Trolley Dolley
Posts: 548
Joined: Sat Jul 29, 2000 1:57 pm

QF Rocks!

Sun Dec 05, 2004 10:50 am

I know QF has been taking a hammering recently in some posts, but my recent experiences of QF make me wonder if my fellow posters and I are flying the same airline. One poster even says QF treats it customers with contempt. I find this hard to believe.

Examples:
You still get to enjoy champagne in real glasses, menu cards and a choice of meals in economy class, not to mention ice-cream, movies and music.

I earn full points on every fare type I fly.
They have great value fares, too! eg NZD99+taxes (AUD90 or USD70) for a 3hour trans-Tasman flight, one-way. Full service included.

The crew on a New Zealand-Australia flight saw there was a large number of Chinese guests, so they made sure the safety demo was in English and Chinese. Culturally, flying betwen NZ and Australia could be equated to flying between Canada and the USA. Foreign languages aren't the norm on this route. (QF34, 02 Dec, AKL-MEL)

The service has been professional and friendly on the ground and in the air.
As a gold flyer I often get addressed by name throughout the flight, even in economy.

It has the best cabin safety procedures of any airline I've seen.

I'm sure some will say that QF operates in a "monoply" but QF was only one of more than 10 airlines I could have chosen to fly between Australia and New Zealand, and Virgin has established pricing power in the Australian market. As I regularly fly to Europe, QF is one of many airlines I could chose from- including Singapore Airlines, Emirates, Asiana or Aerolineas Argentinas. The airline still makes an acceptable profit in this environment.

My circumstances mean that the changes to the frequent flyer programme are a positive, but I fully accept that others will be disadvantaged. The huge positive is the pooling of family points and better earning of status.

Is QF the best in the world? Probably not, its let down by the IFE and its crews can be a little inconsistent at times, but it sure is in the top 10 in my opinion.

For the record, I've been flying QF for over 30 years now, I've seen it at its best and worst. I'm not in a monogamous relationship with QF and will happily fly other airlines. I can't be accussed of being a blindy patriotic Aussie as I live in New Zealand (to call a Kiwi and Aussie is simply the worst insult.) but I was born in Africa. QF has won me over for reasons of service, route network and price.

To all the QF a-nutters, thanks for the great and consistent service. Keep it up!  Smile/happy/getting dizzy
 
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ClassicLover
Posts: 3980
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RE: QF Rocks!

Sun Dec 05, 2004 2:10 pm

What a breath of fresh air that post is!

I last had the pleasure of a Qantas flight in June, when I flew SYD-PER-SYD, and I thoroughly enjoyed it.

Outbound, we had a choice of breakfasts (scrambled eggs for hot, and fruit and cereal for cold), as well as hot bakery items ad things like that. Coming back, we had a choice of meals again, received ice creams for dessert and had free beer and wine on offer.

Every single Qantas flight I have been on (all domestic) have been fantastic. I saw so many posts on people complaining about the food boxes - but I thought they were great. I got a huge foccacia sandwich, water, juice, chocolate and a biscuit.

One time I told the F/A how much I had enjoyed the meal and she asked if I wanted another one - absolutely! So I had two that flight!

As far as I'm concerned, they do a good job in what they do - there is no way they would be as successful if they didn't. Everyone would switch to the alternatives offered.

Finally, why would I spend $10,000 on an around the world ticket in Business Class with Qantas if I didn't think flying them was worthwhile? I think that speaks for itself.

Anyone else have good Qantas experiences? It'd be a nice change to hear about them.

Trent.
I do quite enjoy a spot of flying - more so when it's not in Economy!
 
ZKSUJ
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RE: QF Rocks!

Sun Dec 05, 2004 5:58 pm

Bloddy Australians  Big grin
In all honesty, QF is a good airline with high standards. I have not travelled with them for a while but I have some very good past experiences with them.
 
Trvlr
Posts: 4251
Joined: Thu Feb 17, 2000 9:58 am

RE: QF Rocks!

Sun Dec 05, 2004 6:14 pm

I find QF's inflight service to be consistent and professional. I am especially impressed by their ground amenities (terminals, lounges, etc) in Australia. The domestic lounge at SYD is one of the best I've ever been to. The only part about QF I don't like is the horrendous seat pitch on their 747-400s. As an airline, however, I think they're one of the best ones out there.

