I would have thought the work involved to introduce the 747Adv would be very close to that associated with a completely new type.

Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana!
 
zvezda
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RE: Outlook: 747s To Be Produced For Years To Come

Tue Nov 16, 2004 11:49 pm

Has Boeing indicated whether or not the the B747Adv would have a new wing?
 
DIA
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RE: Outlook: 747s To Be Produced For Years To Come...

Wed Nov 17, 2004 12:39 am

"Has Boeing indicated whether or not the the B747Adv would have a new wing?"

The 747ADV will have either a new wing, or heavy refinements to the existing one. Engines will be upgraded and the fuselage will be lengthened. These refinements are probably just a few of thousands that would be implemented for an ADV model.
Ding! You are now free to keep supporting Frontier.
 
ILSApproach
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RE: Outlook: 747s To Be Produced For Years To Come...

Wed Nov 17, 2004 10:02 am

I believe some airlines can and will benefit from owning both airplanes.

I also believe some will favor one over the other. I think both airplanes will have a viable place in the market for some time to come.

Mike
 
airgeek12
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RE: Outlook: 747s To Be Produced For Years To Come...

Wed Nov 17, 2004 9:28 pm

I think 747s will be around for a L O N G time to come. They are the most popular, reliable, and safe international planes.
--
As always, bigger and better versions of the 747 will always be coming out periodicly.
--
I'm not a huge fan of the new A340 because even though it is two full decks it's like really short- and the 747 makes the compensation for that.
I mean don't the 747 and A340 have about the same passenger compacity?
--
I think if Boeing continues production of the 747 than in a while the 747s deck will keep stretching and keep stretching- and before to long you have a plane that is like 3 A340s all together.
 
N1120A
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RE: Outlook: 747s To Be Produced For Years To Come...

Wed Nov 17, 2004 9:34 pm

>I'm not a huge fan of the new A340 because even though it is two full decks it's like really short- and the 747 makes the compensation for that.
I mean don't the 747 and A340 have about the same passenger compacity?<

I think you are talking about the A380. I also think you are talking about passenger capacity. And no, the A380 is supposed to have 500-550 seats in a 3 class layout, while the current 747-400 runs about 400 in a true 3 class layout (no Y+ cabin, with a true F, J, and Y). The 747ADV would be 450 in a true 3 class
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
ltbewr
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RE: Outlook: 747s To Be Produced For Years To Come...

Thu Nov 18, 2004 12:56 am

From another thread here, with connections to a newspaper article, it notes that the 747 ADV is proposed for by 2010. It would use the engines being developed for the 7E7 (thus spreading out development costs). The article also notes that the 747ADV would also try to be a 'niche' a/c, between the 777/A340's and the A380, with special long haul sleeper seats, flat beds. This article also noted that production is at 2-3 a month of 747's, there is a modest backlog of orders good for a couple of years and about 2/3'rds of orders are for Freighter versions.
I would also assume that the 747ADV could also incorporate the composite technologies to be used in the 7E7, also spreading out development costs. Todays computer technologies can also help in the ADV designing and engineering, to improve fuel efficiency. There are still many customers who's politics and MX people are familiar with the 747 and may not want to stray into Airbus a/c's as would have to retrain.
I think we will see 747's being made in some form until 2020.
 
zvezda
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RE: Outlook: 747s To Be Produced For Years To Come

Thu Nov 18, 2004 1:41 am

While I'm sure the B747Adv will make significant use of composites, the fuselage will use an advanced aluminum alloy that was considered and rejected for use in the B7E7.
 
gigneil
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RE: Outlook: 747s To Be Produced For Years To Come

Thu Nov 18, 2004 1:49 am

...which will relegate the 7E7 to "one-off" status that makes it significantly more expensive to own and maintain.

In order for composites to catch on, you have to make other planes out of it as well.

N

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