ua777222
Posts: 2987
Joined: Mon Dec 22, 2003 11:23 am

AA 777 Fleet Numbers Dropping?

Wed Nov 17, 2004 1:06 am

If I recall correctly AA had UA by the balls for largest 777 operator. Now I was looking at Airfleets and it states that AA has only 45 777-223/ER a/c. While UA has 60 with 3 stored and 5 sold.... I know AA has a/c on hold over in Seattle but 15 of them? I also know that they still took in 9 NEW 767 a/c in 03'. 99' being the last 767 year before 03' for new 767 a/c..... Are these numbers wrong?

Take Care,

UA777222


I think SQ has the largest ACTIVE fleet tied with UA(55). Though their's are MUCH newer with 4 new 777's this year alone.
"It wasn't raining when Noah built the ark."
 
LMP737
Posts: 4852
Joined: Wed May 08, 2002 4:06 pm

RE: AA 777 Fleet Numbers Dropping?

Wed Nov 17, 2004 1:22 am

UA777222:

Forty five sounds about right for the number of 777 in the fleet. American took delivery of a 777 last year with the deliveries to resume in 2006. I'll look into the exact numbers later.
Never take financial advice from co-workers.
 
The777Man
Posts: 5923
Joined: Sun Jul 04, 1999 4:54 am

RE: AA 777 Fleet Numbers Dropping?

Wed Nov 17, 2004 1:49 am

AA never had more than 45 777s and they still have 9 more on order. So AA will pass UA in the number of 777s in the fleet when AA eventually takes delivery of them.

UA currently have 53 active 777s and 2 listed as stored in their fleet. UA had 60 777s but rejected the leases of five of them with two going to RG and three to AI. UA still has one more 777 on order.

There have never been a time when AA had more 777s than UA since UA took delivery earlier of their 777s. UA was the launch customer for the 777 and was the first carrier to take delivery of a 777 on 15May95 and operated the first revenue flight with a 777 on 7Jun95 LHR-IAD.

The777Man
Boeing 777s flown: UA, TG, KE, BA, CX, NH, JD, JL, CZ, SQ, EK, NG, CO, AF, SV, KU, DL, AA, MH, OZ, CA, MS, SU, LY, RG, PE, AZ, KL, VN, PK, EY, NZ, AM, BR, AC, DT, UU, OS, AI, 9W, KQ, QR, VA, JJ, ET, TK, PR, BG, T5, CI, MU and LX.. Further to fly.. LH 777
 
User avatar
American 767
Posts: 3927
Joined: Wed May 19, 1999 7:27 am

RE: AA 777 Fleet Numbers Dropping?

Wed Nov 17, 2004 11:03 pm

The two largest 777 operators in the world are United and Singapore, they each have 60 aircraft, at least close to 60, in their respective fleet. United may have now 55, with one more on order, that'll make 56 when the last one on order is delivered. But I believe Singapore has no less than 60 of them.
American will have, according to what you say, 54 of them when all are delivered. That doesn't mean the fleet number is dropping, it just means they are not the largest 777 operator.

Ben Soriano
Brussels Belgium
Ben Soriano
 
rwylie77
Posts: 322
Joined: Fri May 28, 2004 6:11 pm

RE: AA 777 Fleet Numbers Dropping?

Thu Nov 18, 2004 1:16 am

Why are American still buying new 767's? Which routes are they using them on? I thought they have/had a load of 767's stored in the desert? And I seem to remember a load of TWA 767's were also being stored in the desert by American?
 
N1120A
Posts: 26468
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:40 pm

RE: AA 777 Fleet Numbers Dropping?

Thu Nov 18, 2004 2:12 am

>Why are American still buying new 767's? Which routes are they using them on? I thought they have/had a load of 767's stored in the desert? And I seem to remember a load of TWA 767's were also being stored in the desert by American?<

They already bought them, they are just taking delivery of what is left. The Ex-TWA 767s had different engines, different cockpit layouts and did not suit staying with AA. AA needed the 757s, so they kept them with the PW engines. At the time, they did not need 767s that badly, and had more of their own on order anyway. Also, all their stored 767s are either -200s (they still have some -200ERs flying) or the TW 763s. The planes being delivered are 763ERs.
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
aa777jr
Posts: 2269
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2004 12:03 pm

RE: AA 777 Fleet Numbers Dropping?

Thu Nov 18, 2004 2:47 am

AA actually utilizes ever one of it's T7 on the highest yield routes AA is flying. JFK-LHR, ORD-NRT, etc. Just cause they only are flying 45 of them now, doen't mean they aren't using them effectively.

AA777jr
A liberal is a man who is right most of the time, but he's right too soon.
 
Carpethead
Posts: 2566
Joined: Mon Aug 02, 2004 8:15 pm

RE: AA 777 Fleet Numbers Dropping?