Aaron G.
 
LordHowe
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RE: QF Rocks!

Sun Dec 05, 2004 6:28 pm

Hello all,

My last experiences of QF are from end november/beginning of december. Flew QF SIN-SYD, SYD-CNS-SYD and SYD-HKG - all international widebody services. I have experience of QF since 1988 and I must say they have been better in FA service earlier. The aircrafts and IFE are now better but person to person service is - somehow distant.

I do not know what has happened, but you can feel that something has.

The service ingredients have been better but at the same time the people giving the service have become unfriendly. I agree that choice of meals, Magnum ice creams for dessert, great australian wines are a good thing but the way they are served could often be much more friendly.

Best regards,
LordHowe
Lord Howe Island - The Last Paradise
 
flyinghighboy
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RE: QF Rocks!

Sun Dec 05, 2004 7:08 pm

Flying from MEL-LAX-MEL on the 744ER, the IFE did take away some of the boredom but the seat pitch was something I just hated on QF. I do enjoy flying QF as I usually choose QF over other airlines if the price isn't too much. However I got a big shock when QF93 came in late so I missed QF107 and all the pax were booked on AA flights. I flew a AA 767 to JFK and the seat pitch in Y was just massive compared to Y on QF.
 
thadocta
Posts: 389
Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2001 9:44 am

RE: QF Rocks!

Sun Dec 05, 2004 7:13 pm

"The service ingredients have been better but at the same time the people giving the service have become unfriendly."

I think this is indicative of the generally low morale amongst Qantas cabin crews in general, but particularly long-haul. They don't know what is going to happen with their jobs, Qantas is looking to reduce the number of cabin crew down to regulated minimums, as well as locating some crews off-shore.

In short, their morale is so low that I am not surprised that they do the job in a perfunctory manner.

Dave
 
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BNE
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RE: QF Rocks!

Sun Dec 05, 2004 7:44 pm

I find the service on Qantas excellent, the only bit which is bad is the seat pitch on the 747-400, hopefully this one area of improvement they can put on the A380, 737s and 767s are almost as bad but you are only flying for a few hours so it isn't that big of a problem.
Why fly non stop when you can connect
 
palmjet
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RE: QF Rocks!

Sun Dec 05, 2004 8:27 pm

There's the key: "As a gold flyer I often get addressed by name throughout the flight, even in economy."

QF make a big deal of pretending that they care about their frequent flyers, but in reality, unless you are a 'gold flyer' or some higher being, you are no more important, nor recognised as a loyal QF customer by them, than someone who walks in off the street to fly with them for the first time.
Eastern - Number One To The Sun
 
Qantasclub
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RE: QF Rocks!

Sun Dec 05, 2004 8:32 pm


Qantas has made significant improvements in it's inflight product and service over the years.
I find that these are the reasons I fly Qantas:

The best domestic lounges in the world.
A high degree of operational excellence and safety.
(in my opinion) one of the best looking planes.
Casual, laid back Australian-ness that is enough to make me long for home when overseas.
One of the best J class products in the world.

I will fully admit that the service on QF is not the best in the world, CX and SQ are too far ahead in that regard, but when you compare Qantas to any US carrier or Iberia, they are still miles ahead.

Go the flying kangaroo.
Long Haul is the only way to go
 
SK973
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RE: QF Rocks!

Sun Dec 05, 2004 10:24 pm

In all the times I've been flying between Stockholm and Singapore I've often gone with QF (QF32 out of LHR or QF5/6 FRA-SIN) and always gotten very nice service from them. Food has been above average, F/As nice and accommodating, nice IFE and that lovely snack bag!  Smile

And on the ground the QF check-in agents have always been very helpful eventhough I'm a nonrev!  Big thumbs up
Just as an example, in FR A this past spring they managed to get me a four-seat row of my own which I didn't know until they handed me the boarding pass!  Smile
 
FLYACYYZ
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RE: QF Rocks!

Sun Dec 05, 2004 11:51 pm

I agree. Recently flew QF between SYD/ADL/SYD. Internet fare lower than Virgin Blue, and know the service far exceeded their B.O.B program.

