mrniji
Posts: 5382
Joined: Sun Feb 29, 2004 11:51 am

No 747 Combi To Europe? What About Ops Like AI?

Wed Dec 08, 2004 7:07 pm

The following extract is from an article of the Times of India:

Apart from this, Europe would not allow Boeing 747 combi flights from next year and hence A-I sees no other option but to revive its cargo service.

Is this information true, i.e. won't any 747 Combis (74D, 74M) allowed to Europe? Why would this be?

What do airlines like AI do, that operate the 74D to FRA?

What other airlines operate combis to Europe - any list? Does PK still use the 74M (they used to, right - not sure??)
"The earth provides enough resources for everyone's need, but not for some people's greed." (Gandhi)
 
keesje
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RE: No 747 Combi To Europe? What About Ops Like AI?

Wed Dec 08, 2004 7:14 pm

If this were true KLM would have a problem, the 20 744's combi's are the backbone of our Asian operations..

http://www.klm-engineering-maintenance.com/media_relations/image_library/images/09_rel3_Line%20Maintenance%20KLM%20nose.jpg
"Never mistake motion for action." Ernest Hemingway
 
alexchao
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RE: No 747 Combi To Europe? What About Ops Like AI?

Wed Dec 08, 2004 7:17 pm

Not just KLM, but EVA Air would have problems as well. EVA currently flies the 747-400 Combi into AMS, LHR, and occasionally CDG.
 
B747-437B
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RE: No 747 Combi To Europe? What About Ops Like AI?

Wed Dec 08, 2004 8:22 pm

As always, the ToI has only half the facts.

The true issue as I understand it is that the EU has set a deadline of 2005 for all airlines offering main-deck cargo capacity to install an active fire-surpression system there. Air India's pair of 747-300 Combis do not have this installed and combined with the fact that it makes little sense to maintain a subfleet of only 2 airframes now that the classics are also being retired it is more cost efficient for AI to replace these aircraft than to make the modifications and continue to operate them. Hence all the tenders we have seen this year to lease-in 747-400 Combis that DO have the system installed.
"The A340-300 may boast a long range, but the A340 is underpowered" -- Robert Milton, CEO - Air Canada
 
mauriceb
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RE: No 747 Combi To Europe? What About Ops Like AI?

Wed Dec 08, 2004 8:25 pm

Not just KLM, but EVA Air would have problems as well.

they will send other aircraft, thrust me KLM has a far more problem... with about 16 Combi's in the fleet....

Think KLM has a problem now, maybe the 5 777-300ER order has something to do with this...
 
mrniji
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RE: No 747 Combi To Europe? What About Ops Like AI?

Wed Dec 08, 2004 8:37 pm

AI to replace these aircraft than to make the modifications and continue to operate them. Hence all the tenders we have seen this year to lease-in 747-400 Combis that DO have the system installed.

So the 744 Combis are a replacement for the 74Ds? Are the 744 C's equipped with these systems from Boeing at delivery?

What about the fire-suppression with airlines like KL, Eva? Do they have these installed or are they considering of doing so?

Which other airlines are affected?
"The earth provides enough resources for everyone's need, but not for some people's greed." (Gandhi)
 
Treg
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RE: No 747 Combi To Europe? What About Ops Like AI

Wed Dec 08, 2004 9:52 pm

AFAIK Asiana is using combies to Europe (FRA & LHR) as well...
 
B747-437B
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RE: No 747 Combi To Europe? What About Ops Like AI?

Wed Dec 08, 2004 10:15 pm

What about the fire-suppression with airlines like KL, Eva? Do they have these installed or are they considering of doing so?

AFAIK, they have been standard since around 1995 and have been mandatory in EU-registered aircraft since around 1999. So I am sure that the KLM aircraft have them already. It is only the older Combis such as the AI ones that are not equipped.
"The A340-300 may boast a long range, but the A340 is underpowered" -- Robert Milton, CEO - Air Canada
 
kl911
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RE: No 747 Combi To Europe? What About Ops Like AI?

Wed Dec 08, 2004 10:19 pm

Why are governments against Combis in the first place?
It's still a 747, but in a different configuration.
Can someone answer that?

KL911
 
mrniji
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Joined: Sun Feb 29, 2004 11:51 am

RE: No 747 Combi To Europe? What About Ops Like AI?

Thu Dec 09, 2004 12:50 am

Why are governments against Combis in the first place?
It's still a 747, but in a different configuration.
Can someone answer that?


logically thinking, I suppose that PAX config do have these installed as mandatory, while old cargo were more easy on that (since 'no life is endangered in the cargo zone'). So the cargo zone is less secured, I think, while the rules for the latter are being enforced.. can someone more qualified say whether this is right?  Big grin
"The earth provides enough resources for everyone's need, but not for some people's greed." (Gandhi)
 
alexchao
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RE: No 747 Combi To Europe? What About Ops Like AI?

Thu Dec 09, 2004 1:32 am

they will send other aircraft, thrust me KLM has a far more problem... with about 16 Combi's in the fleet....

Think KLM has a problem now, maybe the 5 777-300ER order has something to do with this...


I don't see why EVA Air doesn't have the same problem. They currently have 9 Combi's in the fleet, and most of the all-passenger 747-400s are flown on higher-density routes. I really don't know what else they could fly since they're retiring their 767s, and they don't have their 777s yet.