Thu Nov 18, 2004 8:47 am

By the end of the decade SQ will operate close to 100 777s! This is assuming some of the earliest variants aren't retired.

AA will overtake UA as the second largest 777 customer in the near future and could look to add more with intent of increased Asian flying.

Has AA considered adding the 773? They could be ideal for LHR runs and S.American routes which aren't too long on the legs and can still keep the RR engine commonality.
 
DCAYOW
Posts: 542
Joined: Thu Nov 27, 2003 3:24 am

RE: AA 777 Fleet Numbers Dropping?

Fri Nov 19, 2004 12:27 am

What does DELTA's 777 inventory and order book look like?
Retorne ao céu...
 
NYCAAer
Posts: 595
Joined: Thu Jul 29, 2004 10:22 pm

RE: AA 777 Fleet Numbers Dropping?

Fri Nov 19, 2004 1:55 am

Nine more 777s are on order at AA for 2006-2009, but American is negotiating with Boeing to defer the orders due to financial constraints. If the new route to China from Chicago is awarded to AA, 777s used on the routes to deep South America from MIA and JFK will go to 767-300ERs. There may also be a decrease in the frequencies of 777 flights from LHR to the U.S.

Rwylie77, AA uses the 767-300ERs on international routes where only a 2-class service is warranted. All flights from the U.S. to CDG, FCO, MAD, MAN, ZRH, BRU and GLA are 763s. The 763s are also used on certain flights to FRA and deep South America, such as EZE, GRU, GIG, SCL, MVD. The Hawaii flights are also flown with 763s.

Personally, the 763 is my fave plane. I prefer a 2-3-2 seating arrangement in Coach. It's more personal. The new ones we took delivery of last year are really nice. They have the "new look interior" based on the interior of the 777.
 
User avatar
jetjack74
Posts: 6585
Joined: Sun Jul 27, 2003 6:35 am

RE: AA 777 Fleet Numbers Dropping?

Fri Nov 19, 2004 3:03 am

The Ex-TWA 767s had different engines, different cockpit layouts and did not suit staying with AA. Also, the lease rates on these aircraft were very unattractive, so they terminated the leases as they expired which wasn't too far away from the official day TW was absorbed by AA.

[Edited 2004-11-18 19:09:32]
Made from jets!
 
flashmeister
Posts: 2671
Joined: Fri Apr 28, 2000 4:32 am

RE: AA 777 Fleet Numbers Dropping?

Fri Nov 19, 2004 6:12 am

DL has 8 777s in the fleet, 5 on firm order, 20 options, and 5 rolling options, according to delta.com. They were delivered mostly in 1999, although it looks like there may have been one delivery in 2002. Total potential fleet is 38, well below UA/AA/SQ.

The 777 has been a conundrum all along for Delta: they had problems negotiating pay rates for pilots, problems finding ideal and consistent interior layouts, and then problems paying for the promised overhead crew rest.

In July 2004, Delta and Boeing agreed to a revised delivery schedule where the first of the remaining 5 on order won't be delivered until 2008, and all options/rolling options on 777 slots in 2005-2007 are cancelled. The next new-delivery 777 for Delta will be in 2008, at which point the others in the fleet will be pushing 10 years old.

I'm not sure that this was a smart move in the end, but I guess it's the only thing DL could do considering their money problems. Eight aircraft does not an efficient fleet make.

 
rwylie77
Posts: 322
Joined: Fri May 28, 2004 6:11 pm

RE: AA 777 Fleet Numbers Dropping?

Fri Nov 19, 2004 6:40 pm

Slightly off topic, but do American's 767's have PTV's? I fly across the Atlantic frequently with American and love their 777's with the PTV's. However, I flew on a 767 once with them to Boston and really missed the PTV to the extent that I would chose another carrier and pay slightly more to get the PTV...makes a big difference on an 8 hour flight!

Are American one of the few airlines still buying new 767's? Seems strange that the 757 line closed ahead of the 767 line even though the 7E7 is more of a direct replacement for the 767? Could American convert some of their orders from 767's to 7E7's?
 
NYCAAer
Posts: 595
Joined: Thu Jul 29, 2004 10:22 pm

RE: AA 777 Fleet Numbers Dropping?

Sat Nov 20, 2004 12:38 am

No, the 763ERs don't have PTVs. Before 9-11, the plan was to have PTVs on the 767s, but then big losses prevented it from happening. I just flew JFK-LHR-JFK as a passenger on a 777, and never watched anything on the PTVs. I was buried in "The Da Vinci Code." But it's all a matter of choice.

There are no more 763ERs on firm order. AA may have some on option, but I doubt they'll exercise that. It will be a while before AA orders any 7E7s to replace the 767s.