*Professional Staff - Ground/In-flight
*Spotless 737-800's
*Comp In-Flight Entertainment
*Fantastic Continental Breakfast on 1:45 flight
*Great Airport Facilities

Obviously those that are crying about the removal of scrambled eggs on short domestic hops, haven't been flying in the US for a while.
Above and Beyond
 
Ratypus
Posts: 185
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RE: QF Rocks!

Mon Dec 06, 2004 12:00 am

Flew QF from PER-SYD and from SYD-AKL in June - one of the best airlines I've been on.

Service - the check-in staff were really on the ball and offered us the 'two' seats at the rear of the B747 PER-SYD when they saw it was just two of us travelling. The cabin crew were really friendly and always helpful.

Meals - were much better than a lot of airlines; variety, choice...and I had a couple of beers and an ice-cream. All in economy.

IFE - on both flights we were shown quality films (PTV on 747, drop-down screens on 737) - not the same old Hollywood muck, but films that I actually really enjoyed.

On both occasions, I left the airport thinking - lunch, beers, ice-cream, good film...AND I'm now in Sydney!

To pre-empt the comment that these were only domestic flights - I would definitely choose QF long-haul to Oz - for the same reasons as above.
Go Qantas!
 
trekster
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Joined: Fri Dec 26, 2003 2:47 am

RE: QF Rocks!

Mon Dec 06, 2004 12:11 am

I have flown QF both times we have gone to OZ (had to go with BA for the SIN part of the flight CRAP service) But QF, wow there 767 to BNE was great, good staff, going up and down the aisles every 15 min or so (BA, I did not see the cabin crew for about 2 hours during part of the flight)

I loved there internal service as well, a whole middle row on there 767, and good food as well.

The flight back was even better, there 747's are very nice.

I loved there service so much i even sent a email telling them so, and have even applied to work for there UK base when it becomes operational next year

I WANT THIS JOB PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE.
Where does the time go???
 
antares
Posts: 1367
Joined: Fri Jun 18, 2004 4:49 pm

RE: QF Rocks!

Mon Dec 06, 2004 4:32 am

Gee even I've had good Qantas flights and great dividends on my shares (and for my clients.) But an orgy of feel good messages masks some realities which are important to keep in mind if Qantas is to continue to prosper.

First, it has to make its employees realise they work for the passengers, not for themselves.

Secondly it has to reform its productivity to become truly profitable. Qantas makes less money that it should, and its share price hasn't seen $5 since the week before Richard rocked up with his excellent Australian adventure announced on November 28, 1999. Since then QF shares have generally been trapped between $3 and $4. Not good.

OK. The flying experience.

The destruction of the value of points overwhelms the pluses in the new scheme.

Trolley Dolley, you are going through life a victim of hype. Sad.

I predict the scheme will in a short period be scrapped, now that its real purpose, selling points to non flyers like retailers, bankers etc, has been diluted by the changes in the rules for accounting for the liability on the books.

Last year, sorry, this year, I used the J class lounge at Sydney International several times. Each time it had just about run out of edible food, but the wines were damn good. And the seats were getting frayed, and it has pathetic access to the internet and does even offer a complimentary wi-fi set up. (Correct me if this has happened recently.) I was flying CX on each occasion because the Qantas upgrade to J class was behind schedule, and I'll be flying VS at leasst once in the near future, because however good or bad VS service turns out to be a wide, genuinely horizontal flat bed rocks the most of anything on a long haul trip.

Domestically where I fly most with Qantas it has trashed its product down to a level of discomfort and indifference that makes it a notch better than Jetstar actually many notches better than Jetstar but uncompetitive with DJ and this is before Live2Air TV.

However I agree from personal experience that its transcon catering levels are excellent. Yet I saved over $500 on a DJ transcon last September and paid about $10 for a really good hot tray meal, at least a wholesome one, if not quite as drawn out but delicious as the Qantas experience. So saving $490 is a compelling reason not to choose Qantas just for better nosh and lousy legroom. Be shocked, DJ now has better but not brilliant legroom than many QF jets in Y.

The Qantas decision to push some of its customers onto JQ is deplorable, especially as they don't get those stupid points that some people believe in, poor benighted....oh you know what i think about that.

I have a client who nearly had the 320,000 points he needed for two first class seats to London when they jacked it up to 550,000 points (for two) and now that he nearly has that they've jacked it up to 768,000 points. Now that is stamping on your customer big time. He'll die before he gets to that number, and I bet they screw it higher yet again.

On international routes Qantas is still rolling out a J class product that SQ,CX and VS have had for years, and VS is retiring its in favour of true comfort, with Air NZ introducing the same format from the middle of next year. Its IFE is totally obsolete. Its FFP is discredited. These are big negatives for good Qantas people to overcome lest they suffer the wrath of the consumer.

In summary, there is a 'good' Qantas, which can be very very good, and a less good Qantas that does awful damage to its reputation, and then there is management trashing the loyalty scheme, which will have lasting repercussions unless they fix it good.
 
AJ
Posts: 2295
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 1999 3:54 pm

RE: QF Rocks!

Mon Dec 06, 2004 6:00 am

It may be of interest to you that on meal time flights on short Cityflyer sectors Qantas is now adding an extra flight attendant to ensure the best possible service. This means a Cabin Crew complement of nine on a Boeing 767-336(ER)!

Again, good to hear some positive Qantas comments.
 
TBCITDG
Posts: 851
Joined: Sat Jan 10, 2004 5:17 am

RE: QF Rocks!

Mon Dec 06, 2004 6:24 am

AJ:
I thought that the additional crew was due to the fact that the new service in Business class is so chaotic, that it sometimes is not even completed due to time restraints? Especially on really short legs like SYD-MEL, SYD-BNE. Doubt very much that they will add another person for the Y class passengers. Any info?
 
ZKOJH
Posts: 1463
Joined: Mon Sep 13, 2004 9:51 am

RE: QF Rocks!

Mon Dec 06, 2004 7:16 am

can't say ive had the fun of flying with them, most of my air travel is with British Midland and Air New Zealand, now thats service to my ears!
Vietnam time..
 
exFATboy
Posts: 1887
Joined: Thu Jul 17, 2003 11:15 am

RE: QF Rocks!

Mon Dec 06, 2004 7:25 am

I flew Qantas on vacation last year: JFK-SYD, SYD-AYQ, AYQ-CNS, PPP-BNE-SYD, SYD-JFK. Was generally impressed with the quality of service, both on the ground and on-board. I flew business class on the trans-Pacific flights, and the service was just right - friendly and helpful, without being overly aggressive...they knew when to leave you alone. In-air staff within Australia was also very good. Ground staff was also great - a very friendly check-in lady at PPP even let me slide when one of my bags was a little overweight.

And after British Airways completely screwed up on my frequent-flyer ticket for SYD-AYQ (didn't issue ticket before I left, office closed when I got to Sydney), Qantas sold me a seat for a flight the next morning for less than AUD 200, instead of taking me to the cleaners like a US airline would have.

Only three complaints with Qantas, all relatively minor.

* On the BNE-SYD leg - that plane had THE tightest seat pitch I've ever seen. I've never been so cramped on a plane, not even on a charter flight from EWR to CUN.

* Scheduling in and out of AYQ needs to be improved - it was impossible to go to Ayers Rock/Uluru without spending 2 nights. That was more time then I really needed there.

* The power ports were out on the flight back home. A minor complaint, but that's something that just shouldn't happen.

Overall, my experience with Qantas was very good, and I'd happly fly them again.
 
rongotai
Posts: 350
Joined: Sun Sep 10, 2000 11:59 am

RE: QF Rocks!

Mon Dec 06, 2004 7:36 am

I am gold on both NZ and QF, and generally happy with both companies Trans Tasman. I have never had an especially bad or especially good experience with QF (and my first flight with them was in 1969). I have had both good and bad with NZ.

However I found myself on Pacific Blue last week WLG-SYD and return. Much to my surprise I was very impressed - and especially with the seat pitch and the low cabin noise on the 737-800. But the really interesting thing was that I found it much more relaxing to have a 3 hour flight where food was NOT served (unless you wanted to buy it). I certainly got a lot more work done than I usually do on meal disrupted QF and NZ.

The absence of early morning departures on DJ will keep me with QF or NZ, but from now on I will be telling them not to offer me food. I have already found the abolition of food on NZ domestic flights a relief from a frenetic cabin environment when meals and wine were served on 30 minute sectors.
 
wgw2707
Posts: 1110
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2003 10:37 am

RE: QF Rocks!

Mon Dec 06, 2004 7:41 am

The reality is QANTAS is able to offer such services mainly because it exists in an environment of minimal competition. The only serious domestic competitor is Virgin Blue, which offers only limited services, and it is easy to tell which carrier the average business traveller will select. Internationally the only competition comes from foreign airlines, and QANTAS naturally has the upper hand when it comes to marketing to Australians. If you think government favoritism and near-monopoly conditions "rock", then QANTAS has been hard-rocking for 84 years.

-WGW2707
 
antares
Posts: 1367
Joined: Fri Jun 18, 2004 4:49 pm

RE: QF Rocks!

Mon Dec 06, 2004 9:14 am

WGW2707,

I think you'll find DJ has become more of an option than before for business travellers.

Some reasons. The really truly good corporate account deals Qantas made to win business off Ansett are about to expire, as Ansett already has, and the renewed deals don't as a rule freely give away J class for a full Y or even discounted Y fare with the lounge membership thrown in as used to be the case.

So businesses are tending to shop. They are even sacking travel management consultants and making it a procurement officer job, as in Smith, buy us cheap this, cheap that, save $10 on the copying paper, oh and by the way, buy us the cheapest fares you can find for SYD-MEL.

Personally I don't think that is smart company policy, but it is happening.

At the moment DJ is officially on around 30% of the total domestic market and that includes the dozens of routes it doesn't serve at all. On the Sydney-Brisbane-Melbourne flights it is knocking on 40% share.

In my opinion that may fall, as JQ dilutes both the QF and DJ share with extra capacity (for very short thin people), but if we read DJ management correctly, it is happy to trade market share for profitability in a situation where JQ has depressed QF yields by around 9.8%.

I do think Qantas needs to reinvent itself on domestic routes pretty damn quick.

 
cessnapilot172
Posts: 18
Joined: Tue May 04, 2004 12:47 am

RE: QF Rocks!

Mon Dec 06, 2004 9:58 am

Trolley Dolley,
Thank you for a positive report. I must say I have flown QF four times and was impressed every time, it is a truly underappreciated carrier. Thanks again for the posting. - Cessnapilot172
 
Qantasflyer
Posts: 390
Joined: Tue Mar 02, 2004 2:13 pm

RE: QF Rocks!

Mon Dec 06, 2004 5:34 pm

I have flown QF many times and find their product and service to be excellent, especially on domestic flights - often described as the best domestic service in the world.
The IFE will be upgraded very soon to feature AVOD. As for the seatpitch - it is on par with the majority of its competitors.

QF is my first choice for domestic and international travel, very satisfied and also happy to see that the vast majority of people share my opinion.

Regards
Qantasflyer That's the spirit. The Spirit of Australia!
 
trekster
Posts: 4319
Joined: Fri Dec 26, 2003 2:47 am

RE: QF Rocks!

Mon Dec 06, 2004 5:41 pm

im 6ft 2, and can say the only time i had trouble with the seat pitch was trying to get out of the third seat in the middle row, with a old lady asleep on ones ide, and my mum and sis asleep on the other, did not know who to wake up, the 767 pitch was even better, but i had a whole middle row to my self, so it did not matter much
Where does the time go???
 
777ER
Crew
Posts: 9875
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RE: QF Rocks!

Mon Dec 06, 2004 5:55 pm

Trolley dolley

Will you be writing up a trip report?

but when you compare Qantas to Iberia, they are still miles ahead. Well hello, QF would have to be miles ahead of IB. I mean that in a postive way.
Head Forum Moderator
moderators@airliners.net for all Moderator contact
 
Ken777
Posts: 9103
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 5:39 am

RE: QF Rocks!

Tue Dec 07, 2004 4:11 am

I've been flying QF for business travel since 1995 and have seen some major improvement over that time - especially in the cattle car food service.

Generally I find that the employees in contact with customers to be excellent, both on the ground and in the air. The only problems I have had with QF have been related to their mid-management, which can be a rather anti-pax, ignorant group at times.

The FAs have always been firsts rate from my experience. They are not the happiest group with some of the games management is playing, but they do respond to a smile and a "thank you" and they do take care of customers very well.

My last flights in Oct & Nov included 747s, 767s and 330s - fortunately in J. The new J seats are great for long haul flights and the 767 flights were on a SYD-AKL-MEL-SYD MR off a RTW ticket. The 767s were actually more comfortable that the 330s as I got the single J seat on the port side. The 330s were fine, but the CX 330 is more comfortable as they installed one less seat per row in J.

The 747 is still number one for me as QF is the only airline I have seen that actually has electrical outlets (110/400) spotted in each cabin for people like me that need to use an autopap (or cpap) to sleep - the joy of sleep apnea. that tends to put their engineering staff one notch above the rest in my book.
 
FlyboyOz
Posts: 1744
Joined: Tue Nov 21, 2000 10:05 am

RE: QF Rocks!

Tue Dec 07, 2004 8:57 am

I had a great time to fly on the QF B744ER from SYD to LAX. The ground staff at the Economy class check-in counter care about me a lot. I asked her to block three seats for me. She said she cannot do that because the seats are assigned already. But she did try her best to block the seats in the computer but she can't. She was very thoughtful cos she gave me two priority tags!!! Then she made a phone call to Qantas cabin crew about my situation.

On board, a male flight attendant came to my seat and ask me about whether I am ok. I was suprised that he told his colleagues to remember me and take care of me a lot on the rest of flight (not the whole Y pax except me...as if I am more important than the others). Before landing, he came back again and ask me "Are you happy that we have settled in Los Angeles?" and I said "Yes, thank you for taking of me". This is the best inflight experience in my life.

Overall, Qantas has been improved a lot...much better than last time.
The Spirit of AustraliAN - Longreach
 
ozglobal
Posts: 2536
Joined: Tue Nov 09, 2004 7:33 am

RE: QF Rocks!

Tue Dec 07, 2004 9:11 am


WGW2707- "The reality is QANTAS is able to offer such services mainly because it exists in an environment of minimal competition."

i) What sort of counter-intuitive poppycock is this? Airlines in monopoly positions don't have to offer ANY sort of service.
ii) As for "no competition", is it of interest to you that QF competes with around 20 other carriers on the kangaroo and Asian routes? Only international exception is transpacific and others are welcome to compete should they care to.
iii) Australians are much less patriotic when choosing an airline: it's a question of value for money pure and simple.
iv) Australians travel internationally more than most and enormously more per capita than Amercians (In 2003 alone, 15% of ALL Australians travelled internationally. In the US, less than 15% possess a passport). Hence, there is a huge international travel market.
v) Is it the successs in the face of the failure of most American airlines or the novel idea of inflight service that most generates this type of reaction?
When all's said and done, there'll be more said than done.
 
v jet
Posts: 757
Joined: Tue May 18, 1999 9:04 am

RE: QF Rocks!

Tue Dec 07, 2004 10:17 am

TBCITDG

Cabin Crew News reports the additonal cabin crew is to assist with the Y service on the above mentioned short sectors.
 
TBCITDG
Posts: 851
Joined: Sat Jan 10, 2004 5:17 am

RE: QF Rocks!

Tue Dec 07, 2004 12:15 pm

Thanks V Jet. I heard through the rumor mill that Business class services are taking quite long to the extent that some crew are still clearing on decent. I thought the additional crew may have been for J class.
 
Trolley Dolley
Posts: 548
Joined: Sat Jul 29, 2000 1:57 pm

RE: QF Rocks!

Wed Dec 08, 2004 4:57 am

Hi there. Sorry, no trip report. Travelling around the world, 57 sectors in 2 1/2 months, crossing a time zone for each day I'm away. In South Africa at the moment, loosing track of which day it is.....

WGW2707. Um, I'm a New Zealander, calling me Australian is about the worst insult you can give me. Our national airline, Air NZ is bloody good to. They give QF a run for its money.  Smile/happy/getting dizzy Sorry to hear you have such a bee in your bonet about antipodean airlines, QF in particular. May I kindly suggest you check out the DJ website to see how extensive their network is. They serve all major population cnetres in Australia.



 
monkeyboi
Posts: 447
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2004 4:12 am

RE: QF Rocks!

Wed Dec 08, 2004 4:57 am

I think the in-flight product on QF is really good. Only thing is though an airline can't 'install' the way a Flight Attendant treats passengers. Don't get me wrong, i'm not saying that QF f/a's are not nice people. It just seems that they are very over worked and aren't really happy to be there. The last time I flew QF SIN-LHR it took an hour and a bit to just get a drink after take-off. This wasn't because the F/A was slow, just because there didn't seem to be many of them! Obviously by the time this poor girl had reached my seat she wasn't in the best of moods. I can sympathise as I am crew myself. I non-rev to sydney a fair bit and find on the SYD/SIN/LHR route that the service is a bit weary. On the flip-side if I travel from london to NRT with BA then QF down to SYD the f/a's seem in a better mood. Maybe NRT is a more desirable trip for the crew? There are some good reading reviews on the 'passenger opinions' page at www.airlinequality.com  Wink/being sarcastic)
 
greatansett
Posts: 485
Joined: Thu Aug 28, 2003 5:38 pm

RE: QF Rocks!

Wed Dec 08, 2004 5:28 am

WGW2707- To say that Qantas has minimal competition on domestic routes is rubbish. Before Ansett's collapse, Ansett had about 36-38% of the domestic market with something like 63 heavy aircraft. Virgin Blue now has 38%+ of the market. Virgin also has nearly all the facilities Qantas provides for Business customers. So to say Qantas has minimal competition on domestic routes is not that accurate.
Ron Paul 2012
 
wgw2707
Posts: 1110
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2003 10:37 am

RE: QF Rocks!

Wed Dec 08, 2004 12:55 pm

i) What sort of counter-intuitive poppycock is this? Airlines in monopoly positions don't have to offer ANY sort of service.

The reality is QANTAS doesn't see the same downward pressure on fares that airlines in the United States and other countries do. QANTAS does have competition-don't get me wrong, but the competition they face is akin to the competition the Big Four US airlines faced prior to 1978-all that's needed is a slight increase in service rather than a slashed-fare approach to competition.

ii) As for "no competition", is it of interest to you that QF competes with around 20 other carriers on the kangaroo and Asian routes? Only international exception is transpacific and others are welcome to compete should they care to.

I never said that QANTAS existed totally without competition. At the same time, does an Australian business traveler really have any other viable option for both domestic or international travel on a regular basis? The answer is no-because none of the competitors QANTAS faces can match the strength of their route network both domestically and internationally. If you regularly have to travel from Sydney to diverse cities, internationally and domestically, such as Perth, Jakarta, Los Angeles, and Seoul, you could fly on a host of international airlines, or you could do it all on QANTAS and earn loyalty points-factoring that in-it is easy to see who has the competitive advantage.

iii) Australians are much less patriotic when choosing an airline: it's a question of value for money pure and simple.

Patriotism has nothing to do with it. The competitive advantage a domestic Australian airline has in terms of winning Australian passengers is network strength, pure and simple. You can't find another airline based in Australia that serves the same range of national and international destinations, period.

iv) Australians travel internationally more than most and enormously more per capita than Amercians (In 2003 alone, 15% of ALL Australians travelled internationally. In the US, less than 15% possess a passport). Hence, there is a huge international travel market.

That's totally irrelevant. QANTAS has a huge advantage internationally, for the reasons mentioned above-in fact, taking that into consideration, QANTAS seems like even more of a monopolist. So let's just cease with the American-bashing disguised as arguments for now, shall we? I don't see any place in this thread where I have criticized Australians, just the national airline that is fleecing them.

v) Is it the successs in the face of the failure of most American airlines or the novel idea of inflight service that most generates this type of reaction?

Again, there you go disguising nationalist comments as arguments... See above.

WGW2707- To say that Qantas has minimal competition on domestic routes is rubbish. Before Ansett's collapse, Ansett had about 36-38% of the domestic market with something like 63 heavy aircraft. Virgin Blue now has 38%+ of the market. Virgin also has nearly all the facilities Qantas provides for Business customers. So to say Qantas has minimal competition on domestic routes is not that accurate.

Virgin Blue is not a viable competitor with QANTAS in terms of being able to win the business traveller, as Virgin Blue operates on domestic routes only, and as far as I know has no reciprocal loyalty benefits with Virgin Atlantic. The loss of Ansett gives QANTAS a huge advantage on their international network, as no other airline offers the range of global connectivity from Australia that QANTAS does. Also, argueing that "Virgin also has nearly all the facilities Qantas provides for Business customers" is rather a stretch considering the total lack of business class on Virgin Blue flights. Virgin Blue is an LCC, QANTAS is a global network carrier-thus while competition for domestic leisure travellers is going to exist, for the business traveller who flies routinely both internationally and domestically, there might as well just be one airline.

-WGW2707

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